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Going into the playoffs: Are you comfortable with Brian Boyle?

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Old
02-29-2012, 07:34 AM
  #26
TheRedressor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by egelband View Post
i think feds offers less than mitchell, actually. but that's just my opinion.
I agree 100% with this.

hopefully Kreider signs and is inserted into the lineup.

Hagelin-Richards-Callahan
Kreider-Stepan-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Anisimov-Mitchell
Fedotanko-Boyle-Prust

Would be very comfortable rolling 4 lines in the playoffs. That 4th line was the work ethic pulse of the team last year and has continued to be so this year.

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02-29-2012, 07:49 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
I should preface this thread by saying: I like Brian Boyle. I think he is probably a nice guy, he works incredibly hard, and his teammates all seem to like him.

But going into the playoffs, do you guys feel uncomfortable with him as our third line center? Considering that Tortorella loves to roll three lines and play them interchangeably; is Boyle a strong enough center to be effective in the playoffs? Personally, I just don't see it.

I've always thought of him being a better fit as a 4th line winger (getting seven minutes a night), then as a shutdown defensive center. I think his general lack of skating speed as well as agility always seems to keep him a step or two behind the play. His wingers, Prust and Dubinsky, always seem to be carrying the workload, with Boyle just "kinda there".

I know he makes the occasional nice defensive play. But I think he just isn't built for being a center with his lack of foot speed. The center position requires a skater to cover a huge area very quickly(especially in the defensive zone). Perhaps they should move Dubi back to center, and switch Boyle to wing?

Dubinsky, at one time, was one of our best face-off guys. Perhaps it might help him considering he has been trying to be more of a playmaker as of late. Dubi also is just as good if not better than Boyle on defensive side of the puck.
As our 3rd line center? No, I am not comfortable with Boyle in that role at all.

If Kreider signs and we can get him into some games, I would shift AA back to 3rd line center between Dubinsky and Prust.

Kreider slots in at LW next to Stepan and Gaborik

Boyle is a great 4th line center. He's a poor choice at 3rd line, but as we stand today, he's the best option we have as it allows AA to play a solid LW to Step and Gabby.

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02-29-2012, 07:53 AM
  #28
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I really can't believe people are expecting Kreider to be signed and inserted into this lineup.
I just highly doubt it. College Junior (graduating a yr early right) with no NHL experience, making an impact, not to mention burning a yr off his ELC. Just doubt it highly.

As for Boyle... His goals from last yr were largely the product of luck or timing... Very opportunistic so I knew he wouldn't come close this yr to matching it.
As has been said, very solid defensively but if we're down in a game he shouldn't be getting much ice. Rather have him on the 4th but he's not a "liability" at least.

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02-29-2012, 07:57 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by vladmyir111 View Post
Probably the last person anyone should be questioning. I mean honestly did anyone expect him to keep up a 20 goal pace this year? Even 10 lol?
there were alot of folks on this board that truly believed that last year was the start of his coming out party and expected 15-20+ goals from him annually.

I was not one of them.

I highly doubt Boyle ever touches 15 goals again let alone 20

a good 4th line Penalty Killer, but not a good choice as this teams 3rd line center.

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02-29-2012, 08:02 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Riche16 View Post
I really can't believe people are expecting Kreider to be signed and inserted into this lineup.
I just highly doubt it. College Junior (graduating a yr early right) with no NHL experience, making an impact, not to mention burning a yr off his ELC. Just doubt it highly.

As for Boyle... His goals from last yr were largely the product of luck or timing... Very opportunistic so I knew he wouldn't come close this yr to matching it.
As has been said, very solid defensively but if we're down in a game he shouldn't be getting much ice. Rather have him on the 4th but he's not a "liability" at least.
If he was a smaller player that was nothing but offence I would agree with you.

Kreider's size, speed and shot make him almost a shoe-in to make the post season roster.

Played at ES and 2nd PP unit his speed alone is going to cause fits for any team we play against.

Am I expecting some magnificint debut from Kreider? No, but I do not expect that he will hurt the Rangers either.

I do expect to see him in the PO's

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02-29-2012, 08:09 AM
  #31
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Like others have said as third line center, no way. That's why I wanted a guy like AK at the deadline who might have meshed with Gabby/Step leaving AA to go back to the third line C and Boyle on the fourth line.

I'd take Boyle anywhere in the lineup over Mitchell though...still don't know why the organization is infatuated with him. I'd have had him in the minors months ago.

I think Kreider definitely turns pro...I don't know what kind of impact he'd make right away but judging by how the GAS line is playing at that time I'd certainly give him a shot on the top unit with Steps/Gab...if not only to just give the Rangers three potential scoring lines instead of the two they have now.

Kreider - Step - Gabby
Hagelin - Richards - Callahan
Dubi - AA - Feds
Rupp - Boyle - Prust

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02-29-2012, 08:12 AM
  #32
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If you see a weakness on a team, commenting on it does not mean you are upset with how the team as a whole is playing or that you are somehow saying that the sky is falling. As mentioned earlier, come playoff time Torts is likely to rely heavily on three lines. If I had my choice those three lines would not include Brian Boyle. He is a 4th line player.

His faceoffs, although improved, are far from reliable especially on the pk. His even strength play is way below average as he cannot pass the puck, he has a hard time staying on his feet in transition and his shot is a crap shoot. He can protect the puck along the boards if he establishes position prior to the defender getting there. However, if it's a 50/50 battle, he often ends up on the ice swiping with his stick for the puck he just let get away.

His effort cannot be questioned; his team first attitude is second to none. However, his skill set is lacking and although there is room for him on a championship team, I believe it needs to be in a smaller role as a 4th line player/PK specialist. And I'd like to see him win more draws on the PK to sure up that part of his responsibility.

We need help on the PP. I'd like to see MZA get a shot in the top 6 and PP which would move Hagelin (who has been great) to the third line with Dubi and Mitch. Now that line can score as well as check. I think Dubi and Hags would be dynamic together with their speed. And then slots Boyle, Prust, and Feds/Rupp where they belong.

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Old
02-29-2012, 08:15 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riche16 View Post
I really can't believe people are expecting Kreider to be signed and inserted into this lineup.
I just highly doubt it. College Junior (graduating a yr early right) with no NHL experience, making an impact, not to mention burning a yr off his ELC. Just doubt it highly.

As for Boyle... His goals from last yr were largely the product of luck or timing... Very opportunistic so I knew he wouldn't come close this yr to matching it.
As has been said, very solid defensively but if we're down in a game he shouldn't be getting much ice. Rather have him on the 4th but he's not a "liability" at least.
If we are losing and need a goal every minutes Boyle spends on the ice is wasted time. So in that situation he is a liability.

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02-29-2012, 08:53 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
If we are losing and need a goal every minutes Boyle spends on the ice is wasted time. So in that situation he is a liability.
I think liability is a bit strong for what you're describing. To me a liability would be someone who, when put on the ice hurts his team. Boyle doesn't necessarily do that. He doesn't exactly help his team by scoring or setting up goals but he's defensivly responsible at least.
Like u said, if we are down he shouldn't be out there, but I don't cringe when he's on the ice.

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02-29-2012, 09:24 AM
  #35
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I am extremely comfortable with Boyle. He was a monster in the playoffs last season with Prust. His size is effective over a long series.

Not sure what people are expecting from a bottom-6 center?

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Old
02-29-2012, 10:31 AM
  #36
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ultra-comfortable

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02-29-2012, 10:32 AM
  #37
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I am comfortable with him, yes. Torts loves him, and seems to be able to draw more out of him than anyone thought he had. I think he'll step up come playoff time.

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Old
02-29-2012, 10:38 AM
  #38
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I'd worry more about everyone on the team, including Hank, before I'd worry about Boyle.

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02-29-2012, 10:43 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riche16 View Post
I think liability is a bit strong for what you're describing. To me a liability would be someone who, when put on the ice hurts his team. Boyle doesn't necessarily do that. He doesn't exactly help his team by scoring or setting up goals but he's defensivly responsible at least.
Like u said, if we are down he shouldn't be out there, but I don't cringe when he's on the ice.
If he is out there when we need a goal, I do cringe. Not because I'm concerned he will make a stupid play that will lead to the other team scoring (because he's solid defensively), but because I know our chances of scoring are slim.

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Old
02-29-2012, 10:50 AM
  #40
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You guys really exaggerate the extent to which Torts uses our lesser offensive talents when we need a goal. A few games ago people were crying about John Mitchell being on our SECOND 6-man unit when we pulled Hank late. That was 9 or 10 forwards deep! Who is supposed to be out there instead?

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02-29-2012, 11:07 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Affinity View Post
I would prefer Boyle on the 4th line with Prust and Rupp. I wish Torts would try Mitchell, Dubi and Feds together as the 3rd line. Prust and Boyle on the 3rd line just makes me I think it would help all 3 offensively if Mitchell, Dubi and Feds played with each other. But I'm not the coach so what do I know? Just my opinion.
Do you understand the concept of a checking line? Its not to be offensive, its to play against the other team's top line and shut them down. Mitchell, Dubi and Feds would be one of the worst checking lines I have ever seen. I don't understand why so many people fail to see the value in a dominant checking line, which is exactly what Dubi, Boyle and Pruster are. How often have you seen the other team's top line go off against NYR since they were put in that role? I can remember once, possibly twice, and it wasn't the entire line, only super individual skill by Malkin and Stamkos.

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Old
02-29-2012, 11:16 AM
  #42
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all the scoring Boyle did last year was gravy. he still has a big body and defends well. he adds some size and defense. he'll do fine.

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02-29-2012, 11:19 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by bogans View Post
Do you understand the concept of a checking line? Its not to be offensive, its to play against the other team's top line and shut them down. Mitchell, Dubi and Feds would be one of the worst checking lines I have ever seen. I don't understand why so many people fail to see the value in a dominant checking line, which is exactly what Dubi, Boyle and Pruster are. How often have you seen the other team's top line go off against NYR since they were put in that role? I can remember once, possibly twice, and it wasn't the entire line, only super individual skill by Malkin and Stamkos.
Your third line players should have more than 14 goals combined through 61 games. That's atrocious.

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02-29-2012, 11:28 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
You guys really exaggerate the extent to which Torts uses our lesser offensive talents when we need a goal. A few games ago people were crying about John Mitchell being on our SECOND 6-man unit when we pulled Hank late. That was 9 or 10 forwards deep! Who is supposed to be out there instead?
Well probably more like 7th or 8th forward depending on whether it's a 2nd or even a 3rd PP unit but otherwise I agree - Mitchell can hold on to the pack and stick handle in the offensive zone (a skill needed during PP) better than other bottom 6 forwards.

And I definitely have no issues with Boyle - while this line lacks goal scoring - they typically generate at least one or two good scoring chances per game so that there is a hope that eventually they get better luck converting these into goals. But more importantly - Boyle and his linemates are sound defensively and their physicality forces the opposition into making errors late in the game, which benefits our scoring lines especially at home with line-matching. And to the point of getting ice time if the team is down - if we are down by only one goal - I don't want them to change their playing strategy (everything else being equal) because this Rangers team proved to be successful in tight games this season.

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02-29-2012, 11:30 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
I should preface this thread by saying: I like Brian Boyle. I think he is probably a nice guy, he works incredibly hard, and his teammates all seem to like him.

But going into the playoffs, do you guys feel uncomfortable with him as our third line center? Considering that Tortorella loves to roll three lines and play them interchangeably; is Boyle a strong enough center to be effective in the playoffs? Personally, I just don't see it.

I've always thought of him being a better fit as a 4th line winger (getting seven minutes a night), then as a shutdown defensive center. I think his general lack of skating speed as well as agility always seems to keep him a step or two behind the play. His wingers, Prust and Dubinsky, always seem to be carrying the workload, with Boyle just "kinda there".

I know he makes the occasional nice defensive play. But I think he just isn't built for being a center with his lack of foot speed. The center position requires a skater to cover a huge area very quickly(especially in the defensive zone). Perhaps they should move Dubi back to center, and switch Boyle to wing?

Dubinsky, at one time, was one of our best face-off guys. Perhaps it might help him considering he has been trying to be more of a playmaker as of late. Dubi also is just as good if not better than Boyle on defensive side of the puck.
My issue is his FO % SH although no one on the team is really doing well SH on the F/O.

Boyle is 53/69 (~%43). The only one worse is Stepan with a whopping 13/28 (~31%)

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02-29-2012, 11:31 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Stugots View Post
Your third line players should have more than 14 goals combined through 61 games. That's atrocious.
Think about how many goals they've prevented, though. Since 1/24, Boyle has only been a minus in two out of 15 games. That's twice in 15 games where his line has been outscored at even strength. In the Columbus game he lost the faceoff that led to the Nash goal (although the CBJ player probably should have been ejected from the circle for cheating in), and in the Hawks game he was on for the Sharp goal which was really on the defense.

When you put Dubi Boyle and Prust out on the ice, you're handcuffing whatever line is out there against them. That's invaluable in the playoffs. Plus, I have a feeling we'll be seeing some nice garbage goals start to go in for those guys. They're all due for a few.

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02-29-2012, 11:47 AM
  #47
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Playoffs are a tight-checking, low scoring, physical affairs. As such, more than comfortable with Boyle.

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02-29-2012, 11:48 AM
  #48
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Think about how many goals they've prevented, though. Since 1/24, Boyle has only been a minus in two out of 15 games. That's twice in 15 games where his line has been outscored at even strength. In the Columbus game he lost the faceoff that led to the Nash goal (although the CBJ player probably should have been ejected from the circle for cheating in), and in the Hawks game he was on for the Sharp goal which was really on the defense.

When you put Dubi Boyle and Prust out on the ice, you're handcuffing whatever line is out there against them. That's invaluable in the playoffs. Plus, I have a feeling we'll be seeing some nice garbage goals start to go in for those guys. They're all due for a few.
Very fair point... just wish their production was higher.

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02-29-2012, 11:49 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
As our 3rd line center? No, I am not comfortable with Boyle in that role at all.

If Kreider signs and we can get him into some games, I would shift AA back to 3rd line center between Dubinsky and Prust.

Kreider slots in at LW next to Stepan and Gaborik

Boyle is a great 4th line center. He's a poor choice at 3rd line, but as we stand today, he's the best option we have as it allows AA to play a solid LW to Step and Gabby.
Not to derail the topic, but I just don't see the Rangers injecting a kid who hasn't played a single NHL game into the lineup this late in the season. Especially, throwing him to the wolves in the playoffs on our first line.

I can see Kreider getting signed and getting a few games in with the Whale though.

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02-29-2012, 12:08 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
Not to derail the topic, but I just don't see the Rangers injecting a kid who hasn't played a single NHL game into the lineup this late in the season. Especially, throwing him to the wolves in the playoffs on our first line.

I can see Kreider getting signed and getting a few games in with the Whale though.
In about six weeks you will see it. Don't forget to tune in.

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