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2012-2013 Sharks Roster analysis

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Old
03-01-2012, 02:02 AM
  #101
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realistically we have no moves we can make with two useless pylons on our roster making too much and both having NTCs/NMCs. i mean we are already pretty crunched for space. also knowing DW, he'll resign white for another year at 2.5 million (ha ha jk). i dont thnk even DW would make a move for nash seeing how there is no way we can fit a full roster if we had nash along with our already highly paid big "2" and boyle.

that said, if havlat and zeus agree to go... nash baby nash!!

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Old
03-01-2012, 10:19 AM
  #102
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I wouldn't move Havlat as he's quite useful when healthy

I would LOVE to have Winnik and Galiardi resigned and let Mitchell walk. Wingels needs a permanent roster spot.

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Old
03-01-2012, 06:13 PM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nighthock View Post
I wouldn't move Havlat as he's quite useful when healthy

I would LOVE to have Winnik and Galiardi resigned and let Mitchell walk. Wingels needs a permanent roster spot.
Marleau-Thornton-Pavelski
Clowe-Couture-Havlat
Galiardi-Moore-Winnik
Winchester-Desjardins-Wingels

Suter-Burns
Vlasic-Braun
Stuart-Demers

Niemi-Greiss

That wouldn't be a bad lineup with having guys like Vandermeer and Ferriero as extras.

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Old
03-01-2012, 06:16 PM
  #104
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I really don't see Moore re-signing. You know people who have goals to watch a game at every NHL arena before they die. I think Moore has a goal to play for every team before he retired. Has he ever re-signed with a team as a UFA?

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03-01-2012, 06:22 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Shark Fin Soup View Post
I really don't see Moore re-signing. You know people who have goals to watch a game at every NHL arena before they die. I think Moore has a goal to play for every team before he retired. Has he ever re-signed with a team as a UFA?
He hasn't but that also might have something to do with the fact that every team he signs with eventually trades him before his contract is up and always ends up a rental. I think he'll re-sign for the simple fact that Doug Wilson is a little more loose with his wallet on depth players than most and that Moore priced himself out of a contract with Montreal during his last go at free agency that he signed a deal like he did with Tampa that was below his likely value.

I'm sure they'll find a way to keep him if Moore puts together a good run to finish this season. A 3 year, 6 million dollar contract is a fair deal for both sides, I feel.

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Old
03-01-2012, 06:37 PM
  #106
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I still think Dustin Penner would be a great signing. He'll probably come dirt cheap, certainly lower than his current salary. He's still driving play and doing all the things that made him one of the most dominant power forwards in the league back in 09-10, the pucks just haven't really gone in over the past year and a half. People will always look for deterministic explanations but I'm inclined to believe a lot of that is just terrible luck. He's a career 12.7% shooter who's scored on 5.8% of the shots he's taken in a Kings sweater. That's not going to persist over the long haul and an astute GM would be looking to capitalize on the difference between Penner's perceived value heading into the free agent market and his actual on-ice value. The Sharks could run with a top nine like this:

Marleau - Thornton - Pavelski
Penner - Couture - Havlat
Galiardi - Moore - Clowe

That would have the added benefit of driving down Clowe's counting stats so he looks bad going into contract negotiations.

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Old
03-01-2012, 06:50 PM
  #107
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I bet DW signs Moore for a season or 2 with a NTC haha
Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
I still think Dustin Penner would be a great signing. He'll probably come dirt cheap, certainly lower than his current salary. He's still driving play and doing all the things that made him one of the most dominant power forwards in the league back in 09-10, the pucks just haven't really gone in over the past year and a half. People will always look for deterministic explanations but I'm inclined to believe a lot of that is just terrible luck. He's a career 12.7% shooter who's scored on 5.8% of the shots he's taken in a Kings sweater. That's not going to persist over the long haul and an astute GM would be looking to capitalize on the difference between Penner's perceived value heading into the free agent market and his actual on-ice value. The Sharks could run with a top nine like this:

Marleau - Thornton - Pavelski
Penner - Couture - Havlat
Galiardi - Moore - Clowe

That would have the added benefit of driving down Clowe's counting stats so he looks bad going into contract negotiations.
He wouldn't help with speed, would rather have a guy like David Jones

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Old
03-01-2012, 06:55 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
I still think Dustin Penner would be a great signing. He'll probably come dirt cheap, certainly lower than his current salary. He's still driving play and doing all the things that made him one of the most dominant power forwards in the league back in 09-10, the pucks just haven't really gone in over the past year and a half. People will always look for deterministic explanations but I'm inclined to believe a lot of that is just terrible luck. He's a career 12.7% shooter who's scored on 5.8% of the shots he's taken in a Kings sweater. That's not going to persist over the long haul and an astute GM would be looking to capitalize on the difference between Penner's perceived value heading into the free agent market and his actual on-ice value. The Sharks could run with a top nine like this:

Marleau - Thornton - Pavelski
Penner - Couture - Havlat
Galiardi - Moore - Clowe

That would have the added benefit of driving down Clowe's counting stats so he looks bad going into contract negotiations.
The lowered shooting percentage could be due to the fact that he is injured, out-of-shape, not working as hard, etc.

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:03 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
The lowered shooting percentage could be due to the fact that he is injured, out-of-shape, not working as hard, etc.
He's creating scoring opportunities at the same rate he was previously. So his laziness/attitude problems/injuries are preventing both him and his linemates only from finishing those chances? I find that hard to believe. I'm open to the possibility but, again, it's the perpetual need for deterministic explanations that creates a lot of this stuff. Over a 121-shot sample (which is how many Penner's taken in L.A.), literally anything can happen and I don't view the results as significant or indicative of anything.

If I had to put my own money on betting whether Penner's SH% next season will be closer to 5.8% or his career average of 12.7%, I'd pick the latter and I'm guessing you would too.

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:12 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Marleau-Thornton-Pavelski
Clowe-Couture-Havlat
Galiardi-Moore-Winnik
Winchester-Desjardins-Wingels

Suter-Burns
Vlasic-Braun
Stuart-Demers

Niemi-Greiss

That wouldn't be a bad lineup with having guys like Vandermeer and Ferriero as extras.
One can dream!

If we're dealing Murray and Boyle, I'd want at least 1 young top 6 fwd coming back. Not only picks or prospects. Boyle should be able to fetch a young top6 fwd.

Small change: Stuart's better as a RD according to WIngs fans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
I still think Dustin Penner would be a great signing. He'll probably come dirt cheap, certainly lower than his current salary. He's still driving play and doing all the things that made him one of the most dominant power forwards in the league back in 09-10, the pucks just haven't really gone in over the past year and a half. People will always look for deterministic explanations but I'm inclined to believe a lot of that is just terrible luck. He's a career 12.7% shooter who's scored on 5.8% of the shots he's taken in a Kings sweater. That's not going to persist over the long haul and an astute GM would be looking to capitalize on the difference between Penner's perceived value heading into the free agent market and his actual on-ice value. The Sharks could run with a top nine like this:

Marleau - Thornton - Pavelski
Penner - Couture - Havlat
Galiardi - Moore - Clowe

That would have the added benefit of driving down Clowe's counting stats so he looks bad going into contract negotiations.
What happens with Winnik, Winchester, Desjardins and Wingels ?

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:14 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
I still think Dustin Penner would be a great signing. He'll probably come dirt cheap, certainly lower than his current salary. He's still driving play and doing all the things that made him one of the most dominant power forwards in the league back in 09-10, the pucks just haven't really gone in over the past year and a half. People will always look for deterministic explanations but I'm inclined to believe a lot of that is just terrible luck. He's a career 12.7% shooter who's scored on 5.8% of the shots he's taken in a Kings sweater. That's not going to persist over the long haul and an astute GM would be looking to capitalize on the difference between Penner's perceived value heading into the free agent market and his actual on-ice value. The Sharks could run with a top nine like this:

Marleau - Thornton - Pavelski
Penner - Couture - Havlat
Galiardi - Moore - Clowe

That would have the added benefit of driving down Clowe's counting stats so he looks bad going into contract negotiations.
I would prefer to roll with a lineup similar to what we have now including guys like Winnik. His salary would pretty much determine if I would personally have him here. Anything more than 3 mil is probably something I'd stay away from with regards to Penner.

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:16 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
What happens with Winnik, Winchester, Desjardins and Wingels ?
If they signed Penner, I guess they'd be better off not spending the money on Winnik unless he's willing to settle for something in the $1.5mil range to play on the fourth line. Desi could still center the fourth line. I don't have any interest in re-signing Winchester and Wingels is a tricky one - if he sustains his current level of play for the rest of the season (assuming he stays in the lineup), then he's a legitimate top nine forward and there's no need for Penner. Otherwise, they could just send him back to the AHL; he'd be a perfect injury call-up if one of those nine (probably Havlat) went down. He's also not going to be waiver eligible at the start of next year so there's no worries there.

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:21 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
If they signed Penner, I guess they'd be better off not spending the money on Winnik unless he's willing to settle for something in the $1.5mil range to play on the fourth line. Desi could still center the fourth line. I don't have any interest in re-signing Winchester and Wingels is a tricky one - if he sustains his current level of play for the rest of the season (assuming he stays in the lineup), then he's a legitimate top nine forward and there's no need for Penner. Otherwise, they could just send him back to the AHL; he'd be a perfect injury call-up if one of those nine (probably Havlat) went down. He's also not going to be waiver eligible at the start of next year so there's no worries there.
I don't like the idea of Penner over Winnik (assuming he plays/contributes as he has historically). I don't think Penner is needed at all - would rather give the chance to Galiardi or Wingels to cement themselves as the young #7 forward. And if Winnik does perform and wants to come back at something less than $2.2m AAV, DW would sign him. Otherwise, it's McGinn & 2 prospects for Gally. THat's bad.

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:32 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
I don't like the idea of Penner over Winnik (assuming he plays/contributes as he has historically). I don't think Penner is needed at all - would rather give the chance to Galiardi or Wingels to cement themselves as the young #7 forward. And if Winnik does perform and wants to come back at something less than $2.2m AAV, DW would sign him. Otherwise, it's McGinn & 2 prospects for Gally. THat's bad.
Yeah I love Winnik and want the Sharks to keep him, I just think there's a strong probability of Penner posting ~45 points at a very reduced cap hit next season and the Sharks should jump on that. He's also a great possession forward so it's not like he'd be piling up those totals while hurting the team with porous defense. Whether or not that has more value than Winnik at $2.5mil is dependent on how the coaching staff uses Winnik in the coming weeks, especially when the team is fully healthy. Just throwing Penner's name out there as a possibility.

I don't think the trade should affect their personnel decisions down the line. Those three assets are obviously never coming back regardless of what happens.

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Old
03-02-2012, 12:26 AM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
He's creating scoring opportunities at the same rate he was previously. So his laziness/attitude problems/injuries are preventing both him and his linemates only from finishing those chances? I find that hard to believe. I'm open to the possibility but, again, it's the perpetual need for deterministic explanations that creates a lot of this stuff. Over a 121-shot sample (which is how many Penner's taken in L.A.), literally anything can happen and I don't view the results as significant or indicative of anything.

If I had to put my own money on betting whether Penner's SH% next season will be closer to 5.8% or his career average of 12.7%, I'd pick the latter and I'm guessing you would too.
The things that tend to create those outlier exceptions of return to mean are the things like injuries and conditioning. I would place a bet on returns for others before I would for Penner.

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Old
03-02-2012, 11:19 AM
  #116
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Here is my off-season plan at this point.

1) Fire Todd and his staff. I like the general idea of a young coach with new ideas, and would go that route again (like we did with Todd) and see whats out there. If not I would consider Randy Carlysle and a few others.

2) I would part ways with White (terrible), Vandermeer (likely unhappy), and Mitchell (dime a dozen).

3) I would try to move Clowe at the draft for picks/prospects. Not because of his current slump, but because of his speed and 'rental' status. I would expect a fairly high 1st rounder and descent forward prospect (not a blue chip). If Gaustad can get a 1st as a rental, Clowe can bring a lot more.

4) I might also move Murray at the draft for the same reasons and replace him with Stuart in free agency (at a discount). Again, his value is inflated, I would expect an overpayment as some GM out there will heavily overvalue him. Let's say a late 1st and 3rd.

5) I would offer Winchester a similar salary to this season, if he doesn't take it I would let him walk.

6) I would look see what kind of return we could get for Niemi and Greiss. I know people will flip out at this, and I don't have a problem with Niemi or Greiss. The reason is because I know Greiss has no future with this team, and Niemi is a replaceable piece that can (like Clowe and Murray) help us rebuild this team on the fly. I would plan for Stalock to get the backup role next season and bring in a new starter like Vokoun, Harding, etc or possibly a cast off like Steve Mason (who i think would be a great reclamation project). I would hope to get a 2nd + prospect for Niemi, and a 3rd/4th for Greiss.

7) Ask Handzus to waive his NMC in order to find him a better fit, if not, buy him out.

8) Re-sign Moore ($2m tops) Winnik (again, $2m) and Galiardi ($850k for 2 years).

9) Try to pry JVR out of Philly (possibly for Niemi). As a backup plan i'd look at Boyes, Jones, or even Semin (if his contract demands are down to a reasonable level). I would avoid Rick Nash at this point.

That gives us a team like:
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Joe Thornton ($7.000m) / Patrick Marleau ($6.900m) / Joe Pavelski ($4.000m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Logan Couture ($2.875m) / Martin Havlat ($5.000m)
Daniel Winnik ($2.000m) / Dominic Moore ($2.000m) / T.J. Galiardi ($0.850m)
Tommy Wingels ($0.875m) / Andrew Desjardins ($0.540m) / James Sheppard ($0.725m)
Brad Winchester ($0.725m)

DEFENSEMEN
Marc-Edouard Vlasic ($3.100m) / Dan Boyle ($6.666m)
Brad Stuart ($2.500m) / Brent Burns ($5.760m)
Justin Braun ($1.200m) / Jason Demers ($1.250m)
Nick Petrecki ($1.125m)

GOALTENDERS
Josh Harding ($3.000m) / Alex Stalock ($0.625m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,716,667; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,583,333

Plus a couple extra 1st's, 2nd's and other misc picks and hopefully a few descent prospects for Worcester.

10) Now, the one addition I would make is IF we can sign Ryan Suter I would move Dan Boyle for a significant return. I would want a top half 1st, high end forward prospect, and a 2nd descent prospect. I would offer Suter $7m.

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Joe Thornton ($7.000m) / Patrick Marleau ($6.900m) / Joe Pavelski ($4.000m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Logan Couture ($2.875m) / Martin Havlat ($5.000m)
Daniel Winnik ($2.000m) / Dominic Moore ($2.000m) / T.J. Galiardi ($0.850m)
Tommy Wingels ($0.875m) / Andrew Desjardins ($0.540m) / James Sheppard ($0.725m)
Brad Winchester ($0.725m)

DEFENSEMEN
Ryan Suter ($7.000m) / Jason Demers ($1.250m)
Marc-Edouard Vlasic ($3.100m) / Brent Burns ($5.760m)
Justin Braun ($1.200m) / Brad Stuart ($2.500m)
/ Nick Petrecki ($1.125m)

GOALTENDERS
Josh Harding ($3.000m) / Alex Stalock ($0.625m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,050,000; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,250,000

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Old
03-02-2012, 11:30 AM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
Here is my off-season plan at this point.

1) Fire Todd and his staff. I like the general idea of a young coach with new ideas, and would go that route again (like we did with Todd) and see whats out there. If not I would consider Randy Carlysle and a few others.

2) I would part ways with White (terrible), Vandermeer (likely unhappy), and Mitchell (dime a dozen).

3) I would try to move Clowe at the draft for picks/prospects. Not because of his current slump, but because of his speed and 'rental' status. I would expect a fairly high 1st rounder and descent forward prospect (not a blue chip). If Gaustad can get a 1st as a rental, Clowe can bring a lot more.

4) I might also move Murray at the draft for the same reasons and replace him with Stuart in free agency (at a discount). Again, his value is inflated, I would expect an overpayment as some GM out there will heavily overvalue him. Let's say a late 1st and 3rd.

5) I would offer Winchester a similar salary to this season, if he doesn't take it I would let him walk.

6) I would look see what kind of return we could get for Niemi and Greiss. I know people will flip out at this, and I don't have a problem with Niemi or Greiss. The reason is because I know Greiss has no future with this team, and Niemi is a replaceable piece that can (like Clowe and Murray) help us rebuild this team on the fly. I would plan for Stalock to get the backup role next season and bring in a new starter like Vokoun, Harding, etc or possibly a cast off like Steve Mason (who i think would be a great reclamation project). I would hope to get a 2nd + prospect for Niemi, and a 3rd/4th for Greiss.

7) Ask Handzus to waive his NMC in order to find him a better fit, if not, buy him out.

8) Re-sign Moore ($2m tops) Winnik (again, $2m) and Galiardi ($850k for 2 years).

9) Try to pry JVR out of Philly (possibly for Niemi). As a backup plan i'd look at Boyes, Jones, or even Semin (if his contract demands are down to a reasonable level). I would avoid Rick Nash at this point.

That gives us a team like:
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Joe Thornton ($7.000m) / Patrick Marleau ($6.900m) / Joe Pavelski ($4.000m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Logan Couture ($2.875m) / Martin Havlat ($5.000m)
Daniel Winnik ($2.000m) / Dominic Moore ($2.000m) / T.J. Galiardi ($0.850m)
Tommy Wingels ($0.875m) / Andrew Desjardins ($0.540m) / James Sheppard ($0.725m)
Brad Winchester ($0.725m)

DEFENSEMEN
Marc-Edouard Vlasic ($3.100m) / Dan Boyle ($6.666m)
Brad Stuart ($2.500m) / Brent Burns ($5.760m)
Justin Braun ($1.200m) / Jason Demers ($1.250m)
Nick Petrecki ($1.125m)

GOALTENDERS
Josh Harding ($3.000m) / Alex Stalock ($0.625m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,716,667; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,583,333

Plus a couple extra 1st's, 2nd's and other misc picks and hopefully a few descent prospects for Worcester.

10) Now, the one addition I would make is IF we can sign Ryan Suter I would move Dan Boyle for a significant return. I would want a top half 1st, high end forward prospect, and a 2nd descent prospect. I would offer Suter $7m.

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Joe Thornton ($7.000m) / Patrick Marleau ($6.900m) / Joe Pavelski ($4.000m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Logan Couture ($2.875m) / Martin Havlat ($5.000m)
Daniel Winnik ($2.000m) / Dominic Moore ($2.000m) / T.J. Galiardi ($0.850m)
Tommy Wingels ($0.875m) / Andrew Desjardins ($0.540m) / James Sheppard ($0.725m)
Brad Winchester ($0.725m)

DEFENSEMEN
Ryan Suter ($7.000m) / Jason Demers ($1.250m)
Marc-Edouard Vlasic ($3.100m) / Brent Burns ($5.760m)
Justin Braun ($1.200m) / Brad Stuart ($2.500m)
/ Nick Petrecki ($1.125m)

GOALTENDERS
Josh Harding ($3.000m) / Alex Stalock ($0.625m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,050,000; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,250,000
Plan B, with Suter, please

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Old
03-02-2012, 11:44 AM
  #118
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HB, my comments:

Suter: It'll take more than $7 since Doughty got $7.1. Probably around the $7.5-8m range. (We know DW doesn't do long-term deals to bring down the cap.)

Trading Boyle: the teams I can think of that could use a stud PMD, where Boyle wouldn't rule out and who DW wouldn't mind trading him to are: NJ, Ottawa. Carolina? - any other teams? Who on those teams should we target? Would rather get a young top 6 fwd as the centerpiece for Boyle.

Same with Stuart: Figure around $3.25-$3.5m (with NMC). Go read the Wings or Trade board for more on Stuart's market value.

Vandy: I don't think you have any basis to say he's unhappy but he's a 7th dman. Those are easy to find and should be cheaper than $1m anyhow.

JvR: If you propose Niemi, what does Philly do with Brrz? Think about the other team, too. Doubt Niemi attracts them.

Fine with Winnik, Moore and Galiardi - though I think more should be budgetted for Winnik and Moore. Just a tad

Harding: Reports are the Wild will try to re-sign him since Backstrom's going to be 34. Maybe on Vokoun as a 1 or 2 yr bridge if we do end up dealing Niemi.

Coaching: DW should force TMac to get a real assistant coach for defense, not Shaw

Wingels: probably a bit less since he'll sign a 1-way deal

Braun: I have that AAV as well. Hopefully a 2-yr deal, then that way he's due for re-signing after the Big 3's deals expire.

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Old
03-02-2012, 11:57 AM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
HB, my comments:

Suter: It'll take more than $7 since Doughty got $7.1. Probably around the $7.5-8m range. (We know DW doesn't do long-term deals to bring down the cap.)
I would pay him himto 7.5m, otherwise not interested.

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Trading Boyle: the teams I can think of that could use a stud PMD, where Boyle wouldn't rule out and who DW wouldn't mind trading him to are: NJ, Ottawa. Carolina? - any other teams? Who on those teams should we target? Would rather get a young top 6 fwd as the centerpiece for Boyle.
Which is fine, that would replace my need to acquire JVR/whoever. I was being very general and vague intentionally. Can Boyle be moved? Absolutely, teams would clamor for him. Can he get that kind of return? Likely. That is all I was getting at.

Quote:
Same with Stuart: Figure around $3.25-$3.5m (with NMC). Go read
the Wings or Trade board for more on Stuart's market value.
Not interested in him at market value, I'd just keep Murray then and let someone else make that mistake. He takes a discount to be here, or I don't want him.

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Vandy: I don't think you have any basis to say he's unhappy but he's a 7th dman. Those are easy to find and should be cheaper than $1m anyhow.
Dime a dozen. I'm fine with it either way. But I suspect he's not happy with his ice time here and will look elsewhere.

Quote:
JvR: If you propose Niemi, what does Philly do with Brrz? Think about the other team, too. Doubt Niemi attracts them.
I said maybe Niemi. If they can't or won't move Bryz, that is their problem. Maybe instead they'd be interested in Clowe. Who knows. I said I'd take a shot at it, if not, I listed backup plans.

Quote:
Harding: Reports are the Wild will try to re-sign him since Backstrom's going to be 34. Maybe on Vokoun as a 1 or 2 yr bridge if we do end up dealing Niemi.
Again, yah, just options, there are quite a few this off-season, the goalie market is saturated right now. Harding may not want to re-sign because he is ready for a starting role NOW, not a few years from now. Also, if CBJ buys out Mason, I'd offer him $1.5m and give it a shot. With that defense, we could likely make Cloutier a vezina winner again.

Quote:
Coaching: DW should force TMac to get a real assistant coach for defense, not Shaw
Clean house. The assistance coaches were Todd's choices, and his responsibility. He blew it imo, and I think we can easily do better elsewhere. I give him credit for being an average coach, that is about it.

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03-02-2012, 12:01 PM
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Led Zappa
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We were top in the west at the all-star break. Fixed the PK to one of the best in the league. Have one of the best PP's in the league. Ran into injury problems and a road trip from hell.

Oh the horror!!! Fire the coaches.

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Well, that was another in a long series of regrettable life choices
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03-02-2012, 12:06 PM
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If we're trading Boyle to the Canes, I want Justin Faulk back. The kid is amazing. No chance they give him up though.

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03-02-2012, 12:12 PM
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SJeasy
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GI,
Ottawa wouldn't want Boyle, they have Karlsson. Red flag on Boyle's SH% of the last two years. He is on the downslope, slightly.

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03-02-2012, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
We were top in the west at the all-star break. Fixed the PK to one of the best in the league. Have one of the best PP's in the league. Ran into injury problems and a road trip from hell.

Oh the horror!!! Fire the coaches.
You love to criticize other people, but never offer your own solutions.

Do you really believe this team is still going to win the cup? When they don't, will you blame bad luck, injuries, and reffing? Or will you actually look at the real issues and offer up what to do about it?

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03-02-2012, 12:20 PM
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SJeasy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post


Clean house. The assistance coaches were Todd's choices, and his responsibility. He blew it imo, and I think we can easily do better elsewhere. I give him credit for being an average coach, that is about it.
I don't agree with clean house. TM is better than many at dealing with star players. A rookie coach would get runover by JT; it wouldn't be pretty. TM had Detroit credentials when he started so it isn't the same as a pure rookie coach. TM is one of the best on neutral zone and entry offense and very good PP. He needs PK, defensive and breakout help. TM is a very good personality fit for the Sharks (getting whatever message across), he just needs strategic help.

I don't like Carlisle for the Sharks. Special set of circumstances in Anaheim where he was the perfect fit for the team personality. Wouldn't work so well for the Sharks unless there were massive changes. Carlisle is a very good coach overall, just not the right one.

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03-02-2012, 12:22 PM
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Gilligans Island
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
GI,
Ottawa wouldn't want Boyle, they have Karlsson. Red flag on Boyle's SH% of the last two years. He is on the downslope, slightly.
Good point on the Sens. The Devils seem to me to be the best trade partner. I just don't know who we'd want from them.

The real question here (and only asked IF we get Suter) is which teams would he go to, yet need him? And on those teams, what do they have that we'd want?

Not surprised about Boyle's declining SH%. Don't know how much of that is mental (he's much more indecisive this past season than prior) or physicaly (wrist injury, than foot).

If we deal Boyle, I'd say we'd get a 2nd line prospect and a 2nd. Dreams of a bonafide top 6 fwd, 1st and another prospect are just that.

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