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Too many second-line centers: Worst than ever?

View Poll Results: So, who do you keep?
Desharnais 93 77.50%
Plekanec 83 69.17%
Eller 94 78.33%
Leblanc 93 77.50%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 120. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-04-2012, 12:23 PM
  #101
DAChampion
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Plekanec is a better player than Jeff Carter and Mike Richards and he is on a better contract.

Thus, if we trade him, we better get an equally good package.

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03-04-2012, 12:24 PM
  #102
Et le But
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
I would rather trade him in the off-season. He isn't retiring or on an expiring contract so I doubt if there would of been that much of a premium paid for him then. If we wait for draft day hopefully we can trade him fr a 1st (either Aberg or Hertl) plus a decent NHL ready prospect or a under 23 roster player would be good.
This is a great way to ruin said prospects.

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03-04-2012, 01:17 PM
  #103
Frozenice
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
This is a great way to ruin said prospects.
So are you suggesting we continue to trade away our roster players for nothing so we avoid ruining prospects by bring them here.

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Old
03-04-2012, 01:24 PM
  #104
Hawkguy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
Patches - DD - Cole
Jagr - Pleks - Bourque
Moen/Leblanc - Eller - Gio


that's how i'd roll...
I like Jagr, but I think Whitney is a better player at this point in their careers. Look at the seasons Whitney puts up with a bunch of nobodies. Seriously, what's he got in Phoenix? Vrbata?

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03-04-2012, 01:24 PM
  #105
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Plekanec gets the less vote. The Habs fans are wise, they know what is best for this team!!

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03-04-2012, 01:48 PM
  #106
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People who wouldn't even consider trading Plekanec have no foresight whatsoever.

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03-04-2012, 01:54 PM
  #107
Et le But
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginu View Post
People who wouldn't even consider trading Plekanec have no foresight whatsoever.
Please find a quote saying Plekanec is untouchable. Please show me one poster saying that.

But trading away Plekanec for unproven prospects and going into next season with DD and Eller as our top 2 Cs, or DD and a rookie as our top 2 Cs, now that is a great example of no foresight.

I know this is hockeys future so prospects are inherently more valuable than established veterans, but it should be common sense.

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03-04-2012, 01:56 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by chewBACHa View Post
all of the above
too simple. one must go.

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Old
03-04-2012, 02:11 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
too simple. one must go.
None of them "must" go. Two of these players can be rather easily converted into a winger, and luckily, our depth on the wings is horrible as of late.

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03-04-2012, 02:12 PM
  #110
Et le But
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Originally Posted by Felix60 View Post
None of them "must" go. Two of these players can be rather easily converted into a winger, and luckily, our depth on the wings is horrible as of late.
Pretty much this. Leblanc is already being converted to a winger.

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Old
03-04-2012, 02:24 PM
  #111
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Let's just assume we draft Grigorenko. And also, just for the sake of assumption, he is Nugent-Hopkins ready. That still is not enough to get rid of any of our centers. The best course of action in such a scenario would be to send Leblanc down to get more quality minutes, and then, line up in this manner...

Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / Mikhail Grigorenko ($1.350m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Lars Eller ($1.750m) / David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Erik Cole ($4.500m)
Travis Moen ($2.250m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Rene Bourque ($3.333m)
Mike Blunden ($0.650m) / Blake Geoffrion ($0.700m) / Ryan White ($0.700m)
Mathieu Darche ($0.700m)


Spread Gio, DD and Plek (the smaller players) out on each line...and then lastly, utilize Pleks great two way game alongside moen and Bourque as your shut down unit...


Last edited by InTheWrist: 03-04-2012 at 02:34 PM.
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Old
03-04-2012, 02:41 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Plekanec is a better player than Jeff Carter and Mike Richards and he is on a better contract.

Thus, if we trade him, we better get an equally good package.
Plekanec is not better than Mike Richards, sorry.

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Old
03-04-2012, 02:54 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Plekanec is not better than Mike Richards, sorry.
I agree. I love Plek, but Richards any day over him.

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03-04-2012, 02:59 PM
  #114
Et le But
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I'd take Mike Richards over Plekanec easily. But I'd take Plekanec over Jeff Carter. Well it depends on the circumstances, but Plekanec has more dimensions and less attitude issues. Carter on this team would be a trainwreck, imagine Carter centring Bourque and White.

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03-04-2012, 04:15 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
OMG. I never said he won't get better or that he's over the hill. Weber did not get better this year. Not all athletes get better, that's my point. You can't argue that. You can't count on all players to get better "next year".
there is a difference between an athlete improving, and an athlete's production/utility on a given team "improving".

Desharnais could find himself centering the 4th line next year, and seeing his production drop immensely as a result. That's not a defacto example of him "regressing" or "not improving" as an athlete.

How a player gets used by a given team ultimately has a bigger impact on how effective they are/appear to be, than wether or not they have improved as an athlete/hockey player.

feels like we're splitting hairs a bit here.

bottom line is that the odds of both Eller and Desharnais being better on opening day 2013 than they were on opening day 2012 are about as good as your going to get in terms of athlete predictions.

why you feel the need to point out that it isn't a 100% certainty is puzzling... in sports, as in life, nothing is 100% certain, that reality doesn't lend itself to much interesting discussion.

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03-04-2012, 04:21 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
I like Jagr, but I think Whitney is a better player at this point in their careers. Look at the seasons Whitney puts up with a bunch of nobodies. Seriously, what's he got in Phoenix? Vrbata?
jagr vs whitney... i'd call it more of a toss up, but for arguments sake let's go with Whitney being the better player.

more important is who would be a better fit.

If I'm not mistaken, Whitney plays next to the 6'6 240 M.Hanzal... would he find the same kind of space lining up next to a much less physically imposing Plekanec?

We know that Pleks/Jagr have great chemistry, so less of an unknown/adjustment period in that regard as well.

in the end, I'd be content with either on a 1-year deal, though I'm not sure about going as high as 5M$ unless both Gomez/Kaberle are no longer here (short of landing Suter/Parise or an equivalent, I don't want to see us spending to the cap just for the sake of it... better to go into the season with some leeway, and keep the options open for a possible trade in-season if/when an elite level player becomes available.

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Old
03-04-2012, 08:03 PM
  #117
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Plekanek..shouldn't be on the penalty kills!!!

I noticed Plekanek has been working the PK the last two years. This overuse
might explain why he seems physically and emotionally drained. If we want
him as the habs first or second line centre, we should avoid using Pleks on the PK.
He will be a fresher offensive contributor. We should use third and fourth line
players on the PK and the top six players on the two tops lines on the power-play.

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03-04-2012, 08:09 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
OMG. I never said he won't get better or that he's over the hill. Weber did not get better this year. Not all athletes get better, that's my point. You can't argue that. You can't count on all players to get better "next year".
Weber has gotten better, just not at the lengths we hoped. He was a project defenseman right from the start and defenseman usually develop later anyway, look at Gorges. Guy became a top pairing defenseman through development. If had of been here at he start 90% of fans would have given up on him, lol.

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03-04-2012, 08:36 PM
  #119
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Weber has gotten better, just not at the lengths we hoped. He was a project defenseman right from the start and defenseman usually develop later anyway, look at Gorges. Guy became a top pairing defenseman through development. If had of been here at he start 90% of fans would have given up on him, lol.
right around when he was traded to us, I spoke with a guy who had been on the Sharks training staff... described Gorges as the hardest working guy in the Sharks organization, absolutely committed to doing everything possible to get better.


no coincidence that, 4 years later, he's far outshot anyone's initial expectations of him.

perfect example of the kind of progression an athlete can make with a bit of skill and a ton of desire.

Both Eller & DD, from what I've read and seen, show a similar type of desire to get better... time will tell.

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Old
03-04-2012, 10:29 PM
  #120
hockeyfan2k11
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So, basically...every athlete improves. There's no such thing as an athlete regressing. This place is funny.

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03-04-2012, 10:47 PM
  #121
Frozenice
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
So, basically...every athlete improves. There's no such thing as an athlete regressing. This place is funny.
Every sport/position is different but for hockey, players generally improve up until the age 25 - 28 and then they tend to plateau and then in their 30's tend to deteriorate. There are exceptions to this rule in both directions.

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03-04-2012, 11:22 PM
  #122
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
So, basically...every athlete improves. There's no such thing as an athlete regressing. This place is funny.
what's funny is how little ability some posters show in the reading comprehension department...

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Old
03-05-2012, 04:41 AM
  #123
La Grosse Tendresse
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I know, let's trade Desharnais for Niinimaa, get rid of Plekanec in order to give ice time to Eller, trade Leblanc for a 4th round pick!

Then, we'll just have to trade for Scott Gomez and we'll be great!

Huzzah!!!!

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03-05-2012, 05:52 AM
  #124
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thats the tightest poll i've seen lately on hf! cheers for that!
Long live democracy! lol

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Old
03-05-2012, 06:23 AM
  #125
hockeyfan2k11
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
what's funny is how little ability some posters show in the reading comprehension department...
You're telling me.

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