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Old
03-05-2012, 02:20 PM
  #76
EspenK
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Originally Posted by frito View Post
I think he can get sent down to Springy AFTER his junior team is done (could be wrong) which is why I was hoping for his Jr. club to be eliminated from the playoffs.
Reading between the lines of this article http://www.tampabay.com/sports/hocke...ack-to/1214057 it looks like he could be sent to the A after his junior team is eliminated from the playoffs.

The only glitch may be that he wasn't sent back to juniors prior to the trade deadline. But the Jackets are too stupid to do anything that would make sense.

After re-reading the article I think he could be sent down when his team is eliminated.


Last edited by EspenK: 03-05-2012 at 02:22 PM. Reason: added comment
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03-05-2012, 02:21 PM
  #77
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If there ever was a time to play the kids, this is it. Johansen should be playing center now on the second line, build some confidence into the kid. Maybe he will learn to enjoy the game again like Brassard has. It is next season that counts. Get ready for it, not this.

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03-05-2012, 02:21 PM
  #78
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So where do you guys see him next year?

Here in the press box?

Here as a starting center-which line?

Here as a winger?

In Springfield?

My guess unless he has a great camp he could be destined for Springfield.

What a waste of a year of his entry level contract. Should have been in juniors in retrospect.
For my money, he's learned more here in 50+ NHL appearances than he would have in Juniors. Where he plays next year depends, as it does for all young players, on his camp/preseason performance. Then, too, it'll also be impacted by any changes in the coach and GM.

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03-05-2012, 02:26 PM
  #79
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I think the age limit is in effect for the entire year, no matter the Juniors playoffs.
Well that just sucks because he really is a tweener. He's too good for juniors and would do nothing but develop bad habits there but not yet ready for the NHL. This is a case where the system is really hurting a potential budding star.

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03-05-2012, 02:26 PM
  #80
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There has been enough good in place with Ryan that a good off season of strength and conditioning should help him have a more productive year.

Richards is certainly trying to prove a point. I'm not sure I haven't seen enough lack-of-compete to call it chronic enough for constant scratching. But he's the coach. For now.

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03-05-2012, 02:31 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
8 minutes last night and again on the wing. So has someone in the Columbus media asked why this keeps happening?
- Rush him and he gets overwhelmed by the responsibility, he tries to compensate and ends up with bad habits decisions that have to be taught out of him.
- Send him down to juniors and he gains nothing but more ice time and a false sense of greatness. I'd rather have him fighting a pro for the puck twice a game than some junior schlub 20 times a game.
- Play him a few minutes on the wing. Coach him. Teach him as many skills, tricks, reads, what have you, all things that will help him later.
- Hope he doesn't let his ego inflate his current worth beyond his potential worth.
- Hope he works his ass off this summer and comes back in NHL shape.
- Hope he doesn't see playing in the AHL next season as a demotion but as the opportunity to become great.

Watch him come up mid season and work his way into a top line center position which he keeps for the next 10 years.

Summary: He is where he deserves to be. He isn't playing well enough to deserve more ice time.

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03-05-2012, 02:35 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
Reading between the lines of this article http://www.tampabay.com/sports/hocke...ack-to/1214057 it looks like he could be sent to the A after his junior team is eliminated from the playoffs.

The only glitch may be that he wasn't sent back to juniors prior to the trade deadline. But the Jackets are too stupid to do anything that would make sense.

After re-reading the article I think he could be sent down when his team is eliminated.
That's not how it works.

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03-05-2012, 03:23 PM
  #83
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- Rush him and he gets overwhelmed by the responsibility, he tries to compensate and ends up with bad habits decisions that have to be taught out of him.
- Send him down to juniors and he gains nothing but more ice time and a false sense of greatness. I'd rather have him fighting a pro for the puck twice a game than some junior schlub 20 times a game.
- Play him a few minutes on the wing. Coach him. Teach him as many skills, tricks, reads, what have you, all things that will help him later.
- Hope he doesn't let his ego inflate his current worth beyond his potential worth.
- Hope he works his ass off this summer and comes back in NHL shape.
- Hope he doesn't see playing in the AHL next season as a demotion but as the opportunity to become great.

Watch him come up mid season and work his way into a top line center position which he keeps for the next 10 years.

Summary: He is where he deserves to be. He isn't playing well enough to deserve more ice time.
I disagree. Johansen was the second leading goal scorer for the jackets for a decent part of the season. He was voted to the young stars game. Richards is doing the exact same thing to Johansen, as Arniel was doing to Brassard. Now Brassard, put in situations where he can suceed (not buried on the 4th line playing 10 mins night), is playing lights out cause his coach believes in him, and playing him where he belong. He should be playing in top 6 as a center to determine areas he needs to work on for the offseason. This season is shot, and should be used as a springboard to next season. If Johansen is one of the guys we are building the franchise around, what good does it do to sit him for games on end. I will never understand scratching Johan in favor of Aaron freaking Johnson.

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03-05-2012, 03:58 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Clitter on the point View Post
I disagree. Johansen was the second leading goal scorer for the jackets for a decent part of the season. He was voted to the young stars game. Richards is doing the exact same thing to Johansen, as Arniel was doing to Brassard. Now Brassard, put in situations where he can suceed (not buried on the 4th line playing 10 mins night), is playing lights out cause his coach believes in him, and playing him where he belong. He should be playing in top 6 as a center to determine areas he needs to work on for the offseason. This season is shot, and should be used as a springboard to next season. If Johansen is one of the guys we are building the franchise around, what good does it do to sit him for games on end. I will never understand scratching Johan in favor of Aaron freaking Johnson.
He sat 6 of 13 games in February after playing through the All Star Break. If we get through the end of the season with Johansen playing less than half of the remaining games you have a point regarding the Brassard reference. Tell me is it possible to prove that Brassard is playing well now because of or despite being held out of games by Arniel? I say despite but that is what I want to believe not because I have proof.

Also, if we are comparing players can't we compare Johansen to Mason's rookie season? League level accolades and never the same since including significant set backs in attitude/work ethic.

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03-05-2012, 04:07 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Clitter on the point View Post
...I will never understand scratching Johan in favor of Aaron freaking Johnson.
Nor will I. Richards cannot possibly believe playing AJ will help him retain this job! If Howson plans to be here next year, why hasn't he intervened? If Priest is as intrusive as some believe, how can he think its fiscally prudent to waste a contract year for a top prospect? I'll never understand this team!

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03-05-2012, 04:14 PM
  #86
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That's not how it works.
Then how exactly does it work?

From what I've read an NHL team can send a 19 year old back to juniors anytime they want. The different game levels (9&40) have to do with whether or not a year is burned off the entry level contract (>9) and the 40 game mark counts as a year towards becoming an RFA.

And it has been reported several places that a junior player can be assigned to the AHL once his team's season is over regardless of his age.

Is it because he is on an NHL roster now?

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03-05-2012, 05:34 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by cbj21 View Post
If there ever was a time to play the kids, this is it. Johansen should be playing center now on the second line, build some confidence into the kid. Maybe he will learn to enjoy the game again like Brassard has. It is next season that counts. Get ready for it, not this.
Do you build confidence by giving away ice time, or complacency?

I'll never understand why people want Johansen handed a top 6 role and the responsibility that goes with it. Haven't any of you been paying attention to the result of putting players in spots they haven't earned.

Enough with the Brassard comparisons. The only thing they have in common is that a player is being scratched. Assuming it's the same thing with entirely different people involved in entirely different situations makes little sense.

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03-05-2012, 08:40 PM
  #88
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What I really want to know is how did we avoid screwing up Moore?

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03-05-2012, 09:23 PM
  #89
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Maybe I'm looking at it from the different angle. But for the player development playing as much as possible isn't always a good thing. Zherdev always played a lot and what? Practice, learning, looking at the game from the press-box view also could be helpful... Johansen played in 51 games already. Back in USSR the whole regular season was 40 games total!
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...017871986.html
I would be happy if Johansen ended like most of those guys and they didn't play even 50 games a year. Maybe that's why Larionov, Fetisov, Selanne, Thomas and Lidstrom are/were able to play till they're 40-41. Even Chris Chelios had never played more than 45 games a year till he was 23.

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03-05-2012, 09:23 PM
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What I really want to know is how did we avoid screwing up Moore?
Don't be so quick to judge, EDM, he may just be a bit more resistant to our special brand of magic.

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03-05-2012, 10:34 PM
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Don't be so quick to judge, EDM, he may just be a bit more resistant to our special brand of magic.
Ruined Brassard for 2nd month scores 1 point per game and ruined Voracek plays top-6 role on Philly. Just don't draft lazy Russians from CSKA Moscow (Zherdev, Filatov AND Grigorenko are all played for CSKA).
Joe Thornton in his 1st NHL season played on the 4th line 55 games and scored 7(3+4) points. His career was obviously ruined by that Bruins idiot coach Pat Burns.

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03-06-2012, 08:23 AM
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What I really want to know is how did we avoid screwing up Moore?
Removing the hyperbole from the statement, put him in a role in which he can have success. Thus far, we seem to be doing that fairly well this year.

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03-06-2012, 08:33 AM
  #93
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Removing the hyperbole from the statement, put him in a role in which he can have success. Thus far, we seem to be doing that fairly well this year.
I agree with this as regards Moore.

This is the half that is the responsibility of the organization. The other is on the player. You need both halves to be successful. Moore has done his part as well.

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03-06-2012, 08:33 AM
  #94
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Ruined Brassard for 2nd month scores 1 point per game
Not sure I understand what you are saying here. If you are saying he has averaged a point-per-game for 2 months now, that would be incorrect. He averaged a 40 point pace in January and, while close to that pace in Feb., he got 11 points in 13 games. He's had a good start to March, but there it's only been 2 games.

To give you an idea, he had two great months last season, November and January, in which he scored at a point-per-game pace.

Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

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03-06-2012, 08:51 AM
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I'm okay with him playing 4th line minutes, but it should be at center. That's where his skills come in. Let D-Mac help him and have Gillies look out for him for the rest of the season and then see where he is next season.

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03-06-2012, 09:01 AM
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Not sure I understand what you are saying here. If you are saying he has averaged a point-per-game for 2 months now, that would be incorrect. He averaged a 40 point pace in January and, while close to that pace in Feb., he got 11 points in 13 games. He's had a good start to March, but there it's only been 2 games.
To give you an idea, he had two great months last season, November and January, in which he scored at a point-per-game pace.
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Most of the thread is about how the Jackets are ruining their prospects. I just tried to point out that 4 of the last 5 first round picks are still far away from being ruined.
Some people are really surprised that Moore isn't a bust yet and I just tried to give them some hope that he's not the only one. Brass, Voracek and Johansen still can be a decent players in the league. Jake Voracek brought you Jack Johnson at the end. Really, let's not get ahead of ourselves

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03-06-2012, 09:19 AM
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Most of the thread is about how the Jackets are ruining their prospects. I just tried to point out that 4 of the last 5 first round picks are still far away from being ruined.
Some people are really surprised that Moore isn't a bust yet and I just tried to give them some hope that he's not the only one. Brass, Voracek and Johansen still can be a decent players in the league. Jake Voracek brought you Jack Johnson at the end. Really, let's not get ahead of ourselves
Yeah, I addressed the hyperbole statements. Let's also acknowledge that even though those players may or may not be ruined, they really aren't playing to their ceilings either (Jake and Brass). It's really too early on Moore to declare anything.

Yeah, I mentioned it before, but Jake and the 8th for JJ and another first isn't a bad return.

Having said that when I responded to you I was mostly questioning what you meant in regards to Brass's performance. You seemed like you misrepresented his performance to meet your own agenda.

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03-06-2012, 10:17 AM
  #98
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Do you build confidence by giving away ice time, or complacency?

I'll never understand why people want Johansen handed a top 6 role and the responsibility that goes with it. Haven't any of you been paying attention to the result of putting players in spots they haven't earned.

Enough with the Brassard comparisons. The only thing they have in common is that a player is being scratched. Assuming it's the same thing with entirely different people involved in entirely different situations makes little sense.
Agreed with ending the comparisons. Brass would play lights out just to get "rewarded" with another scratch or at best fourth line duty. Johansen really hasn't "earned" anything. He looked completely lost in the Colorado game. I do agree with giving him a whirl at center on the 4th line with appropriate line mates but he hasn't earned top six minutes, especially at center where he just isn't ready. It's a moot point but I really wish we could send him to Springy. That is what would be truly best for his development.

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03-06-2012, 11:40 AM
  #99
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Agreed with ending the comparisons. Brass would play lights out just to get "rewarded" with another scratch
I must have a poor memory. I remember Brass getting scratched, but not after playing "lights out". It was mainly in the first year, under Hitch, before his breakout the following year leading up to his injury.

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03-06-2012, 12:12 PM
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Yeah, I addressed the hyperbole statements. Let's also acknowledge that even though those players may or may not be ruined, they really aren't playing to their ceilings either (Jake and Brass). It's really too early on Moore to declare anything.
Sedins didn't play to their ceilings as well for a wile. Henrik never had more than 42 points till he was 25 years old. It doesn't mean Vancouver "screwed them up".

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Having said that when I responded to you I was mostly questioning what you meant in regards to Brass's performance. You seemed like you misrepresented his performance to meet your own agenda.
I said that Brassard for 2nd month scores 1 point per game which is actually what he does... almost... In February he had 11 points in 13 games. In March (with is the 2nd month) he's got 3 in 2. Maybe be I could use a better wording though.

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