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Injury Talk 4.0: Markov practicing with the team, now with contact

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03-06-2012, 10:22 AM
  #1001
Hugo Sham
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Habs are not playing against the Bruins anymore this season.
i'm not only speaking of this year - and we play buffalo twice

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03-06-2012, 10:27 AM
  #1002
Lafleurs Guy
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Yes, they should have tried to win. That's the whole point. Losing on purpose should not be rewarded. I can guarantee you if a team pulled this stunt in this day and age the NHL would actually have the guts to take away the #1 pick, which they should have done to Pitts in 1984.

Let's suppose Montreal keeps Markov out of the lineup. Markov's not gonna be happy about spending two years re-habbing just to be a healthy scratch. Even if he doesn't say anything his agent does. Markov sure as heck wouldn't want to be back in Montreal next year after the bush league stunt and demands a trade. So too do Cole, Gionta, Price, Subban, Gorges, etc etc since they're all disgusted in their team's management.

The media smells blood and they do some digging. Eventually someone in the front office fesses up, the league investigates and figures out that yes, Markov was healthy and was kept out of the lineup in favour of Chris freakin' Campoli just so Montreal would have a better chance to lose a few extra games. PG tries to argue that Campoli is awesome and Markov wasn't ready, despite 19 doctors saying otherwise.

Gary Bettman dinged the New Jersey Devils a pick from signing Kovalchuk to a perfectly acceptable contract. What do you think he'd do to the Habs for making a mockery of about 15 games in an all-out effort to lose? The sad part is no matter what they do they're not going to end up in last overall, Columbus has that locked up. So is it really worth it to try to slightly increase your odds of holding on to # 3 and not falling to # 4 or # 5? Hell no.
BS, it's not close to the same thing.

We could simply go to Markov and say "Look, you're too valuable to to the team to risk anything here. We want to make 100% sure that you're okay. We're going to be overly cautious here and we're probably going to keep you out until the last 5 games of the season. We've already lost you for two years, the season is over anyway... keep rehabbing and we'll see how things go..."

Nothing wrong with this at all. Markov nor his agent aren't going to say boo about this. And even if they did, they have no standing to tell us what to do in this situation. The club has every right to be cautious with him. And even if they did go to the NHL (which wouldn't happen in a million years) it wouldn't mean Jack. Injured players want to come back early all the time. It's up to the club to deem when it's appropriate. Certainly you could make the case of caution here.

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03-06-2012, 10:28 AM
  #1003
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Have you ever heard about a guy who pratice with a contact jersey, but doesn't play a single game when there are 16 left?

It's strange that "[he] would like to play before the end of the season", while practicing in a contact jersey for a few days already.

There is nothing to understand about this case since the beginning.

Has the media went from too positive to too cautious?

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03-06-2012, 10:33 AM
  #1004
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This is a fantastic post which I agree with 100%. This is the Montreal Canadiens. The greatest hockey franchise of all time. Have some ****ing pride
Pride? That's hilarious.

Where has this pride been for the last decade and a half? We've got guys being drafted now who weren't born the last time we won a freakin' cup. Most of the players in the league only know us as also rans at this point. We're currently sitting in last place. Does finishing in third last make it better? No. It just screws up the draft pick for us.

There's nothing shameful in holding out an injured player a little longer and being cautious with him. Nobody is advocating that we tell players to tank games or lose on purpose. But it makes no sense to bring back Markov early in a lost season where beating lower tier clubs (that we're scheduled to play) hurts us.

Let him continue his rehab. Bring him back with 5 games to go. Let him play in the Worlds... that makes a lot more sense.

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03-06-2012, 10:58 AM
  #1005
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Pride? That's hilarious.

Where has this pride been for the last decade and a half? We've got guys being drafted now who weren't born the last time we won a freakin' cup. Most of the players in the league only know us as also rans at this point. We're currently sitting in last place. Does finishing in third last make it better? No. It just screws up the draft pick for us.

There's nothing shameful in holding out an injured player a little longer and being cautious with him. Nobody is advocating that we tell players to tank games or lose on purpose. But it makes no sense to bring back Markov early in a lost season where beating lower tier clubs (that we're scheduled to play) hurts us.

Let him continue his rehab. Bring him back with 5 games to go. Let him play in the Worlds... that makes a lot more sense.
LOL...how many times are you going to repeat the same point over and over again? We get it: you want the Habs to let him continue his rehab, then bring him back with 5 games to go, and let him play in the Worlds... that makes a lot more sense...TO YOU!!!

Are you going to reply to every single person who has a different opinion? Save your energy, or bring new points to the table.

Markov is arguably the best player on the team, and he's the one with the most tenure. After he's busted his a** for 2 years rehabbing, I think the organization owes it to him to let him play as soon as he feels he's ready, provided he's been cleared by his doctors. This is not only the best thing for Markov to build his confidence back, but also for the organization - for a number of reasons which you've ignored.

You can disagree with that, and you're entitled to your opinion. But please stop trying to hammer the same point across over and over again as if everybody is dense and you're the only enlightened soul here.

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03-06-2012, 11:02 AM
  #1006
Lafleurs Guy
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LOL...how many times are you going to repeat the same point over and over again? We get it: you want the Habs to let him continue his rehab, then bring him back with 5 games to go, and let him play in the Worlds... that makes a lot more sense...TO YOU!!!

Are you going to reply to every single person who has a different opinion? Save your energy, or bring new points to the table.

Markov is arguably the best player on the team, and he's the one with the most tenure. After he's busted his a** for 2 years rehabbing, I think the organization owes it to him to let him play as soon as he feels he's ready, provided he's been cleared by his doctors. This is not only the best thing for Markov to build his confidence back, but also for the organization - for a number of reasons which you've ignored.

You can disagree with that, and you're entitled to your opinion. But please stop trying to hammer the same point across over and over again as if everybody is dense and you're the only enlightened soul here.
Dude, folks are responding to my posts and I'm responding to them. Don't like it? Put me on ignore.

As far as new points go... what other points are there to bring to the table here? I've heard... it's about Pride, makes no difference if we get a lower pick, Markov will feel bad etc... I respond to these excuses as they come up.

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03-06-2012, 11:06 AM
  #1007
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Pride? That's hilarious.

Where has this pride been for the last decade and a half? We've got guys being drafted now who weren't born the last time we won a freakin' cup. Most of the players in the league only know us as also rans at this point. We're currently sitting in last place. Does finishing in third last make it better? No. It just screws up the draft pick for us.

There's nothing shameful in holding out an injured player a little longer and being cautious with him. Nobody is advocating that we tell players to tank games or lose on purpose. But it makes no sense to bring back Markov early in a lost season where beating lower tier clubs (that we're scheduled to play) hurts us.

Let him continue his rehab. Bring him back with 5 games to go. Let him play in the Worlds... that makes a lot more sense.
Nonsense! What you propose amounts to coddling. Rehab isn't an infinite process and you don't improve past a certain point. It's best that Markov demonstrate what he's capable of as soon as possible. He would benefit from game experience even if his ice time is limited. I suspect that your underlying motive is not so much to protect Markov as it is to preserve the Habs' lowly position in the standings (or possibly go down one more notch).

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Old
03-06-2012, 11:10 AM
  #1008
Slew Foots
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Dude, folks are responding to my posts and I'm responding to them. Don't like it? Put me on ignore.

As far as new points go... what other points are there to bring to the table here? I've heard... it's about Pride, makes no difference if we get a lower pick, Markov will feel bad etc... I respond to these excuses as they come up.
Nah, I don't mind it. I respect your opinion, even if it's different from mine. I just feel as though you're disregarding the more logical opinions & arguments that counter yours.

"Pride" and "no difference between picking 3rd and 7th" aren't the only arguments, and you know it.

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Old
03-06-2012, 11:20 AM
  #1009
CGG
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
BS, it's not close to the same thing.

We could simply go to Markov and say "Look, you're too valuable to to the team to risk anything here. We want to make 100% sure that you're okay. We're going to be overly cautious here and we're probably going to keep you out until the last 5 games of the season. We've already lost you for two years, the season is over anyway... keep rehabbing and we'll see how things go..."

Nothing wrong with this at all.
BS. Complete and utter BS. There's lots wrong with this. You've got to convince a guy that has basically spent 2 years rehabbing that "the season is over anyway" and he has to sit out some more games even though he's ready to play just to give a GM a small chance at a slightly improved draft pick. If you can't see what's wrong with this then you need help.

There's no way this flies over without incident. The first move would be Markov, who would ask to get the hell out of Montreal at the very first opportunity.

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Old
03-06-2012, 11:26 AM
  #1010
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Nonsense! What you propose amounts to coddling. Rehab isn't an infinite process and you don't improve past a certain point. It's best that Markov demonstrate what he's capable of as soon as possible. He would benefit from game experience even if his ice time is limited. I suspect that your underlying motive is not so much to protect Markov as it is to preserve the Habs' lowly position in the standings (or possibly go down one more notch).
You're just figuring this out now? Dude, you obviously haven't read too many posts in this thread.
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Originally Posted by NRG87 View Post
Nah, I don't mind it. I respect your opinion, even if it's different from mine. I just feel as though you're disregarding the more logical opinions & arguments that counter yours.

"Pride" and "no difference between picking 3rd and 7th" aren't the only arguments, and you know it.
Okay.
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Originally Posted by CGG View Post
BS. Complete and utter BS. There's lots wrong with this. You've got to convince a guy that has basically spent 2 years rehabbing that "the season is over anyway" and he has to sit out some more games even though he's ready to play just to give a GM a small chance at a slightly improved draft pick. If you can't see what's wrong with this then you need help.

There's no way this flies over without incident. The first move would be Markov, who would ask to get the hell out of Montreal at the very first opportunity.
Sure it does. Then again, I wouldn't have him in a contact jersey right now.

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Old
03-06-2012, 11:32 AM
  #1011
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Sure it does. Then again, I wouldn't have him in a contact jersey right now.
Then how does Markov explain to the media in broken English why he wants a trade to get out of Montreal, a team who signed him to a 3-year $16 million deal and gave him all season to re-hab his knee?

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03-06-2012, 11:37 AM
  #1012
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Pride? That's hilarious.

Where has this pride been for the last decade and a half? We've got guys being drafted now who weren't born the last time we won a freakin' cup. Most of the players in the league only know us as also rans at this point. We're currently sitting in last place. Does finishing in third last make it better? No. It just screws up the draft pick for us.

There's nothing shameful in holding out an injured player a little longer and being cautious with him. Nobody is advocating that we tell players to tank games or lose on purpose. But it makes no sense to bring back Markov early in a lost season where beating lower tier clubs (that we're scheduled to play) hurts us.

Let him continue his rehab. Bring him back with 5 games to go. Let him play in the Worlds... that makes a lot more sense.
I think it has been made obvious that he is done his rehab...

I can't believe your motive for keeping him off the ice is so we can finish lower in the standings. What's wrong with you? The guy has been rehabbing for essentially two years. He is DYING to get back onto the ice.

And you're holding him off the ice for stupid, selfish reasons that aren't even a sure thing. Not to mention the draft itself is just a damn lottery anyways.

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Old
03-06-2012, 11:38 AM
  #1013
Lafleurs Guy
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Then how does Markov explain to the media in broken English why he wants a trade to get out of Montreal, a team who signed him to a 3-year $16 million deal and gave him all season to re-hab his knee?
Well, obviously we'd have to assassinate him before this happens... Either that or Giloolooly him.

In all seriousness though, it doesn't happen. The club's waited for him for two years. He can wait a few more games. Besides we tell him he can play at the Worlds with our blessing.

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