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EDM/CLB proposal

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:24 PM
  #51
Vyse64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBJSlash
If it were so easy why haven't you been able to do this yet......


If we are going to risk not going to the playoffs next year you are going to pay a big price. Go ahead and offer Staois and a 2nd for Biron and see what happens.
becuase Conklin was coming into his own before falling off the face of the earth and Markkanen was proving to be a solid goalie (which he is but not overly impressive).

I'm sure Lowe will gladly take Biron for that over what DM is expecting for Denis

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:24 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilforcup
This is beginning to become pointless. What are CLB needs? You want a scoring winger because you dont need any defencemen and no gritty players. Last I checked thats what schremp is. You want one that will help you now? Why? You are not going to make the playoffs this year, and schremp will be ready next year.

You want an over payment for Denis, understandable, but to even suggest asking for Cogliano, Staio, and lets say nothing else is rediculous. I understand that losing Denis will hurt your playoff chances next year, but you can easily trade for a goalie or sign one in the offseason.

Yes I think the oilers should overpay, but not to the extent that CLB fans are suggesting. If most Buffalo fans would glady take a 2nd and Staois (also and overpayment), how is denis "a cogliano" better than biron??
Buffalo has to move a goalie. They have three.
Columbus doesnít. They only have two, one of which is not quite ready for primetime.
That is a big difference in situation, which creates the difference in value.

Also, as I said to a poster earlier -- the proposal I cited did not come from me. It is not a ďColumbus fansĒ proposal. It came from JonQuixote, who, I think, might be an Oilers fan. The second proposal I agreed to, which involved Torres, also did not come from a Columbus fan. It came from rigger, who again, I believe is and Oilers fan.

I like Schremp a lot, but he still has zero NHL experience. Even if he is ready to play next year, its concievable that he could struggle.
If Columbus wants to make the playoffs, they cannot put their hopes on a 19 or 20 year old kid who is a stud at lower levels, but is a total question mark at the NHL.

You view Staios + (pick or prospect) as an overpayment. CBJ fans donít because Columbus does not need Staios. Theyíre 8 deep on the blue line now and will be next year too. While Staios certainly wouldnít hurt Columbus, he doesnít hold that much value because the team doesnít need more dmen.
Staios has more value in a deal to Buffalo because they need dmen.

Its all simple supply and demand.

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:26 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HemskyFreak83
Denis isn't going to get what DM wants for him, he can keep Denis if he's expecting an over-payment, the goalie market is low, if people are expecting Kevin Lowe to over-pay, Lowe will just sit still
Yes sit still because as said before: GMDM dont need to trade anything but if he does it will cost and thats why HE(and we) DOESNT EXPECT ANYTHING TO HAPPEN lol

.. but its still fun to discuss possibel trades

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:28 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbj21
Yes sit still because as said before: GMDM dont need to trade anything but if he does it will cost and thats why HE(and we) DOESNT EXPECT ANYTHING TO HAPPEN lol
then we agree, nothing will happen, good

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:30 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilforcup
Vyborny is by no means a throw in, but I think you are overvaluing him here. When was he captain? When all the good players were in the playing in the NHL playoffs. And theres a funny thing about the past. Things change over time. Schremp dropped because of his rumored indifference to defense and team game. Since the draft his coach says he has corrected both of those, and would probably go in the top 5 now if the draft were redone
Captain of the Czech national team that beat god's team the 2005 World Championship Canada team.

Oh and nevermind that he already has 38 points this season, on pace for 60. He would look gorgeous on the Oil's second line.

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:31 PM
  #56
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If the goalie market truly was low, donít you think you wouldíve seen guys like Denis, Kolzig, Roloson/Fernandez and Biron change teams already?

Just because no one wanted Thibault or Lalime, who both absolutely sucked, especially in comparison to the goalies above, doesnít mean there is no market.

Several teams are champing at the bit for goaltending help but havenít addressed it. I can assure you that isnít because the market is low.

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:32 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HemskyFreak83
becuase Conklin was coming into his own before falling off the face of the earth and Markkanen was proving to be a solid goalie (which he is but not overly impressive).

I'm sure Lowe will gladly take Biron for that over what DM is expecting for Denis
Then why hasn't he? Why isn't Biron playing for the Oil right now for Ulanov and a 9th rounder?

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:34 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe
If the goalie market truly was low, donít you think you wouldíve seen guys like Denis, Kolzig, Roloson/Fernandez and Biron change teams already?

Just because no one wanted Thibault or Lalime, who both absolutely sucked, especially in comparison to the goalies above, doesnít mean there is no market.

Several teams are champing at the bit for goaltending help but havenít addressed it. I can assure you that isnít because the market is low.
Also a HUGE difference is both those goaltenders were waive wire players.

Waiver value does NOT equal Trade value.

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:34 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HemskyFreak83
then we agree, nothing will happen, good
I never said nothing would happen. If it doesnt it doesnt but if it does it means GMDM pulled another great deaL ^^ so i dont see why we should agree on anything.

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:51 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by futurcorerock
Then why hasn't he? Why isn't Biron playing for the Oil right now for Ulanov and a 9th rounder?
you make it sound easy, Lowe does have a budget to think about like even team has now, I believe it's the same reason Ottawa didn't get Doug Weight, the problem is money, players will cost less at the deadline then trading for one now, if you were an owner you want to save/make as much money as possible, its what Lowe has to work with all the time, and he has left budget room to aquire pieces at the deadline, unlike other teams who have little to spend (Vancouver).

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:54 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by futurcorerock
Then why hasn't he? Why isn't Biron playing for the Oil right now for Ulanov and a 9th rounder?
Just wait till after the olympic break, a deal will be reached. Edmonton does not want to pay a 4th goalie for 2 weeks when they are not playing. A deal will happen and Lowe will get an alright deal.

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Old
02-03-2006, 04:58 PM
  #62
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I like the deal... Schremp is a risky investment IMO anyway... he could be great, or he could be at the peak of his worth in regards to a trade right now. I have a hunch it's the latter. Being able to pick up a very solid starter, and a fantastic player in Vyborny for 3 non-roster players and getting to dump salary... I couldn't resist if I was KLowe.

However, many Oilers fans seem to convinced that Schremp is the second coming, so you might have trouble convincing them

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Old
02-03-2006, 05:06 PM
  #63
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If Denis was to go to edm, for me a major part of the deal would have to be matt greene. Before I evan considered schremp I would honestly have to see a picture of him so I could see what he looks like now. Past that For edm to get vyborny they would have to seriously overpay IMO.

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Old
02-03-2006, 05:08 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe
If the goalie market truly was low, donít you think you wouldíve seen guys like Denis, Kolzig, Roloson/Fernandez and Biron change teams already?

Just because no one wanted Thibault or Lalime, who both absolutely sucked, especially in comparison to the goalies above, doesnít mean there is no market.

Several teams are champing at the bit for goaltending help but havenít addressed it. I can assure you that isnít because the market is low.
people talk about supply and demand, it goes both ways

the main reason, there are a number of goalies on the market, that out-weights the number of teams looking for a goalie. Of course a team or two could over-pay but that even less unlikely now with salary cap and as I said ealier, players cost less at the deadline.

If teams do want to make a trade, they'll weight their options and look for a deal that fits them best than making a trade for the sake of trading.

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Old
02-03-2006, 10:40 PM
  #65
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Although he is a very good player, remember Vyborny refused to play in Edmonton when we drafted him in 1993. As a pending UFA, his time in EDM would be short, and most likely unproductive.

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Old
02-03-2006, 10:54 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilforcup
I think I may actually get flamed by fellow oiler fans for this one...but I think its really fair and even.

Schremp + Winchester (should become a good 3rd liner) + Ulanov (salary dump) + Conklin (salary dump)

for

Denis + Vyborny

Salaries are almost even
you get two studs going to edm and slugs going to the blue jackets

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Old
02-03-2006, 11:02 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLAMESTR
you get two studs going to edm and slugs going to the blue jackets
Totally right. On top of that, let me be the first to say

Leclerc > Smyth

Now back under your rock, please.



To keep this on topic, what about:

Markkanen + Winchester

for

Denis

?

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Old
02-03-2006, 11:45 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by futurcorerock
Then why hasn't he? Why isn't Biron playing for the Oil right now for Ulanov and a 9th rounder?
Mainly because Ulanov sucks and 9th rounders don't exist.

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Old
02-03-2006, 11:49 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HemskyFreak83
becuase Conklin was coming into his own before falling off the face of the earth and Markkanen was proving to be a solid goalie (which he is but not overly impressive).

I'm sure Lowe will gladly take Biron for that over what DM is expecting for Denis
I guess that finding a solid goalie doesn't sound that easy then.



Remember Dougie is going to need his socks rocked if Denis is moved. Markannen and a B prospect won't do it.

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Old
02-04-2006, 12:16 AM
  #70
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If I am sitting in Lowe's seat I do not trade Schremp or Cogliano. Edmonton hasn't had two guys with this much potential in the pipeline in a long time. These guys wouldn't get brought in except for an exceptional goaltender. Denis is better than Edmonton's trio right now, and he looked great the other night, but I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of the league.

If the CBJ have the needs that their fans on here say: a winger who can contribute right now + overpayment, how about this:

Torres + conditional second round pick(Edmonton has 2)

for

Denis

It won't be enough to satisfy the CBJ fans here, but I wouldn't pay more for the minor upgrade to Denis. We would have to find another scoring 2nd line winger somewhere, they should become more available as teams fall out of contention.

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Old
02-04-2006, 07:44 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5Whole
If I am sitting in Lowe's seat I do not trade Schremp or Cogliano. Edmonton hasn't had two guys with this much potential in the pipeline in a long time. These guys wouldn't get brought in except for an exceptional goaltender. Denis is better than Edmonton's trio right now, and he looked great the other night, but I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of the league.

If the CBJ have the needs that their fans on here say: a winger who can contribute right now + overpayment, how about this:

Torres + conditional second round pick(Edmonton has 2)

for

Denis

It won't be enough to satisfy the CBJ fans here, but I wouldn't pay more for the minor upgrade to Denis. We would have to find another scoring 2nd line winger somewhere, they should become more available as teams fall out of contention.
I think that's a pretty fair deal. Both teams get pieces they need that should stick with the club for years to come.

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Old
02-04-2006, 09:48 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5Whole
If I am sitting in Lowe's seat I do not trade Schremp or Cogliano. Edmonton hasn't had two guys with this much potential in the pipeline in a long time. These guys wouldn't get brought in except for an exceptional goaltender. Denis is better than Edmonton's trio right now, and he looked great the other night, but I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of the league.

If the CBJ have the needs that their fans on here say: a winger who can contribute right now + overpayment, how about this:

Torres + conditional second round pick(Edmonton has 2)

for

Denis

It won't be enough to satisfy the CBJ fans here, but I wouldn't pay more for the minor upgrade to Denis. We would have to find another scoring 2nd line winger somewhere, they should become more available as teams fall out of contention.

I would absolutely take this deal. Torres addresses a need in Columbus.

Then Columbus could move the 2nd and Luke Richardson for Biron.

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Old
02-04-2006, 09:50 AM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zamboni
Totally right. On top of that, let me be the first to say

Leclerc > Smyth

Now back under your rock, please.



To keep this on topic, what about:

Markkanen + Winchester

for

Denis

?
No way. I'd be willing to take Markkanen or Conklin in return to facilitate a trade, but not if Winchester were the central piece. Columbus has no use or need for Winchester. They have plenty of grinder prospects.

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Old
02-04-2006, 10:42 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5Whole
If I am sitting in Lowe's seat I do not trade Schremp or Cogliano. Edmonton hasn't had two guys with this much potential in the pipeline in a long time. These guys wouldn't get brought in except for an exceptional goaltender. Denis is better than Edmonton's trio right now, and he looked great the other night, but I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of the league.

If the CBJ have the needs that their fans on here say: a winger who can contribute right now + overpayment, how about this:

Torres + conditional second round pick(Edmonton has 2)

for

Denis

It won't be enough to satisfy the CBJ fans here, but I wouldn't pay more for the minor upgrade to Denis. We would have to find another scoring 2nd line winger somewhere, they should become more available as teams fall out of contention.
I like it as well.

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Old
02-05-2006, 12:18 AM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilforcup
I think I may actually get flamed by fellow oiler fans for this one...but I think its really fair and even.

Schremp + Winchester (should become a good 3rd liner) + Ulanov (salary dump) + Conklin (salary dump)

for

Denis + Vyborny

Salaries are almost even

So----nay aint going to go there........ why dont ya toss Smyth and Pronger in for a 7th rounder as well

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