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When Markov's back, what happens to Kaberle?

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Old
03-09-2012, 06:07 AM
  #1
Stormrider451
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When Markov's back, what happens to Kaberle?

So its pretty obvious Gauthier added Kaberle to try and replace Markov while he was nursing his injury.. Whether that was a good idea or worked is not the scope of this topic. Now, Kaberle is obviously pretty one dimensional in that hes only good offensively, particularly the PP. When Markov comes back, what will become of Kaberle? You guys will have 3 PP gifted dmen in Markov Subban and Kaberle. How would you guys like for those three to be used? How will the PP be run?

I know some will say, trade away Kaberle come the offseason and what not.. But lets be realistic, he has a big cap hit and may not be movable. Lets tackle this issue thinking Kaberle will be here for a few years along with Markov and Subban.

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03-09-2012, 06:19 AM
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Tuggy
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If all 3 are in the lineup then Markov-Subban on the first unit and Kaberle will play on the second unit.

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03-09-2012, 06:24 AM
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If you can't trade him, have your pairings on the PP of
Markov-Subban
Kaberle-Weber*

*If he is still around next year.

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03-09-2012, 06:47 AM
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Stormrider451
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrimsonSkorpion View Post
If you can't trade him, have your pairings on the PP of
Markov-Subban
Kaberle-Weber*

*If he is still around next year.
Ok, so the second unit. But not all teams run second units the same. Would you guys like to see a 50/50 split, 70/30 or less? Some teams really have a second unit thats just for the last few secs

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03-09-2012, 07:06 AM
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Emelin ought to have some PP time.

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03-09-2012, 07:13 AM
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If Markov is healthy and plays the last 10 games (and he plays them well) I think there's no doubt that Kaberle is gone in the offseason.

But for this season, RC plays with 7D anyway, so we'll have our regular pairings, and Kaberle will play about 5 minutes of even strength and he'll play about 2 or 3 minutes of second pairing PP time per game.

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03-09-2012, 07:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormrider451 View Post
So its pretty obvious Gauthier added Kaberle to try and replace Markov while he was nursing his injury.. Whether that was a good idea or worked is not the scope of this topic. Now, Kaberle is obviously pretty one dimensional in that hes only good offensively, particularly the PP. When Markov comes back, what will become of Kaberle? You guys will have 3 PP gifted dmen in Markov Subban and Kaberle. How would you guys like for those three to be used? How will the PP be run?

I know some will say, trade away Kaberle come the offseason and what not.. But lets be realistic, he has a big cap hit and may not be movable. Lets tackle this issue thinking Kaberle will be here for a few years along with Markov and Subban.
If Markov proves to be healthy I can see us trading Kaberle in the off season.

People complain about his cap hit but in the last 41 games he is 3-23-26.

2 years at 4.25 is not super expensive. the best thing to do is wait until all the big names are off the market on defense and I'm sure we can find a taker. Teams have more cap room in the summer than at the deadline, plus some small markets need to spend to get to the cap. I'm sure they'd rather get a Kaberle than a Campoli or Commodore.

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03-09-2012, 07:48 AM
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Kill it with fire

Trade him. Stop saying he has no value.
Visnosky is a lesser good smaller paid more and attitude problem Kaberle. He got a godly package. We can fetch a third/second.
Remeber Hal Gill?

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03-09-2012, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
Kill it with fire

Trade him. Stop saying he has no value.
Visnosky is a lesser good smaller paid more and attitude problem Kaberle. He got a godly package. We can fetch a third/second.
Remeber Hal Gill?
That may be, that hes tradeable. Not 100% sure.

On Viasnovsky's defense, the guy got 68pts to lead the NHL last year. Hes a stud. I dont know what the hell is wrong with him this year. But certainly other players in Anaheim seem to be struggling oddly like Bobby Ryan. So I would give him the benefit of the doubt, I think he could come back strong next year. Who knows if hes nursing some injury because hes better than that.

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03-09-2012, 08:31 AM
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Don't believe the hype about Kaberle's suckage that you'll see all over this board. The guy managed to help the Bruins when they won the cup less than a year ago. We Habs fans seem to jump to the conclusion that any perceived deficiency far outweighs any possible positives, and that a player will automatically get worse in each successive game played. Therefore, since Kaberle is not physical and is over the age of 25, it somehow means he sucks and is worthless, and will spiral downward to the point he's no longer fit to play in the ECHL.

Truth is, the guy is 21st in the league amongst defenseman in points even after a dreadful start in Carolina, and mostly with a crappy team here in Montreal. The Habs PP has been clicking close to 25% recently, despite being awful before he showed up. He's not dynamite in his own end, and that has been magnified by the baffling idea to pair him with Campoli most of the time. But Kaberle has been a #1 D man most of his career in Toronto, and like I said, didn't hurt the Bruins last year either. He can play on any team. There are literally no free agents of any value out there after Suter, so if the Habs decide to trade him they'll find a partner as teams are always desperate for offensive help from the blueline - look no further than Zidlicky, who still brought value back despite being awful and getting $4 million a year.

I think Montreal keeps him - having Kaberle skate with Emelin (defensively minded physical guy) on the 3rd pairing plus pulling him out for the PP is an absolute luxury for the Habs if and when Markov comes back. The 3 of them combined (Kabs, Markov, Subban) will give the opposition fits when killing penalties. If they did ditch him, no doubt another vet they bring in will likely be worse than Kaberle anyway, so why bother. Reinforcements like Beaulieu and Tinordi won't be ready for at least a few years.

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03-09-2012, 08:35 AM
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He's made into a stew.

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03-09-2012, 08:38 AM
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There's no way this guy should be in the lineup at the expense of younger defensemen that we're trying to develop. Emelin, Gorges, Webber, Diaz... those guys should be getting the icetime as well as any other kids that we deem ready for the show.

Kaberle never should've been added to begin with.

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Old
03-09-2012, 08:39 AM
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Hopefully a team is desperate this off season and tries to acquire him

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03-09-2012, 08:40 AM
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Kaberle's offensive game has been, as expected, pretty good. That's what he gets paid for.

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03-09-2012, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
Kill it with fire

Trade him. Stop saying he has no value.
Visnosky is a lesser good smaller paid more and attitude problem Kaberle. He got a godly package. We can fetch a third/second.
Remeber Hal Gill?
I don't think Visnoksy is a good example,

The best example is Marek Zidlicky, just as bad as Kaberle defensively but stopped putting up points offensively.

Ziclicky has 16 points in 48 games this year, and the Wild got Palmieri and a 2nd round pick for him.

Even with the extra year and 250K, Kaberle has more value than Zidlicky.

Now I don't think MTL will trade Kaberle until maybe next year's deadline at the earliest or offseason, after seeing how Markov recovers. But if/when it does happen, we will get a better return that what Spacek.

Funny how Canes GM Rutherford said he regretted signing Kaberle, but his biggest regret is going to be trading him too soon.


Last edited by habs03: 03-09-2012 at 08:52 AM.
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03-09-2012, 08:45 AM
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Get him a personal trainer and a sports psychologist. Reduced minutes as a PP specialist. Team won't be competitive for a while, might as well ride the Kaberle contract out.


Edit: Oh yeah, and buy him an adult sized stick and teach him to shoot.

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03-09-2012, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
I don't think Visnoksy is a good example,

The best example is Marek Zidlicky, just as bad as Kaberle defensively but stopped putting up points offensively.

Ziclicky has 16 points in 48 games this year, and the Wild got Palmieri and a 2nd round pick for him.

Even with the extra year and 250K, Kaberle has no value than Kaberle.

Now I don't think MTL will trade Kaberle until maybe next year's deadline at the earliest or offseason, after seeing how Markov recovers. But if/when it does happen, we will get a better return that what Spacek.

Funny how Canes GM Rutherford said he regretted signing Kaberle, but his biggest regret is going to be trading him too soon.
Huge fail.... I meant Zidlicky .... Oh...well...

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03-09-2012, 08:49 AM
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habs03
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Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
Huge fail.... I meant Zidlicky .... Oh...well...
ya, "CGG" bought him up too, but once your bring up the Zidlicky comparison in regards to trade value, all the people saying "no one would take Kaberle.." seem to not reply...

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03-09-2012, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo View Post
If Markov is healthy and plays the last 10 games (and he plays them well) I think there's no doubt that Kaberle is gone in the offseason.

But for this season, RC plays with 7D anyway, so we'll have our regular pairings, and Kaberle will play about 5 minutes of even strength and he'll play about 2 or 3 minutes of second pairing PP time per game.
I don't know if he will be gone in the off season. I think it would depend on the return and whether off season testing of Markov's knee are good. The team might want to keep him around as a backup plan just in case.

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03-09-2012, 08:53 AM
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You guys ever see that movie Old Yeller...

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03-09-2012, 08:55 AM
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If Markov comes back and has a strong 10 games or so to end the year, Kaberle gets dealt this offseason.

And what's hilarious is everyone saying what an awful trade it was, when all we gave up was a non-asset in Spacek, and we are going to likely fetch ourselves a pretty decent return. Classic case of buying low, and selling high. Great asset management by PG.

In regards to the D next year, I'd like to see us sign a Paul Mara type to keep the spot warm for Tinordi. Tinordi is going to be an absolute animal, and I think he's damn close to the show, probably just needs 40 games or so in the AHL to lessen the learning curve.


Markov-Gorges
Emelin-Subban
Mara/Tinordi-Diaz/Weber

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03-09-2012, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormrider451 View Post
Ok, so the second unit. But not all teams run second units the same. Would you guys like to see a 50/50 split, 70/30 or less? Some teams really have a second unit thats just for the last few secs
Good point. Based off what we've seen, it usually is the first wave getting about 1:15 and the second wave getting the remainder.

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03-09-2012, 08:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
If Markov comes back and has a strong 10 games or so to end the year, Kaberle gets dealt this offseason.

And what's hilarious is everyone saying what an awful trade it was, when all we gave up was a non-asset in Spacek, and we are going to likely fetch ourselves a pretty decent return. Classic case of buying low, and selling high. Great asset management by PG.

In regards to the D next year, I'd like to see us sign a Paul Mara type to keep the spot warm for Tinordi. Tinordi is going to be an absolute animal, and I think he's damn close to the show, probably just needs 40 games or so in the AHL to lessen the learning curve.


Markov-Gorges
Emelin-Subban
Mara/Tinordi-Diaz/Weber
You lost me at Mara. You wanna get rid of Kabs and replace him with Mara. He doesn't even play in the NHL anymore. At least Kabs puts up points.

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Old
03-09-2012, 08:59 AM
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habs03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
If Markov comes back and has a strong 10 games or so to end the year, Kaberle gets dealt this offseason.

And what's hilarious is everyone saying what an awful trade it was, when all we gave up was a non-asset in Spacek, and we are going to likely fetch ourselves a pretty decent return. Classic case of buying low, and selling high. Great asset management by PG.

In regards to the D next year, I'd like to see us sign a Paul Mara type to keep the spot warm for Tinordi. Tinordi is going to be an absolute animal, and I think he's damn close to the show, probably just needs 40 games or so in the AHL to lessen the learning curve.


Markov-Gorges
Emelin-Subban
Mara/Tinordi-Diaz/Weber
We'll have a lot of cap space this summer, so I think we should sign a guy better than Mara, someone like Allen or Jackman to a 2 year deal, give Tinordi 1-2 seasos in the AHL and slowly replace one of those guys and also give Beaulieu 1-2 who will be in the AHL next year too to replace Kaberle.

Markov-Emelin
Jackman/Allen-Subban
Kaberle-Gorges

1-2 years
Markov-Emelin
Tinordi-Subban
Beaulieu-Gorges

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Old
03-09-2012, 09:00 AM
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Markov - Gorges or UFA
Gorges or UFA - Subban
Kaberle - Emelin
7th D; Diaz (in pressbox)

on

PP
Markov - Subban
Kaberle - Emelin or depends who the UFA is



You cant really trade Kaberle in the offseason as Markov is too big a question mark

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