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2012 NHL Entry Draft Talk 4.0

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:23 PM
  #1051
Iwishihadacup
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Sometimes I wonder who makes those prospect lists. Obviously those top rated guys aren't worth a 7th round pick.
true story

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:24 PM
  #1052
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
I don't want to get into that debate in the 2012 draft thread, but the only reason Esposito busted is because of his injuries. WJC and on.
This.


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Originally Posted by Pine View Post
One of the knocks on Angelo Esposito was his lacking hockey sense. And hockey sense is actually one of Grigorenko's strong suits.

Among other things Em Ancien mentioned above, I don't see the comparison between Grigo and Espo, except that they both played their junior seasons for Roy.
Double this.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:37 PM
  #1053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
I'm having Deja Vu. This whole Grigorenko debate is taking me back to 2007 when the masses on this board were arguing for us to pick Esposito even though he was losing momentum on scouting lists due to character concerns (i.e. compete level). It must be an every 5 year cyclical event.

Esposito was not popular at all here in 2007 and the concerns about him were much more about the lack of progression and strenght than character.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:37 PM
  #1054
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
I don't want to get into that debate in the 2012 draft thread, but the only reason Esposito busted is because of his injuries. WJC and on.
Well the knee injuries did derail his career, but he was no sure fire thing anyways. I don't think you can say without the knee injuries he would have been a good nhler. I didn't see much in him other than his skating.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:37 PM
  #1055
Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
This.




Double this.
So what is it "this" or "double this"? "This" blames injuries and "double this" blames his hockey sense.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:39 PM
  #1056
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
I don't want to get into that debate in the 2012 draft thread, but the only reason Esposito busted is because of his injuries. WJC and on.
I don't want to debate this either but if you believe "the only reason Esposito busted is because of his injuries", you're entitled to your opinion but I certainly don't share it on Espo. I saw him play numerous times in person.

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03-10-2012, 03:40 PM
  #1057
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
So what is it "this" or "double this"? "This" blames injuries and "double this" blames his hockey sense.
K good, glad someone else saw that post as a "wtf is he trying to say?"

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:44 PM
  #1058
Em Ancien
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
I don't want to debate this either but if you believe "the only reason Esposito busted is because of his injuries", you're entitled to your opinion but I certainly don't share it on Espo. I saw him play numerous times in person.
He might not have met the lofty expectations that were placed upon him in 06 and prior to the 07 draft, but he would've been an NHL player.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:52 PM
  #1059
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If we go 7-7 in the final 14, which I think would be a stretch even with Markov's return, here are the records the other teams must have, at a minimum, so we still are ahead of them in the lottery:

NYI: 6-9 or 5-9-1 (depends who has more ROW)
CAR: 5-9-1
TOR: 4-10-1
MIN: 4-9-1 or 4-10 (also depends on who has more ROW)
ANA: 4-10
TB: 3-11-1

CAR, TOR, ANA and TB are all well ahead in ROW.

Holy ****.

Marc Antoine Godin ‏
NHL execs from three different teams told me #CBJ are expected to trade their 1st round pick (likely 1st overall) at upcoming draft #yakupov

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:53 PM
  #1060
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I'm hoping there's someone who posts or lurks here who is more knowledgeable about the KHL than most, who can post a bit about how the future is looking for that league? It seems to me the situation in Russia could have an impact on Grigorenko's draft position. IMO it is a consideration, if there's a chance we'd be bidding against KHL teams every time he hit restricted free agency. Even if he doesn't intend to go back overseas, that leverage could inflate his salary beyond what a comparable player could expect as an RFA.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:55 PM
  #1061
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
If we go 7-7 in the final 14, which I think would be a stretch even with Markov's return, here are the records the other teams must have, at a minimum, so we still are ahead of them in the lottery:

NYI: 6-9 or 5-9-1 (depends who has more ROW)
CAR: 5-9-1
TOR: 4-10-1
MIN: 4-9-1 or 4-10 (also depends on who has more ROW)
ANA: 4-10
TB: 3-11-1

CAR, TOR, ANA and TB are all well ahead in ROW.

Holy ****.

Marc Antoine Godin ‏
NHL execs from three different teams told me #CBJ are expected to trade their 1st round pick (likely 1st overall) at upcoming draft #yakupov

Woa!!! Why!??!

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:56 PM
  #1062
Em Ancien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
I'm hoping there's someone who posts or lurks here who is more knowledgeable about the KHL than most, who can post a bit about how the future is looking for that league? It seems to me the situation in Russia could have an impact on Grigorenko's draft position. IMO it is a consideration, if there's a chance we'd be bidding against KHL teams every time he hit restricted free agency. Even if he doesn't intend to go back overseas, that leverage could inflate his salary beyond what a comparable player could expect as an RFA.
There was a poster who used to do interviews with Russian players that could possibly give more information, but from what I've read, all of the teams in that league are in the red.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
Woa!!! Why!??!
Probably don't like dealing with Russians or simply want to pick up a D and like the fact they can pick up another good pick along the way. Last possibility would be they want to get the team started on a playoff run as soon as October and are dangling the pick for immediate help.

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Old
03-10-2012, 03:56 PM
  #1063
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Woa!!! Why!??!
The Russian ghosts of their past, perhaps?




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Old
03-10-2012, 04:22 PM
  #1064
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Our 1st + Leblanc + our late 2nd


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Old
03-10-2012, 04:29 PM
  #1065
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I'd definitely do our 1st and 2nd for CBJ 1st...

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Old
03-10-2012, 04:30 PM
  #1066
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Old
03-10-2012, 04:48 PM
  #1067
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
He might not have met the lofty expectations that were placed upon him in 06 and prior to the 07 draft, but he would've been an NHL player.
Habs got absolutely flamed for selecting McDonagh over Espo. The majority on this forum wanted Espo just like the majority now want Grigorenko despite similar red flags. Grigorenko will be a NHL player but I think a Forsberg or a Murray are better players to take if you're looking for better contributions to being a successful NHL team.

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Old
03-10-2012, 04:52 PM
  #1068
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Our 1st + Leblanc + our late 2nd

Let's make sure CBJ wins the lottery before making that trade.

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Old
03-10-2012, 04:54 PM
  #1069
Em Ancien
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
Habs got absolutely flamed for selecting McDonagh over Espo. The majority on this forum wanted Espo just like the majority now want Grigorenko despite similar red flags. Grigorenko will be a NHL player but I think a Forsberg or a Murray are better players to take if you're looking for better contributions to being a successful NHL team.
Similar red flags? The guy lit it up in international competition and has been nothing short of a dominant player in the Q.

Esposito doesn't hold a candle to Grigorenko.

Here's a cross-forum post that's a good summary of the situation :

Quote:
I think it's amazing that no one's touching Yakupov with a ten-foot pole right now, in terms of criticism. But people have been really laying into Grigorenko.

And it makes no sense, because Grigorenko has actually played well over the past month or so. It's Yakupov that's been slumping.

But all I'm reading now is "Grigorenko this", "Grigorenko that", and it's almost always some guy just nitpicking and finding something to complain about.

"He doesn't backcheck enough", "he floats too much", "he's inconsistent", etc.

Meanwhile Yakupov is off-limits. Forsberg must be perfect because nobody watches him. And Galchenyuk has the best situation of all. He's not playing. It's Galchenyuk nostaglia for everyone.

This twitter culture is only creating more confusion. I can't wait for the playoffs, because that will tell the story, no matter what the "experts" try to spin.

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Old
03-10-2012, 05:42 PM
  #1070
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Similar

Here's a cross-forum post that's a good summary of the situation :
Ditto. I'm in the draft the best of the Big 4 F available. But give me a break with this Grigorenko overkill and the myths of Galchenyuk (mia) and Forsberg.

If Galchenyuk is best, let's draft him, but go and read the prospect threads since last summer how he was low on people's list and posters had reservations about him (page 55-54-53...)... Now the longer he's been injured, he's been slowly leaping over the top Ds and the other forwards.

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Old
03-10-2012, 05:58 PM
  #1071
Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Similar red flags? The guy lit it up in international competition and has been nothing short of a dominant player in the Q.

Esposito doesn't hold a candle to Grigorenko.

Here's a cross-forum post that's a good summary of the situation :
Similar red flags in terms of compete level and holes in games. Agreed that Espo isn't as good as Grigorenko but we weren't picking Top 3 when everyone wanted Esposito. I'm just pointing out that Grigorenko is losing steam on draft lists much like Espo was at the same time of year and for many of the same reasons yet everyone here thinks they know better than the scouts and want us to take Grigorenko regardless. The good thing is it sounds like Timmins isn't interested in Grigorenko but of course the masses on this board know more than Timmins and have seen the top prospects play more than Timmins has.

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Old
03-10-2012, 06:00 PM
  #1072
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Our 1st + Leblanc + our late 2nd

nop let's keep our pick and draft twice in the top 5.

I'd trade Plekanec, Weber and Kristo or White for the 1st. Then we get two cornerstone to build around for the future.

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Old
03-10-2012, 06:02 PM
  #1073
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Originally Posted by Ceux de Montreal View Post
nop let's keep our pick and draft twice in the top 5.

I'd trade Plekanec, Weber and Kristo or White for the 1st. Then we get two cornerstone to build around for the future.
Yakupov + Galchenyuk

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Old
03-10-2012, 06:05 PM
  #1074
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Originally Posted by Ceux de Montreal View Post
nop let's keep our pick and draft twice in the top 5.

I'd trade Plekanec, Weber and Kristo or White for the 1st. Then we get two cornerstone to build around for the future.
Your user title is appropriate.

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Old
03-10-2012, 06:05 PM
  #1075
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Does it concern anybody that if Nick Ebert had been injured at the same time as Galchenyuk, he'd be Top-5 on everybody's lists right now?

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