Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
I'd love to hear what some LA Kings fans would think of this, but if I'm LA, I don't think of moving Quick anywhere right now until I know for sure he won't re-sign.
LA will not know that by the draft. LA has lots of time to decide what they have to do, and that depends on Quick, who has lots of time to make a decision. LA would be downright stupid to trade him at the draft or in the offseason, if they don't know for sure that he won't return - and again, chances of that happening are basically slim to none.
Basically when Schneider (and Bernier) are on the market, Quick won't be anywhere near that market.
But ignoring the bad example of Quick, your point that GMs should look around the league and look for best value, I completely agree with you here... but try and find a team (for argument's sake, a group of fans from a team) that would deal their goalie of value for what you're suggesting Schneider's value is here.
Canucks fans (most not all) aren't asking for that high a price... yes, we want to see good value back, but it's not a price where other teams will look at and go "we'll trade our quality goalie for that package"
My opinion is if you put one of these proposal offer from Cannuck fans on the table (Carter + 1st, Giroux + 1st, Hedman/Connollly/1st, Colombus 1st overall, Larson).
Many unavailable goalies could become avaible.
sorry, but those are all ridiculous trade offers that most Canuck fans don't expect to see back for Schneider.
I'm sure I can take a group of the worst fan proposals from any team, but that doesn't mean that's what Canuck fans in general are expecting to see in return.
Schneider's value, IMO, will be a mid/late 1st + quality prospect (quality depending on value of 1st). It won't be Hedman, or Larsson, or the 1st overall... or any established stars like Giroux or Carter (why on earth would the Canucks even want Carter??). And I doubt that Connolly's available now (although not for value reasons) - given that TB just dealt Downie and Ashton.
Just because you have a fan that says that Schneider is worth Crosby, doesn't mean that most Canuck fans think that's his value.
IMO Det. 1st + Connolly would be the value you expect for Schneider at the draft... though, again, Connolly isn't a prospect I see available anymore.
sorry, but those are all ridiculous trade offers that most Canuck fans don't expect to see back for Schneider.
I'm sure I can take a group of the worst fan proposals from any team, but that doesn't mean that's what Canuck fans in general are expecting to see in return.
Schneider's value, IMO, will be a mid/late 1st + quality prospect (quality depending on value of 1st). It won't be Hedman, or Larsson, or the 1st overall... or any established stars like Giroux or Carter (why on earth would the Canucks even want Carter??). And I doubt that Connolly's available now (although not for value reasons) - given that TB just dealt Downie and Ashton.
Just because you have a fan that says that Schneider is worth Crosby, doesn't mean that most Canuck fans think that's his value.
IMO Det. 1st + Connolly would be the value you expect for Schneider at the draft... though, again, Connolly isn't a prospect I see available anymore.
I will give it to you your are less unrealistic than many proposal i have seen.
But we are still almost a Connolly away from agreeing on Schneider value
I will give it to you your are less unrealistic than many proposal i have seen.
But we are still almost a Connolly away from agreeing on Schneider value
okay.. so then ask other team's fans, who would give up their quality goalie for Connolly + Det. 1st?
You think that's too big a price for Schneider, and if that's what it takes to get him, then other teams would offer up their starters (like Quick, or Thomas or Rask, etc) for that kind of a package.
Let's see how many fans from any of those teams would give up their quality goalie for Connolly + Det. 1st.
okay.. so then ask other team's fans, who would give up their quality goalie for Connolly + Det. 1st?
You think that's too big a price for Schneider, and if that's what it takes to get him, then other teams would offer up their starters (like Quick, or Thomas or Rask, etc) for that kind of a package.
Let's see how many fans from any of those teams would give up their quality goalie for Connolly + Det. 1st.
ok, Im starting a new thread about this....i will list every starter (even Mason) so we will get some gauge...
So what if Schieder ask for a trade because he hates shadowing Luongo? Could it be like Hogdson? Does anyone know for sure that Cody asked for a trade?
So what if Schieder ask for a trade because he hates shadowing Luongo? Could it be like Hogdson? Does anyone know for sure that Cody asked for a trade?
He doesnt even need to ask for a trade! Next summer, in the first week of July, he is free to negotiate a one year offer sheet with any teams in the league. If Vancouver Match? then he can walk away as UFA summer 2013.
Vancouver can do nothing to retain him If Schneider wish to become a starter and earn more $. (And i guess he wish that).
I dont see the point for Schneider to ask for a trade.
He doesnt even need to ask for a trade! Next summer, in the first week of July, he is free to negotiate a one year offer sheet with any teams in the league. If Vancouver Match? then he can walk away as UFA summer 2013.
Vancouver can do nothing to retain him If Schneider wish to become a starter and earn more $. (And i guess he wish that).
I dont see the point for Schneider to ask for a trade.
Why in hell would the Canucks let that happen? obviously he will be traded if they dont plan to keep him...
He doesnt even need to ask for a trade! Next summer, in the first week of July, he is free to negotiate a one year offer sheet with any teams in the league. If Vancouver Match? then he can walk away as UFA summer 2013.
Vancouver can do nothing to retain him If Schneider wish to become a starter and earn more $. (And i guess he wish that).
I dont see the point for Schneider to ask for a trade.
And yet, if (more like when) Vancouver matches, he's a backup for another year, something that he doesn't want! Yes, if Schneider is packing and ready to leave the nest next season, it is clearly his best option to sign an offer sheet instead of asking for a trade this summer... Especially when considering he could instead negotiate a 1-year deal with Vancouver on friendly terms, and be presented with the same result (1B Vancouver goaltender next season, completely free thereafter) without employing the more militant offer sheet signing! Nevermind, that through requesting a trade, he could forego being 1B another year (which he pretty much guarantees through signing an offer sheet), and start his career as starter next training camp... Yes, a year is a year! Both short, and long, depending on how you look at it... You have clearly thought this through...
What i am suggesting is its the job of a GM to look at all their options around the league.
I really think Boston will keep Rask, but Thomas could be a target.
About Quick it all depends of the unknown variable of the willingness of Quick to stay in LA beyond 2013 (UFA)
If you are LA and Quick tell you he doesn't want to extend his contract, he want to concentrate on Hockey and wait until he is UFA to see his option and sign the best contract of his career, what do you do with him if another team come with an interesting offer for him? (like one of these Schneider proposal)
How do you do this? troll and get away with it, is there an ebook about how to succeed at it, a youtube channel... I just don't understand how you get away with this all the time and you making it known that you have an obsession with Schneider threads to run them down, HF has gotten so tight with what you can and can't say and how you say it and you seem to bypass this.
How do you do this? troll and get away with it, is there an ebook about how to succeed at it, a youtube channel... I just don't understand how you get away with this all the time and you making it known that you have an obsession with Schneider threads to run them down, HF has gotten so tight with what you can and can't say and how you say it and you seem to bypass this.
Thats exactly why i say there was no point for Schneider to ask for a trade.
But even if the Canuck plan to keep him, they can do nothing to keep him if Schneider is not willing to stay beyond 2013.
if they plan to keep him it means they plan to dump Luongo and sign Schneider long term. Obviously he's not going to stay long term as a backup.. if that is what you are suggesting.
if they plan to keep him it means they plan to dump Luongo and sign Schneider long term. Obviously he's not going to stay long term as a backup.. if that is what you are suggesting.
I think what he's suggesting is that he doesn't see the point in Schneider to ask for a trade, because Vancouver will trade him before he has a chance to ask
If that's what he's arguing, I agree with him... I see no reason for Schneider to ask for a trade, after he has been traded...
if they plan to keep him it means they plan to dump Luongo and sign Schneider long term. Obviously he's not going to stay long term as a backup.. if that is what you are suggesting.
If Vancouver plan to keep Schneider, they should do it in the opposite order. Sign Schneider long term, or at least have an agreement with him. Then trade Luongo.
It could be risky to trade Luongo and then not having Schneider signed long term and near UFA status.
If Vancouver plan to keep Schneider, they should do it in the opposite order. Sign Schneider long term, or at least have an agreement with him. Then trade Luongo.
It could be risky to trade Luongo and then not having Schneider signed long term and near UFA status.
Really? I think if Gillis is interested in keeping Schneider for #1, Gillis should first trade Luongo, then let Schneider sign an offer sheet... If I'm Gillis I wouldn't match... Then I'd play Lack next year, sign Harding, and finally try to sign Schneider as an UFA when he becomes one...
Really? I think if Gillis is interested in keeping Schneider for #1, Gillis should first trade Luongo, then let Schneider sign an offer sheet... If I'm Gillis I wouldn't match... Then I'd play Lack next year, sign Harding, and finally try to sign Schneider as an UFA when he becomes one...
This idea have some merit, Vancouver would get the offersheet compensation and end up with Schneider anyway..
It remember me when St-louis was trading Keitch Tkachuk at the deadline to sign him again as UFA the following summer
Canucks and Leafs make terrible trading partners at this point since the start point for MG would be Gardiner and Burkie wouldn't pull the trigger on that one.
Canucks will at least want a D-man but Schenn likely would be what is offered and at this stage is a lower pairing player on a team with the 3rd worst GAA, shows very little in the way of mobility and seems to blow coverage pretty frequently. If people are going to blame Leafs goaltending for the GAA then they REALLY need a Schneider/Bernier and may ultimately have to overpay anyway. So is it goaltending or the D? Is Schenn salvageable? Maybe but I wouldn't give up a goalie (Schneider) who should actually be starting on the team he's currently playing for in exchange for a package built around Schenn since he'd be at best a number 4/5 guy on the existing 'Nucks team. Not that I'm totally enamoured with Hamhuis, Bieksa, Salo, and Edler all the time but there's no way I play Schenn in front of any of them. In fact, I'd rather see them develop Tanev, Sauve, McNally, and Connauton and fill the gap with decent UFA's or package a goalie for a clear Tier 1 D-man.
And I'm not saying Reimer and Gustavsson are garbage but Schneider is a significant upgrade and has shown to be a high caliber goalie at every level he's played.
Schneider - age 25
Drafted 26th overall, 2004 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cory_Schneider
2003 - U18 Junior World Cup gold medal (United States)
2004 - Dave Peterson Goalie of the Year (awarded by USA Hockey) & IIHF U18 silver medal (United States)
2005 - Hockey East (HE) All-Rookie Team
2006 - AHCA All-American First Team & HE All-Conference Second Team
2008 - AHL Goalie of the Month (Nov) & Rookie of the Month (March)
2009 - AHL Aldege "Baz" Bastien Memorial Award (Goaltender of the Year)
2011 - NHL William M. Jennings Trophy (Shared with Roberto Luongo)
Thats exactly why i say there was no point for Schneider to ask for a trade.
But even if the Canuck plan to keep him, they can do nothing to keep him if Schneider is not willing to stay beyond 2013.
Quote:
Originally Posted by I in the Eye
I think what he's suggesting is that he doesn't see the point in Schneider to ask for a trade, because Vancouver will trade him before he has a chance to ask
If that's what he's arguing, I agree with him... I see no reason for Schneider to ask for a trade, after he has been traded...
Quote:
Originally Posted by palindrom
If Vancouver plan to keep Schneider, they should do it in the opposite order. Sign Schneider long term, or at least have an agreement with him. Then trade Luongo.
It could be risky to trade Luongo and then not having Schneider signed long term and near UFA status.
Quote:
Originally Posted by I in the Eye
Really? I think if Gillis is interested in keeping Schneider for #1, Gillis should first trade Luongo, then let Schneider sign an offer sheet... If I'm Gillis I wouldn't match... Then I'd play Lack next year, sign Harding, and finally try to sign Schneider as an UFA when he becomes one...
Quote:
Originally Posted by palindrom
This idea have some merit, Vancouver would get the offersheet compensation and end up with Schneider anyway..
It remember me when St-louis was trading Keitch Tkachuk at the deadline to sign him again as UFA the following summer
No (at least not that I know of), I just think you have make a solid point on Schneider's value. Noone is giving up big assets for goalies these days.
Varlamov was a major exception made almost entirely due to the fact he was 23 and had so many more years of UFA status left.
LOL you are hitching your wagon to that clown ??
Couldn't have anything to do with the over the top hate that Calgarians have for anything Vancouver ?? No not at all.
Does Bingo approve of you guys posting on other message boards besides Bountiful ?
Kelly Hrudey, Pierre Maguire, Pierre Lebrun and Elliotte Freidman among others have all said that Schneider will fetch a bounty this summer. But hey you keep the hater glasses on .
I find these proposal more interesting when the OP come from a fan of another team.
Except that blankhall is a member of calpuck and hates everything Vancouver. He isn't objective in any way and he and others over there clearly are angry the way thier home message board is portrayed.
Couldn't have anything to do with the over the top hate that Calgarians have for anything Vancouver ?? No not at all.
Does Bingo approve of you guys posting on other message boards besides Bountiful ?
Kelly Hrudey, Pierre Maguire, Pierre Lebrun and Elliotte Freidman among others have all said that Schneider will fetch a bounty this summer. But hey you keep the hater glasses on .
Well put.
The only slight disagreement I have is that I don't think it's hater glasses...but simple fear. Vancouver has owned the NW Division for years and now they have an assets to move that will make them stronger while their rivals struggle to keep up.
Scary thought for some fans.
Gillis will move Schneider for an asset(s) that will make the Canucks stronger.
There's a lot of kind of dumb stuff been written in the last couple of pages.
The value for Schneider or Bernier will be similar. There will likely be 2 components, a pick and a prospect. The higher the pick, the lower quality (or higher risk) the prospect will be. I expect a mid-tier first rounder and an unproven prospect or an NHL prospect and an early 2nd round pick. It won't be Adam Larsson or Victor Hedman because they are the present and future of Tampa and Jersey's defense.
Secondly - the trade (at least in Schneider's case) will very likely happen on or before the 2012 draft because as a pending RFA that's when he has the highest value. As Bernier is under contract for another year, the Kings don't need to trade him, but the probably want to do it at the draft anyways.
Thirdly - it's not in either Schneider or Bernier's interest to sign an extension in Vancouver or LA. Sign and trade deals are rare - moreso when the player knows he is going to be traded. Also - no team is going to offer either of them a 1 year contract. That would be stupid. They will both be offered 3 year contracts.
With Schneider, just because he has some negotiating leverage doesn't mean he's a 1 year rental or will be difficult to sign. Coming out of Boston college there was some concern that Schneider might be difficult to sign to an ELC because if he waited until August he would be a UFA and could earn more money. But he signed with the Canucks even knowing Luongo was ahead of him and he would likely start with the AHL Moose. Cory Schneider wants to be an NHL starting goalie. If he is traded to a team where he has that opportunity, he is not going to be difficult to sign. Any team that is willing to give up the assets that the Canucks want for Schneider is going to be willing to pay him what he is worth.
