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03-12-2012, 03:15 AM
  #1
jonrazor12
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Doughty not meeting expectations....

Another subpar performance from Doughty against Chicago. If there was a game to get up for it was tonights. A lot of people have mentioned Kopitar as a player who needs to step his game up. Richards has been another player that people have been somewhat disappointed in. If there is one player that I feel is playing below his capabilities, its Doughty. I like the guy and have high hopes for him in the future but at this point he is the one guy on the team I cant stand. This guy skips camp, ends up being the highest paid player on the team, and plays like he has his head up his own you know what. Where is the Doughty of two years ago? The guy who was having more fun than anybody else on the ice. The guy who was spinning around opposing players like they were pylons. The guy who would take over a game and take initiative. Why does management single out someone like Kopitar but not Doughty? Time for Doughty to step up. I dont want to see this guy get a free pass anymore. He is on pace for approx 35 points and a minus rating. Not even close to being worth $7 mil. He is the highest paid player. Time for him to play like it.


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03-12-2012, 03:26 AM
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DontgoZiggy
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He's still a kid, gets a little leeway in my opinion.

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03-12-2012, 03:30 AM
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well he got exactly what he wanted, the way he wanted it.........

tells me a little bit about his character.
Every kid that skips team camp belongs to manchester... period
doesn't matter what his name is.

A long contract is working both ways.
If someone would ask me he would have a complete season in the pressbox to think about how nice it is to earn millions for a game, kids playing on an ice sheet.
And if soemone asks me some more, we traded the wrong defender away.
Doughty is almost at the same level than Blake was at his peak... to sad i'm talking about character here

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03-12-2012, 03:50 AM
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He used to have fun and enjoy what he was doing. It doesn't look that way anymore.

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03-12-2012, 04:15 AM
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It seems like we can't go a week without overreacting about our best players. Put these games in perspective. He takes on the toughest opponents so everyone's darlings don't have to. He's also a ripe old 22 years old. People were still making excuses for a 25 year old Jack Johnson.

Doughty, Kopitar, Doughty, rinse, repeat...bad games aren't the whole season, they're still good.

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03-12-2012, 04:51 AM
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I mean really, it's the first year into his new contract. We should wait until next season after he has a training camp and such.

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03-12-2012, 05:33 AM
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I think it's fair to be tough on him with the loaded contract he signed.

But I certainly think its unfair to give up on him and label him a bust 6 months in.

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03-12-2012, 07:19 AM
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If I can defend him a little, I'd like to say that his on ice antics have improved this year. He's acted a little less entitled and his tantrums have gone down considerably. His game has plummeted though. He's still very young.

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03-12-2012, 09:29 AM
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He reminded me of Jack Johnson yesterday with his poor decision making. That was probably his worst game as a pro.

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03-12-2012, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurrilino View Post
well he got exactly what he wanted, the way he wanted it.........

tells me a little bit about his character.
Every kid that skips team camp belongs to manchester... period
doesn't matter what his name is.

A long contract is working both ways.
If someone would ask me he would have a complete season in the pressbox to think about how nice it is to earn millions for a game, kids playing on an ice sheet.
And if soemone asks me some more, we traded the wrong defender away.
Doughty is almost at the same level than Blake was at his peak... to sad i'm talking about character here
I'm not showing up to camp without a contract either. And if you'd put Doughty in Manchester, you're even more screwed in the head than you profess DL to be.

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If I can defend him a little, I'd like to say that his on ice antics have improved this year. He's acted a little less entitled and his tantrums have gone down considerably. His game has plummeted though. He's still very young.
I don't think his game has "plummeted" I think he set very high expectations in his second season and now that he's playing at about 85% of that level, people think he's fallen off. He's still playing at a level where he's a legitimate top two defenseman on any team in the NHL, plays 25 minutes a game and at times looks like that Norris nominee. He's fine, he can be better, but right now he's fine. Just chill out guys.

He's paid $7 million a year because we felt he'd be worth more than that long-term, so yes, he's overpaid right now in the hopes he'll be underpaid long-term. That's the point of long-term deals.

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03-12-2012, 10:08 AM
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Last game was certainly not encouraging, but I'm not worried about him. It's been a crazy year for Dewey.

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03-12-2012, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by DontgoZiggy View Post
He's still a kid, gets a little leeway in my opinion.
$7m does not deserve ANY leeway. He's paid top salary to be a top defender - he's not even close.

Yesterday on NBCS Mike Milbury ripped into Doughty between periods, exposing his recent poor play. And he was 100% correct. Doughty has been making bad choices it seems like, forever. What's the over/under on how many times he gets beat during a game? at least 4 - 6x. And he's not contributing on the offensive end much either.

You know who used to bring it on D... and O? Rob Blake. He was a shutdown D that made the Kings a better team. Doughty is maybe 65% of the player Blake was.

Doughty really needs to up his game a lot for the rest of this season and have a quiet offseason and be ready for next year. He has a LOT of improving to do.


Last edited by Butch 19: 03-12-2012 at 11:59 AM. Reason: oops, meant Milbury, not Kenan
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03-12-2012, 10:13 AM
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Brad Doty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch 19 View Post
$7m does not deserve ANY leeway. He's paid top salary to be a top defender - he's not even close.

Yesterday on NBCS Mike Kenan ripped into Doughty between periods, exposing his recent poor play. And he was 100% correct. Doughty has been making bad choices it seems like, forever. What's the over/under on how many times he gets beat during a game? at least 4 - 6x. And he's not contributing on the offensive end much either.

You know who used to bring it on D... and O? Rob Blake. He was a shutdown D that made the Kings a better team. Doughty is maybe 65% of the player Blake was.

Doughty really needs to up his game a lot for the rest of this season and have a quiet offseason and be ready for next year. He has a LOT of improving to do.
This. This is where those work ethic questions from his draft year come into play. Does he log a lot of minutes? Sure. But if he were in better shape (concussion and missed training camp, etc), those minutes would be more effective. To be clear, I'm not saying he's in BAD shape; you have to be pretty well off to play in the NHL every night. But he needs to figure out how to grow from the kid who dominated boys in juniors to the man amongst men in the NHL. It's certainly not a lack of talent. It's partially positioning, and he's just getting outworked, and that's unacceptable.

I'm not happy with his play this season, but maybe it will be a catalyst for change. If there's one good thing about that rotten attitude of his, it's the hate for losing

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03-12-2012, 10:54 AM
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I still say Doughty is "The Franchise".

He held out of camp = dumb. His contract = about what was expected. Concussion = lingering problems? / combined with missing camp = he's been a little "off" all year but improving. Points & +/- = he's learning the game (combining top point production and defensive shut down role), a marked man every shift, still maturing as a person. Talent, desire, will and attitude = top notch & coveted by every team in the league. Norris Trophies = he'll be a top candidate again very soon I believe. Frustrating to fans at times = absolutely. Disappointing = no, fans need to be less judgmental of his faults and more optimistic about his meeting expectations. Trade him instead of Jack Johnson = NEVER! And I like Johnson and hope he does well throughout the rest of his career.

Conclusion = DD8 is the real deal. If this franchise ever gives up on him like they did way back with Larry Murphy, than I'm done and the franchise can rot in you know where.

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03-12-2012, 10:57 AM
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DontgoZiggy
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Originally Posted by Butch 19 View Post
$7m does not deserve ANY leeway. He's paid top salary to be a top defender - he's not even close.

Yesterday on NBCS Mike Kenan ripped into Doughty between periods, exposing his recent poor play. And he was 100% correct. Doughty has been making bad choices it seems like, forever. What's the over/under on how many times he gets beat during a game? at least 4 - 6x. And he's not contributing on the offensive end much either.

You know who used to bring it on D... and O? Rob Blake. He was a shutdown D that made the Kings a better team. Doughty is maybe 65% of the player Blake was.

Doughty really needs to up his game a lot for the rest of this season and have a quiet offseason and be ready for next year. He has a LOT of improving to do.
According to Nhl numbers he's on 6mill this year, rising. He's overpaid, but whose fault is that? If the market dictates he get 7mill avg, thats what he gets.

Looking at a comparison of Dmen salary in the NHL, it's interesting to see the ages of the Dmen on salary in the ballpark of Doughtys' . The closest paid player of his age (If i've read this right and its correct) is Luke Schenn (3.6 cap hit, 4.6 this year) every other Dman that is even close to doughty in cap are in their mid twenties to thirties.

Perhaps it's a little optimistic to be thinking Doughty would be playing like a 6mill dollar Dman at the age of 22.

http://nhlnumbers.com/players
(type in defence in the search box to sort it)

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03-12-2012, 11:03 AM
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Mats26
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I think Drew stills needs to mature as a player. I would also love to see him play with a younger,faster player than Scuderi. Scuds is a shutdown D, Drew needs to play with a hybrid, like Suter or maybe Carle.

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03-12-2012, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
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I think Drew stills needs to mature as a player. I would also love to see him play with a younger,faster player than Scuderi. Scuds is a shutdown D, Drew needs to play with a hybrid, like Suter or maybe Carle.
I think he needs to mature as a human being. The entire Kings team needs to focus on summer conditioning and come into camp in top notch shape and that should start with the "core" of the Kings.

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03-12-2012, 11:23 AM
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I think Drew stills needs to mature as a player. I would also love to see him play with a younger,faster player than Scuderi. Scuds is a shutdown D, Drew needs to play with a hybrid, like Suter or maybe Carle.
well naturally , hes still a young dude. i disagree about the second part here...Doughty has amazing offensive instincts and it would really stink to see those go to waste if he were to be a stay at home D man

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03-12-2012, 11:30 AM
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well naturally , hes still a young dude. i disagree about the second part here...Doughty has amazing offensive instincts and it would really stink to see those go to waste if he were to be a stay at home D man
I agree, but would they really go to waste?

I'm thinking of his role on Team Canada here. He had a superb tournament, and that's because he was very focused on D first.

We obviously need him in a more dynamic role in LA, but it seems like he needs a renewed focus on the details of defense. I'm sick of watching him get beat on the walls with speed and strength or losing his man in front (and much of that probably comes with elite athlete conditioning as he needs to play big, EFFECTIVE minutes, not just big minutes).

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03-12-2012, 11:35 AM
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you bring up some great points. first and foremost he needs to be in better shape(when he got beat in detroit i nearly punched a hole in my tv)...beyond that i think he could make better choices when it comes to getting involved with the offense and when its time to stay behind. aside from those things, which will get better in time, hes a great player and theres really no need to harp him for having a few bad games

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03-12-2012, 11:46 AM
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Well, we seem to be at a crossroads with Drew.

We can choose to rip him incessantly, based on the short term, knee-jerk thought of "you signed a $7/yr contract and you should be playing like it NOW". Rip him, boo him, call him an underachiever....and deal with the probable after effects of it.

Or....

We could realize that at 22, he's still just a kid. He plays a game where people earn millions - most later in their careers, but since Doughty flashed signs of brilliance early, the "system" saw fit to pay him now. His agent demanded it, DL agreed to it. Fact is, he wasn't ready for it. He head blew up to the size of the Goodyear blimp in that Olympic year, and now he's learning the hard lessons of humility. Those lessons take time to learn. Unfortunately for us, he's getting paid BIG TIME to learn those lessons - this makes it harder to support him as he goes through this.

So, short of trading him, our only choice seems to be to support him, since NOT supporting him has absolutely zero positive consequences.

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03-12-2012, 11:55 AM
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I agree, but would they really go to waste?

I'm thinking of his role on Team Canada here. He had a superb tournament, and that's because he was very focused on D first.

We obviously need him in a more dynamic role in LA, but it seems like he needs a renewed focus on the details of defense. I'm sick of watching him get beat on the walls with speed and strength or losing his man in front (and much of that probably comes with elite athlete conditioning as he needs to play big, EFFECTIVE minutes, not just big minutes).
This is pretty great point. DD has always sort of been at his best when he is playing a simple defensive game and is able to focus on defense and can jump into a play when he is able to. I'm thinking some of his struggles this year might be trying to play to his contract and be "the guy" on this team, which isn't the case anymore. He needs to take care of his own end first and be patient and wait for the chances to come. Voinov's goal last night was a great example of jumping into the rush at the perfect moment and Drew needs to quit trying to make chances happen.

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03-12-2012, 01:26 PM
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frustrates me to no end at this point. the reasons why have more to do with his character than on ice performance, but i think his performance on ice is a result of his character. he is still a kid that has had ridiculous expectations placed on him and i think he tries to hard to live up to being the next Orr. F that i just want Doughty v2009-10. he just has to play within his means and not what people label him.

the hold out was just dumb for everyone involved. of course his agent is going to go for max everything and DL was going to do what he could to minimize. DD on the other hand if he was smart would have just taken a 2 or 3-year deal for $3-5M. it would have paid him well and gotten him to camp. in the end he would end up with his $7M contract down the road.

getting to camp on time and early in his career will do more in the long run for his career. get in, get in shape, build chemistry, develop as a leader, etc. instead he held out and all of that went down the drain. he was out of shape, out of touch, ended up injured. the injury likely wouldn't have happened if he was at camp and in shape, because he would have been up ice another X' feet. argue it if you must, but its a valid point.

in game i think he is trying to do to much when it comes to pushing up ice out of the D zone, or making poor reads on the pinch. this could be him and it could also be a combo of the scoring woes, that he feels he needs to push it further. i think when LA finds some scoring balance up front it will ultimately help DD on the back end.

i agree with others that he is trying to do to much, to often. i think he is trying to live up to expectations and $7M. he needs to just slow it down and not push. god i wish he had someone like L Robinson back behind the bench. a coach that had equally as high expectations early in his career to talk to.

with a new regime change hopefully coming over the summer. i pray they bring in some coach(es) that can connect with these young guys like DD and help them with their brains. there seems to be quite a few that could use some counseling and coaching all at the same time.

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03-12-2012, 01:41 PM
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I don't think his game has "plummeted" I think he set very high expectations in his second season and now that he's playing at about 85% of that level, people think he's fallen off. He's still playing at a level where he's a legitimate top two defenseman on any team in the NHL, plays 25 minutes a game and at times looks like that Norris nominee. He's fine, he can be better, but right now he's fine. Just chill out guys.
.
Every aspect of his game can be questioned. There isn't one area of his game that has not gone the wrong direction. Saying he plays 25 minutes is mute to me because he has not earned those minutes. He has been given the keys of the kingdom since his rookie season. He's been given the most opportunistic shifts, given the best partners and every fault has been overlooked.

His hockey IQ was supposed to be off the charts now looks average at best. His decision making on the PP is confusing and his shot is mind boggling in how long he takes. His defensive angles blow me away. This is not the same guy. Not in the least.

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03-12-2012, 01:57 PM
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He is meeting mine. If anything he superexceeded them during his first couple of years and now at 22 is starting to develop at a more humanly rate then the freakish rate that he had been doing.

He is still our #2 best Dman at 22 and that is important considering that we are the #3d team in the game. I know that it isn't all the result of our D but DD is a big part of the overall reason.

Imagine him in three years when he will still be a young man as far as Dmen development is concerned.

This kid is going to be among the very best and if you can't see that then you simply can't see a phenomenal young D man who is waaaaaaaaaaaay ahead of the curve.

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