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Old
02-26-2012, 03:16 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Prophet of Glennie View Post
So he sucks. He brings nothing to the team. If he was a decent player he would be playing. There is hardly any enforcers left who bring nothing else but fighting. At least Barch is a semi-decent 4th liner who is an amazing locker room guy.

And Dallas is soft? Rofl, go back to your own teams forum you're completely wrong and don't have a clue what you're talking about.
You're 21st in fights this year, have no big hitters besides Souray, and play a Detroit-influenced style of hockey. Your team is soft, get over it.

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02-26-2012, 03:17 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Prophet of Glennie View Post
So he sucks. He brings nothing to the team. If he was a decent player he would be playing. There is hardly any enforcers left who bring nothing else but fighting. At least Barch is a semi-decent 4th liner who is an amazing locker room guy.

And Dallas is soft? Rofl, go back to your own teams forum you're completely wrong and don't have a clue what you're talking about.
Not to mention Luko is a D-man...so he's in a more important position than Godard, and Godard is still on pace to play more than half the season, he's played 36 games so far out of a 76 game schedule.

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02-26-2012, 03:17 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
have no big hitters besides Souray

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Old
02-26-2012, 03:19 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
You're 21st in fights this year, have no big hitters besides Souray, and play a Detroit-influenced style of hockey. Your team is soft, get over it.
Oh my since we're 21st in fights we're soft.

This team is one of the toughest in the league.


Last edited by piqued: 02-26-2012 at 03:40 PM.
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02-26-2012, 03:23 PM
  #80
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You have no arguement besides fights. You've never watched this team, there isn't one soft player in this lineup. Even Eriksson who isn't physical isn't soft. Every player goes in tough in the corners. We have one of the best checkers in the league in Fistric. Benn, Morrow, Ott, Dvorak, Burish, Nystrom all play banging styles. This team is one of the toughest in the league.


Last edited by piqued: 02-26-2012 at 03:41 PM. Reason: QDP
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02-26-2012, 03:30 PM
  #81
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Reopened. Let's try to stick to the original topic.


Last edited by piqued: 02-26-2012 at 03:53 PM.
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Old
02-26-2012, 03:52 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
You're 21st in fights this year, have no big hitters besides Souray, and play a Detroit-influenced style of hockey. Your team is soft, get over it.
You forgot the

Why don't you watch a game before you say something like this?

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Old
02-26-2012, 04:27 PM
  #83
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You don't want an enforcer? O.o
No. Enforcers are useless.

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Old
02-26-2012, 06:13 PM
  #84
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Piqued, I know you asked us to move along, but I really need to make one point.

This rather rude poster insinuated the veteran rule keeps Goddard out.

Since Texas dresses 18 skaters, 12 have to have played less than 260 REGULAR SEASON GAMES.

ONE can have played 320 or fewer REGULAR season games. That means at any time, no more than FIVE can be on a roster who have played more than 320.

Of the players on Texas' roster Brad Lukowich and Eric Goddard obviously fit in the 5 veteran limit.

Maxime Fortunus is the third with 449 regular season games.

With 313 games, Wathier is the one player with less than 320 games. However, Spang also has played less than 320 with only 312 games. However, since only one counts for this group, he falls into the group of 320 or more.

That means Texas could play every veteran, Godard included, and still add one more vet before they reached the limit. However, Godard sits.

If you are going to go out on a limb, be extremely rude, and quote a rule .... you may want to back up what you are saying. Godard is scratched because he has not played well. Texas has more than enough space for their veterans.

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03-07-2012, 11:55 AM
  #85
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I thought I'd update this since I think it's likely Garbutt has played his way into a one-way contract next season.

Eriksson-Jamie Benn-?????
Morrow-Ribeiro-Ryder
Nystrom-Fiddler-Ott
Garbutt-Wandell-Vincour
?????/?????

Goligoski-Larsen
Fistric-Daley
Souray-Robidas
Pardy

Lehtonen
Bachman

AHL

Fraser-Morin-Chiasson
R. Smith-Glennie-Sceviour
Gazdic-Esposito-A. Smith
AHL Contract-Tousignant-AHL Contract
AHL Contract

Oleksiak-Lukowich or Fortunus
Dillon-Nemeth
Jordie Benn-Labrie
AHL Contract

Beskorowany/Campbell

ECHL: Coyle, King

Europe: Klingberg

Buyout: Godard

No Qualifying Offer: Hauswirth, Neal, Stefanovich

I'm making the educated guess that Souray remains in Dallas this time based on what was said after the trade deadline.

This puts Dallas at 44 contracts (needing to sign 3 for the NHL).

There are several interesting UFA College players I hope Dallas has a shot at that could add a contract instead of signing an AHL player. Plus, that goalie from Northeastern (NCAA) who came to Dallas' prospect camp could sign a contract, and Dallas apparently still has interest. I still don't think Theriau would sign with Dallas (since he can opt to re-enter the draft), but I'd try to sign him if they could.

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03-07-2012, 12:40 PM
  #86
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Can you explain how capgeek has King's contract sliding 2 years and extending into 2014?

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03-07-2012, 03:11 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piqued View Post
Can you explain how capgeek has King's contract sliding 2 years and extending into 2014?
No. It has to be a mistake. He turned 20 between Sept. 16th and December 31st last season so that was the first year of his ELC SPC.

CapGeek messed up Jack Campbell's contract slide as well earlier in the year, but they fixed it. They weren't allowing his contract to slide this season.

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03-15-2012, 10:19 PM
  #88
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I changed the title instead of creating a new thread since this seems like it can all go together.

From Mike Heika:

Quote:
Comment From Thomas ... What do you honestly think the Stars roster will look like NEXT season? I'm not interested in a "fantasy" roster, but what are your anticipated lines and d-pairings?

Mike Heika: That's a tough one, because I really believe they will be in the market for whoever the top free agent is. If Zach Parise is available, the Stars will make a great offer. If Ryan Suter is available, the Stars will make a great offer. I don't think they can get both, so if they get one, then that will change how they build out the rest of the roster.

For example, if they get Parise, then maybe they keep Sheldon Souray. Or, if they get Suter, then maybe they trust one of their young forwards in the top six. It's just too early to lay out lines for next October.

And, of course, there is the dreaded thought of what if they don't get anyone to sign here...

Then, what do you do?
I'm going to make separate posts about Suter and Parise below because I don't want one extra long post.

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03-15-2012, 10:32 PM
  #89
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Outside of Suter, I agree that there really is no other D that Dallas should target, but I don't believe signing Suter means you don't sign Souray.

First off, I'll be shocked if Suter isn't locked up with Nashville before July 1st. I believe that Suter and Weber want to play for a franchise committed to winning, and I believe Nashville has probably done enough to prove to those two that they are serious. Plus, maybe more so for Suter than Weber, they'd be dumb to break up the bromance. Those two together have to be one of the best D pairs and most enjoyable to watch in the league. So, I don't even consider Suter a realistic target at this point.

I'm not a big Souray fan, but he grows on me ... when he actually plays. However, I don't care too much that he's hurt a ton because it would be nice to get some of the Texas guys next year a few games (Jordie Benn, Dillon, Oleksiak, and Nemeth).

Like I said, I don't believe Suter is even going to hit the market, and I'd like to see Souray locked up sooner rather than later. There's no one that's worth paying long term, big money too that can replace Souray right now, and I truly believe he'll sign a short term contract (thanks to being 35+) at a reasonable cap hit.

I'm sure you could land a better player than Souray without much trouble in free agency. I just think those players cost more with longer terms, and they'll stand in the way of developing players.

Plus, let's just say Suter actually makes it to FA and he picks Dallas over every other team, Dallas can live with 8 D for a while: Suter, Goligoski, Daley, Larsen, Fistric, Robidas, Souray, and Pardy. Just like this year when Fistric and Larsen both emerged as Top 6 D, Dallas rolled with 8 until they were able to trade Grossmann for a nice return.

So ... my guess is Suter and Weber re-sign in Nashville, and Dallas rewards Souray with a 2 year contract averaging between $2.75 and $3.5 million per year. I think they'll slightly overpay based on their belief he is a key shutdown D and can maintain that level for at least 2 more years. The 2nd year lowers the annual cap hit.

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03-15-2012, 10:50 PM
  #90
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Parise is a tougher nut to crack.

First off, I believe he's a better target for Dallas right now. Suter is a great D, and you'll have to pay him like he's a legitimate #1 D in free agency. My fear is that part of his magic is his union with Weber. Will he be as effective and special with a mediocre D partner or just slightly above average if they put Goli with him? I think Suter is a bigger risk than Parise even though I'd argue another Top D is more important for the long term success of the team.

2nd, will Parise even be available? My initial thought is he's more likely to be available than Suter. NJ's money issues don't look like they'll be solved before July 1st, but they'll have to spend money next summer to reach the floor. The issue though is how will the floor be defined in the new CBA? I just can't imagine it remains at a fixed $16 million below the ceiling, but you know the NHLPA isn't going to want to cave too much on the floor. They'll want as much money as possible to be required to be spent by teams.

So, the rumor is the cap will rise to $69 million before July 1st, but the new CBA should kick that number down to $60 million before the start of the season. I believe Lebrun said the NHL is warning teams that they are responsible for recognizing this, and they shouldn't expect any passes to become cap compliant when/if the cap falls after the CBA. So let's just guess the floor stays consistent and goes to $44 million. Even though the league is funding the Devils, I'd still expect them to spend over the floor. The Devil's already have $42 million though invested in 13 players with no goalie signed. I think the inability of the Devil's to provide a large front-loaded contract plus greater needs at other positions will ultimately see Parise go to the highest bidder.

I also don't agree with Heika again that the option is Parse + Souray or Suter + Prospect forward. Even if you somehow land Parise, Brenden Morrow's career as a Top 6 forward should be coming to a close. At his age and recent health history, he an the team will hopefully realize the benefits of possibly extending his career with a lesser role in the Bottom 6, no PK time, but still contributing on the PP (a la Holmstrom in Detroit and Modano in his last few years in Dallas). IMO, a perfect off-seaon would see Dallas land one Top 6 forward from outside the organization, and then allow Morrow, Glennie, Fraser, and the college forwards to duke it out for the last Top 6 spot.

Carter going to LA and Nash hopefully going to the NY Rangers should seem to give Dallas an advantage in a run at Parise. I am skeptical that Gaglardi would go crazy to sign him, but I think that's the only way he lands in Dallas. GMJN and Gaglardi would have to basically go against their many comments saying that they aren't going to be like Buffalo and finance their future on July 1st. I guess the question is will they identify Parise as a special enough player to open the wallet and overpay. I'd be interested to see piqued workout some of the advanced stats on Parise's effectiveness. I understand them well enough, but not so much that I should be breaking them down for someone else.

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03-15-2012, 11:01 PM
  #91
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Finally ..... I don't buy Heika's last doomsday comment at all, "And, of course, there is the dreaded thought of what if they don't get anyone to sign here..."

It's not the end of the world, and it's far from dreaded. Signing Top 6 forwards and top pairing D in free agency is scary. In nearly every case, you are taking a huge risk with a big, big contract. I don't know that there's a perfect situation that's going to present itself year in and year out like Ryder and Souray did this year. I just mean that they were able to fill two pretty big roles with surprisingly low risk contracts (only 2 years for Ryder and 1 for Souray). If you keep trying to add key players in FA, you'll eventually fork over a big money deal or you'll keep taking risks on bargains and your luck will eventually run out.

If they believe Suter or Parise are special and can be core players for the team, fine. Just don't settle for a Matt Carle or Alexander Semin. The team is already moving in the right direction and I don't know those fringe players who will receive big contracts are worth the risk with Dallas' growing depth of young prospects.

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03-15-2012, 11:15 PM
  #92
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Wow ... I'll add one more reason I think Parise is gone.

I was just checking Kovy's deal to see how much NJ owed him next year, and they did a thing that I'm not sure I've seen on one of those crazy life time contracts.

In the first 2 years of his contract, he's only paid $6 million a season. In the next 6 years though, starting in 2012-13, his salary jumps to $11, $11.3, $11.3, $11.6, $11.8, and $10.

Normally, these contracts pay out big ASAP. I expected to see the numbers possibly start going down. Instead, the meat of his contract is just kicking in to almost the tune of double his cap it. Whatever the floor is, NJ will be spending $5 million over that number just to get to it because of the Kovy contract.

IIRC, the league let the Yotes go over the floor by $10 million this year. They'd have to let NJ significantly go over $10 million past the floor in order to fill the roster and re-sign Parise.

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03-15-2012, 11:21 PM
  #93
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On a final note, I don't like Dallas' chances if they don't make the playoffs and win a round or at least go out in a very competitive loss. They really need to get that #3 seed.

I think they need to prove that they are closer to being a top team than to still rebuilding. I think it's doubtful one team will blow everyone else out of the water and Parise will probably have is pick of lucrative contracts. The intangibles will be key and recent playoff success could be very helpful. The tax situation in Dallas is also a major plus as well.

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03-15-2012, 11:35 PM
  #94
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If the question of this summer were Weber vs. Parise it would be much more of a debate IMO. In that case I would probably go with Weber over Parise. Being as it is Suter vs. Parise it makes the decision to more heavily pursue Parise a pretty easy one to me. I think Suter is a damn fine defenseman. He may be the best defensive defenseman out there. I just don't see the all around game that I would want to give to a player making $7+ million. He's good offensively but not dynamic enough. Again, Weber brings it all to the table. He can pass, he can hit, he can skate, plays defense like a boss, has just the right amount of mean streak, and that shot...the velocity is one thing but the dude can hit the net. If Weber were out there I'd say you offer him what you want, go for a Cup full on in the next 4-5 years and let the chips fall where they may. I just don't see Suter taking any team to that next level.

I'm not all that interested in seeing any advanced statistics on Parise. I've seen him enough to know that he's a player you can win with. He's the hardest working player on the ice and gets results because he combines that with a solid skill set. Aside from that big injury he's been a durable player as well. I'm not sure how high or how long you go (both are going to be more than ideal) but kind of like Weber I think he's worth it. I see a lot of similarities in Parise and Eriksson and if we could just clone Eriksson and put him on the other top line then great. Parise is the closest thing to that and comes from a strong organization to boot.

I think the Stars should pursue Suter like the Texas Rangers "pursued" big name free agents 5-6 years ago. Rangers fans know what I mean by this. I think we should be (relatively) all in pursuing Parise.

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03-15-2012, 11:39 PM
  #95
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Sutter will almost surely go to FA. I'm like 90% positive of that. I know its hearsay but that dude who posted the "I hung out with Lindback" thread that got the team into trouble posts on another forum I frequent. When he was recounting the tale and posting pics and such he commented how Lindback basically said Sutter is gone come FA. Of course a deep playoff run could change that.

I'd give my left nut for Parise. He'd be a perfect fit with us. All-American allstar, top line LW, etc.

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03-15-2012, 11:43 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
If the question of this summer were Weber vs. Parise it would be much more of a debate IMO. In that case I would probably go with Weber over Parise. Being as it is Suter vs. Parise it makes the decision to more heavily pursue Parise a pretty easy one to me. I think Suter is a damn fine defenseman. He may be the best defensive defenseman out there. I just don't see the all around game that I would want to give to a player making $7+ million. He's good offensively but not dynamic enough. Again, Weber brings it all to the table. He can pass, he can hit, he can skate, plays defense like a boss, has just the right amount of mean streak, and that shot...the velocity is one thing but the dude can hit the net. If Weber were out there I'd say you offer him what you want, go for a Cup full on in the next 4-5 years and let the chips fall where they may. I just don't see Suter taking any team to that next level.

I'm not all that interested in seeing any advanced statistics on Parise. I've seen him enough to know that he's a player you can win with. He's the hardest working player on the ice and gets results because he combines that with a solid skill set. Aside from that big injury he's been a durable player as well. I'm not sure how high or how long you go (both are going to be more than ideal) but kind of like Weber I think he's worth it. I see a lot of similarities in Parise and Eriksson and if we could just clone Eriksson and put him on the other top line then great. Parise is the closest thing to that and comes from a strong organization to boot.

I think the Stars should pursue Suter like the Texas Rangers "pursued" big name free agents 5-6 years ago. Rangers fans know what I mean by this. I think we should be (relatively) all in pursuing Parise.
I think you do bring up a good point though .... could you afford to go after Parise this summer and then Weber next summer? Worst case scenario for the Preds would be watching Suter walk this summer. If he does that, I think you have to reasonably assume there is a chance Weber will do the same the following summer when he is also an UFA.

So ... would you not go after Parise in the hope assuming Suter leaves Nashville hoping to get a shot at Weber? I don't think you should take that risk, and I'd still pursue Parise. It's hard though .... because I don't know that Gaglardi would eat the losses to pay top dollar 2 years in a row. However, I think Parise and Weber are definitely players that are worth stretching yourself thin for.

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03-15-2012, 11:47 PM
  #97
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BTW ... I added current cap figures to the 1st post. I went with a $60 million cap mainly because that's what Lebrun and others are predicting it will be at after the new CBA is settled. Plus, I don't see Dallas jumping all the way up past $60 this summer.

ForwardsCap Hit
Ribeiro, Mike$5,000,000
Eriksson, Loui$4,250,000
Morrow, Brenden$4,100,000
Ryder, Michael$3,500,000
Ott, Steve$2,950,000
Fiddler, Vernon$1,800,000
Nystrom, Eric$1,400,000
Vincour, Tomas$800,000

DefensemenCap Hit
Goligoski, Alex$4,600,000
Daley, Trevor$3,300,000
Robidas, Stephane$3,300,000
Pardy, Adam$2,000,000

GoaltendersCap Hit
Lehtonen, Kari$3,550,000

Roster Size13
Salary Cap$60,000,000
Cap Payroll$40,550,000
Projected Cap Space$19,450,000

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03-16-2012, 12:28 AM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
I think you do bring up a good point though .... could you afford to go after Parise this summer and then Weber next summer? Worst case scenario for the Preds would be watching Suter walk this summer. If he does that, I think you have to reasonably assume there is a chance Weber will do the same the following summer when he is also an UFA.

So ... would you not go after Parise in the hope assuming Suter leaves Nashville hoping to get a shot at Weber? I don't think you should take that risk, and I'd still pursue Parise. It's hard though .... because I don't know that Gaglardi would eat the losses to pay top dollar 2 years in a row. However, I think Parise and Weber are definitely players that are worth stretching yourself thin for.
I definitely don't think you hold back on pursuing Parise this year in hopes that Weber becomes available next year. I think you approach this offseason as a big one and go after the only major fish worth (IMO) throwing the bank at. My feeling is that if Suter doesn't sign with a team like Detroit then he will be looked at as a very big disappointment. He can fit right in on a team like that and earn his paycheck but I don't see that happening if he were to sign somewhere that viewed him as getting the "big fish."

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03-16-2012, 12:45 AM
  #99
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Pardy's contract is looking awful now.

This is my dream lineup next year:

Parise - Benn - Fraser/Vincour/Morrow/Glennie/College Forward
Eriksson - Ribeiro - Ryder
Ott - Fiddler - Dvorak
Nystrom/Vincour - Wandell - Garbutt/Burish

For the forwards;
Parise will probably cost 7.5 (I think we'll end up having to pay a bit more than most for obvious reasons).
I'll put Benn in at a cap hit of 5.5 per. Not sure that's what it will be, but it should be around there.
Dvorak should be cheap. ~1.75 at most. If he wants more, just find a capable replacement for this price or cheaper.
Wandell shouldn't get more than 1.75, as well. But I'd be willing to push his a bit, as he's still young and has some potential.
If Burish is willing to take 1.5, keep him. In a very limited role, though. If not, just give Garbutt his spot.
The other spots are extremely cheap ELCs or low contracts.

On defense;
I'd give Souray ~2.5 per. 2.75 at most. He wouldn't be in the NHL if it weren't for us, so he can take a slight pay cut for that.
I'd give Fistric ~2.5, 2.75. He's probably worth less, but with the way we overpay defensemen, it'll be around here.
Larsen is a wild card. I'm hoping we sign him to an Eriksson type contract. It may seem bad now, but it'd be a steal in a couple years. 24 over 6 years. Expensive now, but worth it later on.

Bachman should resign for ~2 million. He hasn't proved enough to earn anything more.

So, if this were to all happen, the totals come out to:
Forwards - 41.1 Million
Defense - 22.2 Million
Goalies - 5.55 Million

I'm hoping my numbers just aren't adding up. So, going back and cutting Burish and Dvorak out by replacing them with 800K players, dropping Pardy's salary, trimming Larsen's down to ~2 million, and just cutting off ~250K from Fistric, Souray, Bachman, and Wandell's contracts, frees up ~7 million, which puts us under.

Maybe some of my guesses are just bad, or my math is wrong, but I don't see how it all works. We've currently got 23.8 million in our forwards, 11.2 in our defense (w/o Pardy), and Lehtonen. Assuming the cap will be 60M, that gives us 21.45M to resign everyone and add FAs. Benn and Parise will command about 13M together, and then we just have 1 bottom line hole to fill (just for now, Morrow is in the top 6, and Vincour and Wandell are on the 4th line). I'd like to see it filled by Garbutt, actually. Cheaper, definitely a 4th liner, but showed some offensive flair too. He's a cheaper, younger Burish. Wandell shouldn't cost more than 1.75 to resign. So the 5 forwards added end up costing ~15M, bringing the forward's total to 38.8M. (Note - this is with Parise. If we don't get Parise, this number would go down by almost 7M).

The defense confuses me. Souray should come back for ~2.5, 2.75. Resign Fistric to a similar contract. And then there's the conundrum of Larsen. I actually think he's more prone to an offer sheet than Benn. He's young and unproven enough that it wouldn't set off a **** storm, but has shown great potential and could be a target. As I said before, I wouldn't mind him signing a higher cap-hit, longer term contract, but rethinking it, I'd rather see a 2-3 contract at 2-3M. I just haven't seen enough consistently to know that he's worth that kind of money yet. I'll give all 3 of our upcoming FAs a 2.75 contract for 2 years, and I expect them to sign something similar to that. So that comes out to ~8M added to bring us to a total of 19.2M. Pretty cheap for an average defense.

Bachman resigns for 2M (probably 1-2 years) or he walks. He isn't worth anymore yet. 2.5 at an absolute max, only because the extra .5M is worth never seeing Raycroft in a Stars' uni again. So 6M for goalies.

Our cap would come out to 64 exactly with Parise. Can't happen if it's at 60, but again, cut some corners here and there and I'm sure we could work it out. Without Parise, we're at ~57M.

Something seems off. I hope I didn't just spend half an hour writing this only to find out that my math was wrong...

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Old
03-16-2012, 01:01 AM
  #100
Bennrocks
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i don't think parise is going to cost 7 million in cap space, also if they do cut the cap down to 60 million im sure there would be another rollback as there was last time. Most of the "important" teams would have less than 4 million in cap with players to resign and i doubt that would fly

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