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TSN Rumor: Islanders and Chicago "set to deal"

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Old
11-15-2003, 11:34 AM
  #26
Av-merican
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Pulford thinks they don't have a problem at center? Hmmm...well, I think that is a problem, though not a big one. I think this team needs to make development of its youth a priority--and this team needs a strong veteran base in order for the kids to learn in the best possible environment. Ruutu has Zhamnov to lean on, and I just don't think Alexei has the kind of character to really teach the kid anything. He was a HORRIBLE choice for captain. Scatchard or Peca would be far better choices as a leader/mentor for this team.

Niinimaa would look good in an Hawks jersey. He hasn't taken kindly to his reduced role in Long Island. He was The Man in Edmonton and maybe he'll flourish with a team short on defensive depth again.

Parrish? Hmmm...I wouldn't be giving up a key prospect like Vorobiev or Radulov for him. Stick with the youth movement--see who else might be moved. Ship Daze away for a box of band-aids.

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Old
11-15-2003, 11:43 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
Isles should be leery of moving any of their top 4.Defense has been the backbone of this yr's team.
Crew, fatal mistake. Your comment assumes that winning is a priority. Or even on the radar screen.

It's money that matters. The quality of the on-ice product is a distant second.

Sorry to be cynical, but when it looks, sounds and feels like a charade, it usually is.

Unless the answer to Vlad's question above about NYI clearing payroll space to move in more salary is "yes," it should be clear what the return would be for any move of Parrish, Cairns, Hamrlik, Janne, etc.:

Young, cheap unproven talent. (And we're not talking blue-chip prospects like Ruutu; that's fantasy.)

And, why not? Reading this thread, seems like a lot NYI fans would embrace a salary dump and youth movement.

Mediocrity rules!

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Old
11-15-2003, 11:44 AM
  #28
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Someone is alseep at the wheel (Milbury or Pully) if this supposed ''big trade'' hinged on Wiemer clearing waivers .

I really like alot of the Hawks younger/cheaper fwd's , Bell,Arnason,Calder but cant really understand why Pully would consider Parrish an upgrade unless Hawks are starved for a RW'er .

I guess we'll assume Hawks wanted isles to eat a chunk of Wiemer's salary if he cleared waivers and then he'd have been added to whatever package was decided upon as the base of the deal .

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Old
11-15-2003, 11:55 AM
  #29
CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier
Crew, fatal mistake. Your comment assumes that winning is a priority. Or even on the radar screen.

It's money that matters. The quality of the on-ice product is a distant second.

Sorry to be cynical, but when it looks, sounds and feels like a charade, it usually is.

Trottier I think the only reason we are seeing the isles shop players like Weimer,Parrish,Scatchard,Cairns instead of the higher priced players like Peca+ Hamrlik at this point is because of the parallels between the Milsteins/Redskins and Wang/Nets.

I think if it wasn't for the possibilty of seeing 5,000 fans a night at the Coliseum, while he tries to convince the NBA he'll be a good owner,this situation would be even uglier then it is.

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Old
11-15-2003, 11:58 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isles72
I really like alot of the Hawks younger/cheaper fwd's , Bell,Arnason,Calder but cant really understand why Pully would consider Parrish an upgrade unless Hawks are starved for a RW'er .

Daze facing a career ending back injury and Zhamnov out for the next several weeks with an injury.

I also wonder why the hawks just don't play out the string with their youngsters.I don't think Parrish is making that much of a difference.


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Old
11-15-2003, 01:45 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
Trottier I think the only reason we are seeing the isles shop players like Weimer,Parrish,Scatchard,Cairns instead of the higher priced players like Peca+ Hamrlik at this point is because of the parallels between the Milsteins/Redskins and Wang/Nets.

I think if it wasn't for the possibilty of seeing 5,000 fans a night at the Coliseum, while he tries to convince the NBA he'll be a good owner,this situation would be even uglier then it is.

It could also be the case that, Peca with his big fat contract, is not easily moveable right now.

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Old
11-15-2003, 05:13 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler
Is it possible that they might have dumped Weimer because they are about to TAKE on some salary? Or is that out of the question?
That's what popped into my mind, too.

Definitely an interesting rumor. The 'Hawks have a ton of prospects and young players, which the Isles would probably have interest in. But I really don't know what the Isles would want.

 
Old
11-15-2003, 05:15 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Av-merican
Pulford thinks they don't have a problem at center? Hmmm...well, I think that is a problem, though not a big one.
As much as it saddens me to say this, I think that the 'Hawks have holes EVERYWHERE.

 
Old
11-15-2003, 05:33 PM
  #34
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yea we do, we have holes on the Ownership
the General Manager
the Assistant General Manager
The Entire Scouting Staff

did i mention the Ownership?


then we have the coaching, id say its a black hole right there


now onto whats on the ice

let L&A be our goalies for now, dont see much of a point of going out and getting a Hurme or someone else, but if we absoultely have to, we can

Defense, Krapotsev getting playing time=bad defense
it needs to be fixed, but im not interested in a "quick fix"


offense: just a bit young, With Zhamnov and Daze out, we do need another goalscorer, and if the PRICE IS RIGHT, Parrish would look good.

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Old
11-15-2003, 09:10 PM
  #35
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Do the hawks have holes everywhere...

On this current team it looks that way. But any level headed hawks fan knows we aren't surpassing Colorado, Detroit, Vancouver, Dallas, and St Louis... THIS YEAR anyway!

SO why trade for a stop gap?

We have a ton of NHL calibre players coming up in the next 2 seasons. At every position.

The question is, will any of them be franchise players. that is the question!

What do we know?

We know that Parrish, Hamerlik, Niinima are all good, way better than average players... But they aren't FRANCHISE players.

There is simply No way that we move Babchuk for Niinima(unless Pully is completely in charge- cause he's nuts). Even though the odds are that babchuk will not end up being as good. We simply have enough depth to take the chance that Anton is a legit #1/#2(and he's already WAY more physical and has a cannon shot).

Now would we move vorobiev for a proven young stud like Iginla- YES! But Parrish isn't Iginla, and Niinima isn't Nik Lidstrom.

If Pully deals these kids, real fans of the hawks will be irate. We are stacked with quality prospects(I don't think there is a question that we have one of the deepest pool of players, the question for the hawks is how many of them will be top 6 forwards/top 4 dmen).

So please, let's not bring into question the "hawk holes".... Its simply an argument that doesn't apply- cause we aren't contending for **** this year.

I'll match our pool of players at any position with any other team. We won't have the high end prospects(the top 5 pick kind) but we have 5-6 legit NHL calibre players at EVERY POSITION. It won't take long before we see this payoff with the big squad.

So why risk the chance on trading a top 3 forward, top pairing dman for an above average winger or above average dman- when we won't be a serious contender for at least 2 more seasons? Most hawk fans are against acquiring Parrish... I am not. But its nuts to deal Vorobiev or radulov for him- its just nuts. Vorobiev or Radulov could be packaged for an absolute stud player- which Parrish simply isn't. If its a salary dump- fine... jump all over it. If Mad Mike is trying to win the trade- it simply isn't worth the risk.

-fullmetalninja

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Old
11-16-2003, 05:15 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fullmetalninja
If its a salary dump- fine... jump all over it. If Mad Mike is trying to win the trade- it simply isn't worth the risk.

-fullmetalninja
I agree with your post 100% (except I think you underrate Hamrlik & Niinimaa somewhat). Adding 2 solid players (example Parrish & Niinimaa) to the current squad does VERY litle to help this year. Hawks simply have too many holes. I wouldn't mind some limited veteran leadership to help the kids out, but not at the price it's likely to take to acquire MP & JN. Like FMN said - if it's a salary dump it's one thing, but if Milbury is looking for equivelant value it's something else entirely.

Problem is that Pulford (like Smith before him) is likely to screw the pooch when it comes to trades. At least we knew that Smith wasn't going to trade the future (his draftee's) for a quick fix. I have no such illusions that Pulford will follow that same strategy.

One thing is strange. Read somewhere where Pully said that we were very close to trading for Weimer, but it was part of a larger deal. If MM was close to getting something for JW, why waive him? Unless he didn't want to take any salary coming back, or Pully was offering crap, or Pully was talking out his rectum.

Just a tough time to be a Hawks fan. You just want to suffer with the kids developing, but you are deathly afraid that management doesn't have the pain threshhold to handle it. (Much like the NYR's posters that all want to rebuild, and mgmt refuses to give it a real shot).

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Old
11-16-2003, 05:26 AM
  #37
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Hawk fans don't want to trade their prospects and most nyi fans don't want to trade 20 something core players for prospects.

Looks like any trades are being held off right now.

NYI Newsday:

But before leaving for the trip Friday afternoon, Stirling already had spoken with Milbury about the situation. "We can't have this hanging over the team," he said.

"I wanted it to come to closure and I asked Mike to do that," Stirling said. "We'll get some time to show what the team can do. We have a tough road trip and this will be a good test for us."

In the meantime, it appears the need to decrease the now-$41-million payroll isn't as critical as suggested earlier in the week.

A person with knowledge of the situation said the team didn't expect to shed all of the $1.4 million owed to Wiemer this season. Because that now is Minnesota's responsibility, the source said, "That gives Mike some breathing room right now."

NY Daily News:

Coach Steve Stirling had initiated a meeting with GM Mike Milbury and owner Charles Wang before the Isles (8-6-2-0 overall and 1-4-2-0 on road) left Friday for this four-game road trip - to discuss how salary-dumping trade rumors were hurting the team.

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Old
11-16-2003, 08:22 AM
  #38
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Anyone think Wiemer got waived because he possibly did something bad?

He was told to sit and wait for a trade or to clear waivers,

We are finding out that teams were interested but the Isles basically decided to denounce his rights by waiving them.

Wiemer possibly did something and MM made an example out of him for the rest of his teammates to see.

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