HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Montréal best teams at drafting from 2000-2009?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-20-2012, 06:40 AM
  #1
palindrom
Registered User
 
palindrom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,148
vCash: 500
Montréal best teams at drafting from 2000-2009?

i invite you to read this interesting article

Excerpt:
Quote:
Over the 10 years in question, Montreal was brilliant at finding players all over the draft, but they didn’t hit a home run with any of their picks.

Read more: http://www.theprovince.com/sports/en...#ixzz1peUkmRy7
We should give Timmins Credit and stop complaining about our draft picks.

palindrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 06:49 AM
  #2
ReVeuF
Registered User
 
ReVeuF's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Montréal
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,038
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
i invite you to read this interesting article

Excerpt:

We should give Timmins Credit and stop complaining about our draft picks.
We are good at drafting nhl players, the problem is always drafting 3rd, 4th liners make us a team of 3rd, 4th liners, lol !

ReVeuF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 06:54 AM
  #3
Whitesnake
Habs of steel
 
Whitesnake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Lorraine, QC
Country: Canada
Posts: 48,689
vCash: 500
3 things:

1- We know already that we've produced the most NHL'ers or close to it.
2- We didn't hit homeruns.......yet. Which is something Price, Subban and MaxPac should take care of. But it is true that we've missed on potential great players. That 2003 and 2006 were key drafts and that we missed on them, also 2004 yet, the pool were thinner to choose from. That, I believe, for a guy who drools over the US, as he should, we should have a better record. So as in our own backyard.
3-And that drafting record should on his own fire Gauthier and Gainey. You can't be at the top of the drafting class and not be able to have a significant and gradual improvement as a team. You can't take those good draft picks like Streit, Grabs and Co and don't transform them into NOTHING. You can't have so many prospects do better elsewhere. We surely have the worst team of the league for that feature.

So clearly Timmins isn't the proble. But we've already established that already. Problem is that some still want to keep the guys who clearly stopped us from improving. Just because they made us a better team than the Réjean Houle era....Geez, when you are look as good people because you are doing better than Houle....are you really good? Or are the expectations set really really reallllllllllly low?

Whitesnake is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 06:56 AM
  #4
onice
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,589
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
Montreal was brilliant at finding players all over the draft, but they didn’t hit a home run with any of their picks.
If by home run they mean Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin then you need the top pick.

But I guess Price, Subban, Patches & McDonagh are only inside the ballpark home runs.

Also that article assumes that the only way to build a SC winner is through the draft. But the GMs of this organization have shown you can can also destroy a team by giving away for nothing or next to nothing your drafted NHLers (Sergei, D'Agostini, McDonagh, Ryder, Grabs, Ribeiro, Lats, Beauchemin, etc) .

I wish people would stop reminding me just how good Timmins is as head scout and how putrid Gainey & Gauthier are as GMs.


Last edited by onice: 03-20-2012 at 07:08 AM.
onice is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 07:00 AM
  #5
gobruins734
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by onice View Post
If by home run they mean Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin then you need the top pick.

But I guess Price, Subban, Patches & McDonagh are only inside the ballpark home runs
How about Bergeron, Krejci, Lucic and Marchand all after the first round?

gobruins734 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 07:05 AM
  #6
palindrom
Registered User
 
palindrom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,148
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobruins734 View Post
How about Bergeron, Krejci, Lucic and Marchand all after the first round?
They was all included in the study, Boston is in the top 10 of the best team at drafting from 2000-2009 While Montreal is first.

What about these first round pick by Boston:

Lars Jonsson (7th overall 2000)
Martin Samuelsson (27th overall 2000)
Toivonen (29th 2002)
Matt Lashoff (22th 2005)

All teams have their miss


Last edited by palindrom: 03-20-2012 at 07:20 AM.
palindrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 07:14 AM
  #7
palindrom
Registered User
 
palindrom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,148
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
3 things:

2- But it is true that we've missed on potential great players.
Other teams miss too!

How many other teams wish they had drafted MacPac? McDonagh and Subban?

Of course we could had drafted Frolov, Williams or Volchenkov instead of Marcel Hossa, but what about, Kryukov, Nedorost, Smirnov, Vorobiev, Yabukov, Kranhn, Alexeev, Jonsson All of them drafted before Hossa but didnt played as many game as Hossa.

Was Marcel Hossa a hit or miss? He was not too shabby for the rank he was drafted in 2000. (16th overall)

palindrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 07:31 AM
  #8
onice
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,589
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobruins734 View Post
How about Bergeron, Krejci, Lucic and Marchand all after the first round?
I don't know what point you're trying to make but I can direct you to the Bruins forum where they have lots of pointless posts. It's this way-------------------------------------->

onice is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 07:55 AM
  #9
hockeyfan2k11
Registered User
 
hockeyfan2k11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 9,166
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReVeuF View Post
We are good at drafting nhl players, the problem is always drafting 3rd, 4th liners make us a team of 3rd, 4th liners, lol !
Subban, Maxpac, Price, SK, AK, McDonaugh, Halak, Streit....

What are you talking about?

hockeyfan2k11 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 08:00 AM
  #10
Agnostic
11 Stanley Cups
 
Agnostic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,285
vCash: 500
It's like that Seinfeld episode when the car rental company doesn't hold the reservation.

Anyone can draft a good player, the important part is to hold on to the good player.

Agnostic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 08:15 AM
  #11
shortcat1
Registered User
 
shortcat1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Downtown Palau, ON
Country: Palau
Posts: 896
vCash: 500
I'm looking forward to see what we get in the next two years.

What with potentially five picks in the first two rounds (unless some are traded away for something else).

Ooops... make that seven picks in the first two rounds this year & next.

Lots of possibilities.


Last edited by shortcat1: 03-20-2012 at 09:26 AM.
shortcat1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 08:59 AM
  #12
HabsSlappy
Registered User
 
HabsSlappy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,111
vCash: 500
This is just a further indictment to how putrid our management has been over the last 5 years.

Gainey started off really well, building up our prospect base and making the Kovalev trade to finally have a game breaker.

It looks like everything went downhill once Gauthier was given the position of Assistant GM and Direct of Pro Scouting.

The trades we have made in giving up good young players for nothing has hindered this team to the point that we are back where we started when Gainey got hired. Ribeiro, Lats, Laps, SK given up for nothing and the grand daddy of them all, giving up McDonagh for Gomez and his huge cap hit have put this team into a death spiral. Had we just given Koivu a fair contract and avoided this whole Gomez debacle, we would be much better off.

I for one will be very upset if Molson does not clean house after our final game of the season. Please keep Timmins, but it is time for someone who knows talent and who will actually be liked by his peers.

Do you think teams give Gauthier favourable deals because they like him? No of course not....the ghost is likely not liked by other GM's so the only deals he can make are deals that he gets screwed on.

Time to bring in a social butterfly type who can be liked by his peers and his players. Someone who can create an environment that is liked by the players and that embraces their strengths. There is a reason that one or two players a year ask for trades out of Montreal. The SH** rolls downhill and it eventually ends up on our young talented players that Timmins does a good job of finding. Then management lacks the composure to actually get a good return for them.

HabsSlappy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 09:23 AM
  #13
beowulf
Poster of the Year!
 
beowulf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 36,986
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to beowulf
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
It's like that Seinfeld episode when the car rental company doesn't hold the reservation.

Anyone can draft a good player, the important part is to hold on to the good player.
It's not only to hold on to all of them but the right ones and to develop them properly.

beowulf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 09:52 AM
  #14
The Gal Pals
Breaking Hab
 
The Gal Pals's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,832
vCash: 500
Fischer over Giroux. It still hurts

The Gal Pals is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 09:55 AM
  #15
RaMMuT
Tank Nation 2012
 
RaMMuT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Palestine
Posts: 1,084
vCash: 500
Everytime I see or hear Ryan McDonagh's name I

RaMMuT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 09:56 AM
  #16
RaMMuT
Tank Nation 2012
 
RaMMuT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Palestine
Posts: 1,084
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by airic000 View Post
Fischer over Giroux. It still hurts
Hey man let's give Timmins some credit here!!!

RaMMuT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:10 AM
  #17
onice
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,589
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsSlappy View Post
This is just a further indictment to how putrid our management has been over the last 5 years.

Gainey started off really well, building up our prospect base and making the Kovalev trade to finally have a game breaker.
We seem to agree on mostly everything except for Gainey's part in this fiasco. I don't excuse Gainey one bit. He's just as much to blame as Gauthier - if not more.

every time I bring up his name as one of the culprits, his fans pipe up with the Rivet & Kovalev trade.

I'll hand it to Bobsled. He won the Rivet trade but it wasn't Rivet for Gorges & Patches. It was Rivet for Gorges & a 1st. Timmins made the Patches part happen. But yes Gainey won that trade.

As for the Kovalev trade there you see the real incompetence of this man as a GM. He gave Sather the choice of Balej or Pleks. Sather made the mistake of picking Balej. How good would that trade look today if Sather had picked Pleks instead?

So basically you've got the Rivet & Kovalev trade on one end of the scale and a truck load of ridiculous blunders on the other end.

onice is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:12 AM
  #18
habitue*
 
habitue*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,858
vCash: 500
Just imagine McDonagh and Giroux on this team...



habitue* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:16 AM
  #19
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 33,247
vCash: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Just imagine McDonagh and Giroux on this team...


McDonagh was drafted by Timmins, traded by the wrong people without probably asking Timmins how he was developing

Giroux well **** happens, plenty of teams passed on him as well

Habs 4 Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:20 AM
  #20
bcv
My french sucks.
 
bcv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,953
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RaMMuT View Post
Hey man let's give Timmins some credit here!!!
Yes. Let's.

bcv is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:27 AM
  #21
Ghetto Sangria
The implication
 
Ghetto Sangria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,038
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
McDonagh was drafted by Timmins, traded by the wrong people without probably asking Timmins how he was developing

Giroux well **** happens, plenty of teams passed on him as well
Actually, in the press conference after the Gomez aquisition, Gainey said they felt McDonagh hadn't progressed as well as they hoped up to that point. So a case could be made that Timmins gave them that scouting report.

Ghetto Sangria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:28 AM
  #22
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 33,247
vCash: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty Danglez View Post
Actually, in the press conference after the Gomez aquisition, Gainey said they felt McDonagh hadn't progressed as well as they hoped up to that point. So a case could be made that Timmins gave them that scouting report.
For some reason I don't really believe Bob

Habs 4 Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:41 AM
  #23
Em Ancien
Sexy 2nd Rounder
 
Em Ancien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mount Real Life
Posts: 8,881
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty Danglez View Post
Actually, in the press conference after the Gomez aquisition, Gainey said they felt McDonagh hadn't progressed as well as they hoped up to that point. So a case could be made that Timmins gave them that scouting report.
Still was our second best defenseman prospect behind Subban at that point, and defensemen usually take longer to develop.

There's also the fact that we gave up something of value for a pricey stack of garbage.

Em Ancien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:50 AM
  #24
Go Habs Go
Registered User
 
Go Habs Go's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Mississauga
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,446
vCash: 500
Nobody expected Giroux to be this good, not even Flyers fans when they drafted him.

Go Habs Go is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2012, 10:54 AM
  #25
Shadow Flyer
Why So Serious?
 
Shadow Flyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: The Interwebs
Country: United States
Posts: 3,714
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Habs Go View Post
Nobody expected Giroux to be this good, not even Flyers fans when they drafted him.
Giroux wasn't even the player the Flyers wanted. They were targeting Sanguinetti at that slot, but the Rangers swooped in and grabbed him.

Hell, Bobby Clarke couldn't even remember Giroux's name when it was time to make the selection. Sometimes you get lucky and miss the player you were hoping for and have a gem fall in your lap. Simple as that.

The Canadiens have drafted well.

Shadow Flyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:29 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.