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Former Jr Coach Graham James Sentenced to 2 Years - UPD: Crown Appeals - Post #85

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Old
12-15-2011, 10:15 AM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Eddy Punch Clock View Post
Put him in a cell with a Flames fan.
Put the Penn State guy in there with him

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12-15-2011, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
Ed Willes of the Vancouver Province on how the Graham James case has haunted him for years. He says he was told about what was going on 20 years ago but never wrote about it.
The conversation happened over 20 years ago and it still sticks to me.

Oh, how it sticks to me.

Bernie Lynch, then the coach of the WHL Regina Pats, and I were chatting when the conversation turned to the Swift Current Broncos.

The Broncos, to that point in the 1988-89 season, had written a remarkable story. Two years after a bus crash had killed four of their players, they'd built a powerhouse under head coach Graham James and star forward Sheldon Kennedy.

That season they went 55-16-1 and swept all three playoff series before winning the Memorial Cup in Saskatoon. Playing a dazzling speed-and-skill game, they were the talk of the league and that summer, I would write a story for The Hockey News heralding Graham James as hockey's man of the year.

Suffice to say that team and James is now remembered for other reasons.

“Do you know what's going on with Graham and Sheldon?” Lynch asked, before describing the pattern of abuse that Kennedy would make public some eight years later.

I've since asked myself five hundred times why I didn't do more to expose James; why I didn't ask more questions; why I didn't dig deeper. Lynch was hardly a WHL insider – it would be his only year coaching the Pats – and if he knew, it stood to reason others knew.
http://www.theprovince.com/sports/Ke...#ixzz1gaK13rXk
Jeez, impactful/well written is right.

I remember reading Sheldon Kennedy's book ("Why I Never Said Anything"). He covered all the bases without really taking shots at anyone other than James--but he also left the clear implication that what was going on was understood by a lot of people around the situation, and simply remained unspoken.

I just can't grasp how that can happen...with adults and people, and children's welfare at stake. If someone knew something, how could it not have been reported, dug into, or brought to light?

Guys like Sheldon Kennedy and Theo Fleury endured absolutely horrible things. Things I would murder people for if it ever happened to my son. Seeing a hatchet-job written about a victim such as the one Pat Hickey wrote about Fleury makes my blood boil even more. It just smack of ignorance, stupidity, and that same kind of you-just-don't-get-it-and-you-never-will simple-mindedness that some people have when it comes to situations such as these. Terrible.

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02-22-2012, 03:41 PM
  #28
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Graham James sentencing hearing begins today in a Winnipeg courtroom. He has pled guilty to molesting two players multiple times - one of them Theoren Fleury.

Fleury has filed a Victim Impact Statement and is asking that...
"James — who he called "a monster" — deserves a "lifetime removed from society."

"Do not show leniency to Graham James," he urged the justice system. "He certainly didn't show any to me or any of his other victims."
Sheldon Kennedy another victim is predicting that James will receive a conditional sentence as he was previously incarcerated for 3 1/2 years in 1997 after he pleaded guilty to sexually assaulting Kennedy, and another player an estimated 350 times over 10 years.

Crown attorney Colleen McDuff said in December there is no plea bargain with James and she will be seeking to have him serve time behind bars.
http://www.canada.com/news/show+leni...#ixzz1n9IICQxI

Here is the text of Theoren Fleury's Victim Impact Statement:
http://www.theprovince.com/news/Theo...162/story.html

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02-22-2012, 03:46 PM
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No jail sentence long enough for this sort of thing. It's good that the Crown is pushing for time behind bars, but it won't be long enough.

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02-22-2012, 05:18 PM
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He is an unrepentant predator. It amazes me that "civilized" societies believe we can reform predators of our own species, when the evidence clearly shows otherwise. Their brains are set, and the settings locked.

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02-22-2012, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by kevinsane View Post
He is an unrepentant predator. It amazes me that "civilized" societies believe we can reform predators of our own species, when the evidence clearly shows otherwise. Their brains are set, and the settings locked.
I do not think anyone is under the impression he can be rehabilitated - the best that can be hope for is controlled.

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02-22-2012, 05:37 PM
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I do not think anyone is under the impression he can be rehabilitated - the best that can be hope for is controlled.
Agreed, but I don't trust the system to monitor him. Unless he gets a lengthy prison sentence, he's still a significant risk to reoffend.

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02-22-2012, 08:56 PM
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The publication ban was lifted on the name of the other player who was assaulted. It was Todd Holt - Fleury's cousin. Holt's life was completely destroyed by James.

Charges against James in respect of another player, Greg Gilhooly, now a corporate lawyer were stayed earlier with Gilhooly's agreement.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/...oly-james.html

Graham James apologized to Fleury, Holt, Gilhooly and other players and arents as well as the "Canadian hockey public" and to the institution of hockey while reading from a prepared statement.

The Crown argued that James should serve six years in prison for his crimes, which he committed while coaching Fleury and Holt in the 1980s and early '90s.

James's lawyer, Evan Roitenberg asked for a 12- to 18-month conditional sentence that would be served in the community, along with conditions that would include a curfew, monitoring and counselling.

James will be sentenced on March 20, Judge Catherine Carlson announced late Wednesday.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manito...g-hearing.html

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02-22-2012, 09:01 PM
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6 years lol

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02-22-2012, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Canucklehead View Post
Jeez, impactful/well written is right.

I remember reading Sheldon Kennedy's book ("Why I Never Said Anything"). He covered all the bases without really taking shots at anyone other than James--but he also left the clear implication that what was going on was understood by a lot of people around the situation, and simply remained unspoken.

I just can't grasp how that can happen...with adults and people, and children's welfare at stake. If someone knew something, how could it not have been reported, dug into, or brought to light?
Sheldon Kennedy wrote in his book that opposing coaches would call him "Graham's little girl friend" or "f-word blocked by filter". But then when he went public with his charges against James, the same people pretended they didn't know.

The level of control that James exerted on his victims must have been unbelievable. Even as adults, Theoren Fleury, Joe Sakic and Graham James were co-owners of the Calgary Hitmen - and James was General Manager.

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02-22-2012, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by LeftCoast View Post
Sheldon Kennedy wrote in his book that opposing coaches would call him "Graham's little girl friend" or "f-word blocked by filter". But then when he went public with his charges against James, the same people pretended they didn't know.

The level of control that James exerted on his victims must have been unbelievable. Even as adults, Theoren Fleury, Joe Sakic and Graham James were co-owners of the Calgary Hitmen - and James was General Manager.
Are you suggesting that the names listed were also abused by Jones? It is awfully incredible that an owner would have hired his abuser to run his hockey team.

Jones will regret this for eternity.

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02-22-2012, 11:06 PM
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Are you suggesting that the names listed were also abused by Jones? It is awfully incredible that an owner would have hired his abuser to run his hockey team.

Jones will regret this for eternity.
Fleury played for James in Moose Jaw and wasn't a part of the Swift Current team or the bus crash, etc.

Joe Sakic doesn't talk about anything to do with Graham James or the Swift Current Broncos (his brother Brian also played for James).

Sheldon Kennedy's book doesn't name names of victims and he has resolutely refused to do that. However he does say in his book that Graham James chose victims that were vulnerable, had weak or absent father figures (single moms) and, outside of hockey, were insecure or lacked social confidence. That doesn't sound like Joe Sakic - although I would be surprised if Sakic didn't know that something was going on.

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02-22-2012, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by LeftCoast View Post
Fleury played for James in Moose Jaw and wasn't a part of the Swift Current team or the bus crash, etc.

Joe Sakic doesn't talk about anything to do with Graham James or the Swift Current Broncos (his brother Brian also played for James).

Sheldon Kennedy's book doesn't name names of victims and he has resolutely refused to do that. However he does say in his book that Graham James chose victims that were vulnerable, had weak or absent father figures (single moms) and, outside of hockey, were insecure or lacked social confidence. That doesn't sound like Joe Sakic - although I would be surprised if Sakic didn't know that something was going on.
From my training, this is the stereotypical profile of a child abuser who grooms families, communities and vulnerable victims. A real shame.

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02-22-2012, 11:39 PM
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Put the Penn State guy in there with him
Child molesters are usually held in single cell protective custody and segregated from the general prison population.

In many cases if they are doing federal time they are housed at Kingston Penitentiary in in Lower H, a super secure segregation cellblock which housed Clifford Olson before his death and now has Paul Bernanrdo and Michael Briere among others.

This is required under Section 31(3)(c) of the Corrections and Conditional Release Act ("continued presence of the inmate in the general inmate population would jeopardize the inmate’s own safety").

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02-23-2012, 12:04 AM
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Child molesters are usually held in single cell protective custody and segregated from the general prison population.

In many cases if they are doing federal time they are housed at Kingston Penitentiary in in Lower H, a super secure segregation cellblock which housed Clifford Olson before his death and now has Paul Bernanrdo and Michael Briere among others.

This is required under Section 31(3)(c) of the Corrections and Conditional Release Act ("continued presence of the inmate in the general inmate population would jeopardize the inmate’s own safety").
That's because they will usually get murdered by other inmates. As much as most inmates have murdered themselves, child murders/rapists are seen by the general prison population as the disgusting ****s they are.

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03-20-2012, 12:15 PM
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Manitoba provincial court Judge Catherine Carlson sentenced James to two years for sexually abusing two former players —ex-NHLer Theoren Fleury and Fleury’s younger cousin, Todd Holt — while coaching them in the junior hockey ranks during the 1980s and early '90s.

The sentence, handed down Tuesday morning in Winnipeg, is for two years on each offence to be served concurrently.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manito...-sentence.html

As far as the sentence you also have to take into account that James was convicted and sentenced to three and a half years previously on similar charges that occurred during the same time period.

Had the other victims come forward at that time all the charges would have been combined and sentencing done globally.

Since Canada imposes concurrent (not consecutive) sentences the total sentence for these crimes is on the order of five and one half years.


Last edited by Wetcoaster: 03-20-2012 at 12:27 PM.
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03-20-2012, 12:45 PM
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Sex offenders should just be castrated and sent to Guantanamo Bay.
That's too lenient, I would like to see them crucified on live television.

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03-20-2012, 01:10 PM
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That's too lenient, I would like to see them crucified on live television.
Not a realistic option.

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03-20-2012, 01:10 PM
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2 years is absolutely stupid. Good grief.

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03-20-2012, 01:13 PM
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Not a realistic option.
Everything starts with a dream.

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03-20-2012, 01:19 PM
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2 years is absolutely stupid. Good grief.
More like 5 1/2 years as a global sentence taking into account the earlier convictions.

You also have to remember that the cases had to be prosecuted under the law as it existed at the time of the offences.

Since then the law has been changed to more explicitly deal with sexual assaults against children and in particular for those predators in a position of trust or authority with increased penalties. Graham James was a main impetus for those many of those changes.

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03-20-2012, 01:20 PM
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Everything starts with a dream.
That dream runs up against the prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment in the Charter.

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03-20-2012, 01:23 PM
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That dream runs up against the prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment in the Charter.
What do you call 1,000 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean?

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03-20-2012, 01:24 PM
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More like 5 1/2 years as a global sentence taking into account the earlier convictions.

You also have to remember that the cases had to be prosecuted under the law as it existed at the time of the offences.

Since then the law has been changed to more explicitly deal with sexual assaults against children and in particular for those predators in a position of trust or authority with increased penalties. Graham James was a main impetus for those many of those changes.
that's the silver lining, i guess.

5 1/2 years for four sustained cases, with a fifth thrown out. on a non-legal, moral level, 13.2 months for each case (including the gillooly one) rends my stomach.

and re: the silver lining again, despite what anyone may cynically say about theo's motivations, in my book he, sheldon, holt, and gillooly are all heroes for coming forward and telling their stories. i hope our country's collective anger today pushes penalties even farther in the future.


Last edited by vadim sharifijanov: 03-20-2012 at 01:41 PM.
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03-20-2012, 01:26 PM
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What do you call 1,000 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean?
An old joke?

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