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Old
03-21-2012, 02:44 PM
  #76
Ometheus
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Originally Posted by Beyonder91 View Post
What you preach is good in theory but its really isn't practical at all. 7 straight years missing the playoffs would have destroyed most organizations but the Leaf fans have given strong support year after year with no results to show for it. 7 years of incompetence.

The mob is the next step in the chain here and is necessary to get this organization back on the right track. Burke has failed the Leafs and there is absolutely zero sign that anything will improve. This is the team he has constructed and its time to tear it down and do a proper rebuild... on rock and not sand.
Mob mentality can't build. It can only destroy.

Ripping something apart in anger because it's not working? That's many things, but it's not wise.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:45 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by indigobuffalo View Post
The Winnipeg Jets are a pretty ****** team but the fans here don't care, they go nuts every game and the Jets home vs away record clearly shows the difference a loyal fanbase can make. Same with Detroit.

Get fans that cheer for better or worse and there will be a lot less worse to be had.
are you nuts LMFAO

comparing the jets (who haven't had a team for 15 years) and the leafs LOLLLLLLL

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:45 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
I've never been more disgusted to call myself a leaf fan.
This thread only confirms that feeling even more.

Ya'll sound like abused wives - making excuses for how great their husbands are.



Denial.
Intellectual, poignant, and constructive.

Bravo.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:45 PM
  #79
wandering goat
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
The entire sport exists for the fans. I've never denied that. A government is nothing without people, an engine is pointless without fuel, and the mind is useless without the body.

However, like each of the things listed above, it goes both ways. They co-exist. If one is not working well, the other falters.
Yeah, like I said, I have no problems with people wanting to cheer on the team through thick and thin, what I think is uncalled for is naming people who are booing or complaining hypocrites or saying that fans are required to support the Leafs without question (whether upon penalty of being said not to be a real fan, or implying that they're responsible for the team's failures, when the players themselves are professionals whose job it is to play at a high level regardless of distractions). I mean, of course you can have that opinion, I just think it's wrong and does a disservice to everyone who's a fan and loves the Leafs even though they aren't pleased with how things are going.

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03-21-2012, 02:46 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
You're upset because of money? My post appeals to the spirit of the game and the fans, not the materialistic woes.

My post never mentioned choosing a person and supporting that person, but at any given time, the Maple Leafs ARE their roster. Until they're no longer putting on the Blue and White, I'll support them.
You can support the team and not the players. And I'm saying fans can be plenty frustrated because of time and money committed to it if not their interests.

You can blindly support them but you're more the delusional fan. Most fans have expectations, there's a reason when you look at how the Leafs have the most expensive tickets, games exclusive to private channels (LeafsTV)

I just..I dont know. People have a right to be angry with this team after supporting them for so long and being near the cellar of the NHL and they haven't managed to get over the hump and get near the playoffs.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:46 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by TrueBlue86 View Post
are you nuts LMFAO

comparing the jets (who haven't had a team for 15 years) and the leafs LOLLLLLLL
That's a fine comparison.

The whole point of this thread is that we have become jaded as fans. We need to whetstone ourselves back into shape.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:47 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by birddog View Post
It's time to turn the mob loose.
Yes, that will get us into the playoffs

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:48 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
Mob mentality can't build. It can only destroy.

Ripping something apart in anger because it's not working? That's many things, but it's not wise.
Nothing can be built on the land before the old building is torn down. Revolution is necessary because as long as the money train is steadily rolling MLSE is sitting fine.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:48 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
That's a fine comparison.

The whole point of this thread is that we have become jaded as fans. We need to whetstone ourselves back into shape.
It's perfectly reasonable to be jaded. We've been charged out the ass and then jerked around for the better part of a decade.

"HEY TORONTO PEP UP AND SUPPORT THE BOYS! WHO CARES IF THEY TRADE 1st ROUDN PICKS, SIGN BAD FREE AGENTS, AND DONT IMPROVE OVER 7 YEARS! YEAH YEaH GO LEAFS GO! WOOOOO!"

No that's insane.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:49 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
You can support the team and not the players. And I'm saying fans can be plenty frustrated because of time and money committed to it if not their interests.

You can blindly support them but you're more the delusional fan. Most fans have expectations, there's a reason when you look at how the Leafs have the most expensive tickets, games exclusive to private channels (LeafsTV)

I just..I dont know. People have a right to be angry with this team after supporting them for so long and being near the cellar of the NHL and they haven't managed to get over the hump and get near the playoffs.
So how does the frustration help? I'd say everyone on this board knows this team is bad right now and the majority wish they were better. We know Burke realizes this as well, so other that getting a few fans off, what does the booing do? I haven't seen it spark a team, but I have seen players request trades because of it. If I'm watching the game it always seems worse when the crowd is booing and I'm betting GMs recognize the pressure these fans create and try to use it to their advantage.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:50 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
You can support the team and not the players. And I'm saying fans can be plenty frustrated because of time and money committed to it if not their interests.

You can blindly support them but you're more the delusional fan. Most fans have expectations, there's a reason when you look at how the Leafs have the most expensive tickets, games exclusive to private channels (LeafsTV)

I just..I dont know. People have a right to be angry with this team after supporting them for so long and being near the cellar of the NHL and they haven't managed to get over the hump and get near the playoffs.
The players ARE the team, so long as they are wearing the jerseys.

I don't blindly support. I've given reasons as to why supporting them is more constructive than berating them.

All the arguments against supporting the team all starts with "having a right", or a sense of entitlement. To what? To winning?

Just like management 'makes their own beds', so do the fans.

My simple statement stands: berating the team does nothing more than step on them while they're drowning. I am not saying cheering for them will result in automatic success, but doing anything else will drag us away from it.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:51 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
Mob mentality can't build. It can only destroy.

Ripping something apart in anger because it's not working? That's many things, but it's not wise.
I for one am not ripping the players, never have.

- it's not dion's fault he's not a #1 D man and no way captain material
- it's not kessel's fault he's not a starting building block to a rebuild and a franchise player to build around
- it's the reimer's fault he is not ready to be a #1 goalie right now
- it's not the fault of komi, connolly, army etc who have signed on the dotted line for crazy contracts they don't deserve

IT'S OUR GM'S FAULT for shoving all this crap down our throats!!!
it's his fault for not rebuilding properly
it's his fault for not getting us a #1 G, #1C, #1 D man or a captain in 4 freaking years!!!!

this is not north carolina or souther california, you can't just say crap out of both sides of your mouth, never come through on promises and not have it backfire on you

burke has overestimated this team EVERY year and has been horrible at talent evaluation.

so after 4 years we should be happy about prospect depth. wow no blue chip prospects, no hope

FIRE BURKE start the rebuild properly

---

ok for you burke optimists... how will we ever win the cup under this guy without a core???
will burke rip off teams in trades and magically get us franchise players? will we sign franchise UFAs? obviously not!!!

it's not going to happy boys. i love the leafs as much as everyone

we need franchise player and a franchise core

we deserve it

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:51 PM
  #88
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Ugh. Another "you're not a real fan unless you're a fan like me" thread. And full of insults to boot... Personally I've always thought "we've got to supports the boys" types wore the skirts.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:52 PM
  #89
Ometheus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
It's perfectly reasonable to be jaded. We've been charged out the ass and then jerked around for the better part of a decade.

"HEY TORONTO PEP UP AND SUPPORT THE BOYS! WHO CARES IF THEY TRADE 1st ROUDN PICKS, SIGN BAD FREE AGENTS, AND DONT IMPROVE OVER 7 YEARS! YEAH YEaH GO LEAFS GO! WOOOOO!"

No that's insane.
My simple statement stands: berating the team does nothing more than step on them while they're drowning. I am not saying cheering for them will result in automatic success, but doing anything else will drag us away from it.

If you're interesting in winning, then cheer and support.

If you're so jaded and furious with the past, things we can't change, that you can't do that, then that's all you are.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:54 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
My simple statement stands: berating the team does nothing more than step on them while they're drowning. I am not saying cheering for them will result in automatic success, but doing anything else will drag us away from it.

If you're interesting in winning, then cheer and support.

If you're so jaded and furious with the past, things we can't change, that you can't do that, then that's all you are.
Ok, whatever. Can't change people's opinions I guess.

Enjoy the crappy product. I'll go **** off to Ottawa or something.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:54 PM
  #91
Ometheus
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Originally Posted by StarBurns View Post
Ugh. Another "you're not a real fan unless you're a fan like me" thread. And full of insults to boot... Personally I've always thought "we've got to supports the boys" types wore the skirts.
Your statement is hypocritical. Which was the point of this thread.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:55 PM
  #92
Ometheus
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Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
Ok, whatever. Can't change people's opinions I guess.

Enjoy the crappy product. I'll go **** off to Ottawa or something.
I never said anything about 'enjoying' anything. But do as you please.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:56 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by TrueBlue86 View Post
I for one am not ripping the players, never have.

- it's not dion's fault he's not a #1 D man and no way captain material
- it's not kessel's fault he's not a starting building block to a rebuild and a franchise player to build around
- it's the reimer's fault he is not ready to be a #1 goalie right now
- it's not the fault of komi, connolly, army etc who have signed on the dotted line for crazy contracts they don't deserve

IT'S OUR GM'S FAULT for shoving all this crap down our throats!!!
it's his fault for not rebuilding properly
it's his fault for not getting us a #1 G, #1C, #1 D man or a captain in 4 freaking years!!!!

this is not north carolina or souther california, you can't just say crap out of both sides of your mouth, never come through on promises and not have it backfire on you

burke has overestimated this team EVERY year and has been horrible at talent evaluation.

so after 4 years we should be happy about prospect depth. wow no blue chip prospects, no hope

FIRE BURKE start the rebuild properly

---

ok for you burke optimists... how will we ever win the cup under this guy without a core???
will burke rip off teams in trades and magically get us franchise players? will we sign franchise UFAs? obviously not!!!

it's not going to happy boys. i love the leafs as much as everyone

we need franchise player and a franchise core

we deserve it
This is not a Burke thread. This thread is not pointed toward people upset with management. It's pointed toward people who heckle the people representing us.

I'm trying to throw a wrench in the self-destructive gears.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:56 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by StarBurns View Post
Ugh. Another "you're not a real fan unless you're a fan like me" thread. And full of insults to boot... Personally I've always thought "we've got to supports the boys" types wore the skirts.
That's weird cause I've always attributed Whine Nation's "We deserve Better" and "We want More" and all that constant whining to their menstrual cycles all syncing up.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:57 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
I never said anything about 'enjoying' anything. But do as you please.
That's the point of being a fan.

You pay money, you receive entertainment.

When that entertainment is not satisfactory you complain. Nothing will realy change in T.O. though with the fan split.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:58 PM
  #96
Ometheus
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Originally Posted by Beyonder91 View Post
Nothing can be built on the land before the old building is torn down. Revolution is necessary because as long as the money train is steadily rolling MLSE is sitting fine.
You don't have much experience with the infrastructure industry.

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:58 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
My simple statement stands: berating the team does nothing more than step on them while they're drowning. I am not saying cheering for them will result in automatic success, but doing anything else will drag us away from it.

If you're interesting in winning, then cheer and support.

If you're so jaded and furious with the past, things we can't change, that you can't do that, then that's all you are.
Not sure if you realize it, but I think the reason you're getting a lot of opposition is because you're belittling anyone who has a different point of view than you, calling them hypocrites and suggesting they're not fans if they don't think like you do. If you wanted to simply suggest that you think that the team will do better if fans don't boo and complain, you could have done it without the jabs at all the people who do express frustration with the team and received a much better reception.

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03-21-2012, 02:59 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Ometheus View Post
This is not a Burke thread. This thread is not pointed toward people upset with management. It's pointed toward people who heckle the people representing us.

I'm trying to throw a wrench in the self-destructive gears.
It is meaningless! This is not a sample of Leafs Nation. This is a place where those people come to piss and moan. Talking to other fans on the street and teh average joe who wears a Maple Leaf hat and you strike a conversation up with: They do not feel the same!

Though it feels like a major percentage on here, itis a minor percentage out there! Heck, there were people at teh game who said they never even heard the "Fire Burkie" chants! Just the media ****** feeding their hungry johns!

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Old
03-21-2012, 02:59 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
You can support the team and not the players. And I'm saying fans can be plenty frustrated because of time and money committed to it if not their interests.

You can blindly support them but you're more the delusional fan. Most fans have expectations, there's a reason when you look at how the Leafs have the most expensive tickets, games exclusive to private channels (LeafsTV)

I just..I dont know. People have a right to be angry with this team after supporting them for so long and being near the cellar of the NHL and they haven't managed to get over the hump and get near the playoffs.
Booing the players is absolutely acceptable because it's holding their piss poor play accountable. The players themselves may have lost all will to represent their organization with any degree of honour, but the angry fans still have that vision of a great Leafs team in their minds. And let's face it, all of us are going to still be here supporting and following our team our own way long after these guys have moved on.

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Old
03-21-2012, 03:00 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by wandering goat View Post
Not sure if you realize it, but I think the reason you're getting a lot of opposition is because you're belittling anyone who has a different point of view than you, calling them hypocrites and suggesting they're not fans if they don't think like you do. If you wanted to simply suggest that you think that the team will do better if fans don't boo and complain, you could have done it without the jabs at all the people who do express frustration with the team and received a much better reception.
You can interpret my words as you wish, but I haven't thrown insults.

Since the beginning, I've collectively referred to the fanbase as 'we', and anybody I've discussed with, I've included both themselves and myself in the same boat.

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