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2012 NHL Entry Draft Talk 6.0

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Old
03-23-2012, 08:12 AM
  #51
SergeConstantin74
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Sounds like an excuse to me. Everyone is expecting him to be shadowed and this is the time for him to step it up and show that he can still produce.
It's not. I wanted to add the precision to Markov's post because I agree with him. I would have liked Grigorenko to respond to cheapshots made on him. Although, it didn't look like to bother him so it didn't change his game.

In the 2nd and in 3rd there were tons of penalties so it didn't help him to control the play at even strength. He doesn't play on the PK and Quebec's PP sucks. Roy stopped playing his best lines at the end of the third because of cheap shots.

Like Markov said, he played a decent game but he could do better.


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03-23-2012, 08:15 AM
  #52
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So far he's been producing, no?

Anyway, I'm not putting much weight into the first round, I want to see him against a powerhouse like Shawinigan or SNB, two teams against which he struggled this year.
4 goals and 4 assists in 5 games against Shawi.

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03-23-2012, 08:26 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Most action the draft talk thread has ever seen because of the potential top pick.
At this point, it's the only good thing that has happened this season...sort of...

Not sure who we get, but it has to be a player who can lace em up almost right away in the NHL...looking more and more like a Top 5 pick...

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03-23-2012, 08:27 AM
  #54
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I want to know if Yapukov's concussion might make him a less sought-after prospect?

Now that he's more likely to get out of the game because of a similar headshake...

Or his skill still warrants drafting him 1st, regardless of health concerns?

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03-23-2012, 08:30 AM
  #55
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I would like to know Grant's opinion on Forsberg.

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Old
03-23-2012, 08:31 AM
  #56
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Anyone else think that if Timmins pulls a Chipchura in this draft, he is done. Kind of think he has been on the hot seat for a while since most of his staff was fired before the draft in L.A.
Not its noo that I am down on Timmins, as he has a great eye for third line talent, but there has been limited success with his first round selections (I think it the criteria he uses). An opportunity like this to draft this high is extremely rare for MTL, so I hope he doesn't blow it. He must be scouting those top guys like crazy, so I need to trust his decision. Part of me is terrified that PG will still be there and will make the decision, or worse trade that pick for a 30year old+ player on the decline.
Got my fingers crossed!
If they win the lottery & get that first overall, I will climb onto my roof in Winnipeg naked & since the anthem in French!

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03-23-2012, 08:50 AM
  #57
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Okay people are falling in love with Forsberg because he is a big '?'. Wtf. When I read some of us would take him in front of Yakupov is sooooo retarded.

Yakupov has superstar skills. Nobody else in this draft has that.

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03-23-2012, 09:07 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by SnapVirus View Post
Okay people are falling in love with Forsberg because he is a big '?'. Wtf. When I read some of us would take him in front of Yakupov is sooooo retarded.

Yakupov has superstar skills. Nobody else in this draft has that.
I completely agree even though I like Forsberg.

Yakupov is the only player in this draft that can truly be called a franchise player. If we win the lottery we will finally have that true gamebreaker that we have missed since Lafleur.

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03-23-2012, 09:09 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by habsfan92 View Post
Anyone else think that if Timmins pulls a Chipchura in this draft, he is done. Kind of think he has been on the hot seat for a while since most of his staff was fired before the draft in L.A.
Not its noo that I am down on Timmins, as he has a great eye for third line talent, but there has been limited success with his first round selections (I think it the criteria he uses). An opportunity like this to draft this high is extremely rare for MTL, so I hope he doesn't blow it. He must be scouting those top guys like crazy, so I need to trust his decision. Part of me is terrified that PG will still be there and will make the decision, or worse trade that pick for a 30year old+ player on the decline.
Got my fingers crossed!
If they win the lottery & get that first overall, I will climb onto my roof in Winnipeg naked & since the anthem in French!
Let's stop with that fallacy. When Timmins' picked Chipchura (18th overall) he was a big kid who played a power game and skated like the wind. He was also slated to play for the WJC team. He had his achillies tendon sut clean thru and had his year ended. He never was able to skate as well since. He went from a 2nd/3rd line forward to an NHL/AHL tweener after that injury. You can't blame the scouting staff for players who were traded or injured after they were picked.

Now, if he pulled another Fisher, that's a different story

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03-23-2012, 09:19 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by habsfan92 View Post
Anyone else think that if Timmins pulls a Chipchura in this draft, he is done. Kind of think he has been on the hot seat for a while since most of his staff was fired before the draft in L.A.
Not its noo that I am down on Timmins, as he has a great eye for third line talent, but there has been limited success with his first round selections (I think it the criteria he uses). An opportunity like this to draft this high is extremely rare for MTL, so I hope he doesn't blow it. He must be scouting those top guys like crazy, so I need to trust his decision. Part of me is terrified that PG will still be there and will make the decision, or worse trade that pick for a 30year old+ player on the decline.
Got my fingers crossed!
If they win the lottery & get that first overall, I will climb onto my roof in Winnipeg naked & since the anthem in French!
So if he pulls a Beaulieu, he's a genius. If he pulls a Chipchura, he sucks.

I mean, it's the same thing. Chipchura was a sound pick at the time, no one could've predicted that injury.

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03-23-2012, 09:21 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Halifaxhab View Post
Let's stop with that fallacy. When Timmins' picked Chipchura (18th overall) he was a big kid who played a power game and skated like the wind. He was also slated to play for the WJC team. He had his achillies tendon sut clean thru and had his year ended. He never was able to skate as well since. He went from a 2nd/3rd line forward to an NHL/AHL tweener after that injury. You can't blame the scouting staff for players who were traded or injured after they were picked.

Now, if he pulled another Fisher, that's a different story
I am a huge fan of Timmins but you have taken some liberties with the facts.

Chipchura NEVER "skated like the wind". His skating was the reason that he dropped so far in the draft and was the one thing that everyone was hoping he could improve in order to be a future leader on the Canadiens. Unfortunately the injury dashed any hopes of him making significant improvement in his skating and left him as a borderline NHLer.

He never really played a power game either as he was more of a cerebral player who would play the body effectively and would stick up for teammates if required. He was a little too passive to be called a power forward in the making and was more comftorable passing the puck than driving to the net.

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03-23-2012, 09:22 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
It's not. I wanted to add the precision to Markov's post because I agree with him. I would have liked Grigorenko to respond to cheapshots made on him. Although, it didn't look like to bother him so it didn't change his game.

In the 2nd and in 3rd there were tons of penalties so it didn't help him to control the play at even strength. He doesn't play on the PK and Quebec's PP sucks. Roy stopped playing his best lines at the end of the third because of cheap shots.

Like Markov said, he played a decent game but he could do better.
I was at the game and i agree with this. Good first period but the pace of the game really dropped in the 2nd and 3rd. Would've liked to see more 5 on 5 play but it is what it is. What I can say is that he's always in good position in the O-zone. One playoff game doesn't tell it all but so far so good for me. I'd really like if he gathered more speed to breakout with the puck thought.

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Old
03-23-2012, 09:22 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
So if he pulls a Beaulieu, he's a genius. If he pulls a Chipchura, he sucks.

I mean, it's the same thing. Chipchura was a sound pick at the time, no one could've predicted that injury.
It was a weak draft and most of us were ok with the Chipchura pick.

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03-23-2012, 09:23 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
4 goals and 4 assists in 5 games against Shawi.
How many of those points were made before the trade deadline?

Shawinigan was a rather unhealthy team at first too.

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Old
03-23-2012, 09:26 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
It was a weak draft and most of us were ok with the Chipchura pick.
Everyone was eccstatic over the pick.

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03-23-2012, 09:30 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Everyone was eccstatic over the pick.
Considering most of the junk that followed the pick, it would be reasonable to assume that a healthy Chipchura would have been a decent pick in hindsight.

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Old
03-23-2012, 09:34 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Everyone was eccstatic over the pick.
The funny thing for me is that it came down to Korpikoski and Chipchura. we took Chipchura and the Rangers selected Korpikoski with the next pick. Five years later I had a toss-up between Leblanc and Kreider. Once again we took Leblanc and the Rangers took Kreider with the next pick.

Next time we draft one slot ahead of the Rangers I will have to lay some money on who they will pick!

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Old
03-23-2012, 09:36 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
I am a huge fan of Timmins but you have taken some liberties with the facts.

Chipchura NEVER "skated like the wind". His skating was the reason that he dropped so far in the draft and was the one thing that everyone was hoping he could improve in order to be a future leader on the Canadiens. Unfortunately the injury dashed any hopes of him making significant improvement in his skating and left him as a borderline NHLer.

He never really played a power game either as he was more of a cerebral player who would play the body effectively and would stick up for teammates if required. He was a little too passive to be called a power forward in the making and was more comftorable passing the puck than driving to the net.
You're right. Chipchura wasn't a bad pick at the time. He was seen as the safest player in the 1st round. He was also rated first in ISS rankings at mid term, and 4th at years end.

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Old
03-23-2012, 09:37 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Considering most of the junk that followed the pick, it would be reasonable to assume that a healthy Chipchura would have been a decent pick in hindsight.
It's not like he's a terrible player at the moment. He's just not an important one.

It's not like we did like the Flames and traded down because they'd rather have Travis Zajac's teammate, Kris Chucko, over the former. Boy did that turn into a blunder.

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03-23-2012, 09:43 AM
  #70
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I still think we will end up with a defenseman on draft day, although my pick would be Galchenyuk although he'd have to be healthy. Seems to have a higher battle level than Grigorenko with a similar skill set. Dumba, if the Oilers don't take him, may be coming to Montreal.

Tom Wilson would look good in a Habs uniform as well, as he should be a decent power forward prospect.

Maybe get Damon Severson with the Nashville second rounder. Hopefully Lukas Sutter in the third round.

How do you guys see our first 4 picks going?

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03-23-2012, 09:46 AM
  #71
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I still think we will end up with a defenseman on draft day, although my pick would be Galchenyuk although he'd have to be healthy. Seems to have a higher battle level than Grigorenko with a similar skill set. Dumba, if the Oilers don't take him, may be coming to Montreal.

Tom Wilson would look good in a Habs uniform as well, as he should be a decent power forward prospect.

Maybe get Damon Severson with the Nashville second rounder. Hopefully Lukas Sutter in the third round.

How do you guys see our first 4 picks going?
I am not crazy about the Wilson pick. I think there is a very high probability that he becomes a career journeyman 4th liner. I see alot of Colton Gillies in him.....

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03-23-2012, 09:48 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
I am a huge fan of Timmins but you have taken some liberties with the facts.

Chipchura NEVER "skated like the wind". His skating was the reason that he dropped so far in the draft and was the one thing that everyone was hoping he could improve in order to be a future leader on the Canadiens. Unfortunately the injury dashed any hopes of him making significant improvement in his skating and left him as a borderline NHLer.

He never really played a power game either as he was more of a cerebral player who would play the body effectively and would stick up for teammates if required. He was a little too passive to be called a power forward in the making and was more comftorable passing the puck than driving to the net.
his skating was drastically different after the injury and not very good. His physicality was lessened after the injury also.

But my bottom line point I was trying to get at was that it wasn't a terrible "bust" pick or that Timmins' screwed up. He was a solid pick that, without the injury, could have netted us a very solid 2nd/3rd line player.

If you want to point to a massive error in judgement (if you can call it that) it would be the David Fisher pick. Not one where a player had a massive injury or one that was under devellopped.

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Old
03-23-2012, 09:48 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
It's not like he's a terrible player at the moment. He's just not an important one.

It's not like we did like the Flames and traded down because they'd rather have Travis Zajac's teammate, Kris Chucko, over the former. Boy did that turn into a blunder.
Not everyone was a fan of the pick. I never saw Chipchura as anything more than a third liner, good character guy, modest skater, modest skill. Not that I wouldnt have taken him later in the draft, just not at that point in the first round. I would have rather gambled on a player with higher upside at where Mtl was picking.
And Calgary's drafting is horrible, no question.

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03-23-2012, 09:52 AM
  #74
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Not everyone was a fan of the pick. I never saw Chipchura as anything more than a third liner, good character guy, modest skater, modest skill. Not that I wouldnt have taken him later in the draft, just not at that point in the first round. I would have rather gambled on a player with higher upside at where Mtl was picking.
And Calgary's drafting is horrible, no question.
The reason most of us were ok with the pick was that he was considered a very safe bet to play in your top nine with the potential to be a 2nd line shutdown center. It was an incredibly weak draft and every pick from that point on seemed to be a bit of a reach.

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03-23-2012, 09:53 AM
  #75
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his skating was drastically different after the injury and not very good. His physicality was lessened after the injury also.

But my bottom line point I was trying to get at was that it wasn't a terrible "bust" pick or that Timmins' screwed up. He was a solid pick that, without the injury, could have netted us a very solid 2nd/3rd line player.

If you want to point to a massive error in judgement (if you can call it that) it would be the David Fisher pick. Not one where a player had a massive injury or one that was under devellopped.
Well, Fischer lost his mom and had a serious illness that made him lose a lot of weight in his first 2 years of college iirc.

Not that it's an excuse IMO, his senior season was absolutely dreadful. Looks like he'll make the AHL this season, so he might turn into a 7th D/AHLer.

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