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All Purpose Tank Thread - We're back to 28th

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Old
03-26-2012, 05:50 PM
  #101
dierks
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
This is why I could easily see us trading up for Colubus's pick if we can hold onto 2nd or 3rd. It sounds crazy but to move up one or two spots we might be only looking at giving up a 2nd rounder.
maybe if you're moving from 12th to 10th.. its going to cost more then a 2nd rounder

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03-26-2012, 05:57 PM
  #102
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by dierks View Post
maybe if you're moving from 12th to 10th.. its going to cost more then a 2nd rounder
Seriously, flip it around, if we won the lottery to draft first, does anyone think that we should trade down to 2nd overall if Columbus were to give us the 2nd and their second rounder?

No?

I didn't think so.

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Old
03-26-2012, 06:20 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post

With all due respect: Who gives a crap? I mean seriously... why are we trying to get a 3rd liner for a guy like Cammy? We're hovering near the bottom of the Conference and we rush out for this guy?
Not that we want a 3d liner for cammy, more that we traded for top 9 player (cammy is only able to play top 6, if not he's useless, which was my point). As it stands, the other "top 9" forward in our ranks was AK. And looks like he was already scratched from future plans when the cammy trade happened. Technically, in GM shoes, i think what was meant to be was to replace AK with Bourque (Which i absolutely dislike, since i find AK to be much more productive and useful to a team, except for fighting aspect, "intimidation factor" or whatever), shed one of the big contracts we have on the team ( in case Gomez back fires and we are stuck with his cap hit next year, or part of his cap hit which would still be big.) so we can (hopefully) sign Price and PK to long term juicy contracts and most likely try and get Sutter to sign here.
Thats when i will have better view of the trade, if such things DO happen this summer.
Quote:
The entire premise of the trade is wrong.

It hasn't been a small period of time. Bourque was ripped to shreds by Kelly Hrudey all the way back in November. He SPECIFICALLY made fun of the Flames' assertion that there was a club out there enquiring about this guy. He's been roasted in the press all year long for lack of effort. Any surprise that he's shown none here?

As to your point about him not being effective on THIS team... well, why are we going after a 30 year old player in exchange for Cammy anyway? I can understand taking on Bourque's contract if we're at least getting a first rounder back but a 2nd and a prospect who's doubtful to even make the NHL?

Why?
Cammy wasn't fetching a 1st. Maybe a low first, which is not far away from the value of a 2nd (which is in 2013? will be in the low 30's IMO) and a prospect. An inconsistent Bourque is much easier to deal with then an unconsistent and unproductive Cammy.
once again i'm not sold on the trade, but i do see the logic behind it, and the intentions, which is why i wanna see what happens next. i fully expected Bourque to be very inconsitent, and pretty much not very surprised about the result in Montreal, since it's exactly what i heard and saw from him. Assuming that we might of gotten a better return for Cammy, i will not


Also, as much as i dislike the trade, and we might percive as losers in it, i think Cgy is the biggest loser out of this, they gave up a prospect a pick for player that will be useless and probably 10x less motivated next year then he was in MTL this year, because CGY has been sucking, and next year will be some hardcore sucking. They will be stuck with 6m sniper on a lottery team.


Last edited by uiCk: 03-26-2012 at 06:36 PM.
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Old
03-26-2012, 06:22 PM
  #104
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There is no way we are moving up to pick Clb pick with only adding a 2nd rounder. Will have to be a decent roster player for us to move up there.

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03-26-2012, 06:25 PM
  #105
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jinx thread... habs finish season with W's

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03-26-2012, 06:28 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by uiCk View Post
There is no way we are moving up to pick Clb pick with only adding a 2nd rounder. Will have to be a decent roster player for us to move up there.
I would gladly give them Plekanec, free 5 extra mil on the cap with our 1st for there's.

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03-26-2012, 06:32 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Maxpac View Post
I would gladly give them Plekanec, free 5 extra mil on the cap with our 1st for there's.
considering it will be a winger, i rather not lose a center, which is being undermined because of DD's insane offensive production at center (And shootout goals).

I'd much rather draft a center with potential higher then DD, Pleck, and trade of em in 2013-2014.

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Old
03-26-2012, 06:35 PM
  #108
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The last #1 overall trades


1999 Vancouver/Tampa - Traded 1999 first round pick (#4-Pavel Brendl), two 1999 third round picks (#75-Brett Scheffelmaier) (#88-Jimmie Olvestad) to Lightning for 1999 first round pick (#1-Patrik Stefan) on 1999-06-26


This deal gave Vancouver 1 and 3, Burke flipped the #1 to Atlanta as a favour to Dudley if Dudley would agree not to touch the sedins in this deal

Atlanta/Vancouver - Traded 1999 first round pick (#2-Daniel Sedin), 2000 conditional third round pick (#67-Max Birbraer) to Canucks for 1999 first round pick (#1-Patrik Stefan) on 1999-06-26


-------------------

2001
Columbus - Traded 2002 first round pick (#3-Jay Bouwmeester), and gave the Panthers the option to swap 2003 first round picks (not exercised) to Panthers for 2002 first round pick (#1-Rick Nash).

2003
Pittsburgh - Traded 2003 first round pick (#3-Nathan Horton), 2003 second round pick (#55-Stefan Meyer) to Panthers for 2003 first round pick (#1-Marc-Andre Fleury), 2003 third round pick (#73-Dan Carcillo) on 2003-06-21

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03-26-2012, 07:06 PM
  #109
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OMG! i realy never tought this is possible, i just don't understand how i can be happy about this :/ sorry habs but we need this

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Old
03-26-2012, 07:06 PM
  #110
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Didn't follow prospects back then, but i would say drop off from 1st to 2nd overall this year is quite steep, and that's why i would say it's going to take more then a 2nd, and i would imagine (picking goaltender first overall) that difference in top 3 those years was more or less marginal and more about preference and gurateeing a certain prospect.

Thanks for the post commandant

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03-26-2012, 07:37 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by uiCk View Post
Didn't follow prospects back then, but i would say drop off from 1st to 2nd overall this year is quite steep, and that's why i would say it's going to take more then a 2nd, and i would imagine (picking goaltender first overall) that difference in top 3 those years was more or less marginal and more about preference and gurateeing a certain prospect.

Thanks for the post commandant
Thats definetely a good point

I'll also add that the value of draft picks increased in the post cap world as its taken more to move up in recent years and thats even with lower picks (leafs for Schenn, Habs for Tinordi, and other trade ups)

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03-26-2012, 08:03 PM
  #112
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This day shall live in infamy.

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Old
03-26-2012, 08:06 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Maxpac View Post
I would gladly give them Plekanec, free 5 extra mil on the cap with our 1st for there's.
Yup, and it would ease our prospect transition as he'd be going from a Jr team to an AHL team...

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Old
03-26-2012, 09:39 PM
  #114
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by uiCk View Post
Not that we want a 3d liner for cammy, more that we traded for top 9 player (cammy is only able to play top 6, if not he's useless, which was my point). As it stands, the other "top 9" forward in our ranks was AK. And looks like he was already scratched from future plans when the cammy trade happened. Technically, in GM shoes, i think what was meant to be was to replace AK with Bourque (Which i absolutely dislike, since i find AK to be much more productive and useful to a team, except for fighting aspect, "intimidation factor" or whatever), shed one of the big contracts we have on the team ( in case Gomez back fires and we are stuck with his cap hit next year, or part of his cap hit which would still be big.) so we can (hopefully) sign Price and PK to long term juicy contracts and most likely try and get Sutter to sign here.
Thats when i will have better view of the trade, if such things DO happen this summer.

Cammy wasn't fetching a 1st. Maybe a low first, which is not far away from the value of a 2nd (which is in 2013? will be in the low 30's IMO) and a prospect. An inconsistent Bourque is much easier to deal with then an unconsistent and unproductive Cammy.
once again i'm not sold on the trade, but i do see the logic behind it, and the intentions, which is why i wanna see what happens next. i fully expected Bourque to be very inconsitent, and pretty much not very surprised about the result in Montreal, since it's exactly what i heard and saw from him. Assuming that we might of gotten a better return for Cammy, i will not


Also, as much as i dislike the trade, and we might percive as losers in it, i think Cgy is the biggest loser out of this, they gave up a prospect a pick for player that will be useless and probably 10x less motivated next year then he was in MTL this year, because CGY has been sucking, and next year will be some hardcore sucking. They will be stuck with 6m sniper on a lottery team.
There's absolutely no way that Cammy doesn't net at least a mid 1st rounder or good prospect. Yes, we'd probably have to take back some salary on the other side but a mid 1st for a guy like Cammy is reasonable. I'm not suggesting that he'd get us a top five but a mid first certainly isn't out of the question.

As for Cammy, if Calgary is out of it next year at the deadline, they'll just trade him. He's not going to be hard to move.

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Old
03-26-2012, 09:49 PM
  #115
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Columbus should get fined for loosing like that...

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Old
03-26-2012, 09:51 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Commandant View Post
The last #1 overall trades


1999 Vancouver/Tampa - Traded 1999 first round pick (#4-Pavel Brendl), two 1999 third round picks (#75-Brett Scheffelmaier) (#88-Jimmie Olvestad) to Lightning for 1999 first round pick (#1-Patrik Stefan) on 1999-06-26


This deal gave Vancouver 1 and 3, Burke flipped the #1 to Atlanta as a favour to Dudley if Dudley would agree not to touch the sedins in this deal

Atlanta/Vancouver - Traded 1999 first round pick (#2-Daniel Sedin), 2000 conditional third round pick (#67-Max Birbraer) to Canucks for 1999 first round pick (#1-Patrik Stefan) on 1999-06-26


-------------------

2001
Columbus - Traded 2002 first round pick (#3-Jay Bouwmeester), and gave the Panthers the option to swap 2003 first round picks (not exercised) to Panthers for 2002 first round pick (#1-Rick Nash).

2003
Pittsburgh - Traded 2003 first round pick (#3-Nathan Horton), 2003 second round pick (#55-Stefan Meyer) to Panthers for 2003 first round pick (#1-Marc-Andre Fleury), 2003 third round pick (#73-Dan Carcillo) on 2003-06-21
Fascinating bit of info. Stephan was a bust so I can see teams wanting to move away from him. I remember at the draft the Sedins as a package were worth more than the #1 pick that year, the question was could they be landed. To Burke's credit he made one of the great draft deals of the last twenty years. But it was facilitated by it being such a weak draft for top forwards otherwise. Patrick Stephan, Pavel Brendl, ugh. This year could be similar, with D as the real gold instead of the Sedins. I could see the #1 being up for grabs this year too, if Columbus doesn't have faith in Nial, especially with his injury. If they like Murray, for instance, they could be ready for a flip to 2-3. It's not a killer draft year.MAG being a goalie I can understand that trade too, very few teams would be willing to pick a goalie #1.

The Columbus-Fla swap is just bizarre. Col moved from 3 to 1 for an option they never exercised? Col moved up to #1 for FREE? How often does that happen? Was that McLean in Fla?


Last edited by Bullsmith: 03-26-2012 at 10:11 PM.
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Old
03-26-2012, 10:05 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by uiCk View Post
There is no way we are moving up to pick Clb pick with only adding a 2nd rounder. Will have to be a decent roster player for us to move up there.
Agreed. Yakupov may not be the fit for Columbus, but he's the clear #1. They're not going to downgrade simply for a 2nd rounder.

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Old
03-26-2012, 10:13 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Patty Roy View Post
Agreed. Yakupov may not be the fit for Columbus, but he's the clear #1. They're not going to downgrade simply for a 2nd rounder.
I think you're right. But he's a question mark, just got completely wiped out and is an undersized winger to boot. Doesn't mean a 2nd rounder does it, but if a team wanted to go after him, IMO he's one of the rare clear #1s that could be had.

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Old
03-27-2012, 01:50 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Bullsmith View Post
Fascinating bit of info. Stephan was a bust so I can see teams wanting to move away from him. I remember at the draft the Sedins as a package were worth more than the #1 pick that year, the question was could they be landed. To Burke's credit he made one of the great draft deals of the last twenty years. But it was facilitated by it being such a weak draft for top forwards otherwise. Patrick Stephan, Pavel Brendl, ugh. This year could be similar, with D as the real gold instead of the Sedins. I could see the #1 being up for grabs this year too, if Columbus doesn't have faith in Nial, especially with his injury. If they like Murray, for instance, they could be ready for a flip to 2-3. It's not a killer draft year.MAG being a goalie I can understand that trade too, very few teams would be willing to pick a goalie #1.
Florida didnt want the goalie as they had Luongo, they wanted Horton

Pittsburgh was 3 and wanted the goalie

Carolina wanted Fleury too but had Staal ahead of Horton, so Pittsburgh/Florida were able to make the deal and Pitt got who they wanted and Florida still got Horton at 3.

Quote:
The Columbus-Fla swap is just bizarre. Col moved from 3 to 1 for an option they never exercised? Col moved up to #1 for FREE? How often does that happen? Was that McLean in Fla?
McLean was in Columbus.

Same situation as above McLean wanted Nash badly. Florida was going to take J-Bo first overall and Atlanta would have got Nash. Florida learned Atlanta wouldnt take J-Bo and would take Lehtonen instead, both Atlanta and Columbus were trying to get the number 1 pick. Florida took the offer of the pick swap from Columbus.

The idea was no one knew who would be better out of Columbus and Florida the next season as both teams were bad. Florida got a guarantee they would be able to make a swap the next year if Columbus had a better pick than them. They were trying to guarantee a great pick in 2003. Florida ended up with 1st overall again so they didnt bother swapping as Columbus was #4.

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Old
03-27-2012, 03:41 AM
  #120
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I laugh at all the ppl blaming goats for our plight. There are many reasons we are in 29th. Goats didn't magically give us a playoff spot with all that happened so off with his head. Sure goats may not be the best gm but I don't see where this is all his fault.
If u all feel better blaming one person than I guess he Is your man.
Me I blame injuries, parity, JM, youngsters thrust into jobs before being ready cause of injuries. Etc..
Plus the fans for Being unreasonable in their demands for French coaching and managing.
Heck if u want to blame one guy blame Gomez for sucking so hard. Who knew he would slide so fast at his age? No one.

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Old
03-27-2012, 06:54 AM
  #121
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Yup, and it would ease our prospect transition as he'd be going from a Jr team to an AHL team...
Can anybody help me as I have absolutely no idea what he is babbling about???

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03-27-2012, 07:13 AM
  #122
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living in the states i don't get to see much of any junior games...if any...
i watch the junior majors ever winter thanks to nhl network and heard the GRIGS is better than YAKUPOV....plus i beleive Grigs is on the ramparts where Roy coaches so are we all on board for Grigs if he can fall to us.....
thank god for directv and center ice i watch bleu,blanc,rouge religiously.....

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Old
03-27-2012, 08:44 AM
  #123
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Can anybody help me as I have absolutely no idea what he is babbling about???
getting rid of Plekanec isnt the solution

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Old
03-27-2012, 09:06 AM
  #124
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Whenever I go to tsn and check the standings to see how we are doing compared to the other bottom feeders, I get a sad feeling when I click the sort by "league" button, it makes me sad that I'm looking to see how low we are today.

Except today, I had a happy when I seen we are 29th. Pretty pathetic that it makes me happy that we suck. I can't wait till the off season at this point.

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03-27-2012, 09:41 AM
  #125
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Can anybody help me as I have absolutely no idea what he is babbling about???
Unless you want to re-live the same abysmal season and gun for McKinnon next year, it would be both dumb and useless to trade our best overall forward to move up from Grigorenko to Yakupov.

... and tell me would you would sign with this magical 5mil cap space, Alex ****ing Semin ?

Yakupov - Semin < Grigorenko - Plekanec

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