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McDonagh vs Subban

View Poll Results: Who would you rather have in your top four?
P.K. Subban 229 42.25%
Ryan McDonagh 313 57.75%
Voters: 542. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-28-2012, 06:16 PM
  #376
NYRSchrute217
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Originally Posted by Clipitar View Post
I could bring up the fact Girardi went to the All-Star game, but I think everyone will agree he shouldn't have got the invite in the 1st place.
Who agrees with that? Girardi was in the Norris conversation from October-February

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03-28-2012, 07:06 PM
  #377
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
Nonsense. He deserved to go there at that point of the season. (Logging nearly 30 MPG, on pace for 40 points ,etc)
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRSchrute217 View Post
Who agrees with that? Girardi was in the Norris conversation from October-February
So Girardi deserves Norris consideration for almost the full season, yet McDonagh is the one who deserves all the credit?

You can't have it both ways.

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03-28-2012, 07:14 PM
  #378
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
I wouldn't ever deal him heads up for McDonagh and no Habs fan would.
Though this is likely true, we can't deny that they are indeed close in terms of value (regardless of who's better).

Anyways, I don't think the Rangers will anywhere near as successful without our gift so I'll be waiting for future considerations.

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03-28-2012, 07:15 PM
  #379
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Originally Posted by Clipitar View Post
So Girardi deserves Norris consideration for almost the full season, yet McDonagh is the one who deserves all the credit?

You can't have it both ways.
They have both been great. At least until recently. The Rangers play a team-oriented style. It's not about the individual players. Maybe that's why the Rangers are in 1st and Montreal is 15th.

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03-28-2012, 07:15 PM
  #380
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
I need to watch Subban more, but man, McDonagh is showing glimpses that he could become an almost franchise level defenseman. His ability to read the play and make the right decision is extremely good, and he's jumping up into the play at the right time more and more often. In addition to that, his one on one defense is excellent, and his overall defense is very good.

Things keeping him from being top level elite at the moment would be: he could sometimes do a little better with the puck in his own end. Mainly just that he could sometimes make a better play than sling it around the boards (not that he does that all the time), but I think that's something that will come with some time. And his shot could use improvement. Not even necessarily his slap shot, which is pretty good, but just overall getting it off, making himself more of a threat when he carries the puck into the zone or makes a move at the blueline to shake a guy and get open.

Subban already has that dynamic ability McDonagh is trying to add but probably isn't as reliable. I tend to think that Subban will always be more of a scoring threat, but they should both be great players in their own way
Agreed. I personally don't wish McDonagh to fail just because Gainey was desperate enough to give him up for... Gomez. He was one of our top young prospect and I'm glad to see that he's finally developing into the player we thought he would become.

I think that in both McDonagh and Subban's cases, they will become impact players down the line, especially that at such young age, they already have an impact on their team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
"Anchors the #2 PK"

McDonagh anchors the #2 TEAM.
So what you're saying is that the Rangers form a better team than the Habs. Way to state the obvious. Did you look at the standings before making that statement or was that just a hunch?

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03-28-2012, 07:17 PM
  #381
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Originally Posted by KingWantsCup View Post
I'm shocked that MCD is getting the recognition he deserves over a big name D-man. I really feel like most people aren't very aware of him, or how good he is. I guess I was wrong on both accounts.
Non-habs fans just hate Subban

I'm a fan of both players, I can see why both team's fanbases prefer keeping their player. McDonagh has been a good surprise for anyone who didn't know who he was (Gainey?).

PK on the other hand, I've rarely see someone who hates losing like he does. When the game seems out of reach, he always seems to try to carry the team on his back and tries to get something going. Whether that's an end to end rush, a big hit, or getting the other team to take a dumb penalty. He's a breath of fresh air on this team and I love the guy. In terms of skill, there are very few defenceman in the NHL that can match Subban. Once he decides to start shooting a wrister more often (ala Karlsson), he'll do much better. He's still young, but he's got alot of growing to do.

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03-28-2012, 07:19 PM
  #382
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Originally Posted by NYRSchrute217 View Post
They have both been great. At least until recently. The Rangers play a team-oriented style. It's not about the individual players. Maybe that's why the Rangers are in 1st and Montreal is 15th.
I actually agree with you, but it goes against what the majority of your fellow fans have been saying so far in this thread. That's why I pointed it out.

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03-28-2012, 07:25 PM
  #383
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Originally Posted by poetryinmotion View Post
You implied it in your answer, obviously.
No I didn't. You're assuming things that didn't happen.

Quote:
And the second part is ********, Rangers fans have been as bad if not worse in this thread, my reponses have been accordingly, go read the previous pages in case you haven't been following.
You know nothing about the Rangers and their players and their is evidence in the thread.

Quote:
And what facts did I misinterpret exactly? I know you like to believe that McDonagh is your #1 defenseman but TOI and usage proves you otherwise. Did I pull that out of my ass? It's clear as day. If I were to ask Tortorella he'd say the same.
Richards on the PP comment for one.

Assuming that Del Zotto has been just as valuable as McDonagh is laughable to say the least.

Quote:
And if he was a two way defenseman like you are suggesting (because clearly I don't know what kind of defenseman he is, having followed him as a prospect throughout his development here, right? right?) then he would be getting powerplay minutes instead of you having a forward on the point.
Brad Richards is a top 5 PPP producer in the league since the lockout, all of them from manning the point. Richards has a LHS, Del Zotto also has a LHS. This speaks volume of the depth that the Rangers have on the point for the PP, not for the lack of offensive talent McDonagh has.

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I don't care if you would trade your whole team for Subban, I wouldn't ever deal him heads up for McDonagh and no Habs fan would.
Cool story.

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03-28-2012, 07:25 PM
  #384
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I still take Subban over Mcdonagh 10 out of 10 times, but theres nothing wrong with Mcdonagh. Subban is a little more flashy while Mcdonagh is more steady. Once Subban becomes a bit more steady I think the Gap between them will widen a bit. Subban is more of a gamebreaker. Once again though, **** you Bob Gainey.

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03-28-2012, 07:30 PM
  #385
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Originally Posted by Clipitar View Post
So Girardi deserves Norris consideration for almost the full season, yet McDonagh is the one who deserves all the credit?

You can't have it both ways.
McDonagh was equally as good, but he wasn't well known or experienced to be named to the All-Star team.

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03-28-2012, 07:46 PM
  #386
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
McDonagh was equally as good, but he wasn't well known or experienced to be named to the All-Star team.
And he wasn't logging 30 minutes a game while leading the league in blocked shots.

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03-28-2012, 08:45 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by Clipitar View Post
And he wasn't logging 30 minutes a game while leading the league in blocked shots.
girardi and mcdonagh have averaged more TOI this season than subban. mcd has averaged 40 seconds more per game this season than subban.

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03-28-2012, 11:12 PM
  #388
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Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
girardi and mcdonagh have averaged more TOI this season than subban. mcd has averaged 40 seconds more per game this season than subban.
I was referring to Girardi's TOI/G back when he was picked for the All-Star game.

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03-29-2012, 12:36 AM
  #389
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McDonagh has been at least as good as Girardi this season. There is a reason this guy is +43 in his first two NHL seasons thus far... other teams rarely ever score when he's on the ice.

Take away Subban's 14 PP points and McDonagh has 9 more points than him this season. It's not like Subban is putting up Karlsson numbers. Subban gets nearly 3 more minutes of PP time every game compared to McDonagh (McDonagh gets all of around 40 seconds). That's a massive difference

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03-29-2012, 12:41 AM
  #390
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
McDonagh has been at least as good as Girardi this season. There is a reason this guy is +43 in his first two NHL seasons thus far... other teams rarely ever score when he's on the ice.

Take away Subban's 14 PP points and McDonagh has 9 more points than him this season. It's not like Subban is putting up Karlsson numbers. Subban gets nearly 3 more minutes of PP time every game compared to McDonagh (McDonagh gets all of around 40 seconds). That's a massive difference
Take away 14 points from Mcdonagh, and Subban has 19 more points then him this season. See how dumb an argument that is. Subban gets more pp time because he deserves it, not the other way around.

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03-29-2012, 12:43 AM
  #391
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As for the Suter comparison, I don't see why it's offbase. It took Suter 3 years to hit 30 points, and that's with a nice junk of PP time included. McDonagh hit 30 in his second year after playing just 40 games in his rookie season.

I actually think Suter is a perfect comparison. He's a smart, not amazingly gifted offensive player who's best attribute will always be his defense. That's pretty much what McDonagh is

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03-29-2012, 12:47 AM
  #392
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Originally Posted by habscup View Post
Take away 14 points from Mcdonagh, and Subban has 19 more points then him this season. See how dumb an argument that is. Subban gets more pp time because he deserves it, not the other way around.
Oh lord, how is that even similar?

Go look up MDZ's stats and see how many PP points the guy has in the last month. The only reason McDonagh is not getting PP time is because Tortorella is too stubborn to realize that MDZ brings nothing to the PP. McDonagh has deserved PP time as much as any player on the Rangers this season. Is it his fault Tortorella is blind?

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03-29-2012, 12:52 AM
  #393
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Oh lord, how is that even similar?

Go look up MDZ's stats and see how many PP points the guy has in the last month. The only reason McDonagh is not getting PP time is because Tortorella is too stubborn to realize that MDZ brings nothing to the PP. McDonagh has deserved PP time as much as any player on the Rangers this season. Is it his fault Tortorella is blind?
Partly yes, if McD really is ready to be a quarterback on the pp, then he would be on it more often, no questions asked.

This in no way makes him better than Subban. I dont even see the argument.

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03-29-2012, 08:15 AM
  #394
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PK Subban

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Old
03-29-2012, 08:55 AM
  #395
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Originally Posted by Rangers4Life74 View Post
I think this thread is meaningless to even debate right now.why not wait until we see how both players perform in the playoffs this year.

oh,my bad...
Is this statement really coming from a Rangers fan?

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03-29-2012, 09:53 AM
  #396
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Originally Posted by habs_24x View Post
Is this statement really coming from a Rangers fan?
Are you really calling him out when two years ago Hab fans were doing the exact same thing when the Rangers missed the playoffs. Let the guy gloat, you can gloat too if the Rangers miss the playoffs again.

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03-29-2012, 11:37 AM
  #397
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Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
No matter the fan base, if someone claims taht a d-man has a 80 points per season potential, ignore him/her.

But it's two posts of yours that I quote which clearly show that you have no clue of what you're talking about when talking about Subban. You can praize McDonagh all you want, it's fair, but the way you try downplaying Subban is ridiculous as your points are simply false and full of air.

McDonagh is a safer player, no one in their right mind would deny that. Subban is a high risk, high reward player but he does a hell of a lot more than what you're describing. He has game breaking abilities as at any point, he can rush the puck and score or set-up that winning goal and that, whether it's at even strength or on the PP. Opposing players better keep their head up when Subban is on the ice as he'll crush you. Defensively, he is sound. Yes, he will turn the puck over once in a while but most times, he'll be the one hustling and fixing his own mistakes.

In my opinion, McDonagh is a good defenseman but Subban is and will be better down the line.


You're describing Subban at his best. He hasn't been at his best this season, which is why I said what I said. Subban hits hard, can skate, can shoot and create offense. I got it. This season, he's taken a step back. He's not an offensive force on the blue line. He's certainly not an offensive force at ES.

Statistically, Macdonagh is light years ahead of Subban from a defensive standpoint, as the stats clearly indicate

Offensively, they are very close statistically, as proven with, yup you guessed it...stats.

Subban migh have "game-breaking abilities", but this season, how many times has been a game breaker? Stats say otherwise.

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03-29-2012, 12:04 PM
  #398
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What I see in this thread is a huge love letter from NYR fans to their beloved young D-stud. This fine, I have no issue with this whatsoever other than I'd wish he was still on our team.

The problem rather resides in the NYR fans' appraisal of Subban's game, which I'm sorry to say, but just proves how little you guys have watched him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
You're describing Subban at his best. He hasn't been at his best this season, which is why I said what I said. Subban hits hard, can skate, can shoot and create offense. I got it. This season, he's taken a step back. He's not an offensive force on the blue line. He's certainly not an offensive force at ES.

Statistically, Macdonagh is light years ahead of Subban from a defensive standpoint, as the stats clearly indicate

Offensively, they are very close statistically, as proven with, yup you guessed it...stats.

Subban migh have "game-breaking abilities", but this season, how many times has been a game breaker? Stats say otherwise.
You seriously need to start watching some Habs games on a regular basis if you want to have any sort of credibility when describing Subban's game.

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03-29-2012, 12:07 PM
  #399
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Originally Posted by nafsregnar21 View Post
Are you really calling him out when two years ago Hab fans were doing the exact same thing when the Rangers missed the playoffs. Let the guy gloat, you can gloat too if the Rangers miss the playoffs again.
I don't remember Habs fans specifically gloating to NYR fans. I guess there's some kind of rivalry between both fan bases, but I think most Habs fans don't really pay attention to it.

We kind of own you guys for some reason (since that 0-5 comeback?), even when we suck at every single levels like this season.

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03-29-2012, 12:57 PM
  #400
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
You're describing Subban at his best. He hasn't been at his best this season, which is why I said what I said. Subban hits hard, can skate, can shoot and create offense. I got it. This season, he's taken a step back. He's not an offensive force on the blue line. He's certainly not an offensive force at ES.

Statistically, Macdonagh is light years ahead of Subban from a defensive standpoint, as the stats clearly indicate

Offensively, they are very close statistically, as proven with, yup you guessed it...stats.

Subban migh have "game-breaking abilities", but this season, how many times has been a game breaker? Stats say otherwise.
Subban has been great this year, you should watch games instead of looking at stats. He is also great defensively and the only way to measure that is to watch the games. You are ignorant on how Subban has played this year and I'm putting it kindly.

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