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Iginla - Stay or Trade?

View Poll Results: Should Iginla be traded for the right package?
Yes 69 81.18%
No 16 18.82%
Voters: 85. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-29-2012, 03:19 PM
  #26
Xelstyle
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Originally Posted by CGYPUKSUX View Post
At this point, addition by subtraction. This is Iginla's team and nothing is going to change until Iginla is gone. The country club atmosphere is not going change until Iginla is gone. No one is going to assume a leadership role until Iginla is gone. The most important thing to this team moving on is a complete change in leadership and that starts with the captain. Whatever you can get for Iginla is good return because it is a sign the team is serious about wanting to make a change that points to a new future. With an aging and depreciating Iginla we are no better than Oiler fans, talking about the great past, that actually wasn't so great to begin with.
Solid explanation.
If we can get one quality piece out of it, I'm happy.

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Old
03-29-2012, 07:12 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Xelstyle View Post
Solid explanation.
If we can get one quality piece out of it, I'm happy.
This. I love Iggy as much as the next guy, but as long as he's around, the rebuild will never happen.

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Old
03-29-2012, 07:16 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Stewie Griffin View Post
Historically, this team has done poorly trading away talent (hell, even Niewendyk was almost traded for Todd Harvey, but the Flames "settled" for Iginla). Based on this trend alone, keeping Iginla makes the most sense.

If "the right package" is an overpayment by some team which also takes Iginla's intrinsic value to the City and the Organization into account, then I'd be okay with trading him. (by that, I mean we need to seriously pillage someone in the trade, for a change) Since that "right package" probably won't come around, I voted no.



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How about Iggy to the Rangers for Lundmark and Blackburn?

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Old
03-30-2012, 01:39 AM
  #29
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Trade him but not because its his fault. The owners/GM's have never surrounded him with enough talent to win. One cup run in 15 years pretty sad. Look how well he plays in The Olympics etc when he has talent around him. I have said it before I really hope Iggy has enough fire left in him to want to move somewhere he has a shot at the cup. He owes this team nothing. The return may not be as great as some think but both sides need a change.

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Old
03-30-2012, 06:03 AM
  #30
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Look how well he plays in The Olympics etc when he has talent around him.
Other than the 5 goals he scored against the two worse teams in the tournament, and being the placeholder on the Crosby goal, Iggy didn't look particularly good in the last Olympics.

He started on the first line, and ended up on the 4th. He had trouble keeping up to the elite talent, but he was the oldest forward on the Canadian team.

But with a NMC, Iggy is entitled to determine his own fate. I'd move him if he wants to be moved. If he wants to finish his career in Calgary, it needs to be at a significant discount to what he is currently paid.

Calagry is likely not to serioulsly contend for a number of years, paying Iggy $4M to mentor the kids isn't a bad choice, as we aren't likley to have any cap problems for a while assuming Calgary actually tries to rebuild and not sign over the hill and overpaid UFA's.

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Old
03-30-2012, 06:06 AM
  #31
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They shouldn't make the same mistake that Toronto made with Mats Sundin. As much as I dislike the Flames (Canucks Fan) I'd hate it if the franchise went in a similar direction. It was a lot more fun when our teams were competitive with one another (not meant as a shot).

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Old
03-30-2012, 07:42 AM
  #32
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They shouldn't make the same mistake that Toronto made with Mats Sundin. As much as I dislike the Flames (Canucks Fan) I'd hate it if the franchise went in a similar direction. It was a lot more fun when our teams were competitive with one another (not meant as a shot).
I am so tired of people being blind to facts.

The Leafs never made a mistake with Sundin, HE REFUSED TO WAIVE HIS NTC. Why is this so difficult for the people on HF to understand.

The Flames are in the same situation and in the end its up to Jarome not the team.

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Old
03-30-2012, 11:35 AM
  #33
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The Flames should show some class and move Iggy to a contender to give him a chance at Lord Stanley's mug. He deserves the chance just like Ray Bourque did.

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Old
03-30-2012, 12:22 PM
  #34
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Iggy has become our new Lanny. All of us adore him, but he simply doesn't have the tools to be our number one guy. Keep him, but reduce his role, and mayhap give the C to Giordano or or someone else who fits (Cammi, Tangs?).

Too much is being put on his shoulders and he just isn't the same guy who put this team on his back in 04. It's time for the Flames management to open their eyes to this reality

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03-30-2012, 12:39 PM
  #35
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The Flames should show some class and move Iggy to a contender to give him a chance at Lord Stanley's mug. He deserves the chance just like Ray Bourque did.
If Iggy asked to be moved, I'm sure the Flames would move him. It's really his choice.

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Old
03-30-2012, 12:50 PM
  #36
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Iggy has become our new Lanny. All of us adore him, but he simply doesn't have the tools to be our number one guy. Keep him, but reduce his role, and mayhap give the C to Giordano or or someone else who fits (Cammi, Tangs?).

Too much is being put on his shoulders and he just isn't the same guy who put this team on his back in 04. It's time for the Flames management to open their eyes to this reality
there is no one on this team other than Iggy that deserves to be a captain in the NHL

the only thing Iggy needs is a better team around him and a system that our players can succeed in

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Old
03-30-2012, 12:54 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
I am so tired of people being blind to facts.

The Leafs never made a mistake with Sundin, HE REFUSED TO WAIVE HIS NTC. Why is this so difficult for the people on HF to understand.

The Flames are in the same situation and in the end its up to Jarome not the team.
It's Jarome's final call, but there's no indication that management has ever asked him to even consider waiving his NTC.

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Old
03-30-2012, 12:54 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
there is no one on this team other than Iggy that deserves to be a captain in the NHL

the only thing Iggy needs is a better team around him and a system that our players can succeed in
Do you honestly think there is a system that this team can succeed with? What defines success? If it's just making the playoffs, then MAYBE. If the goal is winning the cup, then no way in hell. Iginla has had better teams around him. How many systems do you try before you acknowledge that this core cannot win?

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Old
03-30-2012, 01:02 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Canuckaholic19 View Post
They shouldn't make the same mistake that Toronto made with Mats Sundin. As much as I dislike the Flames (Canucks Fan) I'd hate it if the franchise went in a similar direction. It was a lot more fun when our teams were competitive with one another (not meant as a shot).
Hey you're a Canuckaholic, I'm a flameaholic. I like your team better.

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Old
03-30-2012, 02:42 PM
  #40
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Should be up to Iggy. He's earned the right. Ask him want he wants, whatever that is, make it happen. I'd love to see him stay but if he wants to leave and/or a deal can be put in place that helps the team, I'd have no problem with that.

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03-30-2012, 03:00 PM
  #41
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Honestly, this team reminds me so much of the 2007-08 Vancouver Canucks. The team has run its course and the whole team needs to be revamped. All of the once-reliable veterans have now lost their ability to contribute; this last stretch of games is where the team unfortunately has burned out. The 2007-08 Canucks lost 7 of their last 8 games and missed the playoffs by a mere three points. Had they played .500 hockey, they would have been in the playoffs.

This team has done exactly the same. This is the time to make some changes. The core of this team needs to change.

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Old
03-30-2012, 06:41 PM
  #42
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It's a game of chicken. Iginla is too classy to request a trade, and ownership/management think too highly of him to ask him to waive his NMC (which he has already said he will do if asked). Neither party is willing to make the first move.

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Old
03-30-2012, 07:07 PM
  #43
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All depends on Iggy for me. If he wants to win, and move on, then yes. If he wants to stay, then he's done enough for this team that I'm okay with that.
This sums up how I feel. While I don't want to see Iginla leave, I would really love to see him get a chance to win the Cup. I would be very ubnhappy to see him get the Ryan Smyth treatment but if it's to a Cup contender then I'd be happy for him, as long as the Flames get some real good building blocks.

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Old
03-30-2012, 07:12 PM
  #44
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It's a game of chicken. Iginla is too classy to request a trade, and ownership/management think too highly of him to ask him to waive his NMC (which he has already said he will do if asked). Neither party is willing to make the first move.
That and I think he just wants to stay in Calgary.

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Old
03-30-2012, 10:43 PM
  #45
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Trade him and blow up the team time for a rebuild.

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Old
03-30-2012, 11:06 PM
  #46
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I say keep him and put him on a line with Baertschi.

He'd score 30 again and Baerstchi would win the Calder. Would be good for his development.

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Old
03-30-2012, 11:19 PM
  #47
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I say keep him and put him on a line with Baertschi.

He'd score 30 again and Baerstchi would win the Calder. Would be good for his development.
And how would that work exactly? Iginla is becoming a joke and should not be anywhere near Bartschi or the rest of the hockey club. Any player who spends as much time as Iginla does cherry picking should not be in a leadership or first line role with the team. Would you want Bartschi cherry picking or learning how to play a complete game? Time to move Iginla for the betterment of the team.

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Old
03-31-2012, 02:41 AM
  #48
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Do you honestly think there is a system that this team can succeed with? What defines success? If it's just making the playoffs, then MAYBE. If the goal is winning the cup, then no way in hell. Iginla has had better teams around him. How many systems do you try before you acknowledge that this core cannot win?
Yes I do think there is a system that work. Look at our team and look at a team like Nashville or St. Louis. On paper we are just as good as them, on the ice that is not the case.

Coaching is a significant downfall of this team.

just look at our forward group


We have 3 wingers (Iginla, Tanguay & Cammalleri) that could be 70 point players if used effectively.

We have 2 centermen (Olli & Stajan) that have multiple 50 point seasons under their belts.

We have Glencross who would have easily been a 50 point player this season had it not been for his injury.

We have 3 former 20 goal scorers (Stempniak, Comeau and Moss) that fill out our 3rd line and see spot duty in the top 6 when there are injuries.

then we also have a good young two-way centerman who hasn't have the offensive reigns taken off him yet in Backlund (at least IMO) waiting to have some sort of a break out season.

and yet we are 25th in the league for goals for? its mind numbing how bad this team is offensively with all the offensive weapons we have. This team should be top 10 in scoring with 3 lines that can score, but with Brent Sutter's system we are near the bottom forcing players into roles they are not suited for.

Stajan is a good example, 2 time 50 point center, he starts playing for Sutter and immediately his offense dries up and he gets tossed on the 3rd and 4th lines.

Comeau is another example, the kid is creating a **** load of chances but Sutter won't put someone to clean up the garbage on the line with him, instead he puts Comeau with a softer perimeter playing (albeit recently more feisty) Stajan and a shooter in Stempniak. If Comeau was playing with Glencross or Moss someone would be near the net to bury those chances.

Moss is another example, he has a poor camp and gets made the #1 center due to injuries even though he is far from a top line player and horrid on faceoffs, someone being adequate defensively does mean they are capable of being an NHL center.

And that's just looking at our forwards.

Don't get me wrong I fault Feaster a bit too as he failed to address a HUGE need for this club in faceoffs and a guy that can stand in front of the net on the PP (Ryan Smyth would have been ideal). I will give him a bit of a pass because he was close to getting Smyth and he had his hands tied by Darryl's poor cap management. But he easily could have picked up Steckel from the Devils for the pick he traded to NJ for Letourneau-Leblond which would have finally given us a faceoff specialist to use on the PK and late in games. Which IMO would have saved us at least a couple blown leads.

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Old
03-31-2012, 10:24 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
Yes I do think there is a system that work. Look at our team and look at a team like Nashville or St. Louis. On paper we are just as good as them, on the ice that is not the case.

Coaching is a significant downfall of this team.

just look at our forward group


We have 3 wingers (Iginla, Tanguay & Cammalleri) that could be 70 point players if used effectively.

We have 2 centermen (Olli & Stajan) that have multiple 50 point seasons under their belts.

We have Glencross who would have easily been a 50 point player this season had it not been for his injury.

We have 3 former 20 goal scorers (Stempniak, Comeau and Moss) that fill out our 3rd line and see spot duty in the top 6 when there are injuries.

then we also have a good young two-way centerman who hasn't have the offensive reigns taken off him yet in Backlund (at least IMO) waiting to have some sort of a break out season.

and yet we are 25th in the league for goals for? its mind numbing how bad this team is offensively with all the offensive weapons we have. This team should be top 10 in scoring with 3 lines that can score, but with Brent Sutter's system we are near the bottom forcing players into roles they are not suited for.

Stajan is a good example, 2 time 50 point center, he starts playing for Sutter and immediately his offense dries up and he gets tossed on the 3rd and 4th lines.

Comeau is another example, the kid is creating a **** load of chances but Sutter won't put someone to clean up the garbage on the line with him, instead he puts Comeau with a softer perimeter playing (albeit recently more feisty) Stajan and a shooter in Stempniak. If Comeau was playing with Glencross or Moss someone would be near the net to bury those chances.

Moss is another example, he has a poor camp and gets made the #1 center due to injuries even though he is far from a top line player and horrid on faceoffs, someone being adequate defensively does mean they are capable of being an NHL center.

And that's just looking at our forwards.

Don't get me wrong I fault Feaster a bit too as he failed to address a HUGE need for this club in faceoffs and a guy that can stand in front of the net on the PP (Ryan Smyth would have been ideal). I will give him a bit of a pass because he was close to getting Smyth and he had his hands tied by Darryl's poor cap management. But he easily could have picked up Steckel from the Devils for the pick he traded to NJ for Letourneau-Leblond which would have finally given us a faceoff specialist to use on the PK and late in games. Which IMO would have saved us at least a couple blown leads.
You have me coming around Medium Rare. A new coach could really turn our fortunes around. I look at Paul Byron. He did some inspiring things in Calgary in limited ice time. His speed created some breakaways, he was physical (when a small guy plays like that it lifts the team and the fans) and he had that big penalty shot goal.

If he got say Kostopolous's ice time would we be 3-4 points better off?

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Old
03-31-2012, 11:03 AM
  #50
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You have me coming around Medium Rare. A new coach could really turn our fortunes around. I look at Paul Byron. He did some inspiring things in Calgary in limited ice time. His speed created some breakaways, he was physical (when a small guy plays like that it lifts the team and the fans) and he had that big penalty shot goal.

If he got say Kostopolous's ice time would we be 3-4 points better off?
it is really hard to say, people like to crap on Tko a bit, but he had a role and was effective when used in said role. However when he was thrown onto the 3rd and even 2nd lines it was a HUGE mistake IMO, but that is Sutter's fault and not Kostopolous' he only has certain attributes and he does work his ass off every shift. We have more talented player to fill those roles though and Byron is definitely one of those guys, if Byron could win faceoffs I would consider him for a 3rd or 4th line center role next season

However I am afraid that Byron will be lost in the shuffle a bit next year as I think Nemisz is better suited for the NHL at this point in time and Bouma and Horak have surpassed him on the depth chart. Then you add in Jackman re-signing and Beartschi and you have 4 guys fighting for 2 positions (I guess Horak might fight for a center spot but I really hope not since he is a liability in the faceoff circle) and I would prefer any of them be in Abbotsford next year over being the 13th forward.

Also consider we have a good amount of cap space, we could really make a pitch at one or 2 of the defensemen on the market and sure up our defense and would make it so our forwards can take more risks (assuming a new coach is in place).

And since Kiprusoff has shown he tends to struggle when the team opens up in front of him maybe its time to move him and platoon Irving with a Marty Biron, Josh Harding or Tomas Vokoun. I think this team has enough offensive tools to be very effective playing more of a fire wagon style game.

I proposed this in a Leafs thread in the trade forum but never got too much feedback, but I suggested the following:

to
(G) Miikka Kiprusoff
(D) Brett Carson
(Pick) 1st in 2012
to
(C) Joe Colborne
(D) Mike Komisarek
(Pick) 1st in 2012

this would give the Flames a top 10 pick, a rugged physical defenseman (albeit overpaid) to play with Brodie on the 3rd pairing and a good center prospect with size.

another deal I would very much consider is something around Giordano and Mike Green (assuming we are going to a more offensive brand of hockey) as Green brings in a right handed shot and is a true PP QB that we sorely lack. Also I think Green could very much compliment Bouwmeester on the PP like McCabe did during his time in Florida. And speaking of Bouwmeester I think an uptempo offensive system would very much compliment what he brings and make him much more dangerous offensively.

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