How did I know Krazy would chime in? He always does. It's not the body count bud, just the fact that there could be one. Pick any auto racing genre, or better yet, name one that hasn't had them--slot cars don't count. Get the picture yet?
OK, if you say so. Why have there been ongoing measures to limit the speed of F1 cars?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWilson
DANGER sells tickets--even the ones you boys buy. Either of you have season tickets you paid hundreds and in most cases thousands for to international chess? Curling? Spelling bees? Ping Pong? Dare I say...major league baseball? Do you frequent those message boards? If you do, congrats, you're a renaissance man.
Maybe, but not the reason I buy them. I don't have MLB season seats (too much of a time commitment), but I do spend more on Jays tickets per year than my Colts season tickets cost. I also have had NFL season seats for years...a league that had the sense to start limiting hits to the head with Deacon Jones in the 1970's. One of the issues that many don't like to talk about is that most of these kids will not go on to play professional sports (likely including your fave Colts) and if they have long term physical issues, it's the Ontario taxpayer who will get to pick up the tab. I pay quite enough taxes already, thanks very much.
...and you got it upside down about the high sticks issue, way back then this was not a problem in the NHL, not saying it didn't happen, I'm saying it wasn't a problem, it evolved into a problem as the player's respect for one another devolved... it's to the point where they had to do something about it. Your not being disrespectful by hitting someone hard as long as it's clean... it's good old fashion hockey in a Canadian tradition... Canada's most proud tradition... and some of you want that gone I guess....
Fair points. You're right ont he above point and I guess the question for me is in how we define a clean hit. Traditionally, people think of an elbow to the head as a "dirty hit". Why is that? Does it cause more injury to the brain than a shoulder? Doesn't seem logical to me, but it could be so. I think more likely it's because it's always been so. Probably created before people wore shoulder pads. Certainly before players wore hard plastic ones. Right now a hit to the head is illegal in the OHL. Any hit to the head. Therefore it is, by definition, NOT a clean hit...at least given the current rules of the OHL.
My point and that of others here, in a broader sense, is that the game cannot become what it is not, or well... it ceases to be the same game. However antediluvian it may seem, the fact remains that the game will always have a measure of risk to it and that risk is what makes it appealing. My views on hits to the head are practical--its gonna happen, even when there is no intention. Sometimes it happens because players, for lack of a better description, **** up. The game should make them PAY for that at every turn--otherwise they aren't worth the salaries they command--and demand. These are privileged people by most human standards. There are literally millions of people, every day and in every way, risking their well being and certainly their lives for a whole lot less fame and fortune, a WHOLE lot less.
Every player has a choice to make about playing at higher and higher levels and a chance to evaluate the risks at each. If you want the ultimate thrill or the ultimate payday, you have to be willing to pay the ultimate price. This is precisely the reason fighting should be left in and the physicality of hockey shouldn't be altered so much that it becomes a different game. 20,000 people in an arena stand up at the same time and scream their heads off for three things during a hockey game—The anthem, goals and hits/fights.
The ‘best’ that every country has want to play in the NHL because it’s the fastest, most brutal game (IMHO) man has ever invented. There is nowhere to run or to hide in the arena, and it brings out the absolute best that its particpants can offer. Ask 100 Canadians on the street if they think the European game is better, more apealing, more worth their dollar. Better yet, ask 100 Americans (the biggest market for the game) what they want to pay for. It ain’t the Euro game or some watered down version of this one.
I guess the question for me is in how we define a clean hit.
The problem is in the way that they totally excuse the person that got hit even if he was being very foolish. If you look at the video, the coach as got the same question. Alot of us do...
and are the rules in the OHL getting the players ready for the NHL? Maybe Halmo did Yakupov a big favor. If Yakupov crosses a crucial zone like that in the NHL carrying his head down to his waist, what you think is going to happen in the NHL? Did he learn anything from any of this?
I watched Yakupov the other night against Saginaw. Looked tentative and a little gunshy. That's just a post injury fact of life I suppose.
His game is so active, so full of cuts and directional changes. He uses the entire sheet, which could make him a great NHL player or end his career quickly, depending upon whether he has in fact made a mental note of the recent gap in his memory (concussion). He's an exciting player for sure, but there are plenty of those in the NHL--and plenty of guys that make careers out of keeping them honest.
If you're not an offensive weapon and a highly touted draft pick or a smooth skating puck wizard, your job is usually to stop one. That means in order to keep your job you have to, well, STOP guys that make you look bad. Part of what bothers me about some of the people posting on here is that they don't think that part of the game is important or matters or is an ART. It is and there are guys that are gifted when it comes to it. Watching a guy like Andy Sutton backpedal across the entire blue line to hipcheck a forward into next week is a thing of beauty. What's also noticeable is that the guys he's hitting are usually not fully aware of what is coming. That is the skill of Sutton, and the FAULT of the guy he's hitting. Complacency has no place in this game and it will be removed by those in the game whose job it is to do so.
I watched Yakupov the other night against Saginaw. Looked tentative and a little gunshy. That's just a post injury fact of life I suppose.
His game is so active, so full of cuts and directional changes. He uses the entire sheet, which could make him a great NHL player or end his career quickly, depending upon whether he has in fact made a mental note of the recent gap in his memory (concussion). He's an exciting player for sure, but there are plenty of those in the NHL--and plenty of guys that make careers out of keeping them honest.
If you're not an offensive weapon and a highly touted draft pick or a smooth skating puck wizard, your job is usually to stop one. That means in order to keep your job you have to, well, STOP guys that make you look bad. Part of what bothers me about some of the people posting on here is that they don't think that part of the game is important or matters or is an ART. It is and there are guys that are gifted when it comes to it. Watching a guy like Andy Sutton backpedal across the entire blue line to hipcheck a forward into next week is a thing of beauty. What's also noticeable is that the guys he's hitting are usually not fully aware of what is coming. That is the skill of Sutton, and the FAULT of the guy he's hitting. Complacency has no place in this game and it will be removed by those in the game whose job it is to do so.
And the art goes on also like the Gretsky - McSorley combo. Alot of people's hero is Gretsky, and probably don't even acknowledge McSorley. Guess who is Gretsky's hero.... Yes it's McSorley, Gretsky said it himself, that if it wasn't for McSorley half the records he owns would not have been attained. It was McSorley's job to "Stop" the "Stopper"
How about the league phones the Rangers and says there is no problem with the hit and he can play tonight and then on Monday the inform the Rangers that they have changed there minds and now he is suspended indefinetely or until we complete are review next Friday.
Or, they could just drag their feet and not make a bleeping decision.
I fully expected Randell to be sitting tonight regardless, so any delay in announcing a suspension doesn't matter to the outcome, but once again the league is showing how stupid it is to not have representatives available to review what happens on the weekend, considering most of the games are played then.
It also looks as though Brace skips away scot free for spearing Gibson. How nice.
Watching a guy like Andy Sutton backpedal across the entire blue line to hipcheck a forward into next week is a thing of beauty. What's also noticeable is that the guys he's hitting are usually not fully aware of what is coming.
I LOVE hip checks. Hardly ever see them anymore. Effective in stopping an opponent and people rarely get concussed as a result of one...
Randell got 10 games and I have to admit it shocked me.
First time offender seems a little steep.
They were talking about this during the Owen Sound game. the commentators said that the OHL will rule 10 games minimum on any suspendable head hit no matter what.
They were talking about this during the Owen Sound game. the commentators said that the OHL will rule 10 games minimum on any suspendable head hit no matter what.
If the league were consistent in this, I'd be all for it. But you know that's not going to happen.
And are they going to dish out higher suspensions for repeat offenders? Doubtful.
It's worrisome in terms of our game. The 'highest' level of junior hockey isn't what it used to be. It's getting softer and its really tough to understand the logic here.
I don't know CharlieGirl, I was just repeating what I herd
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWilson
It's worrisome in terms of our game. The 'highest' level of junior hockey isn't what it used to be. It's getting softer and its really tough to understand the logic here.
Yep, they're not getting them ready for the NHL, and that's dangerous.
If the league were consistent in this, I'd be all for it. But you know that's not going to happen.
This is a valid concern. The Randell hit didn't seem as bad to me as some of the other hits that got 10 games. One of the key faults I see with the rationale system they are using is that a binary measure of injured/not injured seems to be taken into account. When somebody does something malicious and the victim is uninjured by good fortune, there either a minimal or no penalty.
I have no problem with Randell being suspended - it was a clear headshot (although 10 games surprised me). But I do agree with you that there are hits just as or more dangerous, where the player is not injured - perhaps if those were dealt with more seriously, we wouldn't see so many injuries.
Someone on the Rangers board made a good point. Fanelli has played all year and, while he's been hit hard and legally, no one has aimed for his head. Players can play that way, they just don't for whatever reason.
I think the "reason why" it happens should be the top issue the OHL should look at. Was the hitter vicious? Was the reciever being stupid. Combination of both maybe? There can be alot of reasons why someone got hit in the head. It could happen that someone got nudged at the wrong time as another player just happen to be skating by that zone, and unwillingly clipped the head with his elbow.
In the Yakupov incident, Halmo didn't have any choice really. Yakupov was bent over not accepting that the puck rolled off his stick and reaching for it with his head down to his waist. All this in prime hockey zone in front of the net. What else was there available for Halmo to do? As good as Yakupov is, he will get killed in the NHL if he tries this move. Halmo did him a favor. Sorry... but Yakupov, you were being careless and you got what you deserve. This is hockey, not ping-pong.
Branch in his infinite wisdom, the biggest idiot in hockey in my books, said that Halmo shouldv'e "backed off"... really Branch? You think?
That guy, or those that he might be a puppet to are the most dangerous thing to north american hockey players, and they need to be gone along with their logic that is the most stupid logic I ever seen in hockey.
Last edited by bidzey: 03-30-2012 at 09:22 AM.
Reason: spelling mistake that changed the meaning
Whatever the rules are or become, the fact remains that head shots will happen regardless. Guys get hurt on those types of plays. It's just the nature of the game.
Another example is boarding. This is arguably an even more dangerous situation. Players get concussed from head shots. Paralysis rarely if ever occurs there. Boards can, have and do result in paralysis, which to me is far worse than scrambled eggs. Boarding is 2 mins, 10 if it's blatant. IDK the figures, but how many suspensions have been issued for boarding? Are they higher or lower than for head shots? IDK.
I guess what I'm wondering is why head shots apparently are getting more attention or more severe punishment than an infraction that has ended the careers and the normal lives of more than a few hockey players from all levels? Just seems misplaced and a bit inconsistent to me.
If the league is repeatedly handing out lengthy suspensions, which seems to be the trend, eventually the message will get across to coaching staffs and then players. The criteria for suspensions seems to be very inconsistent though. That is a great risk because the "we will suspend you" message will get through, but the "here's why" message won't. So, the coaches and players will default to a much less physical, softer game in order to keep playing and not, well, sitting. Sounds like the evolution of European hockey to me boys.
Does Dalton Smith get suspended for his hit in last nights game against Bellville? It looked like a decent hit but he got a 5 minute head check and game misconduct (automatic 10 game rule?)
How Rose escaped without a suspension is something I'd really like the league to explain. But it really doesn't matter now, other than hoping Faksa will be okay to play soon.
How Rose escaped without a suspension is something I'd really like the league to explain. But it really doesn't matter now, other than hoping Faksa will be okay to play soon.
How Rose escaped without a suspension is something I'd really like the league to explain. But it really doesn't matter now, other than hoping Faksa will be okay to play soon.
There was at least 2 other hits that was suspension worthy in this series, Gilbert on Faksa in Game 1 and Gilbert on Thomson chin (Game 3?).
Oh well...water under the bridge!
It's not that these were penalties a few years ago but under the present rules they 100% are.
