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Pierre Gauthier & Bob Gainey let go - Savard brought back in advisory role - Part II

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Old
04-01-2012, 02:25 PM
  #976
Rise from the Ashes
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Timmins as GM would not be a bad idea whatsoever. However, I see it being a lot more likely that he ends up being promoted to assistant general manager and be the head professional scout. I would then either promote our best amateur scout to Director of Player Personnel or hire outside of the organization.

In my mind:

GM: Pierre McGuire
ASST GM: Trevor Timmins

Then surround these two men with experienced hockey men. The combination of McGuire's vision and Timmins understanding of talent could be quite dynamic.

Also, regarding those who feel Timmins may be fired due to new management; all the new management has to observe is his track record which is pretty damn good. Moreover, the influx of great young talent into Hamilton next year will be a testament to his competency. Just wouldnt make sense. I dont think he had any say in what previous management did with his selections.


Last edited by Rise from the Ashes: 04-01-2012 at 02:35 PM.
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Old
04-01-2012, 02:32 PM
  #977
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You seem to think the whole situation happened just because Tremblay randomly decided to humiliate Roy for no reason. That's extremely naive and simplistic. And that's before even accounting for the fact that Roy's response was INCREDIBLY disproportionate.
Only if we decide to believe that this was the only incident that has ever happened between them. It started way before that and surely things we don't know about. Tremblay had to be amongst one of the most condescending people on the planet. Just like Carbonneau. Yet, I couldn't care less if you get the job done. Tremblay had to know better but to provoke Roy like that and humiliate him. I agree, Corey is the first and main problem in this. By far. And frankly, I don't see Houle being at fault for not talking him out of this 'cause clearly the order was coming from Corey. Another condescending person and that's coming from a very good source, my late father. Knew Corey VERY WELL. From his young days to his last moments when my father was a usher at the Bell Centre. And that's mainly why Corey appointed Houle in the first place. 'Cause he got out of a situation when he didn't have a whole lot of control with Savard, to a situation when he would have loved to have way more with Houle, which he had. Houle's fault is for not bringing a better package.

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04-01-2012, 04:07 PM
  #978
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Lets not forget the other factor in the Roy game. Mario let his emotions get the best of him and took it out on Roy.

Mario never liked Scotty Bowman, always felt that Scotty mistreated him on those 70s teams. Always the whipping boy, never appreciated, not enough ice time.

This was Mario's first game coaching against Scotty and he wanted it bad. Told everyone who would listen that he would beat his old coach. Roy had an off night and Mario felt humiliated again. Scotty didnt back the Wings off the throttle cause Tremblay's words about him had become bulletin board material. He wanted to embarrass him. Mario blamed Roy for his own personal embarrassment by Scotty and left him in for a few more so he'd be embarrassed too.

A juvenile move and one that cost the franchise dearly.

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04-01-2012, 04:56 PM
  #979
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Lets not forget the other factor in the Roy game. Mario let his emotions get the best of him and took it out on Roy.

Mario never liked Scotty Bowman, always felt that Scotty mistreated him on those 70s teams. Always the whipping boy, never appreciated, not enough ice time.

This was Mario's first game coaching against Scotty and he wanted it bad. Told everyone who would listen that he would beat his old coach. Roy had an off night and Mario felt humiliated again. Scotty didnt back the Wings off the throttle cause Tremblay's words about him had become bulletin board material. He wanted to embarrass him. Mario blamed Roy for his own personal embarrassment by Scotty and left him in for a few more so he'd be embarrassed too.

A juvenile move and one that cost the franchise dearly.
Just as an aside... the fans who were there at the game that night deserve a ton of blame for this. If they hadn't treated Roy the way they did, he probably doesn't blow like he did. The mock cheering was brutal and it was sickening to see it again a few years back with Price. We clearly haven't learned our lesson.

I hope some of the fools who were at the game know what they did to screw up our team. They deserve a big part of the blame too.

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04-01-2012, 05:03 PM
  #980
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Originally Posted by Commandant View Post
Lets not forget the other factor in the Roy game. Mario let his emotions get the best of him and took it out on Roy.

Mario never liked Scotty Bowman, always felt that Scotty mistreated him on those 70s teams. Always the whipping boy, never appreciated, not enough ice time.

This was Mario's first game coaching against Scotty and he wanted it bad. Told everyone who would listen that he would beat his old coach. Roy had an off night and Mario felt humiliated again. Scotty didnt back the Wings off the throttle cause Tremblay's words about him had become bulletin board material. He wanted to embarrass him. Mario blamed Roy for his own personal embarrassment by Scotty and left him in for a few more so he'd be embarrassed too.

A juvenile move and one that cost the franchise dearly.
And what was with Ronald Corey sitting behind the bench....like come on,,,so lame still cant stand to see that stupid smirk on him and Tremblays face when Roy approached them on the bench.
What a **** show that was.

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04-01-2012, 05:05 PM
  #981
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Just as an aside... the fans who were there at the game that night deserve a ton of blame for this. If they hadn't treated Roy the way they did, he probably doesn't blow like he did. The mock cheering was brutal and it was sickening to see it again a few years back with Price. We clearly haven't learned our lesson.

I hope some of the fools who were at the game know what they did to screw up our team. They deserve a big part of the blame too.
I'm sorry. Its just that I paid 25$ for standing room tickets and at the time it was a lot...

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04-01-2012, 05:42 PM
  #982
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I'm sorry. Its just that I paid 25$ for standing room tickets and at the time it was a lot...
It's all your fault then. You're the guy who started the cheering weren't you?

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04-01-2012, 05:47 PM
  #983
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Ok Tremblay vs Roy..who cares it's over how about we stay on topic so people that really don't give a flying crap who's fault it was can actually read about what the title of the thread states...The past is the past let it go ffs

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04-01-2012, 06:06 PM
  #984
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Ok Tremblay vs Roy..who cares it's over how about we stay on topic so people that really don't give a flying crap who's fault it was can actually read about what the title of the thread states...The past is the past let it go ffs
It's hard to let it go because the main players are all still around and part of this process. Bowman who may want in as special consultant. Roy who many want as coach. Tremblay now among the media and critiquing this process. LOL

The only one gone is Corey & even his era is in part represented in Savard, who was his GM AND Savard was part of that 70s team with Tremblay & Bowman. LOL

The behind the scenes relationships/politics with this team is at times quite amazing. It's better than a soap opera.

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04-01-2012, 06:10 PM
  #985
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Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
I'm sorry. Its just that I paid 25$ for standing room tickets and at the time it was a lot...
I suppose everybody can act stupid and go mental whenever they pay for something ?? Where do you work, so that I can buy one of your products or pay for a service, and then go berserk for no reason other than 'I paid for that!'...

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Old
04-01-2012, 06:10 PM
  #986
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
It's all your fault then. You're the guy who started the cheering weren't you?
I was a mere follower. I was a young teen seeking approval from the season ticket holders below me who were Nordique fans studying at UQAM

Clearly the blame is on Nordique Nation

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Old
04-01-2012, 06:13 PM
  #987
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I suppose everybody can act stupid and go mental whenever they pay for something ?? Where do you work, so that I can buy one of your products or pay for a service, and then go berserk for no reason other than 'I paid for that!'...
I work in a tiny back office situated inside a dimly lit coffee shop in St. Leonard .. Ask for Vinny


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Old
04-01-2012, 06:15 PM
  #988
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Originally Posted by Vasculio View Post
I suppose everybody can act stupid and go mental whenever they pay for something ?? Where do you work, so that I can buy one of your products or pay for a service, and then go berserk for no reason other than 'I paid for that!'...
Is that Billy Two Rivers in your avatar? Just noticed you're almost 10 years a member of HF Boards, congrats man. Wrestlemania tonight, go Undertaker going for 20-0.

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Old
04-01-2012, 06:18 PM
  #989
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I suppose everybody can act stupid and go mental whenever they pay for something ?? Where do you work, so that I can buy one of your products or pay for a service, and then go berserk for no reason other than 'I paid for that!'...
If you have ever worked in customer service you would know this happens wayyy more often than you think.

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Old
04-01-2012, 06:29 PM
  #990
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I suppose everybody can act stupid and go mental whenever they pay for something ?? Where do you work, so that I can buy one of your products or pay for a service, and then go berserk for no reason other than 'I paid for that!'...
Sports IS entertainment and that's exactly what you pay for.
I wouldn't expect you to act like that when buying a cell phone, but you lay your hard earned dollars down for a diversion. To cheer for the home team and boo the visitors. If your home team doesn't perform to snuff then they get it.

I've been to Wales and was taken to see a famous club side(Pontypool) take on a has been. They were being jeered for winning because they weren't winning by enough.

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04-01-2012, 09:18 PM
  #991
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Saying that Tremblay was least responsible is just silly.
Corey was a fool, Houle was a simpleton, and Tremblay was a donkey.

I felt ill when I watched that game. Roy was not bigger than the team, people say that to justify their contempt for him. He was their leader, on and off the ice. He was their franchise player, led them to 3 finals, & two championships. Tremblay was a hot tempered commentator who became the coach with zero experience and didn't want to share the limelight. He failed to realize that there was only one horse that pulled this cart, and when you beat him to death, that cart isn't going to move anymore. Coaches need their veterans & leaders to buy in or they lose the room. Instead of respecting his leaders, he belittled them and his system & style was clearly that of someone who has never coached. the leaders of the team could not have respected him. I find it hard to believe that any other competitive goalie, lets say Brodeur, would have accepted being intentionally embarassed on home ice and not demand to be traded. The team failed Roy but implementing a special needs management team. Houle is not in hockey anymore, and the only reason Tremblay got a job as asstnt coach is because Lemaire is his buddy.
I agree with everything, but honestly, your post is too black and white ... there is a learning process and Im sure tremblay himself could testify that he would be ''ready'' for it a lot more now than back in the days. Im sure he's a much much better coach/ass coach now than he was 10 years ago ... this is where experience has weight ... I wouldn't mind him in the organization anymore (not as coach but ass/coach or hamilton coach I would welcome it honestly)

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04-01-2012, 09:43 PM
  #992
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Originally Posted by Rise from the Ashes View Post
Timmins as GM would not be a bad idea whatsoever. However, I see it being a lot more likely that he ends up being promoted to assistant general manager and be the head professional scout. I would then either promote our best amateur scout to Director of Player Personnel or hire outside of the organization.

In my mind:

GM: Pierre McGuire
ASST GM: Trevor Timmins

Then surround these two men with experienced hockey men. The combination of McGuire's vision and Timmins understanding of talent could be quite dynamic.

Also, regarding those who feel Timmins may be fired due to new management; all the new management has to observe is his track record which is pretty damn good. Moreover, the influx of great young talent into Hamilton next year will be a testament to his competency. Just wouldnt make sense. I dont think he had any say in what previous management did with his selections.
If I were Timmons I'd consider it a slap in the face to be an assistant to Pierre. What has Pierre ever done to deserve the GM position?

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04-01-2012, 09:50 PM
  #993
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If I were Timmons I'd consider it a slap in the face to be an assistant to Pierre. What has Pierre ever done to deserve the GM position?
he's just so groovy


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04-01-2012, 10:09 PM
  #994
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You guys do realize that potential GMs are interviewed and asked to outline a fairly detailed plan before they get hired, right?

It's not like Savard and Molson are watching Pierre McGuire telecasts to see if he would make a good GM.

If he is a candidate he will be interviewed extensively. And if the management group decides that his plan going forward is the best one, he will be hired.

You need to seperate the TV personality from him as a person. It isn't the same thing.

If he is a serious candidate he will be asked to give a very detailed plan which spans from the type of team to build to player development to injury protocol to cap management. In fact, most potential GMs likely have this plan prepared in advance for potential job openings.

If his is the best, why not hire him? Because you don't like how he analyzes games?

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04-01-2012, 10:14 PM
  #995
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You guys do realize that potential GMs are interviewed and asked to outline a fairly detailed plan before they get hired, right?

It's not like Savard and Molson are watching Pierre McGuire telecasts to see if he would make a good GM.

If he is a candidate he will be interviewed extensively. And if the management group decides that his plan going forward is the best one, he will be hired.

You need to seperate the TV personality from him as a person. It isn't the same thing.

If he is a serious candidate he will be asked to give a very detailed plan which spans from the type of team to build to player development to injury protocol to cap management. In fact, most potential GMs likely have this plan prepared in advance for potential job openings.

If his is the best, why not hire him? Because you don't like how he analyzes games?
Because he's one of the biggest blowhards there is. I don't even know why his name is being discussed. I understand people have heard of him, but give me a proven GM, or give the job to Timmons. Pierre just makes zero sense from every angle accept for the publicity of it.

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04-01-2012, 10:21 PM
  #996
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Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
Because he's one of the biggest blowhards there is. I don't even know why his name is being discussed. I understand people have heard of him, but give me a proven GM, or give the job to Timmons. Pierre just makes zero sense from every angle accept for the publicity of it.
You could have a blowhard proven GM if you really want it: Brian Burke might want out of the ship he's sinking...

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Old
04-01-2012, 10:24 PM
  #997
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Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
Because he's one of the biggest blowhards there is. I don't even know why his name is being discussed. I understand people have heard of him, but give me a proven GM, or give the job to Timmons. Pierre just makes zero sense from every angle accept for the publicity of it.
I get what you're saying, not that I agree, but why would Timmons be a better choice? I don't see why Timmons would be a good choice for GM...He is great at what he does but what makes you think he'd be a good GM?

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