Wow, is Emelin really that bad defensively? The guy's a hit machine but I guess that doesn't apply to getting the puck...
He has been miscast in the top 4, something he isn't ready for yet, especially with Kaberle or Markov (while he has poor mobility). Plek is number two and that is merely because he is always on in a defensive role and, being on the helicopter line, can't generate the offense to fix his +/-. Chances are Emelin has a similar problem where, if he isn't on with the DD line, he doesn't get the offensive support from his forwards or defensive help from his partner and it results in poor stats.
Tinordi needs time to develop in the AHL, but could surprise in training camp. Probably unlikely though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOLR
Tinordi: He looked kinda awkward at the last camp, I feel he is probably another year away. Beaulieu played better, we might see him. (And traditionally offensive Ds game can adapt better to the NHL)
The biggest obstacle for Beaulieu is Tomas Kaberle, it will probably be a binary decision between the two. It will be difficult for management to play Kaberle over him if Bealieu has another impressive training camp, but if he's only good and not great, then I think Kaberle blocks him for a year.
The AHL is still made of boys and men who are under-performing, teams that get depleted of their talent along the year are probably comparable to good OHL teams.
The OHL is not even close of the AHL.
I took a random year close to us and compared the stats of the top OHL players that played in the AHL the next year
Michael Swift
2007-08 Niagara IceDogs OHL 68 38 62 100
2008-09 Lowell Devils AHL 52 12 15 27
It's similar to all kids I checked...and let's not forget that they all played in the AHL a year more develloped than what they were in the OHL.
I could'nt find a single OHL player that dominated the AHL right away. There is probably some but most OHL stars struggle in the AHL which is a far far batter league.
Michael Swift
2007-08 Niagara IceDogs OHL 68 38 62 100
2008-09 Lowell Devils AHL 52 12 15 27
It's similar to all kids I checked...and let's not forget that they all played in the AHL a year more develloped than what they were in the OHL.
I could'nt find a single OHL player that dominated the AHL right away. There is probably some but most OHL stars struggle in the AHL which is a far far batter league.
I'm not saying the OHL is superior, but that teams like our Hamilton bulldogs in match up against good OHL teams would probably lose. The AHL is superior but it isn't very good a matchup between Swedish ligue 1 teams and AHL teams I'd put a dime on the Swedish league.
I'm not saying the OHL is superior, but that teams like our Hamilton bulldogs in match up against good OHL teams would probably lose. The AHL is superior but it isn't very good a matchup between Swedish ligue 1 teams and AHL teams I'd put a dime on the Swedish league.
LOL you seriously think the Dogs would lose to an OHL team boy you don't follow JR hockey much do you.
I'm not saying the OHL is superior, but that teams like our Hamilton bulldogs in match up against good OHL teams would probably lose. The AHL is superior but it isn't very good a matchup between Swedish ligue 1 teams and AHL teams I'd put a dime on the Swedish league.
LOL not a chance
The guys who suck on the bulldogs and are third and fourth liners are like Dany Masse, Phillipe Lefebvre, Alain Berger etc... all guys who dominated at the JR level, and those are the bottom 6ers. They'd destroy an OHL team
Tinordi needs time to develop in the AHL, but could surprise in training camp. Probably unlikely though.
The biggest obstacle for Beaulieu is Tomas Kaberle, it will probably be a binary decision between the two. It will be difficult for management to play Kaberle over him if Bealieu has another impressive training camp, but if he's only good and not great, then I think Kaberle blocks him for a year.
Agreed and that's not too bad. At this point the AHL is still a good step forward.
'While the American Hockey League is not a hot-spot for prospects to run to, the league does a very respectable job of prepping young talent for the NHL.'
I think Tinordi, Ellis and Beaulieu should spend all of next season in Hamilton. They each have a strong chance of becoming impact players on the Habs, but not for the next 2-4 years. If we want an immediate impact on defense, we need to sign an experienced UFA in the summer. I dont think it's a coincidence that the last two times the Habs missed the playoffs were the year before Hamrlik arrived and the year after Hamrlik left. Obviously Hamrlik is too old now, but we need someone reliable who can eat up important minutes on the back end. Yemelin, Diaz, Beaulieu, Ellis, Tinordi all have the potential to become that one day, but none are even close. If we want to be a better team next season we should go after an experienced defenseman. Suter would be ideal (but unlikely), however, there are other good options available through free agency.
the usual callup/short stint if there's some injuries on D and he's the best in line and doing well. but he shouldn't start yet. he'll get there though.
Wow, is Emelin really that bad defensively? The guy's a hit machine but I guess that doesn't apply to getting the puck...
No he's just randomly getting terrible goaltending behind him. .898 even strength save percentage. He should be a minus player this year but no where near that bad.
No he's just randomly getting terrible goaltending behind him. .898 even strength save percentage. He should be a minus player this year but no where near that bad.
This makes no sense, than not just Emelin but all the other rookies on D should have a comparable +/- record.
This makes no sense, than not just Emelin but all the other rookies on D should have a comparable +/- record.
+/- over a single season is subject to wild swings of circumstances outside a player's control. In this case Emelin got the short end of the goaltending stick. His overall play 5 on 5 play is better than any of the other 2nd and 3rd pairing regulars (Diaz, Kaberle, Campoli, Weber, Gill, Spacek) although Diaz is pretty close.
He has been miscast in the top 4, something he isn't ready for yet, especially with Kaberle or Markov (while he has poor mobility). Plek is number two and that is merely because he is always on in a defensive role and, being on the helicopter line, can't generate the offense to fix his +/-. Chances are Emelin has a similar problem where, if he isn't on with the DD line, he doesn't get the offensive support from his forwards or defensive help from his partner and it results in poor stats.
Plus Emelin tended to get absolutely burnt for a goal at least once per game for most of the season. Hard to say if it was communication problems or just not being able to deal with (even non-star) NHL forwards. He had ups and downs and looked better at the end of the year.
I would not say that he is a major star with non-representative stats. His D was bad at times. As with Weber (might be way better with a physical stay-at-home partner) and Diaz I would not want to guess which ones to keep. It's easier with Campoli and Kaberle: neither.
Tinordi could be the perfect partner for Subban or one of the little Ds. With Markov in the D is better, but if Tinordi can eat minutes and protect an offensive D (physically and defensively) the D might actually be good.
I hope whoever the new GM is puts a strong emphasis on proper development. I guess some fans haven't learned any lessons from the Habs rushing prospects to the NHL.
No he's just randomly getting terrible goaltending behind him. .898 even strength save percentage. He should be a minus player this year but no where near that bad.
He's still our worst dman defensively imo (well except Weber). He had a pretty terrible season...
I hope whoever the new GM is puts a strong emphasis on proper development. I guess some fans haven't learned any lessons from the Habs rushing prospects to the NHL.
Gauthier reversed that trend. Pacioretty went back to AHL last yaer, Subban played a full yaer AHL. LeBlanc started there this year until the injuries went out of control. even Diaz was to start AHL until Markov had a couple setbacks.
In Ottawa they are giving alot of credit to their turn around with how they let there young guys develop together in the AHL. I'd love to Tinordi next year, and I think he's close to being able to perform the role he'd play (a backend physical defensive defenseman). But allowing him, Bealiaeu, Ellis, Leblanc, Gallagher, etc develop together in the AHL would be ultimately beneficial...
Would love to see him up early if he is ready. We are in desperate need of another good defensive dman. Weber looks like his days are going to be numbered, shame he never really reached his potential.
how do you want him to reach his potential, when he was forward/defense/healthy scratch/goalie lol
But i believe he will reach his potential elsewhere (habs cliché)
Tinordi needs time to develop in the AHL, but could surprise in training camp. Probably unlikely though.
The biggest obstacle for Beaulieu is Tomas Kaberle, it will probably be a binary decision between the two. It will be difficult for management to play Kaberle over him if Bealieu has another impressive training camp, but if he's only good and not great, then I think Kaberle blocks him for a year.
If Kaberle gives them a reason to be patient with Beaulieu and give him AT LEAST the better part of a year in Hamilton, it will be the best thing he's done for the org.
