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New Research on the Dangers of Hockey Fights..People are Calling for no More Fighting

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04-06-2012, 06:07 PM
  #1
tjolsen
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New Research on the Dangers of Hockey Fights..People are Calling for no More Fighting



New research that was released from Boston University School of Medicine says that Hockey and Football players have a high chance of building up a protein in their brain called Tau. Tau causes the memory loss, dementia and other deadly brain problem. The study has shown that players who fight are much more likely to develop Tau in their brains and some people are calling for no more fighting...Fans are saying if you want to watch fights watch MMA or boxing....what do you guys think?


Last edited by tjolsen: 04-06-2012 at 06:21 PM.
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04-06-2012, 06:08 PM
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Dirty Dan
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Fighting hurts you? OH GEE WHAT A REVELATION

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04-06-2012, 06:12 PM
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Papaspud
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Another day, another anti-fighting diatribe.


On sidebar: The Penquins called up Steve MacIntyre for Saturday's game against the Flyers. Guess they did that for his scoring touch. lol

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04-06-2012, 06:17 PM
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tjolsen
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no man I love hockey fights, I am not rooting against them...

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04-06-2012, 06:18 PM
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tjolsen
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Originally Posted by Papaspud View Post
Another day, another anti-fighting diatribe.


On sidebar: The Penquins called up Steve MacIntyre for Saturday's game against the Flyers. Guess they did that for his scoring touch. lol
hahaha yeah I heard all he does is put it in the net

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04-06-2012, 07:43 PM
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tjolsen
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Fighting hurts you? OH GEE WHAT A REVELATION
Lol I know it may sound obvious but apparently Tau is a serious problem

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04-06-2012, 11:36 PM
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Isn't this already pretty common knowledge?

Look at what they found with Probert's brain (though some of the damage is obviously from drugs and alcohol) or Boogaard's etc.

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04-06-2012, 11:53 PM
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tjolsen
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Isn't this already pretty common knowledge?

Look at what they found with Probert's brain (though some of the damage is obviously from drugs and alcohol) or Boogaard's etc.
Yes i think in the basic form everyone knows if you get hit in the head a lot you will most likely get brain damage...I just mean I thought the information was new and unknown and yes hahaha that is prob why they found what they found in probert's brain lol

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04-07-2012, 09:05 PM
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I mean most of this stuff is common sense.

Why do people yell "duck"...? So you don't get hit in the head.

It's the brain, the control center.

But for me it all comes down to choice. The players know the risks they take and if they choose to fight I say "So be it!"

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04-07-2012, 09:21 PM
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There will still be head trauma without fights. Already the case in football and some of the more prominent concussions this year were not due to fights at all.

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04-08-2012, 03:00 PM
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New research that was released from Boston University School of Medicine says that Hockey and Football players have a high chance of building up a protein in their brain called Tau. Tau causes the memory loss, dementia and other deadly brain problem. The study has shown that players who fight are much more likely to develop Tau in their brains and some people are calling for no more fighting.?
Can you tell me what this new research is, if its from BU and CTE its not new and the results are still very preliminary.

CTE is a very very difficult thing to study because it can only be done posthumously, and unless something has changed they have found it in players brains that were not fighters. This isnt to say that there is no link, right now we just don't know. Using these preliminary results as the basis for policy decisions is a very bad idea, it is the same mentality that allowed several children in California to die from Whooping cough because their parents were convinced that there was a link between immunization and autism.

If the link is as strong as some suggest, it should be easy to prove.

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04-08-2012, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by tjolsen View Post
Lol I know it may sound obvious but apparently Tau is a serious problem
That's what they'll say when they come for the hitting too.

Hockey's a dangerous sport, that's why they pay you the big bucks.

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04-09-2012, 01:15 AM
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billybudd
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Originally Posted by tjolsen View Post


New research that was released from Boston University School of Medicine says that Hockey and Football players have a high chance of building up a protein in their brain called Tau. Tau causes the memory loss, dementia and other deadly brain problem. The study has shown that players who fight are much more likely to develop Tau in their brains and some people are calling for no more fighting...Fans are saying if you want to watch fights watch MMA or boxing....what do you guys think?
While not necessarily incorrect (and not new, either), anything Boston University of Medicine says about fighting in hockey has to be taken with a grain of salt. The program in question is run by a former professional wrestler named Chris Nowinski who has developed a reputation as something of a snake-oil salesman who makes bold pronouncements the research can't back up to get media coverage and raise his own profile. They've got a lot of data regarding football players. Far less with fighters in hockey.

To date, two ex-fighters in hockey have tested positive for CTE. BU has tested more than two ex-hockey-fighters, so I assume the rest of them came back negative. What's more alarming is that Rick Martin, who was not a fighter, also tested positive for the disease, so the cause of CTE in hockey players, in theory, might be due to something called SCIs (sub-concussive impacts), which means HITTING may be the major risk factor, not fighting.

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04-09-2012, 10:13 AM
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Hockey would suck without fighting and no one would watch it. Then all the teams would be bagging to get fighting back so they could get fans out to the games. People don't understand fighting. You fight to get your team going if there playing bad, you fight because another player hurt or did something dirty to your teammate, and lastly you fight because the fans love it. So for all you babies and wimps out there that want to get fighting out of hockey i have something for you. Go watch another sport like swimming or volleyball. Take up those sports they don't have concussions. Go play your wussie sports.

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04-09-2012, 02:52 PM
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Found some other neat reads on said protein, interesting, hopefully something can be done to combat it.

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04-09-2012, 03:47 PM
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So repetitive punches to the head are bad? I can tell a college degree was needed to come up with that conclusion.

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04-09-2012, 06:00 PM
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While not necessarily incorrect (and not new, either), anything Boston University of Medicine says about fighting in hockey has to be taken with a grain of salt. The program in question is run by a former professional wrestler named Chris Nowinski who has developed a reputation as something of a snake-oil salesman who makes bold pronouncements the research can't back up to get media coverage and raise his own profile. They've got a lot of data regarding football players. Far less with fighters in hockey.
.
Nowinski is apparently a current doctoral candidate in neurobiology, I am not sure if his " snake -oil-ness" is due to wanting to get his name in the papers or whether he is really just an very enthusiastic advocate looking to bring attention to his cause ( apparently he suffered more than his fair share when he was a professional wrestler).

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04-10-2012, 11:01 AM
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Is this the same research that found damage in all hockey player brains studied? That study only researched one non-fighter, and that player's brain was in a similar state.

Can you link the new study?

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04-10-2012, 12:59 PM
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Is this the same research that found damage in all hockey player brains studied? That study only researched one non-fighter, and that player's brain was in a similar state.

Can you link the new study?
My guess is that there is no "new" study but that the results of the CTE study were new to the OP. It's hard to keep up with everything.

And the study in question was really nothing more than a couple of press releases that coincided ( intentionally or not) with the tragic deaths of players that got a whole lot of legs when the NYT did their piece on Boogaard.

And Rick Martin's case, although he was not a fighter his head, reportedly, bounced off the ice a couple of times, which CTE or not, cant be good.

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04-10-2012, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by WorkingOvertime View Post
Is this the same research that found damage in all hockey player brains studied? That study only researched one non-fighter, and that player's brain was in a similar state.

Can you link the new study?
Yes I know only one of them were fighters but the others took their fair share of licks


http://www.bu.edu/cste/about/what-is-cte/

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04-10-2012, 04:48 PM
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My guess is that there is no "new" study but that the results of the CTE study were new to the OP. It's hard to keep up with everything.

And the study in question was really nothing more than a couple of press releases that coincided ( intentionally or not) with the tragic deaths of players that got a whole lot of legs when the NYT did their piece on Boogaard.

And Rick Martin's case, although he was not a fighter his head, reportedly, bounced off the ice a couple of times, which CTE or not, cant be good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjolsen View Post
Yes I know only one of them were fighters but the others took their fair share of licks


http://www.bu.edu/cste/about/what-is-cte/
The problem with the research is that it does not separate the effect of being a hockey player who doesn't fight from the effect of being a hockey player that does fight.

Is fighting causing CTE, or is playing hockey in physical leagues for 20+ years causing CTE? This study does nothing to answer this question, especially when most head injuries in hockey are not a result of fighting.

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04-10-2012, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by WorkingOvertime View Post
The problem with the research is that it does not separate the effect of being a hockey player who doesn't fight from the effect of being a hockey player that does fight.

Is fighting causing CTE, or is playing hockey in physical leagues for 20+ years causing CTE? This study does nothing to answer this question, especially when most head injuries in hockey are not a result of fighting.
Yep that's the rub, right now the number of hockey brains they have is pretty low ( I dont know for sure but perhaps less than a dozen). Extrapolating the results to suggest a link between CTE and fighting and not CTE and any other number of environmental factors ( non-fighting concussions, drinking, sleep habits, genetics) is going to be extremely difficult.

I also don't like the fact that when they apparently looked at Boogaards brain samples, the person who was responsible for making the determination of CTE ( which is very technically challenging) knew beforehand that the brain came from a hockey player. I think has the potential to introduce a huge observational bias and it should have been done blind ( why it was not I do not know) but that's a gripe for another day.

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04-10-2012, 10:53 PM
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While not necessarily incorrect (and not new, either), anything Boston University of Medicine says about fighting in hockey has to be taken with a grain of salt. The program in question is run by a former professional wrestler named Chris Nowinski who has developed a reputation as something of a snake-oil salesman who makes bold pronouncements the research can't back up to get media coverage and raise his own profile. They've got a lot of data regarding football players. Far less with fighters in hockey.

To date, two ex-fighters in hockey have tested positive for CTE. BU has tested more than two ex-hockey-fighters, so I assume the rest of them came back negative. What's more alarming is that Rick Martin, who was not a fighter, also tested positive for the disease, so the cause of CTE in hockey players, in theory, might be due to something called SCIs (sub-concussive impacts), which means HITTING may be the major risk factor, not fighting.
BINGO!

You really hit it right on the head, no pun intended.

I really believe that many of the enforcers like MacIntyre, McGrattan, Scott, etc would be fighters in another sport (MMA, Boxing) if they couldn't do it in hockey. They gravitated to their position because it allowed them to earn the best living for their skill set. Maybe a Princeton guy like Parros becomes a CPA but most of these guys would be in a field that maximized their best attribute which for many would be taking advantage of their size and physicality. Look at Brashear still making a living with his fists doing MMA fighting.

Bottom line, as many have said, hockey is a violent sport and people realize that banging your head isn't good.

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04-11-2012, 06:39 AM
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I'm currently watching the newest episode of House just thought I'd mention that the patient is a minor league enforcer and CTE is what their bringing up at this point (granted its not gunna be that but interesting seeing them argue over fighting in hockey)

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04-11-2012, 06:47 AM
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I'm currently watching the newest episode of House just thought I'd mention that the patient is a minor league enforcer and CTE is what their bringing up at this point (granted its not gunna be that but interesting seeing them argue over fighting in hockey)
Did the minor league enforcer die? Because thats the only way cte can be diagnosed ( unless house once agin broke all the rules and chopped out a significant amount of the guys brain to satisfy his curiosity).

The show is entertaining in a way but its still a show that takes a lot of medical license to make it entertaining. The new york times ( and more recently the atlantic) proved that there is a pretty good market for disingenuous and self rightous concern for the safety of guys willing to drop them.

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