....but looking at the Rebels vs. Silvertips squads and some stats...it definately seems like Murray has gotten a less talented team to the playoffs and been a much better scorer in the playoffs than Dumba has on a more talented squad. Clearly Dumba has come along this year and is the better scorer but he couldnt carry the team after losing Kuemper and the Nuge like Murray did the Silvertips after they lost Shane Harper and then Tyler Maxwell...and by that I mean getting them to the playoffs...but that also has to do with games and playing style...
Still Murray is 0.8 ppg in the playoffs over 20 games in the past 4 years wheras Dumba is 0.18 ppg over 11 games in three years...to me that is a good indicator of leadership and character on Murray.
Red Deer missed the playoffs with 70pts.
Everett made the playoffs with 54pts.
Ryan Murray is almost a full year older than Dumba (10mths).
Only two teams miss the playoffs in the Western Conference.
Four teams miss the playoffs in the Eastern Conference.
If we 2nd pick, could we trade for Montreal 3rd since they want Grig and get extra + murray assuming he isn't gone?
No, like i said earlier, habs have nothing that would knock my socks off, Price is a headcase (cant really blame him though, he gets the Luongo treatment there), plus he wont be traded anyways.
Subban i like but he's not getting traded, the only other players i like are prospects (dont need more of those), Tinordi and Beaulieu are the only ones that interest me, and they are probably untouchable. They can just draft AG if they want a centre.
I'm almost certain that if Rielly would have played more this season... he would be right up there with Murray and Dumba on most people's lists for the #1 dman. As it is... if he comes back some time in these playoffs and plays decently... I think his draft status will go up because scouts will have that fresh look and know he's a healthy body again.
Rielly could be the best dman in this draft and his offensive skills would be a really good fit on the Oilers.
Rielly is not the best dman in this draft. And his injury and missing the year makes him fall even that much further behind.
No, like i said earlier, habs have nothing that would knock my socks off, Price is a headcase (cant really blame him though, he gets the Luongo treatment there), plus he wont be traded anyways.
Subban i like but he's not getting traded, the only other players i like are prospects (dont need more of those), Tinordi and Beaulieu are the only ones that interest me, and they are probably untouchable. They can just draft AG if they want a centre.
Tinordi is a helluva prospect. I have zero time for Beaulieu. It would be Tinordi or nothing for me, and they would probably never go for it. You could get a bidding war between the Leafs and the Habs, since they both may covet that pick, but then again, the Habs may be ok with calling our bluff, and/or just taking Galchenyuk instead.
Tinordi is a helluva prospect. I have zero time for Beaulieu. It would be Tinordi or nothing for me, and they would probably never go for it. You could get a bidding war between the Leafs and the Habs, since they both may covet that pick, but then again, the Habs may be ok with calling our bluff, and/or just taking Galchenyuk instead.
Yup, Tinordi would be the one i would be looking at, wanted him in his draft year, but yeah they wont be trading him. They wanna call our "bluff", let 'em...like i said, they have nothing else i want anyways. Then they can draft whoever they want at 3. Its NEVER a good idea to trade down at the top of the draft anyways.
The Leafs can go pound sand, they have absolutely nothing that i would even entertain in a trade (also dont wanna deal with BB ever again). I get a kick out of their fans in the trade forum, at the start of the year when everyone was making proposals for Schenn, they were all up in arms about it, saying he was untouchable yada yada, and now they are the ones that look desperate to dump him for whatever they can get (most of the proposals involving him are started by their fans, its hilarious, always knew he was overrated by them). He has now been replaced by Gardiner (who?)....same thing happened last year with Reimer. dont want Phaneuf, dont want Gunnarsson, dont want any of their forwards, their goalies arent much better than ours are.
Rielly is not the best dman in this draft. And his injury and missing the year makes him fall even that much further behind.
I wouldn't be so sure of that. From what I've seen of them all... Rielly is better than Murray offensively and better than Dumba defensively. His defense isn't quite as good as Murray and his offense is likely not quite as dynamic as Dumba. I think that puts him right there in the conversation with those two.
I need to see him play more... (keep waiting to see if he ever comes back in the playoffs) but I think he's right up there with Murray/Dumba and if pushed I'd say he's a better balance of offense and defense than those two are... perfect for the Oilers.
Last edited by nexttothemoon: 04-07-2012 at 01:45 AM.
Tinordi is a helluva prospect. I have zero time for Beaulieu. It would be Tinordi or nothing for me, and they would probably never go for it. You could get a bidding war between the Leafs and the Habs, since they both may covet that pick, but then again, the Habs may be ok with calling our bluff, and/or just taking Galchenyuk instead.
For me... Grigorenko is pick 2A and Galchenyuk is 2B so if I coveted one over the other (I favour Grigs) and he was gone I wouldn't be that dissapointed choosing the "leftovers". I'm sure there would be some other scouts and organizations thinking the same way so I don't know how strong the bargaining power would be to hold teams "ransom" for their picks. Throw in Faksa and that's yet another option for teams looking for help at centre.
Yup, Tinordi would be the one i would be looking at, wanted him in his draft year, but yeah they wont be trading him. They wanna call our "bluff", let 'em...like i said, they have nothing else i want anyways. Then they can draft whoever they want at 3. Its NEVER a good idea to trade down at the top of the draft anyways.
The Leafs can go pound sand, they have absolutely nothing that i would even entertain in a trade (also dont wanna deal with BB ever again). I get a kick out of their fans in the trade forum, at the start of the year when everyone was making proposals for Schenn, they were all up in arms about it, saying he was untouchable yada yada, and now they are the ones that look desperate to dump him for whatever they can get (most of the proposals involving him are started by their fans, its hilarious, always knew he was overrated by them). He has now been replaced by Gardiner (who?)....same thing happened last year with Reimer. dont want Phaneuf, dont want Gunnarsson, dont want any of their forwards, their goalies arent much better than ours are.
What about the Leaf's first round picks in 2012 and 2013?
Quote:
Originally Posted by nexttothemoon
I wouldn't be so sure of that. What what I've seen of them all... Rielly is better than Murray offensively and better than Dumba defensively. His defense isn't quite as good as Murray and his offense is likely not quite as dynamic as Dumba. I think that puts him right there in the conversation with those two.
I need to see him play more... (keep waiting to see if he ever comes back in the playoffs) but I think he's right up there with Murray/Dumba and if pushed I'd say he's a better balance of offense and defense than those two are... perfect for the Oilers.
I call shenanigans on the Rielly being better defensively than Dumba. Not true imo. Not from what Ive seen. He wasnt better than either of Dumba nor Murray BEFORE he was injured, so Im not sure how he is better now.
Btw, it's almost time for the carriage to turn into a pumpkin. Are you ready for your new user title?
What about the Leaf's first round picks in 2012 and 2013?
I call shenanigans on the Rielly being better defensively than Dumba. Not true imo. Not from what Ive seen. He wasnt better than either of Dumba nor Murray BEFORE he was injured, so Im not sure how he is better now.
Btw, it's almost time for the carriage to turn into a pumpkin. Are you ready for your new user title?
I think he was solid defensively when I saw him... but again I have seen very little of him because he's been hurt... I'd just say he'd be right up there with those 2 when healthy, and I hope to hell he plays somewhere in the playoffs before they are eliminated although he'll likely be rusty as hell now anyway.
Sure... send me the user title... might as well put it up to join up with my fancy avatar that I get to sport for the rest of the month of April via another avatar bet lost. It's not loking good for me for the rest of the millenium.
I think I'll just talk **** and not back it up from now on like most folks here do.
[QUOTE=I am the Liquor;47456973]What about the Leaf's first round picks in 2012 and 2013?
QUOTE]
uhh, i dunno, maybe, but do you really think they would trade next years 1st (and to us of all teams)? And even if we did this, we could be picking anywhere from 5-7, you willing to give up Grigo or Murray or Dumba for that pick, just to get their 2013? I'm not willing to do that myself (especially since we would be giving up Grigorenko to the ugh, Leafs).
I think he was solid defensively when I saw him... but again I have seen very little of him because he's been hurt... I'd just say he'd be right up there with those 2 when healthy, and I hope to hell he plays somewhere in the playoffs before they are eliminated although he'll likely be rusty as hell now anyway.
Sure... send me the user title... might as well put it up to join up with my fancy avatar that I get to sport for the rest of the month of April via another avatar bet lost. It's not loking good for me for the rest of the millenium.
I think I'll just talk **** and not back it up from now on like most folks here do.
I actually like Reilly too (along with Ceci, Reinhart, and Koekkoek)....i wonder if he doesnt play in the playoffs if his stock would fall far enough for us to grab him in the 2nd instead?
LMAO, ahh now it makes sense, couldnt figure out what was going on with your avy...love the last line in your post, thats good stuff right there.
I think he was solid defensively when I saw him... but again I have seen very little of him because he's been hurt... I'd just say he'd be right up there with those 2 when healthy, and I hope to hell he plays somewhere in the playoffs before they are eliminated although he'll likely be rusty as hell now anyway.
Sure... send me the user title... might as well put it up to join up with my fancy avatar that I get to sport for the rest of the month of April via another avatar bet lost. It's not loking good for me for the rest of the millenium.
I think I'll just talk **** and not back it up from now on like most folks here do.
Youre a good sport and you make this board a better place. I enjoy your enthusiasm and respect your views on most things hockey and prospects especially.
May as well make the user title a positive one as well, and considering the time of year, heading into the playoffs n all, I think it should be..........
What about the Leaf's first round picks in 2012 and 2013?
That 2013 pick could be a lotto pick or it could be a 15-30 pick (one of these years the Laffs have to fluke it and actually make the playoffs). Next years draft is deep but there is too much uncertainty which makes the swap too big of a gamble.
Alternatively if the Oilers swapped say the #2 pick for the Leafs #5 this year and the Leafs threw in a decent prospect I'm sure the team would at least listen to the offer if it was Schenn or another decent prospect in the conversation.
I'd personally still just keep the pick, go BPA and pick Grigorenko though.
uhh, i dunno, maybe, but do you really think they would trade next years 1st (and to us of all teams)? And even if we did this, we could be picking anywhere from 5-7, you willing to give up Grigo or Murray or Dumba for that pick, just to get their 2013? I'm not willing to do that myself (especially since we would be giving up Grigorenko to the ugh, Leafs).
Yes. I would probably do it. Take Reinhart with the Leafs 2012 pick and we will either be using our own pick or their pick next year to grab one of Monahan, Lazar, or Mackinnon for our center. Perhaps we combine the picks into a package to get one of the above, or on the off chance both picks are lottery picks, take two of the above three players! We could even throw in Gagner if we had to. It would be worth it.
The Leafs are going to blow next year. Their pick could be better than ours.
And Burke is going to be uber desperate to make the playoffs. He could very well do something stupid. Again.
Yes. I would probably do it. Take Reinhart with the Leafs 2012 pick and we will either be using our own pick or their pick next year to grab one of Monahan, Lazar, or Mackinnon for our center. Perhaps we combine the picks into a package to get one of the above, or on the off chance both picks are lottery picks, take two of the above three players! We could even throw in Gagner if we had to. It would be worth it.
The Leafs are going to blow next year. Their pick could be better than ours.
And Burke is going to be uber desperate to make the playoffs. He could very well do something stupid. Again.
I personally wouldnt, even though that would give us 2 shots at MacK (i've been following this kid as long as i did with Hall, probably 3 years before his draft year, definitely will be a sure fire superstar in the NHL). Would rather grab Grigo this year, be set up the middle, let the dmen prospects start coming in within the next year or 2. The other 2 you mentioned, i dont know too much about them other than what is said about them in here (and i realize the scouts have watched them and know about them more than i do).
The Laffs are a crapshoot next year IMO, could be 30th, could be fighting for a playoff spot (cant see them being better than 8th at most though). Definitely agree that BB will more than likely do something retarded, like he does every year.
If the Leafs offered 2012 first and 2013 first for our 2102 first I'd bite.
I don't claim to know anything about this years draft picks other than what I read from you all but I do feel the leafs aren't going to be any better next year.
Course it would probably cost Tambelinni his job. But I think it would be the best move for us overall.
Could be a bad case of prospectitus though! This forum tends to do that for ya hehe.
I think he was solid defensively when I saw him... but again I have seen very little of him because he's been hurt... I'd just say he'd be right up there with those 2 when healthy, and I hope to hell he plays somewhere in the playoffs before they are eliminated although he'll likely be rusty as hell now anyway.
Sure... send me the user title... might as well put it up to join up with my fancy avatar that I get to sport for the rest of the month of April via another avatar bet lost. It's not loking good for me for the rest of the millenium.
I think I'll just talk **** and not back it up from now on like most folks here do.
Id take that bet from what I've seen of the 3(which hasn't been a lot), Rielly has the most potential and the best chance to be a game changer. He has arguably the best skating and is for sure the most offensive of the 3. If he falls it'll be because the scouts think that his ACL surgery has effected his skating.
No, like i said earlier, habs have nothing that would knock my socks off, Price is a headcase (cant really blame him though, he gets the Luongo treatment there), plus he wont be traded anyways.
Subban i like but he's not getting traded, the only other players i like are prospects (dont need more of those), Tinordi and Beaulieu are the only ones that interest me, and they are probably untouchable. They can just draft AG if they want a centre.
It would be for a draft pick and the habs would want a specific center, they may have grigorerko rated way ahead of AG. It's a long shot but it would be due diligence to pursue if the oilers wanted a Dman. However the oilers front office would probbaly make the same assumptions you are and not even pursue it.
I wouldn't be so sure of that. From what I've seen of them all... Rielly is better than Murray offensively and better than Dumba defensively. His defense isn't quite as good as Murray and his offense is likely not quite as dynamic as Dumba. I think that puts him right there in the conversation with those two.
I need to see him play more... (keep waiting to see if he ever comes back in the playoffs) but I think he's right up there with Murray/Dumba and if pushed I'd say he's a better balance of offense and defense than those two are... perfect for the Oilers.
I agree that the oilers need an offensive pp smooth skating kind of guy and I like the sounds of Rielly as well. I doubt if they have him ahead of dumba and murray et all but he is the type of player we need the most imo.
I agree that the oilers need an offensive pp smooth skating kind of guy and I like the sounds of Rielly as well. I doubt if they have him ahead of dumba and murray et all but he is the type of player we need the most imo.
yeah, i dont think anybody has him ahead of Dumba. He's (Dumba) just as good offensively as any dman in this draft IMO (although i havent seen Reilly play live, so i guess it's not the most unbiased opinion here). He definitely lived up to the hype when he was here (offensively at least, he didnt throw any big hits but i suspect it was because they only had 4 dmen and he either didnt want to risk injury or a penalty).
i still think he is the best all around option in this draft if we take a dman (and he's a RHD which we could use too). Still prefer MG though myself. I dunno, its a tough call this year.
if they use the pick, I'm hoping they go with a defensemen, even at 2nd. Craig Button has Grig at 7th, so is he really all that? As for which defensemen? I'm partial to Reinhart because he's a horse, but I'll leave that in Stu's hands.
best case scenario is still to trade the pick for what you want, but only for what you want. using the pick should be plan B.
If we 2nd pick, could we trade for Montreal 3rd since they want Grig and get extra + murray assuming he isn't gone?
Habs' fans does not even know if we want Grigs or Gal? A lot of our fans also like Forsberg. If the Oilers pick Grigs, we still have Gal and Forsberg to choose from. After Yakupov, it's a crapshoot between Grigs/Gal/Forsberg. I don't see why the Habs need to swap pick with the Oilers. Also, the Habs feel the Oilers will pick a defenseman. If that's the case, Grigs/Gal/Forsberg will all be available at 3rd pick.
