He'll be 30 by the end of the first year of this contract. He's a heck of a player, but this just doesn't seem very smart. Just like the Howard contract will come back and bite the Phils, I can't help but think Cincy will regret this by the end. He's a heck of a player now though.
So Votto is under his current contract through 2013, and the Reds have a payroll of roughly 80 million right now. So....they negotiated against themselves (Ryan Howard anyone?) to pay a player annually 25% of their current payroll? I don't quite get it.
It seems like there's going to be a major influx of revenue coming into the league in the near future. With the new major TV deals in LA and Texas and the $2 billion purchase of the Dodgers they could have potentially capitalized on a contract that will seem like a bargain in 2 - 3 years. On top of which their hands may have been forced a bit because if Votto had hit the open market there are teams with some very deep pockets that could have offered him a lot of money -- he could have likely gotten a bigger contract than Pujols being younger and accounting for inflation, higher revenue, etc.
Besides, if we had gotten rid of Votto we would just be searching for a superstar. You need franchise level players like Votto to make a run at the WS tqbh. Building the team around guys like Votto, Bruce, Mesoraco, Latos, Cueto and Marshall gives the team a very, very good to elite core that just needs ownership to be dedicated in surrounding them with a decent supporting cast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721
He'll be 30 by the end of the first year of this contract. He's a heck of a player, but this just doesn't seem very smart. Just like the Howard contract will come back and bite the Phils, I can't help but think Cincy will regret this by the end. He's a heck of a player now though.
Joey Votto is arguably one of the most athletic, if not the most athletic, first basemen in the league. He takes very good care of himself, he's a perfectionist, and even now most of his value is in his vision and plate discipline. He is going to age very well and playing the least demanding position on the field will also help in that regard. Not to mention when you count for inflation, and the potential for the revenue increase that appear to be coming on league-wide this deal looks fine.
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Originally Posted by Shaman464
Cabrera says hello.
They are comparable hitters, but Votto is a gold glover and a good baserunner. Cabrera is literally only there for his bat.
People should also keep in mind that this deal is a huge win for the fans too. It's very early, but if Votto keeps up anywhere near his current level of play over an extended period of time he'll probably be a hall of famer, and he'll spend his entire career in Cincinnati. That means a lot for a franchise with the history of the Reds.
the brewers and cardinals weakened themselves and they'll be losing a team in the central in a year. the reds are possibly the best team in the division.
It seems like there's going to be a major influx of revenue coming into the league in the near future. With the new major TV deals in LA and Texas and the $2 billion purchase of the Dodgers they could have potentially capitalized on a contract that will seem like a bargain in 2 - 3 years. On top of which their hands may have been forced a bit because if Votto had hit the open market there are teams with some very deep pockets that could have offered him a lot of money -- he could have likely gotten a bigger contract than Pujols being younger and accounting for inflation, higher revenue, etc.
Besides, if we had gotten rid of Votto we would just be searching for a superstar. You need franchise level players like Votto to make a run at the WS tqbh. Building the team around guys like Votto, Bruce, Mesoraco, Latos, Cueto and Marshall gives the team a very, very good to elite core that just needs ownership to be dedicated in surrounding them with a decent supporting cast.
Joey Votto is arguably one of the most athletic, if not the most athletic, first basemen in the league. He takes very good care of himself, he's a perfectionist, and even now most of his value is in his vision and plate discipline. He is going to age very well and playing the least demanding position on the field will also help in that regard. Not to mention when you count for inflation, and the potential for the revenue increase that appear to be coming on league-wide this deal looks fine.
They are comparable hitters, but Votto is a gold glover and a good baserunner. Cabrera is literally only there for his bat.
People should also keep in mind that this deal is a huge win for the fans too. It's very early, but if Votto keeps up anywhere near his current level of play over an extended period of time he'll probably be a hall of famer, and he'll spend his entire career in Cincinnati. That means a lot for a franchise with the history of the Reds.
I never said they had to get rid of him, but why sign him right now? Why wouldn't they wait a year and make sure everything is cool? All they've done is added a year of risk on top of negotiating against nobody but themselves. Again, see Ryan Howard on both counts.
Great signing, is absolutely amazing at batting and has elite patience so I don't think he'll even be a burden whatsoever, maybe on the last 2 years at most imo.
Why on earth do u wanna stay with the Reds??? They aren't contenders.
Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, Tigers, Angels all have their 1Bs locked up long term. Who could give that sort of $$$ to Votto? Blue Jays maybe. Cubs probably too. I cant think of anyone else. He wouldnt hit free agency for another 2 years. That's a long time, anything can happen during that time.
Brewers lost Fielder, Cards lost Pujols. There's no reason why Reds cant take the division. NL is wide open.
Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, Tigers, Angels all have their 1Bs locked up long term. Who could give that sort of $$$ to Votto? Blue Jays maybe. Cubs probably too. I cant think of anyone else. He wouldnt hit free agency for another 2 years. That's a long time, anything can happen during that time.
Brewers lost Fielder, Cards lost Pujols. There's no reason why Reds cant take the division. NL is wide open.
The Dodgers would have thrown the entire Federal Reserve at Votto had he reached the open market. That said, he never has never struck me as the type of guy who would be totally comfortable in a large market.
It's a little difficult to justify 10/225 for Votto when Matt Kemp got 8/160 and Troy Tulowitzki got 10/157. Both of them play premium positions and I believe they were closer to free agency than Votto was (I may be wrong). Still, the Reds wanted to keep their superstar in town, and they did that.
The Dodgers would have thrown the entire Federal Reserve at Votto had he reached the open market. That said, he never has never struck me as the type of guy who would be totally comfortable in a large market.
It's a little difficult to justify 10/225 for Votto when Matt Kemp got 8/160 and Troy Tulowitzki got 10/157. Both of them play premium positions and I believe they were closer to free agency than Votto was (I may be wrong). Still, the Reds wanted to keep their superstar in town, and they did that.
Because neither of those players are as good as Votto. They play in premium positions, and you could argue that Tulo is as valuable as Votto is to his team...but Kemp has one great season without a whole lot of pressure under his belt. Votto has been a top 5 hitter, consistently, for the last 3 seasons and if any of the other players in the line-up could hit consistently he would be even better.
Over the last 3 years Votto has the 2nd highest wOBA in the league, 3rd highest wRC in the league, and the 4th highest WAR (2nd highest over the last two years) in the league.
Being that 3 years is the general accepted period for a players performance to be measured by (to rule out fluke years like Kemp's and Granderson's), you can see that Votto is one of the top 2 - 3 hitters in the entire league (only behind Cabrera and Pujols.)
For comparison Tulo is 6th in WAR, 8th in wOBA and 15th in wRC over the same period of time. WAR takes into account position.
You also have to realize that Kemp hasn't been nearly as consistent as Votto, and he plays a more demanding position. It's very unlikely that either Tulo or Kemp will end up playing at the same level as Votto as deep into their careers as Votto will.
Sorry to see Phillips go, but Votto is irreplaceable. That he's getting paid less than Pujols and Fielder is huge for us especially as a mid-low market team (budget-wise.)
It seems that you may have spoken too soon. The Reds are very close to signing Phillips to an extension.
