HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Buffalo Sabres
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Derek Roy

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-16-2012, 06:59 AM
  #76
Play4Miracles*
1 nation under Oil
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 5,241
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dma0034 View Post
Anyone think this is a reasonable trade:

Buffalo
2nd Overall Pick 2012

Columbus:
Derek Roy
Buffalo 1st 2012
Nashville 1st 2012
Cond Buffalo 2nd 2012 (if Roy doesn't resign)

Idea here is to draft Galchenyuk. Then our center situation is Ennis, Galchenyuk, Hodgson and Adam for the next 5-6 years (with Adam being replacable)

Columbus does it to get a center who can play with Nash (replace Carter). They can pick up one of the top d-men with Buf's pick and there is Nashville's sweetner. The Cond (may be too high) is to give Columbus something when Roy leaves them next year.
I think their GM is looking at that #2 pick as untradeable. They are many years away from competeing.

Play4Miracles* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 07:18 AM
  #77
tmack224
Registered User
 
tmack224's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 1,297
vCash: 500
I see Roy getting traded in 2 scenarios

Roy for Change of scenery type player and a pick (think Chris Stewart and a pick)
or
Roy for a 1st and a 3rd

tmack224 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 07:38 AM
  #78
SoFFacet
Registered User
 
SoFFacet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 1,445
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by heartsabres View Post
You deal logically with facts yet you don't read the post nor do you quote it properly.(shaking my head)

I proposed Roy + Buf 1st for Toronto OR NYI OR MON PICK
that is Derek roy to move up 7-9 spots not Roy for Tor 1st.

In typical hockeybuzz fashion you butcher it. I think someone like the Islanders could bite. The Islanders and also looking for defencemen we have extra.
I quoted and responded to your statement correctly and completely within the first post that I made responding to your post, when I was talking about bottom feeder teams in general. Also, in my next post responding to Awwufelloff, I mentioned Toronto and Montreal.

I simplified your argument to just Toronto in the third post that I made, for the sake of succinctness and to properly set up humor. This is a common literary technique.

In any case, as I have explained now several more times than should be necessary, none of the teams you mention would be interested in trading down and out of a position to draft Grigorenko or Galchenyuk in exchange for one year of Roy.

SoFFacet is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 07:50 AM
  #79
Karate Johnson
Zemgus is my Copilot
 
Karate Johnson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,626
vCash: 500
Roy
Miller
Nash 1st
Buff 1st

For

Malkin

Karate Johnson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 08:03 AM
  #80
TehDoak
General Zad
 
TehDoak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 17,993
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to TehDoak
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirris View Post
The thing is the Columbus was shopping Nash and still might be in the offseason. They're in full rebuild mode now. So why would they give up a #2 overall for a one year rental and two lower tier first rounders when they can shop Nash for even better and keep the pick and draft a new #1 future center.

This isn't the NFL where a couple of mid first rounders are just as valuable as a 2-4 pick. The drop off in quality of talent is huge. There are some draft years where only a half of the top ten drafted players even make an impact in the NHL while most of the remaining first rounders are busts.

Your not going to land a top 3 pick with a scrub like Roy and some mid level picks.
Columbus is looking for NHL ready talent for Nash. It's the reason they didn't get a deal done at the deadline.

Columbus, as a franchise, cannot afford 3 more years in the basement. They are losing 10-15 million a year by some reports. They needs to be in the playoffs so they don't play to half full buildings every night. I actually would not be surprised if they moved the 2nd overall for NHL ready talent. They wouldn't trade it for Roy, however, as he makes too much and isn't much of an upgrade over what they have.

A realistic cost for the 2nd overall would be:

Foligno, Hodsgon, and 11th overall. Maybe you could swap one of those out for Sekera.

AKA far too much. 4th overall is probably much more attainable and Roy makes some sense for the Isles.

TehDoak is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 08:23 AM
  #81
tmack224
Registered User
 
tmack224's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 1,297
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karate Johnson View Post
Roy
Miller
Nash 1st
Buff 1st

For

Malkin
Couple things:

Fluery would have to be traded from Pittsburgh first, That package isnt enough, and Buffalo would need to get a goalie in another trade.

To Buffalo:
Malkin
Fluery
Orpik

To Pittsburgh:
Vanek
Miller
Mcnabb
Buffalo 1st
Nashville 1st
Buffalo 2nd
CGY 2nd

tmack224 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 08:44 AM
  #82
heartsabres*
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Budapest
Country: Hungary
Posts: 1,790
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmack224 View Post
Couple things:

Fluery would have to be traded from Pittsburgh first, That package isnt enough, and Buffalo would need to get a goalie in another trade.

To Buffalo:
Malkin
Fluery
Orpik

To Pittsburgh:
Vanek
Miller
Mcnabb
Buffalo 1st
Nashville 1st
Buffalo 2nd
CGY 2nd
I don't think Malkin is going anywhere.....Soffacet will tell you in a rational and logical way with setting you up with some succinctness for the sake of humor. A common literary technique.

I think Vanek for Martin + Staal is more likely

heartsabres* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 09:52 AM
  #83
Zip15
Registered User
 
Zip15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 17,264
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
so you are no longer in favor of trading him to chicago for pirri or mcneil?
I think that if they trade Roy, they need to acquire another top-9 center, preferably one who can give you at least 40 pts and be able to hold his own against good competition. It doesn't have to be in the same deal. For instance, I'd trade Roy for McNeill/Pirri if we were acquiring someone like Kelly. And if they could net someone like Moore, who isn't incompetent offensively, to anchor the 4th line, even better.

Zip15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 10:02 AM
  #84
Karate Johnson
Zemgus is my Copilot
 
Karate Johnson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,626
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmack224 View Post

To Buffalo:
Malkin
Fluery
Orpik

To Pittsburgh:
Vanek
Miller
Mcnabb
Buffalo 1st
Nashville 1st
Buffalo 2nd
CGY 2nd

Boom! Done.

Karate Johnson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 10:05 AM
  #85
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I think that if they trade Roy, they need to acquire another top-9 center, preferably one who can give you at least 40 pts and be able to hold his own against good competition. It doesn't have to be in the same deal. For instance, I'd trade Roy for McNeill/Pirri if we were acquiring someone like Kelly. And if they could net someone like Moore, who isn't incompetent offensively, to anchor the 4th line, even better.
Would you trade roy for pirri, if we signed Stoll?

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 07:05 PM
  #86
Zip15
Registered User
 
Zip15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 17,264
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Would you trade roy for pirri, if we signed Stoll?
I'm skeptical of Stoll right now. I don't think it can be said too many times how poor he was this season--in a contract season, no less. He averaged .77 pts/60 mins at ES. For a frame of reference, Kaleta and Ellis averaged .86. He again produced pretty well on the PP, and he'd be a good point-shooter on the second PP unit. He's good at faceoffs and would add some sand, but I do think his defensive abilities are a tad overrated--I recall Murray saying when they acquired Richards that they now had a second shutdown center to go along with Kopi, the implication being that Stoll was not that. At the same time, Gerbe-Stoll-? could be a solid bottom-6 line

It'd come down to price. He's going to need to take a serious paycut for me to be interested. Something like 2yrs/$4m? I'm probably in. Something like 3-4 years at $3+ per, I'm out. And I'd want insurance in the form of a good 4C if we went with Stoll at 3C. Again, someone like Moore.

I'd probably do it just from an asset perspective. I think Buffalo needs to put as many good, young forwards in its system as it possibly can, either to develop or to use as trade pieces when good players pop free.

Zip15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 08:34 PM
  #87
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I'm skeptical of Stoll right now. I don't think it can be said too many times how poor he was this season--in a contract season, no less. He averaged .77 pts/60 mins at ES. For a frame of reference, Kaleta and Ellis averaged .86. He again produced pretty well on the PP, and he'd be a good point-shooter on the second PP unit. He's good at faceoffs and would add some sand, but I do think his defensive abilities are a tad overrated--I recall Murray saying when they acquired Richards that they now had a second shutdown center to go along with Kopi, the implication being that Stoll was not that. At the same time, Gerbe-Stoll-? could be a solid bottom-6 line

It'd come down to price. He's going to need to take a serious paycut for me to be interested. Something like 2yrs/$4m? I'm probably in. Something like 3-4 years at $3+ per, I'm out. And I'd want insurance in the form of a good 4C if we went with Stoll at 3C. Again, someone like Moore.

I'd probably do it just from an asset perspective. I think Buffalo needs to put as many good, young forwards in its system as it possibly can, either to develop or to use as trade pieces when good players pop free.
id go 3 yrs / 9.0 / 3 per

i think it's misleading to look at a 3rd line centers evens strength production, on a team that for most of the year was one of the worst even strength offensive teams....for example:

kopitar : 2.25 per 60
Poms : 2.24 per 60
Staff : 2.18 per 60

for the record... Stoll's previous 3 seasons with LA
10-11 1.61
09-10 1.65
08-09 1.40

Unless you are going to begin arguing that derek roy's trade value should be measured by his 1.58 PTS per 60 this season, i suggest taking a more holistic view

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-16-2012, 09:06 PM
  #88
Zip15
Registered User
 
Zip15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 17,264
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
id go 3 yrs / 9.0 / 3 per

i think it's misleading to look at a 3rd line centers evens strength production, on a team that for most of the year was one of the worst even strength offensive teams....for example:

kopitar : 2.25 per 60
Poms : 2.24 per 60
Staff : 2.18 per 60

for the record... Stoll's previous 3 seasons with LA
10-11 1.61
09-10 1.65
08-09 1.40

Unless you are going to begin arguing that derek roy's trade value should be measured by his 1.58 PTS per 60 this season, i suggest taking a more holistic view
If Roy's production in 11-12 was what it had been in previous years, he'd be worth a hell of a lot more than Pirri. Anyways, that's a different conversation. I said I'd probably do it, too. I'd take five more years of team control over Pirri and adding another good (legitimate) center prospect to our organization, even if I'm not high on Stoll. We need to add players to that 20-23 year old core, and start turning over the Rochester core.

I know I'm probably in the minority here, but I don't want to take on any long-term deals this summer. I don't want to give out anything more than a year or two. We can't add anymore potential albatrosses, and I want us to be freeing up as much space as possible with what could be a very good 2013 UFA class (and we're not winning anything of importance next year): Getzlaf, Perry, Hartnell, Morrow, Clowe, Horton, Zajac, possibly Weber, et al. Obviously, some of those guys will be re-signed long before then, but with financial issues facing the Ducks and Devs, and possible changes in Dallas and Anaheim, some of those guys may pop free, and we need to be prepared to pounce.

Again, I know you're a big fan of Stoll. I'm not. Difference of opinion and no big deal.

Zip15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 08:13 AM
  #89
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 16,271
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmack224 View Post
I see Roy getting traded in 2 scenarios

Roy for Change of scenery type player and a pick (think Chris Stewart and a pick)
or
Roy for a 1st and a 3rd
I would be stunned if they moved Roy for futures in the off season unless they had a deal in place to replace Roy with another team.

I think Regier kicks the tires yet again on moving Roy and doesn't get a deal to his liking so he's back with the Sabres to start next season.

It's the Timmah dance all over again.....


WhoIsJimBob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 09:27 AM
  #90
struckbyaparkedcar
Zemgus Da Gawd
 
struckbyaparkedcar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Upstate NY
Country: Cote DIvoire
Posts: 10,612
vCash: 500
I still think Roy to Vancouver has legs if they continue the flameout. There isn't another top six center on the market who can fit into the Canucks cap structure, they really need scoring depth, and unless they trade Edler, Kesler or (to a lesser extent) Burrows, they don't have the assets to get this year's Richards/Carter/Burns.

struckbyaparkedcar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 10:19 AM
  #91
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 16,271
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
I still think Roy to Vancouver has legs if they continue the flameout. There isn't another top six center on the market who can fit into the Canucks cap structure, they really need scoring depth, and unless they trade Edler, Kesler or (to a lesser extent) Burrows, they don't have the assets to get this year's Richards/Carter/Burns.
What would the Canucks have to offer that Regier would want for Roy, though?

WhoIsJimBob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 10:23 AM
  #92
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,736
vCash: 500
Can we trade Roy for Brian Boyle? please?

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 10:23 AM
  #93
Zman5778
Registered User
 
Zman5778's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cressona/Reading, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 3,900
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Zman5778 Send a message via MSN to Zman5778 Send a message via Yahoo to Zman5778
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
What would the Canucks have to offer that Regier would want for Roy, though?
Zack Kassian??

Zman5778 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 10:47 AM
  #94
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 16,271
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zman5778 View Post
Zack Kassian??
Roy + Nashville 1st for Schneider!


WhoIsJimBob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 10:57 AM
  #95
gallagt01
Registered User
 
gallagt01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sloan
Posts: 8,372
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Can we trade Roy for Brian Boyle? please?
Boyle is one of my favorite players in the league. What an acquisition he would be.

This trade is akin to the Roy for Hanzal proposals though.

I'd love to sign both Chris Kelly and Greg Campbell in the offseason; I doubt Boston lets both walk.

gallagt01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 11:10 AM
  #96
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loods View Post
Quote:
Boyle is one of my favorite players in the league. What an acquisition he would be.
This trade is akin to the Roy for Hanzal proposals though.

I'd love to sign both Chris Kelly and Greg Campbell in the offseason; I doubt Boston lets both walk.
I wanted to offersheet him last year... but then we went and wasted a 2nd round pick on Brad Boyes...

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 11:58 AM
  #97
struckbyaparkedcar
Zemgus Da Gawd
 
struckbyaparkedcar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Upstate NY
Country: Cote DIvoire
Posts: 10,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
What would the Canucks have to offer that Regier would want for Roy, though?
Schroeder and a 1st.

Then flip your two late firsts or a 1st and one of the seconds for another young center (Bozak, Filppulla, Anisimov).

struckbyaparkedcar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 12:03 PM
  #98
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 16,271
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
Schroeder and a 1st.

Then flip your two late firsts or a 1st and one of the seconds for another young center (Bozak, Filppulla, Anisimov).
I don't see Schroeder and a late 1st being enough.

Schroeder is under .5 ppg in two seasons in the AHL and the talk now is that he's a defensively responsible center.

I have no interest in a 5'9" 180 lb 3rd line center that doesn't have a lot of bite to his game.

WhoIsJimBob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 12:12 PM
  #99
struckbyaparkedcar
Zemgus Da Gawd
 
struckbyaparkedcar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Upstate NY
Country: Cote DIvoire
Posts: 10,612
vCash: 500
Chicago isn't great place to develop youth though, it's a team that's trying to win Calder Cups and I think that he'd be a welcome addition to Rochester with the potential to be a key call-up for Buffalo in the coming season as well.

He's not really the centerpiece of the deal anyway, though. The key thing is to get 3 (!) first round picks to play with and then either use them to move allllllllll the way up in the draft or to get a young top 6-9 pivot.

struckbyaparkedcar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2012, 12:29 PM
  #100
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 16,271
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
Chicago isn't great place to develop youth though, it's a team that's trying to win Calder Cups and I think that he'd be a welcome addition to Rochester with the potential to be a key call-up for Buffalo in the coming season as well.

He's not really the centerpiece of the deal anyway, though. The key thing is to get 3 (!) first round picks to play with and then either use them to move allllllllll the way up in the draft or to get a young top 6-9 pivot.
Schroeder wasn't anything of note his rookie season in Manitoba and he was pretty stagnant this year. In the few viewings I got of him in Rochester, I tried watching him and he was a total non-impact guy.

I wouldn't want him taking up a pro contract and playing time in Rochester.

And I wouldn't deal Roy for a late round 1st as something like 12, 24, and 27 is not going to get the Sabres a top end pick.

Teams don't trade out of the top 5 and down to 12. Since the lockout, there has been 1 trade where a team traded out of the top 5 and that was moving back only two spots from 5 to 7.

WhoIsJimBob is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:58 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.