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General Stars Talk IV: The Prequel

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04-24-2012, 12:14 PM
  #301
Elysian
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Originally Posted by Frozen Failure View Post
There was a lot more organ/keyboard this year, too. And personally, I like the organ/keyboard.
I hate it. Seriously hate it.

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Old
04-24-2012, 12:57 PM
  #302
Frozen Failure
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Originally Posted by Elysian View Post
I hate it. Seriously hate it.
I don't think you're a real hockey fan now.

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Old
04-24-2012, 01:46 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by Frozen Failure View Post
I don't think you're a real hockey fan now.
I've only ever been a Stars fan, since the 97-98 season. I don't care what kind of tradition there is in hockey elsewhere, Dallas has never seemed like the kind of team to follow tradition.

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04-24-2012, 01:56 PM
  #304
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I don't like when the organist clumsily tries to play a modern song on an organ.

There are some songs that sound great when played properly, though.

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04-24-2012, 02:08 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Modo View Post
I don't like when the organist clumsily tries to play a modern song on an organ.

There are some songs that sound great when played properly, though.
Agree with that, the modern stuff happens far too often during games though.

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04-24-2012, 02:47 PM
  #306
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I never thought I'd see the day where doug ****ing armstrong would be up for a GM of the year award. Wow.

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04-24-2012, 03:13 PM
  #307
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I never thought I'd see the day where doug ****ing armstrong would be up for a GM of the year award. Wow.
Did he even really do anything? Most of that team was built through the draft and they got lucky with Elliot.

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04-24-2012, 03:25 PM
  #308
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Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Did he even really do anything? Most of that team was built through the draft and they got lucky with Elliot.
edit: Had the wrong team in mind

GMJN got lucky with Kari yet we applaud him all the time for that move.


Last edited by Elysian: 04-24-2012 at 06:18 PM.
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Old
04-24-2012, 04:32 PM
  #309
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Originally Posted by Troy McClure View Post
There was a lot more rock this season, or at least, that's what it sounded like when watching from home.
which is odd because if JeffK no longer does music and now there is more rock you wouldn't think that JeffK didn't care for it, I mean he works for 102.1

bizarre

but yeah there was a lot more organ than before, I remember opening night against Chicago I was like what the heck is this

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Old
04-24-2012, 06:15 PM
  #310
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Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Did he even really do anything? Most of that team was built through the draft and they got lucky with Elliot.
He hired Hitchcock.

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04-24-2012, 06:27 PM
  #311
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He hired Hitchcock.
True.

All he ever had to do.

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04-24-2012, 08:02 PM
  #312
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A lot of people deserve credit for where the Blues are, starting with Jarmo and John Davidson. Still though, I doubt a GM without personal ties to Hitch would have hired him, especially with his reputation of being a bad coach for younger players.

Armstrong made some silly moves when he was here but he was at times bold and made moves with a plan in mind. The Ribeiro trade itself almost makes up for any bad trades he made. I didn't always agree with Armstrong's choices, especially toward the end, but I think he's a smart guy and he put in his dues in St. Louis. The "GM-in-waiting" thing worked out pretty well for him and the organization.

Hiring the should-be Jack Adams winner definitely goes a long way toward making him look really smart.

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Old
04-24-2012, 08:21 PM
  #313
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Originally Posted by Elysian View Post
edit: Had the wrong team in mind

GMJN got lucky with Kari yet we applaud him all the time for that move.
Got lucky? Huh?

Trading for Kari was/is by far Nieuwendyk's best move (at least actively speaking -- passively letting Turco and Modano leave rank right up there as well) and it was apparent as a great move at the time it was made.

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04-24-2012, 08:26 PM
  #314
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We planned on Kari being our starter.

Elliot was brought in as a back-up to Halak.

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04-24-2012, 10:39 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by piqued View Post
Got lucky? Huh?

Trading for Kari was/is by far Nieuwendyk's best move (at least actively speaking -- passively letting Turco and Modano leave rank right up there as well) and it was apparent as a great move at the time it was made.
Yes it was lucky. They traded for a guy no one else wanted and no one knew could stay healthy. It was an easy gamble to take because Turco was so obviously done.

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04-25-2012, 12:47 AM
  #316
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Originally Posted by Troy McClure View Post
They traded for a guy no one else wanted
How do you know that?

Why are we not giving Nieuwendyk credit for this move? Luck or not he pulled the trigger on the deal and the player he acquired has been great.

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04-25-2012, 01:02 AM
  #317
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Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
We planned on Kari being our starter.

Elliot was brought in as a back-up to Halak.
A little revisionist here, but the I agree that GMJN deserves more credit for Kari than Armstrong deserves for Eliott. Eliott should be praised for having a great year, but he wasn't expected to do anything (I think his contract was 2 way?). Its kinda like a much better Nystrom, even when he was succeeding people didn't give Joe a ton of credit.

Also further evidence that Badgers help hockey teams win

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04-25-2012, 01:38 AM
  #318
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Originally Posted by Troy McClure View Post
Yes it was lucky. They traded for a guy no one else wanted and no one knew could stay healthy. It was an easy gamble to take because Turco was so obviously done.
They traded for a guy no whom no one else could accommodate nor afford to gamble on. There's a huge difference.

Easy gamble or not but if you can't give credit for a trade that got us an elite goalie and gave up a failed prospect and a low pick, then there's something wrong with you.

If you call Ribeiro for Niinimaa an "easy gamble" I'm gonna lose it.

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04-25-2012, 09:03 AM
  #319
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Originally Posted by Troy McClure View Post
Yes it was lucky. They traded for a guy no one else wanted and no one knew could stay healthy. It was an easy gamble to take because Turco was so obviously done.
Far from lucky.
Most GM's and hockey people knew Kari had the talent to be good. His drive wasn't there but the talent was.
A change of scenery and being on his ass to stop eating cheeseburgers everyday helped him get into shape and get back to the reason he was chosen so high in his draft year.

That's not lucky. That's doing your homework on a player you know has the talent but just needed the motivation to succeed.

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Old
04-25-2012, 10:08 AM
  #320
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Originally Posted by hairylikebear View Post
They traded for a guy no whom no one else could accommodate nor afford to gamble on. There's a huge difference.

Easy gamble or not but if you can't give credit for a trade that got us an elite goalie and gave up a failed prospect and a low pick, then there's something wrong with you.
Nieuwendyk did not know for certain whether Kari could stay healthy. He also had no way of knowing whether Kari would be serious about changing his off-ice habits.

There was plenty of risk involved with Kari, yet the trade worked out. Unless you're trying to attribute some psychic power to Nieuwy, you have to acknowledge that Kari working out as well has he has involved some luck. I don't see why that's a bad thing. Taking risks is part of a GM's job, and luck plays a role in determining whether that risk bites a GM in the butt.

I give Nieuwy credit for having the balls to make a deal other GMs did not want to make. He saw a team need, saw a potential solution he could acquire on the cheap, and took the risk. His $1 Kari lotto ticket was a big winner. That's great. It doesn't make him prescient. It makes him a smart gambler.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hairylikebear View Post
If you call Ribeiro for Niinimaa an "easy gamble" I'm gonna lose it.
If Ribeiro turned out to be the mess idiot Habs fans said he was and Habs management obviously thought he was, would you be citing him as an example? There was risk with Ribeiro, but it worked out. It has turned out to be an amazing trade all because the Stars gave up nothing to get him.

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Old
04-25-2012, 12:42 PM
  #321
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Originally Posted by Troy McClure View Post
There was plenty of risk involved with Kari, yet the trade worked out. Unless you're trying to attribute some psychic power to Nieuwy, you have to acknowledge that Kari working out as well has he has involved some luck. I don't see why that's a bad thing. Taking risks is part of a GM's job, and luck plays a role in determining whether that risk bites a GM in the butt.
I don't see why you call it luck that the risk ended up not manifesting itself. The Stars took aggressive steps to change Kari's outlook on training and personal health. They sent a specialist to Atlanta immediately that summer to begin working with him on making those changes, something the Thrashers organization never bothered to do.

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Old
04-25-2012, 01:14 PM
  #322
Troy McClure
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When they traded for him, they had no way of knowing if he would be receptive to a whole new training program or if he would stick with it.

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04-25-2012, 06:39 PM
  #323
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I don't see why you call it luck that the risk ended up not manifesting itself.
Someone who thinks and speaks in terms of "luck" automatically takes a rational discussion and makes it irrational. There's no way to disprove good luck or bad luck.

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Old
04-25-2012, 06:50 PM
  #324
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Would you prefer "fortunate coincidence"?

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Old
04-25-2012, 10:00 PM
  #325
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Would you prefer "fortunate coincidence"?
No, I would not.

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