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Bates signs 3 year deal

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03-06-2006, 04:18 PM
  #101
PECAhead
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Originally Posted by My friend
Now that his $ figure has been revealed, I am still happy about this signing.

With the hypothetical third line for next year I mentioned earlier, I think the key thing is that Bates would be with players who while young, have been lauded for thier work ethic and defensive play. Having Bates as the veteran anchor to that line will go a long way to ensuring that the Isles will get the most out of those 2 players.

That line is far from proven, but it IS CHEAP, FAST physical, and "Dog free" and that means we will have more $$ to fix the top 2 lines, since we were not going to sign a -proven- 3rd line center / winger, for less than $1.2mil...NO WAY. That whole line will cost us about $3 mil total, VERY reasonable, especially cosidering the upside that line has. You also have Colliton in the mix for the 3rd / 4th lines next year.

Also don't minimize the fact that he scored that goal in the playoffs that year. That's more than most can say on this team, and it's a good start. I am also happy that we apear to be rewarding hard-working players with reasonable contracts, and that bodes well for team chemistry.

One side note, If we see Parrish re-sign, who wants to bet that Yashin will not be here, one way or the other, next year?
Just want to go on record that I'm happy about this signing both for length and price. I think it is solid and fair deal.

I also want to say that I agree with many of the above comments. I think Bates is an excellent player to place on a third or fourth line with talented youngster as the "Anchor." Bates has really stepped up with a leadership role this year. I think that is being reflected in this deal.

Also, I truly hope you are right about Parrish and Yashin.

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03-06-2006, 04:20 PM
  #102
Darth Milbury
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Could somebody tell me if that above posted list is correct? Why do we keep hearing that York and Asham are impending UFAs? That just doens't make sense to me.

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03-06-2006, 04:23 PM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
Could somebody tell me if that above posted list is correct? Why do we keep hearing that York and Asham are impending UFAs? That just doens't make sense to me.
FWIW, I am 99.9% certain that York is a restricted free agent, not a UFA. He is one short on years played in the league to qualify this year.

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Old
03-06-2006, 04:25 PM
  #104
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You are right that many of our prospects are thought of as good-great 3rd liners, with some possible upside to 2nd line duty.

BUT, even with my proposed 3rd line next year of Bergie- Nokie- Bates, that is pretty young, and we would have to have a vet, if not Bates on that line anyway.

Thing is, Bates at $1.2 is very reasonable, and so what if we have a log jam for the bottom 2 lines in a couple of years? If they all develop into great 3rd liners, they, or Bates will still be VERY attractive to teams looking for that type of player, since NONE of those guys (including Bates) will be making much over a mil. per.

In the meantime we have a player in Bates who sets a good example to our young guys, and if history is any guide, we will see that a Bates / type player will command MUCH more this offseason. Especially when you consider that there are not many high end guys available this summer, so lower level guys may actually soak up those $$ this offseason, just as Satchard did last year.

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03-06-2006, 04:31 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Henry I
I don't get it. Are we really going to be needing Bates in 3 years? Isn't he basically exactly what we're hoping about half of our prospects are going to be in the near future?

Hell, do we really need Bates that much now? He's good for a nice scoring streak every season and he is a big fish in a small pond on the Isles when it comes to faceoffs and defense, but he's nothing special. Parrish should have been offerred any money that we gave to Bates.
Parrish plays a completely different role than Bates, so this is hardly an one or the other situation. As pointed out by Hahn, Bates is also close friends with Parrish, so this could all be a ploy to convince Parrish to sign here at a discount, since he now knows this is where his close friend will be the next few years.

Actually, we're hoping most of those guys turn out to be better than Bates. But Bates is a good guy to help work those guys in slowly, avoid giving them too much responsibility at once and help ease the transition. If after 1 or 2 years, his job doing that is done, and the kids have proven they're ready we trade him. Or, if the kids bust, we still have him to keep doing what he's doing.

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03-06-2006, 04:33 PM
  #106
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I thought this year there is suppose to be a good UFA class.

Bates must be a backup plan or insurance policy...in case they can't land bigger fish after they buy out Yashin and likely lose Parrish.

So if they buyout Yashin and don't resign Parrish it might make sense to have Bates there.

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03-06-2006, 04:46 PM
  #107
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Wow, lot of posts to read through....

I generally think this is OK. We'll likely see this is a decent price (1.2 per) for what Bates is bringing, so if the 3 years is the price for a discount, so be it.

A hard working guy with speed that can play the pk will always have some value if all the kids pan out and we want to trade him later.

I have no problems with MM still at the controls if Wang's personally OKing the deals until a new GM is in place. It's Wang's team, it's his money. Having Bates under contract isn't going to scare away any potential GM's.

In fact, having some players with value around will be more valuable to a good GM than cash or cap room, I suspect. Leaving a new GM with just a pile of cash and cap room WILL NOT fix the problems here. They need some spare parts to work with as well.

A final thought, may the timing of this also be so teams dealing with MM at the deadline realize he's still got some power and won't just be out to firesale the impending UFAs? May change the approach some teams take in making us offers...

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Old
03-06-2006, 04:48 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYIsles1
On this team (unlike those clubs) the third line center's role requires a player who can contribute at both ends of the ice as it's currently constructed.

Even if I were to agree with you that this team needs more offense (deja vu', the fallacy perpetrated to gullible fans, summer 2005!), seems to me that one might start targeting the first and second line centers for more offense waaaay before the third-line pivot. Anyhow, if teams can go to the Cup Finals with the likes of those offensive dynamos Tim Taylor and Stephane Yelle manning their checking line, so too can this one succeed with Shawn Bates in a similar role. It is worth noting that Yelle plays on a team that is notoriously short on firepower itself; point is, they do not give up goals.

Seems to me that we just have a different approach to fixing what ails this team. I believe that this team will score more goals if it concentrates fully first on preventing them. "Getting more offense" should in no way be the first priority (icing 12 forwards and 6 dmen who commit to team defense each night is.) In fact it's a distant second, IMO, having witnessed the lessons of this past summer and current season. (As well as seeing what has worked for winning teams for decades. Same as you have.)

If you think Bates is not an solid defensive forward, fine, we simply disagree. But if you are trying to revolutionize the priorities/role of a third-line center in the NHL, you're going at it alone. The only teams in which offense is a priority for the third-line center are all-star and fantasy teams. Seriously. Of course you welcome offensive contributions from your third-liners, but that is secondary. And relative to other 3rd liners around the NHL, Bates produces offense very respectably.


Where your point is lost is that the Islanders for years have been giving up 20-60 goals (thirty eight in 05-06) against more than New Jersey every year (including 01-02 when the Islanders beat them out in the standings) but every single year the Islanders led the division in scoring to off-set it...

"Offset it"? Which team has been more successful over that the last few years? Defense wins. Period.


Last edited by Trottier: 03-06-2006 at 05:02 PM.
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Old
03-06-2006, 04:48 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesdabus
I thought this year there is suppose to be a good UFA class.

Bates must be a backup plan or insurance policy...in case they can't land bigger fish after they buy out Yashin and likely lose Parrish.

So if they buyout Yashin and don't resign Parrish it might make sense to have Bates there.
Many of those high-end guys already re-signed with thier teams, like Vinny L., Jerome Iginla, Joe Thorton, Martin St.Louie, Saku Koivu etc. There are very few "franchise" or even true "top Line" type UFA this summer. Evan Marc Savard is rumored to be staying in Atlanta, amd I'd hardly consider him a "franchise foward".

This year the BIG money will go to Dmen, even moreso than last year, and Bates' pricetag will not harm us there.

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03-06-2006, 04:55 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JKP
In fact, having some players with value around will be more valuable to a good GM than cash or cap room, I suspect. Leaving a new GM with just a pile of cash and cap room WILL NOT fix the problems here. They need some spare parts to work with as well.
Agree totally... see Boston Bruins of this past summer. They had no roster and a lot of cap room coming into the free agency period. They slapped together a team that took far to long to develop any chemistry. Even our own Isles experienced the same with their extreme roster change.

Having cap space is very important but so is having some continuity. Even for a mediocre team like the Isles. A player like Bates is a good example for younger players to learn from.

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Old
03-06-2006, 05:10 PM
  #111
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"...seems to me that one might start targeting the first and second line centers for more offense waaaay before the third-line pivot." - Trottier

I agree 100% with you. I will not get down on Bates because Yashin and Kvasha are both overpaid DOGS, and haven't lived up to thier billing. We now have rewarded a guy who has played his role as well as anyone could have reasonably asked, and has by ALL ACCOUNTS been every Coach's dream.

Great, now that it looks like we have another CONTRIBUTER on board for the future, it's time to do the dirty work on the top 2 lines. Get Parrish signed for reasonable $, and throw Yashin, and Kvasha overboard.

Bates' deal is good news, especially if it means more $ for guys who care, and guys who float are cast off.

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03-06-2006, 06:19 PM
  #112
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I don't mind this signing at all. Bates is a valuable commodity on this team and is very versatile. Don't forget before his injury he was on a hot streak (8 goals or something?). A nice ideal 3rd liner/Pker that all winning teams need. i'd like to see the money figures, but should be a wise financial investment, as well as on the ice. My only concern is whether the new G.M. is going to have cap leeway...next 3 days should be exciting...

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Old
03-06-2006, 07:11 PM
  #113
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Overall I like the guy. The good attitude and hard work his needed on this team. Not sure what the rush was to do this thougy. I guess MM was afraid Batesy would light it up and carry the team to the playoffs...

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Old
03-06-2006, 10:43 PM
  #114
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Mike's leaving and all the Massachussetts boys are getting 3 or 15 year deals before the next GM can say a thing.

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Old
03-07-2006, 04:57 AM
  #115
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I don't see how anyone can be too upset with this.

You will always have to up some salary for years of UFA. You get a few teams bidding and Batesy maybe goes for $1.4-1.5 million/year in the offseason.

In the meantime the Islanders secured an asset, at a price that does not kill their cap while showing loyalty to a player who wished to stay on the Island into UFA years.

I don't think a new GM who may want to go in another direction would have any problems moving him.

So what exactly is the problem? I don't care about guys getting locked in for an extra $100K or $200K or an extra year as long as their trade value doesn't suffer.

It's guys getting locked in for 3 or more years too many for $1+million/year too high that bothers me.

,
Mitch

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Old
03-07-2006, 05:07 AM
  #116
Capt Reynolds
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seph
Actually, we're hoping most of those guys turn out to be better than Bates. But Bates is a good guy to help work those guys in slowly, avoid giving them too much responsibility at once and help ease the transition. If after 1 or 2 years, his job doing that is done, and the kids have proven they're ready we trade him. Or, if the kids bust, we still have him to keep doing what he's doing.
This is actually the best argument I've heard in favor of the signing, Seph. Nokie and Bates can each play C and wing so they can rotate at third line C next year and then you have a good, hard-working vet to help steady the line. Say LW-C-RW of Bergie -- Nokie/Bates -- Bates/Nokie. I like that a lot as our third line. I'm still not wild about the length of the deal, or at MM making commitments on his way out the door, but I will just hope this is it for his signing guys and I'll look forward to what has the makings of a speedy and tenacious (and, yes, even a little chippy!) third line for us next year and keep my fingers crossed about the rest of it.

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Old
03-07-2006, 06:35 AM
  #117
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Bates

Quote:
Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey
Mike's leaving and all the Massachussetts boys are getting 3 or 15 year deals before the next GM can say a thing.
I have to admit I wonder what Bates has over Milbury.

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Old
03-07-2006, 02:07 PM
  #118
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I like this signing. Bates can be very useful and should help the young guys develop. If every thing goes well then guys like Bergie and Colliton can slowly take over the third line roles and eventually move Bates down to the Fourth. Then maybe we can get some minutes out of the fourth line which I think is critical throught the long season I do not expect this to happen over night but to develop slowly over the next couple of years.

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Old
03-16-2006, 06:27 AM
  #119
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3/16:

http://www2.townonline.com/medford/s...ticleid=449436
New York Groove

"I'm extremely happy," said Bates, following a 3-1 win over his old team the Boston Bruins at the TD Banknorth Garden, March 11. "To get the three years is special. I worked hard to get that so I'm very pleased. They've been loyal to me and I think my answer was to be loyal to them. They came up with a great offer and it was something I couldn't refuse."

"I've loved my four seasons with the Islanders. This is where I really developed as a player," Bates said. "It was a priority for me to stay an Islander. I'm very appreciative that management was as enthusiastic about making a commitment to me."

"Shawn has been a very good player for us for four seasons now and his wish was to stay an Islander," said Milbury. "We were happy to get a long-term deal done with him. Shawn is the kind of versatile and dedicated player that every team in the NHL wants. In a skater's game, he has become even more valuable."

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