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Kypreos: Luongo has asked for a trade (All Luongo talk here)

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Old
04-28-2012, 04:57 PM
  #51
Jack de la Hoya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 93gilmour93 View Post
Spare parts
Spare parts = expendable non-core players of varying levels of value.

I don't see how that doesn't fit as a description of the OP package (outside the 1st)

Quote:
Tyler Bozak
Clark MacArthur
Matt Frattin
Joe Colborne
Carl Gunnarsson/Luke Schenn
Mike Komisarek
Frattin and Colborne are comfortably "B" level prospects, Gunnarsson is a strong role player--but he's basically a second-pairing defenseman (an adequate one, to be sure, but not a cornerstone). Schenn is Schenn--one of the most oft-discussed players on this board.


Last edited by Jack de la Hoya: 04-28-2012 at 05:29 PM.
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Old
04-28-2012, 05:26 PM
  #52
93gilmour93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Spare parts = expendable non-core players of varying levels of value.

I don't see how that doesn't fit as a description of the package you suggested (outside the 1st)



Frattin and Colborne are comfortably "B" level prospects, Gunnarsson is a strong role player--but he's basically a second-pairing defenseman (an adequate one, to be sure, but not a cornerstone). Schenn is Schenn--one of the most oft-discussed players on this board.
I never suggested anything what are you talking about.

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Old
04-28-2012, 05:29 PM
  #53
Jack de la Hoya
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Originally Posted by 93gilmour93 View Post
I never suggested anything what are you talking about.
Meh. My bad. Didn't realize there were two people with "Gilmour93" in this thread.

DougGilmour93 v. 93 Gilmour93. You can understand my confusion, right?

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04-28-2012, 05:32 PM
  #54
93gilmour93
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Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Meh. My bad. Didn't realize there were two people with "Gilmour93" in this thread.

DougGilmour93 v. 93 Gilmour93. You can understand my confusion, right?
Honestly I didn't even notice myself. All good

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Old
04-28-2012, 05:40 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougGilmour93 View Post
Feel free to counter guys.

We know it won't take much to get Luongo out of Van City, so let me know what you would need for Kesler. Thanks
That's just wrong.

For Kesler and Luongo start with:

Gardiner
Schenn
Colborne
Kadri
5th overall pick
2013 1st round pick

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Old
04-28-2012, 05:58 PM
  #56
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@OP: Yeah, sure. Throw in Mike Brown and we'll add Hamhuis and the Sedin twins too.

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Old
04-28-2012, 07:02 PM
  #57
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I'm not fan of either team and I really dislike the Canucks, but the original proposal is absurd. The Canucks don't have enough roster spots for those guys and I am not sure how many of them can even make the team.

I know Leaf fans will hate it, but for Luongo and Kesler I think Kessel, Reimer, and the Leafs 2012 1st is more like it. Vancouver gives up the better forward and the better goaltender and the 1st balances it out.

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04-28-2012, 07:09 PM
  #58
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In two separate deals?

5th + Kulemin for Luongo (Similar to Voracek + Couturier logic)

In terms of Kesler:
Grabovski + Gardiner would probably fair.

So:

5th Overall
Kulemin
Grabovski
Gardiner
Reimer (pot sweetener)

Sounds relatively even.

My guess is each fanbase is probably a little uncomfortable with the return meaning its probably fair.

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Old
04-28-2012, 07:09 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
I'm not fan of either team and I really dislike the Canucks, but the original proposal is absurd. The Canucks don't have enough roster spots for those guys and I am not sure how many of them can even make the team.

I know Leaf fans will hate it, but for Luongo and Kesler I think Kessel, Reimer, and the Leafs 2012 1st is more like it. Vancouver gives up the better forward and the better goaltender and the 1st balances it out.
Still makes no sense for the Canucks.

1) They can't replace Kesler with Kessel. They have no center depth for a trade like that and would be left with a rookie (Schroeder) or a bottom-6 center (Lapierre/Malhotra) in a top-6 role. For the Canucks Kesler is much more valuable than Kessel as he addresses not only a team need with his type of play, but a huge positional need.

2) They have no need for Reimer. Why give asset value to a player you don't need? Lack has spent and excelled in 2 straight years in the minors and is the same age now as Reimer. He's more than NHL ready for a backup role. Adding another young goalie makes no sense.

The Leafs don't have the assets to get Kesler unless they make a stupidly one sided offer which is too hard to refuse - like Kessel + Grabovski + Gardiner - which doesn't make sense for them. Kesler won't be dealt for "fair" offers that don't address a team need.

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04-28-2012, 07:12 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaBorat View Post
In two separate deals?

5th + Kulemin for Luongo (Similar to Voracek + Couturier logic)

In terms of Kesler:
Grabovski + Gardiner would probably fair.

So:

5th Overall
Kulemin
Grabovski
Gardiner
Reimer (pot sweetener)

Sounds relatively even.
Leafs fans counter with Gunnerson, Komisarek, and a 2nd. Canucks fan laugh. They say ok fine take Colborne, Canucks fans laugh, they say ok fine you can have Schenn, we say no thank you we want Gardiner, but Gardiner is untouchable, have Kadri, no thanks don't want Kadri, OH fine we don't want Kesler or Luongo anyways we're fine with Reimer and huh Connolly, yeah he'll bounce back, good luck moving that albatross contract for a top 10 goalie you fools. Have fun missing the playoffs, oh yeah well screw you.

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Old
04-28-2012, 07:18 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaBorat View Post
In two separate deals?

5th + Kulemin for Luongo (Similar to Voracek + Couturier logic)

In terms of Kesler:
Grabovski + Gardiner would probably fair.

So:

5th Overall
Kulemin
Grabovski
Gardiner
Reimer (pot sweetener)

Sounds relatively even.

My guess is each fanbase is probably a little uncomfortable with the return meaning its probably fair.

don't know why everyone is so crazy to get Kesler.. would rather not pay the price to get him and focus on just Luongo... look elsewhere for a Center.

Canucks dealt Hodgson because there was no where to move up... Kesler was their #2.. don't think they go back on that and deal him too... if they planned on moving him they would of held onto Hodgson.

if we could get Lu for Kulemin and a 5th I would be very happy!

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04-28-2012, 07:22 PM
  #62
ChrisKreider20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TorontoTrades View Post
don't know why everyone is so crazy to get Kesler.. would rather not pay the price to get him and focus on just Luongo... look elsewhere for a Center.

Canucks dealt Hodgson because there was no where to move up... Kesler was their #2.. don't think they go back on that and deal him too... if they planned on moving him they would of held onto Hodgson.

if we could get Lu for Kulemin and a 5th I would be very happy!
lol not a 5th...
the fifth overall...

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Old
04-28-2012, 07:22 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TorontoTrades View Post
don't know why everyone is so crazy to get Kesler.. would rather not pay the price to get him and focus on just Luongo... look elsewhere for a Center.

Canucks dealt Hodgson because there was no where to move up... Kesler was their #2.. don't think they go back on that and deal him too... if they planned on moving him they would of held onto Hodgson.

if we could get Lu for Kulemin and a 5th I would be very happy!
Given the comparison he made to the Philly deal, pretty sure he meant the 5th overall, not a 5th rounder?

You'd be okay with a 5th overall + Kulemin for Luongo? Where do I sign?

Can't see Luongo returning that kind of a pick. At best, we get Det's 1st from TBay, but Luongo isn't worth a top-5 pick.. Of course I'd love to be proven wrong!

but hey, if you're willing to offer that, we'll let you keep your 5th overall and Kulemin... Just send us Gardiner instead

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04-28-2012, 07:26 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaBorat View Post
In two separate deals?

5th + Kulemin for Luongo (Similar to Voracek + Couturier logic)

In terms of Kesler:
Grabovski + Gardiner would probably fair.

So:

5th Overall
Kulemin
Grabovski
Gardiner
Reimer (pot sweetener)

Sounds relatively even.

My guess is each fanbase is probably a little uncomfortable with the return meaning its probably fair.
I would do the first one for sure. But no thanks to Kesler for Grabovski and Gardiner we get an inferior offensive player, which is stupid seeing as the last two playoffs are biggest need was offense.

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Old
04-28-2012, 07:51 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaBorat View Post
lol not a 5th...
the fifth overall...




oh god no then.

5th overall for Lu no thaaaank you.

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Old
04-28-2012, 08:01 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougGilmour93 View Post
I'll start by saying that I think Kesler could be a decent #1 centerman in Toronto.

So here goes...


To Vancouver:
Tyler Bozak
Clark MacArthur
Matt Frattin/Joe Colborne
Carl Gunnarsson/Luke Schenn
Mike Komisarek
1st in 2012 (5th overall)

To Toronto:
Ryan Kesler
Roberto Luongo

Constructive criticism is appreciated. Feel free to write counter proposals.
Less players
Better players

That's the secret to a better offer

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Old
04-28-2012, 08:02 PM
  #67
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With Vancouver in win-now mode, there is no way that they would trade Kesler for picks or prospects. For him to be pried away, a marquee roster player would have to be coming the other way. The only player on the Leafs' roster fitting that description in any way is Kessel, but I don't think either team makes that trade. Kessel is Burke's special project, and Kesler fills Vancouver's organizational needs (grit, plays C).

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Old
04-28-2012, 08:29 PM
  #68
nmbr_24
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Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
Still makes no sense for the Canucks.

1) They can't replace Kesler with Kessel. They have no center depth for a trade like that and would be left with a rookie (Schroeder) or a bottom-6 center (Lapierre/Malhotra) in a top-6 role. For the Canucks Kesler is much more valuable than Kessel as he addresses not only a team need with his type of play, but a huge positional need.

2) They have no need for Reimer. Why give asset value to a player you don't need? Lack has spent and excelled in 2 straight years in the minors and is the same age now as Reimer. He's more than NHL ready for a backup role. Adding another young goalie makes no sense.

The Leafs don't have the assets to get Kesler unless they make a stupidly one sided offer which is too hard to refuse - like Kessel + Grabovski + Gardiner - which doesn't make sense for them. Kesler won't be dealt for "fair" offers that don't address a team need.
I was just looking at the value of it and trying to point out that Luongo and Kesler in the same deal just won't get dealt for a bunch of lesser players who wouldn't even have a great shot at making the team. No contender is going to trade Kesler for a bunch of lesser parts. I understand a Luongo move and how he may go for players who don't have as much value as he does, but packaged together the Canucks are going to be looking for premium talent and not 3rd liners, prospects, and 2nd/3rd pairing D. At least getting Kessel and the 2012 1st is more equal value, Reimer is basically a throw in.

I wasn't actually making a proposal, just commenting on the value needed to make that kind of move.

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04-28-2012, 08:45 PM
  #69
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Toronto doesn't want a diver and a terrible term.

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04-28-2012, 09:43 PM
  #70
DougGilmour93
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1st deal

To Van:
Kulemin/MacArthur
Bozak
5th overall

To Tor:
Kesler
29th overall


2nd deal

To Van:
Schenn
Komisarek
35th overall

To Tor:
Luongo

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Old
04-28-2012, 09:59 PM
  #71
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lets just stop with the Kesler offers... clearly not going to happen.. they dealt Hodgson because he couldn't move up.. they're not going to flip Kesler just months after.


if that gets it done for Luongo I'd be very happy.. I think the Canucks would prefer Armstrong to Komisarek though.

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Old
04-28-2012, 10:59 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TorontoTrades View Post
lets just stop with the Kesler offers... clearly not going to happen.. they dealt Hodgson because he couldn't move up.. they're not going to flip Kesler just months after.


if that gets it done for Luongo I'd be very happy.. I think the Canucks would prefer Armstrong to Komisarek though.
Does Komisarek have a NMC or a NTC?

If he has a NMC, it's a non-starter. The Canucks couldn't afford his cap hit on the team, even if they move Luongo. The Canucks simply have no cap room, and you don't deal players who contribute just to fit in Komisarek's cap hit.

Whatever cap dump the Canucks take (if they are worthwhile pieces to take a cap dump) has to be able to be waived and their cap hit eliminated.

The Canucks are playing above the cap as it is, and Schneider's raise will eat up most of Luongo's cap, while their replacements and re-signing will take up the rest. The Canucks simply can not take on the cap hit of a player that they can't send to the minors.

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Old
04-28-2012, 11:13 PM
  #73
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Haha thanks guys got a good chuckle from this thread

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Old
04-28-2012, 11:22 PM
  #74
kmad
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Toronto doesn't want a diver and a terrible term.
Exactly. They're doing just fine with Reimer Gustavsson.

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Old
04-29-2012, 12:21 AM
  #75
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Toronto doesn't want a diver and a terrible term.
But Toronto does want to make the playoffs.

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