HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Winnipeg Jets
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Mark Scheifele to RW for 2012

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-01-2012, 11:40 AM
  #1
Peter Petan
I Can Fly!
 
Peter Petan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Country: Canada
Posts: 374
vCash: 50
Mark Scheifele to RW for 2012

Being that he's a top 6 style player, having a 19 yr old on a checking line is usually a recipe for disaster. I'd rather have Burmi or the 'POV holding down 2nd line duties (for experience reasons). Maybe I just have a man-crush on the way Giroux was developed, but i think this is the easiest way to get him NHL experience

Peter Petan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 11:49 AM
  #2
jamiebez
Registered User
 
jamiebez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,406
vCash: 500
I firmly believe Mark Scheifele will be the #1 center for the Barrie Colts next season.

Considering he's only played 2 years in the OHL and isn't AHL-eligible, I really think that's the best thing for him.

I think the only way that changes is if he has a great showing in the playoffs for the Ice Caps, beefs up in the off-season, and has a lights-out camp/pre-season/9-game trial. And if they go out and acquire another forward in trade or free agency, even that may not be enough.

jamiebez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 11:57 AM
  #3
WaveRaven
Registered User
 
WaveRaven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Winnerpeg
Posts: 464
vCash: 50
I don't see it, we need size up the middle Mark should be able to provide that.

WaveRaven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 12:25 PM
  #4
vBurmi
Blue-Line Dekes
 
vBurmi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Greater Detroit
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,406
vCash: 5949
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiebez View Post
I firmly believe Mark Scheifele will be the #1 center for the Barrie Colts next season.

Considering he's only played 2 years in the OHL and isn't AHL-eligible, I really think that's the best thing for him.

I think the only way that changes is if he has a great showing in the playoffs for the Ice Caps, beefs up in the off-season, and has a lights-out camp/pre-season/9-game trial. And if they go out and acquire another forward in trade or free agency, even that may not be enough.
Unfortunately, I agree with this. I don't think Scheifele is strong enough on his skates to survive the transition to the NHL at this point. We pretty much all agree that Burmistrov was rushed - Scheifele would be rushed even more if he came in next year (disregarding age) because he doesn't have the puck handling abilities to get away from the physical aspect like Burmistrov does. Scheifele is also a more cerebral player so getting his confidence wrecked by being manhandled night after night could stunt his development much worse.

If he bulks up massively in the offseason, he's got a shot but I don't see the Jets rushing him. With Little, Burmistrov, Antropov and Cormier they've got their 4 centers. They'll likely either re-sign Slater and move either Burmistrov or Cormier to the wing, or sign a center who plays well on the wing . That would be alright .

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveRaven View Post
I don't see it, we need size up the middle Mark should be able to provide that.
Agreed. Little and Burmistrov aren't the one-two duo we need at center if this team is going to ever make it anywhere in the playoffs; They're just too small. As good as Burmistrov is defensively, he's not very strong in faceoffs and we saw his offensive game flourish this season for the short stretch he played on the wing.

vBurmi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 12:55 PM
  #5
BigTuna49
RIP KevFist
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Egypt
Posts: 23,071
vCash: 1165
Quote:
Originally Posted by vBurmi View Post
Agreed. Little and Burmistrov aren't the one-two duo we need at center if this team is going to ever make it anywhere in the playoffs; They're just too small. As good as Burmistrov is defensively, he's not very strong in faceoffs and we saw his offensive game flourish this season for the short stretch he played on the wing.
I think this size thing, is a little overblown around here. Yeah, it wouldn't hurt to have some more size, but it's not 100% necessary. Giroux and Briere are the top two centers on Philly and neither are 6'0. The best thing Burmi and Little could do was strengthen their lower body more. More so Burmi though. He has the potential to be a first line player and he'll need to be a stronger skater. He obviously has the skating ability already. Just need to get stronger.

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 02:10 PM
  #6
DespoticNewt
Registered User
 
DespoticNewt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,158
vCash: 234
Quote:
Originally Posted by vBurmi View Post
Unfortunately, I agree with this. I don't think Scheifele is strong enough on his skates to survive the transition to the NHL at this point. We pretty much all agree that Burmistrov was rushed - Scheifele would be rushed even more if he came in next year (disregarding age) because he doesn't have the puck handling abilities to get away from the physical aspect like Burmistrov does. Scheifele is also a more cerebral player so getting his confidence wrecked by being manhandled night after night could stunt his development much worse.

If he bulks up massively in the offseason, he's got a shot but I don't see the Jets rushing him. With Little, Burmistrov, Antropov and Cormier they've got their 4 centers. They'll likely either re-sign Slater and move either Burmistrov or Cormier to the wing, or sign a center who plays well on the wing . That would be alright .



Agreed. Little and Burmistrov aren't the one-two duo we need at center if this team is going to ever make it anywhere in the playoffs; They're just too small. As good as Burmistrov is defensively, he's not very strong in faceoffs and we saw his offensive game flourish this season for the short stretch he played on the wing.
I would not be upset to see Scheifele play another year at OHL level. It would help his game tremendously to develop his speed and puck possession skills while limiting his chances to get hurt by playing against players who would most likely be smaller than him.

DespoticNewt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 03:23 PM
  #7
Tintin's Ghost
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Saskatoon
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,127
vCash: 500
Ideally, Scheif will only make the opening roster if he drops jaws at TC and not b/c he is the only option the Jets have for a top 6 forward. Why would Noel and Co. do the very thing to Scheif that they complain happened to Burmi?

I think that Scheifele was always seen as a longer-term project than some of his other draft year peers. If TNSE wanted a big center ready-to-insert into the lineup then perhaps would have drafted Couturier? As much I was leaning towards SC, with Scheifele now part of the organization's long term plans then l hope they invest as much time with him as needed for proper development. I lived in Regina when Eberle played for the Pats and he only progressed ten-fold both times he was returned to junior after being drafted. Ryan Johansen is similar player to Mark and he appeared to struggle this year as a 19 y/o (playing for the Jackets notwithstanding).

Another poster pointed out that Mark's game is very cerebral and to put him in a position where he experiences constant failure while only stunt the way he thinks the game. That analysis seems bang on.

Tintin's Ghost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 03:31 PM
  #8
SCP Guy
Registered User
 
SCP Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Peg
Country: Portugal
Posts: 1,951
vCash: 50
I would love to see every top draft pick we have spend at least 1 season on the 1st line of the Ice Caps.....So that means see ya in 2 years Mark

SCP Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 03:50 PM
  #9
sully1410
Registered User
 
sully1410's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Turner Valley, Alta.
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,126
vCash: 50
Speaking of center and what not...maybe they should try wheeler at centre? Put Kane on the left and put Burmi on the Right.

Kane- Wheeler- Burmi
Ladd- Little- Wellwood/Mach

Bottom six you get the picture. I really think that could work, he's got the size and the play making ability to compliment the other two. We know Kaner is great at scoring goals, and ive read here that Burmi is offensively gifted on the wing. Why the **** not?

sully1410 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 05:05 PM
  #10
mondo3
Registered User
 
mondo3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 863
vCash: 571
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCP Guy View Post
I would love to see every top draft pick we have spend at least 1 season on the 1st line of the Ice Caps.....So that means see ya in 2 years Mark
agree 100%

mondo3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 05:38 PM
  #11
Aerial
Registered User
 
Aerial's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,284
vCash: 500
Yeah, I'm in no rush to see Mark up here and think he's better at C than the wing, so might as well grow him up that way until he's really ready to come in and take the next step in the NHL.

Aerial is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 06:38 PM
  #12
KingBogo
Admitted Homer
 
KingBogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 4,632
vCash: 1345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke49 View Post
I think this size thing, is a little overblown around here. Yeah, it wouldn't hurt to have some more size, but it's not 100% necessary. Giroux and Briere are the top two centers on Philly and neither are 6'0. The best thing Burmi and Little could do was strengthen their lower body more. More so Burmi though. He has the potential to be a first line player and he'll need to be a stronger skater. He obviously has the skating ability already. Just need to get stronger.
Getting bigger and tougher to play against is one of the biggest refrains heard from Noel/Chevy. Having a couple smaller high end point producers is great when you have a lot of size across the board. IMO the Jets would be very well servred getting bigger down the middle.

We can speculate all we want about if Scheifele will make the Jets lineup next year, but we are all pretty much pissing into the wind. He will be on the team if he earns it and management feels that playing at a lower level it isn't necessary for his development. Bottom line is the Jets are a bottom third team and they need help in a lot of areas.

KingBogo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 06:54 PM
  #13
Bob E
Registered User
 
Bob E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Winnerpeg
Posts: 3,269
vCash: 500
Glad to see there are a number of folks giving Scheifele the time he needs to mature and be ready for NHL duty. Too many fans want to rush a player - to their long-term detrement.

As much as a work stopage would likely kill me next fall, the only good news in that would be... it might work out best for Mark. He could then go back to Jr, without anyone questioning whether he should play here/there, play in the World Jrs again as a 19 yr old. It seemed to work quite well for the '03 drafted players like Getzlaf and Carter.

BTW, not that i'm comparing Mark's game to Getzlaf and Carter, but their stats in Jr at the same time in their careers is remarkably similar. Just saying.

Bob E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 07:40 PM
  #14
razorsedge
West Town Sports
 
razorsedge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Fort Sask, Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,679
vCash: 50
I can't wait till next draft so we can have this topic regurgitated repeatidly with a new prospect name.

razorsedge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 08:11 PM
  #15
Tintin's Ghost
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Saskatoon
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,127
vCash: 500
Speculating about prospects is the lifeblood of HF boards. Don't think it's a negative thing.

Tintin's Ghost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 09:32 PM
  #16
BigTuna49
RIP KevFist
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Egypt
Posts: 23,071
vCash: 1165
Quote:
Originally Posted by sully1410 View Post
Speaking of center and what not...maybe they should try wheeler at centre? Put Kane on the left and put Burmi on the Right.

Kane- Wheeler- Burmi
Ladd- Little- Wellwood/Mach

Bottom six you get the picture. I really think that could work, he's got the size and the play making ability to compliment the other two. We know Kaner is great at scoring goals, and ive read here that Burmi is offensively gifted on the wing. Why the **** not?
No. Just no. Wheeler is not able to have the defensive responsibility it takes to play center. He doesn't kill penalties for a reason. Not because he's bad. He's passable. But not for center. Plus, his play style isn't the best for it. He plays an end to end skating type of game. He plays off of skill, not vision. He would not work out well at center. There is a reason he has hardly played center in the NHL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBogo View Post
Getting bigger and tougher to play against is one of the biggest refrains heard from Noel/Chevy. Having a couple smaller high end point producers is great when you have a lot of size across the board. IMO the Jets would be very well servred getting bigger down the middle.

We can speculate all we want about if Scheifele will make the Jets lineup next year, but we are all pretty much pissing into the wind. He will be on the team if he earns it and management feels that playing at a lower level it isn't necessary for his development. Bottom line is the Jets are a bottom third team and they need help in a lot of areas.
We'd be well served getting bigger on the 3rd line instead of having Stapleton and Mittens playing there. That's been our biggest problem. If we were to get bigger there then having smaller centers like Burmi or Little wouldn't seem as big of a problem. Scheifele will probably end up being a top 6 center for us with a year to 3 years with Burmi there as well. Little will probably move to wing more so going forward. And honestly, I wish Little had the puck on his stick more often. He's an accurate passer with pretty solid vision. Being at center he is always back helping the D.

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-01-2012, 11:14 PM
  #17
sully1410
Registered User
 
sully1410's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Turner Valley, Alta.
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,126
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke49 View Post
No. Just no. Wheeler is not able to have the defensive responsibility it takes to play center. He doesn't kill penalties for a reason. Not because he's bad. He's passable. But not for center. Plus, his play style isn't the best for it. He plays an end to end skating type of game. He plays off of skill, not vision. He would not work out well at center. There is a reason he has hardly played center in the NHL.



We'd be well served getting bigger on the 3rd line instead of having Stapleton and Mittens playing there. That's been our biggest problem. If we were to get bigger there then having smaller centers like Burmi or Little wouldn't seem as big of a problem. Scheifele will probably end up being a top 6 center for us with a year to 3 years with Burmi there as well. Little will probably move to wing more so going forward. And honestly, I wish Little had the puck on his stick more often. He's an accurate passer with pretty solid vision. Being at center he is always back helping the D.
As far as his defensive game, I would have thought just the opposite. He's the forward that I always see back with Toby when Buff gets himself caught.

The rest I can't argue with. You very well might be right. It does make sense as to why it hasn't been tried before. I figured I'd post it on here to see what you guys thought.

sully1410 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 09:16 AM
  #18
Grind
Stomacheache AllStar
 
Grind's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 4,140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke49 View Post


We'd be well served getting bigger on the 3rd line instead of having Stapleton and Mittens playing there. That's been our biggest problem. If we were to get bigger there then having smaller centers like Burmi or Little wouldn't seem as big of a problem. Scheifele will probably end up being a top 6 center for us with a year to 3 years with Burmi there as well. Little will probably move to wing more so going forward. And honestly, I wish Little had the puck on his stick more often. He's an accurate passer with pretty solid vision. Being at center he is always back helping the D.
I think the logic behind "big down the middle" versus "big third line" is that you end up consistently difficult to play against.

Though I'd be happy either way, having a trio of big centers is generally thought of as allowing you to always have a big, defensively capable, forward who keeps other teams honest on the ice.

Having a big third line can be great, and can really infuriate opponents when on the ice, but the problem is your leaving a lot up to line matching with that strategy, and for half the games of the year, your not in total control of that.


both have it's merits, but i can see why one would prefer 3 centers to a 3rd line. besides, it's not like you can't have both, though that would require nothing short of some miracle work on chevy's behalf.

Grind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 09:52 AM
  #19
Yukon Joe
Registered User
 
Yukon Joe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: YWG -> YXY -> YEG
Posts: 1,433
vCash: 624
Quote:
Originally Posted by razorsedge View Post
I can't wait till next draft so we can have this topic regurgitated repeatidly with a new prospect name.
It's May and our team didn't make the playoffs. What else are we going to talk about?

Yukon Joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 10:14 AM
  #20
razorsedge
West Town Sports
 
razorsedge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Fort Sask, Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,679
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukon Joe View Post
It's May and our team didn't make the playoffs. What else are we going to talk about?
I might of came across a bit to harsh about this topic.

I'd just like to read more discussion about our other prospects. My time for researching them are limited plus I like to reading peoples opinions on them.

razorsedge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 11:14 AM
  #21
jigglysquishy
Registered User
 
jigglysquishy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Regina, Saskatchewan
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,385
vCash: 492
I'm glad the consensus is that he spends another year in junior. I'm a big believer that the NHL rushes a lot of players and destroys careers. Just because Crosby came in at 18 doesn't mean everyone should.

Just look at how Jordan Eberle turned out.

Another year in the O will only help Mark and the Jets long term.

jigglysquishy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 11:32 AM
  #22
Peter Petan
I Can Fly!
 
Peter Petan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Country: Canada
Posts: 374
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukon Joe View Post
It's May and our team didn't make the playoffs. What else are we going to talk about?
Ragging on Buff and Enstrom's contract situation has grown tiresome...

Peter Petan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 11:33 AM
  #23
garret9
AKA#VitoCorrelationi
 
garret9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 10,516
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by sully1410 View Post
As far as his defensive game, I would have thought just the opposite. He's the forward that I always see back with Toby when Buff gets himself caught.

The rest I can't argue with. You very well might be right. It does make sense as to why it hasn't been tried before. I figured I'd post it on here to see what you guys thought.
I also remember him not having the greatest of FO%... (Haven't confirmed as of right now)...
We have enough subpar FO centres haha

garret9 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 12:15 PM
  #24
ps241
The Danish Dash!
 
ps241's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 10,922
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tintin's Ghost View Post
Ideally, Scheif will only make the opening roster if he drops jaws at TC and not b/c he is the only option the Jets have for a top 6 forward. Why would Noel and Co. do the very thing to Scheif that they complain happened to Burmi?

I think that Scheifele was always seen as a longer-term project than some of his other draft year peers. If TNSE wanted a big center ready-to-insert into the lineup then perhaps would have drafted Couturier? As much I was leaning towards SC, with Scheifele now part of the organization's long term plans then l hope they invest as much time with him as needed for proper development. I lived in Regina when Eberle played for the Pats and he only progressed ten-fold both times he was returned to junior after being drafted. Ryan Johansen is similar player to Mark and he appeared to struggle this year as a 19 y/o (playing for the Jackets notwithstanding).

Another poster pointed out that Mark's game is very cerebral and to put him in a position where he experiences constant failure while only stunt the way he thinks the game. That analysis seems bang on.
good post.......interesting what did you notice differently about Ederle’s second year back after his draft (the same year Mark would be going into)? I get why Eberle went back to Juniors for one year but was less certain why he went back for the 2nd year based on how NHL ready he was in his rookie year.........he is obviously the poster boy for two additional years in Juniors. I know Hawerchuk said it pretty well when discussing Mark vs. Telegin and why Mark might need one more year in junior. Dale said Mark was dominant some nights whereras Ivan (by the last two months) was dominant every night and maybe the best player in the OHL and was clearly a man amongst boys. Dale said it had become obvious Telegin was ready for the next level and when you see a guy "that dominant" you know they will succeed at the next level and it’s time to move on. He said Mark needed to "master" the little things that allow you to "consistently dominate" every night.

while we are at it I have watched how good Adam Henrique is this season for Jersey and he had two additional years in Junior and one season in the AHL or the "three year plan" and by the time he hit the NHL his numbers were the same as they were in his last year in the AHL and he is up for rookie of the year. Like Eberle in some ways it seems like top notch asset management in both cases they let the bird cook in the oven for just the right amount of time.

I would have zero issue with this path for Scheif if he needs it........I would much rather see Mark take three years but arrive ready for our top 6 and maybe even the top line as opposed to coming in a year earlier on our 3rd line.

ps241 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-02-2012, 03:13 PM
  #25
BigTuna49
RIP KevFist
 
BigTuna49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ATL
Country: Egypt
Posts: 23,071
vCash: 1165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grind View Post
I think the logic behind "big down the middle" versus "big third line" is that you end up consistently difficult to play against.

Though I'd be happy either way, having a trio of big centers is generally thought of as allowing you to always have a big, defensively capable, forward who keeps other teams honest on the ice.

Having a big third line can be great, and can really infuriate opponents when on the ice, but the problem is your leaving a lot up to line matching with that strategy, and for half the games of the year, your not in total control of that.


both have it's merits, but i can see why one would prefer 3 centers to a 3rd line. besides, it's not like you can't have both, though that would require nothing short of some miracle work on chevy's behalf.
It's not preferring a bigger 3rd line over 3 bigger centers. It's the fact that getting a bigger and better 3rd line in general will be the first step to being a playoff team. It will give us more depth and size at the same time. Plus, it's much easier to find quality 3rd liners then big top 6 centers. Oh, and cheaper. That's more what I was getting at. Also, how many teams have 3 big centers in their top 9?

BigTuna49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:37 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.