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Old
05-02-2012, 09:05 AM
  #101
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I was going to bring up Daigle as the nail in the coffin but was beaten to it.

If I'm Tambo and there is a legit trade I was considering, I'd probably leak it first to gauge reaction.

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05-02-2012, 10:27 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by copper_blue View Post
I hope you guys are right, drafting Yakupov just makes me a bit nervous.


Check out this interesting read from the National Post about Russians in the NHL.

http://sports.nationalpost.com/2012/...oves-puzzling/
The National Post is a conservative rag newspaper that offers wholly biased commenting on a complete range of subjects, of course it offers a nationalistic and uneducated perspective on foreign hockey players. Circulation is on par with the Winnipeg Free Press, don't give them the hits.

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05-02-2012, 10:56 AM
  #103
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With the rumour out there that Staal may be on the block in Pittsburgh, would there be a match between the Oilers and Penguins in the 1st for Staal?

Not the defenceman that the Oilers desperately need but Staal would be a perfect fit in the top 6. Clarifying alot of the remaining issues. Size, center, somewhat physical, winner, some expereince but still young, plays both sides of the puck and so on....

There would have to be some discussion between the Oilers and Staal's camp to guage if he is amiable to playing here beyond next year but aside from that?

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05-02-2012, 11:05 AM
  #104
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He is not injured.

And is training for the combine.
combines are stupid. it doesn't really measure enough things that are appicable to play on the ice. I don't care how many pushups a guy can do or how far his long jump is, and I don't see a 240 pound player flying at a guy when he is riding a bike.
RNH probably didn't excell on many of the tests but look at his hockey IQ and vision on the ice.

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05-02-2012, 11:14 AM
  #105
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combines are stupid. it doesn't really measure enough things that are appicable to play on the ice. I don't care how many pushups a guy can do or how far his long jump is, and I don't see a 240 pound player flying at a guy when he is riding a bike.
RNH probably didn't excell on many of the tests but look at his hockey IQ and vision on the ice.
Combine isn't the end all be all of scouting. It just reveals more factors to consider.

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05-02-2012, 11:20 AM
  #106
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Does the latest news of Radulov, Kostitsyn and the Kuznetsov signing in the KHL and the rumoured contract offer to Burmistrov from AK Bars Kazan make you nervous?

Spector reported that Russian Hockey Federation told Kuznetsov, if he wants to have a chance to be on the Russian team in 2014, he needs to leave the NHL and sign in the KHL.

I agree with Spector, drafting a Russian, especially first overall is a nervous situation to be in, due to the recent players leaving the NHL or teams (i.e. Columbus).

If the Oilers retain the pick, I would still draft Yakupov but I would be extra diligent in his background (character) check.
Perhaps he's not as "generational" as the two but the last two Russians to 1or 2 were Ovechkin and Malkin. Given there talent base and Yakupovs, the KHL as a B league just doesn't seem formidable. Especially when you have a player like Yakupovs playing junior in Canada and maintaining the idea with conviction his goal is to win here. Not too mention Radulov and Kuznetsov were drafted while playing in Russian leagues....

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05-02-2012, 11:29 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by copperandblue View Post
With the rumour out there that Staal may be on the block in Pittsburgh, would there be a match between the Oilers and Penguins in the 1st for Staal?

Not the defenceman that the Oilers desperately need but Staal would be a perfect fit in the top 6. Clarifying alot of the remaining issues. Size, center, somewhat physical, winner, some expereince but still young, plays both sides of the puck and so on....

There would have to be some discussion between the Oilers and Staal's camp to guage if he is amiable to playing here beyond next year but aside from that?


Staal is one year from being a UFA, and likely won't be as good as Yakupov in the NHL.

The question is, do you trade 1st overall for Jordan Staal? The simple and complete answer is NO.

If the Oilers want to trade for Jordan Staal, there's a deal there to be made, just not with 1st overall, unless the team is looking to giveaway Elite Talent.

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05-02-2012, 11:37 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by copperandblue View Post
With the rumour out there that Staal may be on the block in Pittsburgh, would there be a match between the Oilers and Penguins in the 1st for Staal?

Not the defenceman that the Oilers desperately need but Staal would be a perfect fit in the top 6. Clarifying alot of the remaining issues. Size, center, somewhat physical, winner, some expereince but still young, plays both sides of the puck and so on....

There would have to be some discussion between the Oilers and Staal's camp to guage if he is amiable to playing here beyond next year but aside from that?
Did you just show up to the party?

No, no and no again for the #1 pick for Staal story. His a UFA after one year, and not guranteed to sign with Edmonton past that. We would get Yaks for 7 years. Staal has never had more than 50 points, and although he brings the size and grit - it's not enough to replace another potential cornerstone franchise guy in Yakupov.



Last edited by McBooya42: 05-02-2012 at 11:47 AM. Reason: replaced "a" with "another" ;)
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Old
05-02-2012, 11:47 AM
  #109
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We've been debating the exact same thing for three weeks straight and every day the same verdict is rendered.

It's getting absurd.

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05-02-2012, 11:47 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
Staal is one year from being a UFA, and likely won't be as good as Yakupov in the NHL.

The question is, do you trade 1st overall for Jordan Staal? The simple and complete answer is NO.
YES I would but as I mentioned I would need a face to face with Staal's camp to know what his intentions are. Perhaps take the step of drafting Yakupov on Pittsburgh's behalf and make the move on July 2nd for an extended Staal.

And the question of if Staal will be 'as good' as Yakupov is a little vague, no?

Will Yakupov put up more points? Yes. Is he going to be a better player? Unlikely. Will he be as consistant of a performer for as long as Staal? Unlikely. Does he fit the make up of THIS team as well as a guy like Staal? NO.

But then again I also don't think Yakupov is going to be what people here are predicting, I certainly don't think that adding a player of his ilk solves the issues that plague this team and I think that Staal does.

It takes more than putting up points to win a championship.

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Old
05-02-2012, 11:59 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by copperandblue View Post

It takes more than putting up points to win a championship.
In that case we shouldnt have drafted hall either cuz it takes more than speedy, aggressive, and highly talented left wingers to win championships..

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05-02-2012, 12:03 PM
  #112
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In that case we shouldnt have drafted hall either cuz it takes more than speedy, aggressive, and highly talented left wingers to win championships..
And it's that kind of critical thought that makes this place what it is, thanks for that!

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05-02-2012, 12:08 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by copperandblue View Post
YES I would but as I mentioned I would need a face to face with Staal's camp to know what his intentions are. Perhaps take the step of drafting Yakupov on Pittsburgh's behalf and make the move on July 2nd for an extended Staal.

And the question of if Staal will be 'as good' as Yakupov is a little vague, no?

Will Yakupov put up more points? Yes. Is he going to be a better player? Unlikely. Will he be as consistant of a performer for as long as Staal? Unlikely. Does he fit the make up of THIS team as well as a guy like Staal? NO.

But then again I also don't think Yakupov is going to be what people here are predicting, I certainly don't think that adding a player of his ilk solves the issues that plague this team and I think that Staal does.
It takes more than putting up points to win a championship.
First bolded - you are entitled to your opinions just as everyone else here of course. You are severly outnumbered in your viewpoint however.

Second bolded - the lack of consistent secondary scoring WAS one of the major plagues holding this team back. Adding Yakupov will help resolve that, and give us two dangerous lines for other teams to get into fits over when trying to cover them. Yes, it takes more than points to win a championship - but it sure as hell is easy when you score more goals. Adding a #1 pick sniper would be beneficial towards that cause.

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Old
05-02-2012, 12:14 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by copperandblue View Post
YES I would but as I mentioned I would need a face to face with Staal's camp to know what his intentions are. Perhaps take the step of drafting Yakupov on Pittsburgh's behalf and make the move on July 2nd for an extended Staal.

And the question of if Staal will be 'as good' as Yakupov is a little vague, no?

Will Yakupov put up more points? Yes. Is he going to be a better player? Unlikely. Will he be as consistant of a performer for as long as Staal? Unlikely. Does he fit the make up of THIS team as well as a guy like Staal? NO.

But then again I also don't think Yakupov is going to be what people here are predicting, I certainly don't think that adding a player of his ilk solves the issues that plague this team and I think that Staal does.

It takes more than putting up points to win a championship.
Just as an aside, don't know if this is entirely relevant, but I'd think since the draft is happening in Pittsburgh and the crowd had nigh to cheer for during the first round - if you let them know we'll draft for them (stealing their thunder) and then trade said draft pick to Pittsburgh the day after for a crowd favourite Jordan Staal, the organizations involved plus the players may be quite pissed off.

Also, no to the trade, only because he's UFA in one year as of now.

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05-02-2012, 12:16 PM
  #115
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And it's that kind of critical thought that makes this place what it is, thanks for that!
I think the hidden point (or maybe I'm just reading too much into it) is that you draft BPA, assemble the pieces and then once you know what you have, trade from strength to fill a weakness.

Staal may very well fit this team better than Yakupov, and (definitely) vice versa. But why trade now for a UFA in one year that will be long gone by the time the Nuge starts shaving once every two days.

By that time, some guy named Couturier or (for all we know) Lander could be the best two way center in the game.

As frustrating as it may be... we are still assembling assets for later distribution.

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Old
05-02-2012, 12:17 PM
  #116
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First bolded - you are entitled to your opinions just as everyone else here of course. You are severly outnumbered in your viewpoint however.
Whish is why a discussion takes place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Booya42 View Post
Second bolded - the lack of consistent secondary scoring WAS one of the major plagues holding this team back. Adding Yakupov will help resolve that, and give us two dangerous lines for other teams to get into fits over when trying to cover them. Yes, it takes more than points to win a championship - but it sure as hell is easy when you score more goals. Adding a #1 pick sniper would be beneficial towards that cause.
Perhaps, but to whatever degree this problem plagued this team, even the most pro-Yakupov fan would have to concede that of all teh problems this team has, secondary scoring is well down the list in priorities that need addressing and - to a lesser degree - would still be getting addressed.

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05-02-2012, 12:20 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by copperandblue View Post

Will Yakupov put up more points? Yes. Is he going to be a better player? Unlikely. Will he be as consistant of a performer for as long as Staal? Unlikely. Does he fit the make up of THIS team as well as a guy like Staal? NO.
.
Points and GOALS, you need those to WIN games. Also, Yakupov is an ELITE Talent, Jordan Staal is not. Elite Talent ALWAYS fits your team better then NOT Elite talent.

Jordan Staal might be a 25-30g guy, Yakupov will likely be a 35-50g guy, making him alot more valuable.

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05-02-2012, 12:23 PM
  #118
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Perhaps, but to whatever degree this problem plagued this team, even the most pro-Yakupov fan would have to concede that of all teh problems this team has, secondary scoring is well down the list in priorities that need addressing and - to a lesser degree - would still be getting addressed.
Actually No, it doesn't fall "well down" the list. I'm sure you've seen the "stellar" numbers put up by Hemsky, Smyth and others from January on, Secondary Scoring was a MASSIVE Problem on this team, which was compounded by other problems.

If this is to suggest, some how, that a 2nd line center bigger then Sam Gagner is worth more then an ELITE Talent, who will become a goal scorer and major offensive threat for this team, then I think the point is being missed.

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05-02-2012, 12:34 PM
  #119
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Just as an aside, don't know if this is entirely relevant, but I'd think since the draft is happening in Pittsburgh and the crowd had nigh to cheer for during the first round - if you let them know we'll draft for them (stealing their thunder) and then trade said draft pick to Pittsburgh the day after for a crowd favourite Jordan Staal, the organizations involved plus the players may be quite pissed off.

Also, no to the trade, only because he's UFA in one year as of now.
As someone who is concerned with Edmonton's interests only, pissing off the draft crowd is no matter to me. Insulting Yakupov is also no matter to me. And Stall being pissed off is entirely on point, the Oilers interest need to be protected so he would need to be involved in some capacity as an extension would prove.

Truth is, the fans at the draft wouldn't know to be pissed off in that case.

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05-02-2012, 12:37 PM
  #120
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I think the hidden point (or maybe I'm just reading too much into it) is that you draft BPA, assemble the pieces and then once you know what you have, trade from strength to fill a weakness.

Staal may very well fit this team better than Yakupov, and (definitely) vice versa. But why trade now for a UFA in one year that will be long gone by the time the Nuge starts shaving once every two days.

By that time, some guy named Couturier or (for all we know) Lander could be the best two way center in the game.

As frustrating as it may be... we are still assembling assets for later distribution.
And this probably touches on where the real divide occurs.

There is a faction that appears to see the draft as Christmas morning and the rebuilt being an defacto result of this fluid evolving series of selections.

Where as the other faction sees the rebuild as something specific, driven be decisions of needs, opportunities and a specific timeline.

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05-02-2012, 12:39 PM
  #121
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And this probably touches on where the real divide occurs.

There is a faction that appears to see the draft as Christmas morning and the rebuilt being an defacto result of this fluid evolving series of selections.

Where as the other faction sees the rebuild as something specific, driven be decisions of needs, opportunities and a specific timeline.
there is another faction. he is just eating a sandwhich.

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05-02-2012, 12:41 PM
  #122
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Actually No, it doesn't fall "well down" the list. I'm sure you've seen the "stellar" numbers put up by Hemsky, Smyth and others from January on, Secondary Scoring was a MASSIVE Problem on this team, which was compounded by other problems.

If this is to suggest, some how, that a 2nd line center bigger then Sam Gagner is worth more then an ELITE Talent, who will become a goal scorer and major offensive threat for this team, then I think the point is being missed.
Why would you compare Yakupov to Smyth, Hemsky and others?

Further, why would you compare Staal to Gagner with only size being a qualifier?

You're right something is being missed.

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05-02-2012, 12:45 PM
  #123
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YES I would but as I mentioned I would need a face to face with Staal's camp to know what his intentions are. Perhaps take the step of drafting Yakupov on Pittsburgh's behalf and make the move on July 2nd for an extended Staal.

And the question of if Staal will be 'as good' as Yakupov is a little vague, no?

Will Yakupov put up more points? Yes. Is he going to be a better player? Unlikely. Will he be as consistant of a performer for as long as Staal? Unlikely. Does he fit the make up of THIS team as well as a guy like Staal? NO.

But then again I also don't think Yakupov is going to be what people here are predicting, I certainly don't think that adding a player of his ilk solves the issues that plague this team and I think that Staal does.

It takes more than putting up points to win a championship.
Yeah and it takes more than Jordan Staal to get the first overall pick.

It would be a collasal blunder to trade Yakupov for Staal. The failure would be legendary.

As far as I'm concern, the whole notion of Staal for 1st overall pick is up there with wanting Eberle in the AHL, or Eberle being injured due to the losing culture of the Oilers. Just plain ridiculous.

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05-02-2012, 12:50 PM
  #124
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The National Post is a conservative rag newspaper that offers wholly biased commenting on a complete range of subjects, of course it offers a nationalistic and uneducated perspective on foreign hockey players. Circulation is on par with the Winnipeg Free Press, don't give them the hits.
The article itself wasn't too bad though. If anything, by reading it, created further distinction in one's mind between a player like Radulov and Yaks, as Radulov may very well be the "tower without a roof".

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05-02-2012, 12:50 PM
  #125
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And this probably touches on where the real divide occurs.

There is a faction that appears to see the draft as Christmas morning and the rebuilt being an defacto result of this fluid evolving series of selections.

Where as the other faction sees the rebuild as something specific, driven be decisions of needs, opportunities and a specific timeline.
Would you trade Steven Stamkos for Jordan Staal?

How about Taylor Hall for Jordan Staal?

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