HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Out of Town Thread part XLIII All talk from around the league here

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-03-2012, 12:12 AM
  #126
Et le But
Moderator
 
Et le But's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York
Country: Argentina
Posts: 17,756
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post
Some people were upset because they believe he never got his chance to shine and it was the coach's fault. Some people even believed Andrei Kostitsyn was worth a 1st rounder.
In this draft, the Preds 1st rounder will be lucky to produce a winger as good as Kostitsyn. We aren't talking a top 10 pick here.

Et le But is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 12:31 AM
  #127
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post
Some people were upset because they believe he never got his chance to shine and it was the coach's fault. Some people even believed Andrei Kostitsyn was worth a 1st rounder.
Does that mean he's a superstar?

When AK shine, he will score 25 goals not 40.

Is it me or only you guys use the word superstar and Andrei Kostitsyn in the same sentence? Even the guys that support or defend AK doesn't consider him as a superstar... or even a star player.

Stradale is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 12:37 AM
  #128
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,991
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post
Some people were upset because they believe he never got his chance to shine and it was the coach's fault. Some people even believed Andrei Kostitsyn was worth a 1st rounder.
Nobody ever said he never got a chance. Is it really that hard to read things nowadays?
Apparently people also said he was a misunderstood superstar?!...

People said he wasn't used properly, and they're right. Being used for 10min with Gomez and a scrapper is not the right way to use AK. Maybe you think it was, but it was pretty clear to many that it wasn't/isn't. Give him decent offensive wingers, and he'll produce, as he has done along side Plekanec, Eller, Lang. Really not that hard to notice.
Expect him to consistently produce every night, then you should expect to be disappointed. At this point, we should all know that AK will go through droughts, it's well known and expected, but that doesn't negate his offensive contribution (20g).

Point wasn't that he was worth a 1st rounder (debatable considering Nsh has been strong all year and considered a contender, which means final 4. So a very late 1st rounder, that's very debatable), but more that he is worth more than a 50-60 pick.
That we're likely to benefit more from him staying on our team, willing to re-sign for cheap (good depth player next to Eller's wing on the 3rd line), than what we'll get from that draft pick. You never know with drafting, you can completely miss in the 2nd round and draft a star in the 6th round.
But the point is with Plek-DD-MaxPac-Cole-Cammy-Eller-AK-Gionta, we had some good winger depth. We under traded Cammy, and did the same with AK.
That's all.

Nobody ever said AK was worth CLB's first round pick, nobody ever said he was a misunderstood superstar, nobody ever said he never had a chance.
What it really just comes down to is that Eller is better with him on his wing, than White. Likewise for Plek. Not real hard to understand.

Now I've discussed this before. I feel Gauthier was going for a rebuild on the fly. He traded away AK because, even if he wanted to stay here and sign for cheap, he would have had a raise from 3.25M. Instead of giving him that new small raised contract, he went after Bourque who's essentially identical, signed long term and only has a 80K increase over AK's cap hit(we'll give him a pass on this season), and then sign a big free agent with Cammy's money (Parise or Semin, if not, plan B would be for depth guys like Parenteau). Pretty sure that's why Gauthier went after Bourque.
In any event, it's a moot point right now.

Kriss E is online now  
Old
05-03-2012, 06:35 AM
  #129
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,814
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post
Some people were upset because they believe he never got his chance to shine and it was the coach's fault. Some people even believed Andrei Kostitsyn was worth a 1st rounder.
I'm pretty sure he deserved better than 4th line abd 10 minutes a night on a team that finished 28th overall.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 06:41 AM
  #130
ECWHSWI
5M? insulting!!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 15,498
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post
Some people were upset because they believe he never got his chance to shine and it was the coach's fault. Some people even believed Andrei Kostitsyn was worth a 1st rounder.
and some here are retarded enough to think we have so much depth on the wings that losing a 20G scorer would make no difference...

ECWHSWI is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:08 AM
  #131
WeThreeKings
DJ Nikita
 
WeThreeKings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Halifax
Country: Canada
Posts: 35,921
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to WeThreeKings
Rangers win in triple OT with McDonagh playing 50+ minutes.

**** you Gainey and Gauthier. **** you Scott Gomez.

WeThreeKings is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:10 AM
  #132
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 33,214
vCash: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Rangers win in triple OT with McDonagh playing 50+ minutes.

**** you Gainey and Gauthier. **** you Scott Gomez.
And Gaborik gets the GWG a signing that was made possible for the Rangers thanks to those 2 retards

Habs 4 Life is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:27 AM
  #133
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,991
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
And Gaborik gets the GWG a signing that was made possible for the Rangers thanks to those 2 retards
Pretty sure they would have signed him even if Gomez stayed there. Probably would have been buried in the minors or something.

I feel NYR are overachievers though.

Kriss E is online now  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:32 AM
  #134
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,814
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
and some here are retarded enough to think we have so much depth on the wings that losing a 20G scorer would make no difference...
I don't think it's unreasonable to expect we can find a 20 goal scorer as a UFA for around 3 mil.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:32 AM
  #135
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,814
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Pretty sure they would have signed him even if Gomez stayed there. Probably would have been buried in the minors or something.

I feel NYR are overachievers though.
Columbus was also in the running so he would have ended up there.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:40 AM
  #136
HCH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The Wild West
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,655
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I don't think it's unreasonable to expect we can find a 20 goal scorer as a UFA for around 3 mil.
A list of potential candidates would be nice.

HCH is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 08:50 AM
  #137
Myron Gaines*
Trop Giou
 
Myron Gaines*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,391
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
In this draft, the Preds 1st rounder will be lucky to produce a winger as good as Kostitsyn. We aren't talking a top 10 pick here.
You're probably right or not. It's a crap shot, no one knows. The fact is that Kostitsyn had 24 points in 53 games and his reputation of being a non consistent player around the league (effort wise) didn't help. Maybe you're right, we could've gotten that 1st rounder from Nashville, but I wouldn't be surprised if Nashville's offer was the best we got.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
Does that mean he's a superstar?

When AK shine, he will score 25 goals not 40.

Is it me or only you guys use the word superstar and Andrei Kostitsyn in the same sentence? Even the guys that support or defend AK doesn't consider him as a superstar... or even a star player.
When did I talk about him being a superstar in my post? I understand that you're all defensive because I don't share the same opinion on Kostitsyn with you, but when you say you guys as in "all the Kostitsyn haters" makes me not wanna argue about him, because I'm not even hating on the guy, I just don't think that just because he scores 20 goals that he's a good player.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
and some here are retarded enough to think we have so much depth on the wings that losing a 20G scorer would make no difference...
You can't have Bourque and AK on your team, AK was tradeable because he is a UFA this year. At least Bourque plays on the PK and a bit more productive on the scoresheet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Nobody ever said he never got a chance. Is it really that hard to read things nowadays?
Apparently people also said he was a misunderstood superstar?!...

People said he wasn't used properly, and they're right. Being used for 10min with Gomez and a scrapper is not the right way to use AK. Maybe you think it was, but it was pretty clear to many that it wasn't/isn't. Give him decent offensive wingers, and he'll produce, as he has done along side Plekanec, Eller, Lang. Really not that hard to notice.
Expect him to consistently produce every night, then you should expect to be disappointed. At this point, we should all know that AK will go through droughts, it's well known and expected, but that doesn't negate his offensive contribution (20g).
This is where I really have a problem. Yes, Kostitsyn produced to a certain extent with those players, but you always forget when he was playing with skilled players in the top 6 and coasting. Kostitsyn had a great shot, was somewhat physical, and his defensive game got better with the years (doesn't mean he was a good defensive player), but when he wasn't filling the net for 6 games in a row, he would disappear and not contribute with anything else. He obviously didn't deserve to be playing in the top 6 during those times and it wasn't because he wasn't scoring, he just wasn't contributing with anything. It's been the same with every coach he's had, he's been in the dog house with every single one of them, at one point he has to be held accountable.

Myron Gaines* is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 09:23 AM
  #138
HCH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The Wild West
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,655
vCash: 500
It looks like AK blew a big opportunity in Nashville but those who say a winger who scores 20 goals can be picked up through free agency are dreaming. I went through the list of left wingers only. They had to have scored at least 18 goals last year, they had to have had a contract that paid $3 million or less and they had to be a UFA (not RFA).

The list included Steve Sullivan and that's it... unless I missed someone. Maybe there are bushel of UFA right wingers who are inexpensive and who have scored around 20 goals but I doubt it.

The solutions are not as easy as they appear

HCH is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 09:45 AM
  #139
Protest the Hero
Registered User
 
Protest the Hero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,383
vCash: 500
Courtesy of Mike Boone, from someone on twitter:

"The game between New York and Washington went so late the only people watching the ending were Andrei Kostitsyn and Alexander Radulov"


Protest the Hero is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 10:18 AM
  #140
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,991
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post
This is where I really have a problem. Yes, Kostitsyn produced to a certain extent with those players, but you always forget when he was playing with skilled players in the top 6 and coasting. Kostitsyn had a great shot, was somewhat physical, and his defensive game got better with the years (doesn't mean he was a good defensive player), but when he wasn't filling the net for 6 games in a row, he would disappear and not contribute with anything else. He obviously didn't deserve to be playing in the top 6 during those times and it wasn't because he wasn't scoring, he just wasn't contributing with anything. It's been the same with every coach he's had, he's been in the dog house with every single one of them, at one point he has to be held accountable.
It's funny that you highlight the part where I specifically mention AK is expected to go through droughts, and then say I seem to forget that he goes through slumps.
Re-read. I posted that it should be expected that AK will go through this problem.

That's fine, he doesn't deserve to be on the top top 6 when he coasts, I can understand that. If it's to give another player that is pushing hard and producing well enough to deserve a promotion, then okay, give him AK's spot. But that's not what happened this year. Nope. We decided to put AK on the 4th line, and give Darche or White promotions over him. Basically we gave players that were not producing better his spot, which is completely moronic.
Also, I'm not even saying AK should have been in the top 6 (I think there's no question he should be there ahead of guys like Darche, but that's not the point anyways), I'm talking about the 3rd line. He never coasted on a line next to Eller. He did his thing, they dominated the opposition, it's only normal for them to have some bad games, happens to every single line (even the DD one), but overall they were a fine duo.

But, as I mentioned, your point is moot. No matter how many bad games AK plays, putting White ahead of him is NEVER a better option. Never.
So, ya, you can argue that when he's bad he deserves to be demoted, sure. But there's no point in demoting someone when the end result is making our team worse. That's just stupid.

I don't care how often he coasts. The object is to win the game. You never know when he might pop one in, so you keep him there unless the plan B can actually turn out to be better. When Plan B is Ryan White, then no, you stick with AK.
Again, we're not even talking about top 6, we're talking about 3rd line.

Kriss E is online now  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:03 AM
  #141
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,814
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HCH View Post
A list of potential candidates would be nice.
Stoll Penner Boyes Jones Brunette Fedotenko Rolston Langkow plus guys like Smyth Semin Whitney Jagr for around 4 mil.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:07 AM
  #142
akratique
Registered User
 
akratique's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Country: Bhutan
Posts: 221
vCash: 500
Darren Dreger this morning on TSN 990 said 2 interesting things:

1. This is surely not the first time these two do something like this.
2. He'd be surprised if these guys are back in the lineup next game.

I'm sure Poile would love his 2nd rounder back.

akratique is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:08 AM
  #143
FlyingKostitsyn
Registered User
 
FlyingKostitsyn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Quebec
Country: Australia
Posts: 8,052
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HCH View Post
It looks like AK blew a big opportunity in Nashville but those who say a winger who scores 20 goals can be picked up through free agency are dreaming. I went through the list of left wingers only. They had to have scored at least 18 goals last year, they had to have had a contract that paid $3 million or less and they had to be a UFA (not RFA).

The list included Steve Sullivan and that's it... unless I missed someone. Maybe there are bushel of UFA right wingers who are inexpensive and who have scored around 20 goals but I doubt it.

The solutions are not as easy as they appear
Well for starters, just without looking, theres PA Parenteau who scored 18 goals but put up 67 points. Much more than AK ever scored. The guy would be a nice complement to Plekanec or Eller.

FlyingKostitsyn is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:10 AM
  #144
DenverHabsFan
Registered User
 
DenverHabsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Highlands Ranch, CO
Country: United States
Posts: 1,381
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Stoll Penner Boyes Jones Brunette Fedotenko Rolston Langkow plus guys like Smyth Semin Whitney Jagr for around 4 mil.
If Semin takes such a huge pay cut, he'll probably stay with the Caps. I would like him with the Habs, though.

DenverHabsFan is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:18 AM
  #145
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 33,214
vCash: 256
Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverHabsFan View Post
If Semin takes such a huge pay cut, he'll probably stay with the Caps. I would like him with the Habs, though.
Same here. A couple of week ago I wasn't sold on Semin, I thought he was one of those lazy guys but after watching him in the Boston series and him not backing away from Chara and company I wouldn't mind bringing him in. He would be a great sniper for Plekanec and we have a good enough group of checkers to get it done, with Pleks he wouldn't have to worry much about the defensive game

Habs 4 Life is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:19 AM
  #146
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverAlone View Post

When did I talk about him being a superstar in my post? I understand that you're all defensive because I don't share the same opinion on Kostitsyn with you, but when you say you guys as in "all the Kostitsyn haters" makes me not wanna argue about him, because I'm not even hating on the guy, I just don't think that just because he scores 20 goals that he's a good player.
Well you was quoting my post about who in the world thought AK was a superstar.

I don't get defensive, I just think its stupid to create things to bash AK or the fans. I've never heard someone thinking AK was a misunderstood superstar. Have you?

AK had a rough year.. but he wasn't useless... until RC took over.

He is a player that scores 1 goal every 4 games (103g in 398 games) and 20% of his goals are game winner. I don't think he just as bad as people are calling him.

Stradale is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 11:27 AM
  #147
Habaneros
Habs Cup champs 2010
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,710
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by akratique View Post
Darren Dreger this morning on TSN 990 said 2 interesting things:

1. This is surely not the first time these two do something like this.
2. He'd be surprised if these guys are back in the lineup next game.

I'm sure Poile would love his 2nd rounder back.
Will give Nashville a 2nd round pick for Radulov...how about it?

Habaneros is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 12:12 PM
  #148
MarkovsKnee
Registered User
 
MarkovsKnee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,046
vCash: 500
After watching the Caps during these playoffs I've changed my mind on Dennis Wideman. He's been steady for them. I didn't like him because he was awful in Boston, but he seems to have settled down.

Like so many others, he played monster minutes last night, 40 minutes - the most ice time of any Capital. I wouldn't mind the Habs signing him. Wideman and Salvador are 2 guys that I like.

Historically, who ever wins the epic OT game usually goes on to win the series because the loss becomes such an emotional let down for the losing team. However, Torts really played the **** out of his top 4 D-men and Richards in this game.

Hunter didn't shorten his bench so much, so he needs to look at that and say: boys, let's just keep pounding the **** out of them the next game. Just continually try to wear them down. Caps have some big wingers who should be able to do that.

And, yes, I'm going for the Caps in this series.

MarkovsKnee is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 03:55 PM
  #149
ECWHSWI
5M? insulting!!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 15,498
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Stoll Penner Boyes Jones Brunette Fedotenko Rolston Langkow plus guys like Smyth Semin Whitney Jagr for around 4 mil.
huh...

Rolston scored SEVEN goals this season (in 70 games)
Fedotenko scored NINE in 73 games
Brunette got TWELVE in 78 games
everyone here think Penner is A.K. equivalent
Boyes scored EIGHT in 65 games
Stoll scored SIX in 78 games
Langkow scored ELEVEN...



that's the list of 20 goals scorer you found ? really ?

come on now...

ECWHSWI is offline  
Old
05-03-2012, 04:10 PM
  #150
habitue*
 
habitue*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,804
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HCH View Post
It looks like AK blew a big opportunity in Nashville but those who say a winger who scores 20 goals can be picked up through free agency are dreaming. I went through the list of left wingers only. They had to have scored at least 18 goals last year, they had to have had a contract that paid $3 million or less and they had to be a UFA (not RFA).

The list included Steve Sullivan and that's it... unless I missed someone. Maybe there are bushel of UFA right wingers who are inexpensive and who have scored around 20 goals but I doubt it.

The solutions are not as easy as they appear
PA Parenteau scored 19 goals and had more than 60 points. You can get him for 3-3,5 a year.

But Habs can get a good winger in that range IF they trade some assets - like their 3rd overall pick or a package or Plekanec

habitue* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:35 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.