HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

The FAN 1200 - Pierre McGuire - 3rd overall vs J. Staal??

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-03-2012, 02:51 PM
  #126
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 32,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wedge View Post
that's probably what McGuire suggested in the interviews which made him lose the job.
Bergevin yesterday said he was open to different options regarding the draft pick. So I doubt that's what made Savard and Molson pick Bergevin

Habs 4 Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 02:54 PM
  #127
Erik Estrada
One Country United!
 
Erik Estrada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Land of the Habs
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,905
vCash: 500
I really hope not.

Erik Estrada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 02:55 PM
  #128
Habs 4 Life
No Excuses
 
Habs 4 Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Italy
Posts: 32,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Even Plekanec straight up for Staal makes little sense unless you can get Staal signed at a reasonable cap number. Even worse he could ask for the moon and then walk as a UFA.

I don't see any reason to touch our top 3 centers unless a deal comes along that's really to our advantage.
Adding a player like Staal is to our advantage. I agree about the FA factor and it's scary but if we are ready to spend now and would be willing to give a UFA a big contract then why wouldn't we do the same and offer Staal what he wants and pay him like our # 1 center?

Habs 4 Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 02:56 PM
  #129
JHabs61
Registered User
 
JHabs61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 960
vCash: 500
This is why we didn't hire McGuire

JHabs61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 02:56 PM
  #130
TheBuriedHab
Registered User
 
TheBuriedHab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 5,173
vCash: 500
Not unless Staal signs longterm before the trade. How bad would it be for us to trade our highest pick in forever for one year of Jordan Staal. No thanks.

TheBuriedHab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:10 PM
  #131
LyricalLyricist
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,767
vCash: 1100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
He costs us one of our best assets while not really giving us what we need. I see it as a very poor fit. Center is actually our strongest position after goalie. If we are to spend a huge asset like the #1 pick I want a high end winger who can score 30(Ryan) or a #2 d-man that brings size and can eat minutes(Myers Seabrook).
That pick would be lucky to get us a Jordan staal. Staal on an extension and I do this.


Last edited by LyricalLyricist: 05-03-2012 at 04:16 PM.
LyricalLyricist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:12 PM
  #132
Lafleurs Guy
Registered User
 
Lafleurs Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Koivu for Staal would've been good three or four years ago. Our 3rd for him though? Doesn't make sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
That pick would be lucky to get us a Jordan staal. Staal on an extension and I'd this.
Extension or not, I don't see the reason to do this. Staal has been used (rightly or wrongly) in a checking role for most of his career. We are in desperate need for an elite offensive centerman. I'd much rather look at the draft for this than Staal.

Lafleurs Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:19 PM
  #133
Markowicz
Simple Jacques
 
Markowicz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,889
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
If you trade out of the top 6, the guys you can draft are the type of guys we have a lot of in our system. Plus with the draft being what it is we may get a player almost as good at #33 than we could at 16-20.

The weakness in the draft is after the top 15 it seems to drop to 2nd round quality and stays there up to 45-50.
Okay, I'll take your word for it.

But that said, the Caps picks are currently #11 and #16.

Markowicz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:25 PM
  #134
131313
Registered User
 
131313's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,040
vCash: 500
I`m not against trading the 3rd overall but not for Jordan Staal. What we need is a more offensive minded gamebreaker type. I like Staal and he is a good player but i think i`d prefer gambling on one of Yakupov/Grigorenko/Galchenyuk especially with Staal contract situation.

I wouldn`t cry if we do get Staal because i do like him but i`m not sure it`s the best course of action for now.

131313 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:36 PM
  #135
MathMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,855
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habster33 View Post
Did anyone else just heard what Pierre McGuire just said on The FAN 1200?

3rd overall vs Jordan Staal
Staal has one year left on his deal, so no thanks.

MathMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:42 PM
  #136
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 28,938
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
That pick would be lucky to get us a Jordan staal. Staal on an extension and I'd this.
...and to sign him to that extension will cost how much and for how long?

If you have to give up your #3 overall pick AND pay Staal a small fortune might as well overpay for Parise/Suter or whoever and keep the pick. That's part of what made the Kessel trade dumb...Toronto traded 3 assets for the guy THEN had to sign him at 5.4 mil /year.

Monctonscout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 03:48 PM
  #137
NewHabsEra*
 
NewHabsEra*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,695
vCash: 500
Even if J Stall was extended, I wouldnt trade our 3rd overall for him.. He has some nice qualities but is at best a good second line center IMO, not exactly what we need.. I would trade our first for his brother Eric though..

NewHabsEra* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:03 PM
  #138
JohnnyReb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 550
vCash: 500
Man, tough crowd.

Staal is exactly what we need, only we won't have to wait the three years it will take Grigorenko/Galchenyuk/Forsberg to get there. I mean geez, the chance to get a 24 year old, 6'3, 220lbs, character center who scored 25 goals last year and who is already defensively polished... and you guys are worried about his contract?? You'll have over a year to sign him! Have you no faith in your city, your organization, your fans, your owner?? Why wouldn't he re-sign here?? If you can't convince a guy to sign with your team with over a year to do so what makes anybody think we can sign somebody like Parise instead??

Everybody wants the new GM to be aggressive... well, being aggressive comes with risk. Paul Homlgren traded a first round pick for two UFAs... not guys who were a year away from being on the market, guys who were weeks away from being on the market. Guys who would never have a chance to play in front of Philly fans, to live in the city, to experience what it was like to be Flyers before making their decision. THAT was aggressive, and Timonen and Hartnell have become key cogs in that organization.

Like I said in my original post, if you are worried about him being injury-prone that's one thing. But if you think he's going to be healthy... With the 3rd overall we would be lucky to get what Staal already brings, and he's still getting better.

JohnnyReb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:08 PM
  #139
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,137
vCash: 500
If we are going to trade for Staal (which I fully endorse), then next years 1st would be where I would want to start.

It is rumoured that he is looking for 6 million per season and I think he is worth it. This is a guy who is only 23 and is nearly a poiny per game player while having to play behind Crosby and Malkin with very little power play time. He is a top penalty killer and is one of the top shutdown centers in the game. You go head to head with the oppositions top line all night/every night and come out on top on most nights.

With his great size he would be a perfect center for Gallagher in the coming years and Gionta would fit in their nicely next season.

Estimated_Prophet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:11 PM
  #140
uocooco
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Country: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 314
vCash: 500
Jordan Stall is a heck of an Hockey Player, I find him being severely underrated over here...

uocooco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:14 PM
  #141
vokiel
#NoTradesWithEDM
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Midgetland
Country: Martinique
Posts: 5,679
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Breadman View Post
There is some talk he may ask for a trade or already has with the threat of him not resigning next year. He doesn't want to be a 3rd line center he wants to be a #1 or 2
Then I know where he's ending up.. Columbus, and you know for who, and you know we can't match.

vokiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:22 PM
  #142
LyricalLyricist
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,767
vCash: 1100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
...and to sign him to that extension will cost how much and for how long?

If you have to give up your #3 overall pick AND pay Staal a small fortune might as well overpay for Parise/Suter or whoever and keep the pick. That's part of what made the Kessel trade dumb...Toronto traded 3 assets for the guy THEN had to sign him at 5.4 mil /year.
Why exactly would parise come here? "I can't wait to play for a bottom dweller that made no attempt to get better"

Even if parise comes, so what, you think it will help us be a contender?

Way I see it is, either this team retools, gets younger and stocks up at the draft and builds around the foundation of young talent or they make an attempt to improve now.

I prefer #1 but seems like #2 is the direction the team will go, or better yet, status quo. I seriously hope bergevin has a vision and isn't afraid to go a step back to go a step forward.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vokiel View Post
Then I know where he's ending up.. Columbus, and you know for who, and you know we can't match.
Nash for about 8 mil? I don't think they can afford it under the cap.

LyricalLyricist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:36 PM
  #143
vokiel
#NoTradesWithEDM
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Midgetland
Country: Martinique
Posts: 5,679
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
...

Nash for about 8 mil? I don't think they can afford it under the cap.
How about Kunitz + Staal for Nash + picks if needed?

Bad proposal?

Edit: well off-topic anyway, there's certainly more work to do than just straight up, you're right.

vokiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:40 PM
  #144
Frozenice
the random dude
 
Frozenice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,853
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyReb View Post
Man, tough crowd.

Staal is exactly what we need, only we won't have to wait the three years it will take Grigorenko/Galchenyuk/Forsberg to get there. I mean geez, the chance to get a 24 year old, 6'3, 220lbs, character center who scored 25 goals last year and who is already defensively polished... and you guys are worried about his contract?? You'll have over a year to sign him! Have you no faith in your city, your organization, your fans, your owner?? Why wouldn't he re-sign here?? If you can't convince a guy to sign with your team with over a year to do so what makes anybody think we can sign somebody like Parise instead??

Everybody wants the new GM to be aggressive... well, being aggressive comes with risk. Paul Homlgren traded a first round pick for two UFAs... not guys who were a year away from being on the market, guys who were weeks away from being on the market. Guys who would never have a chance to play in front of Philly fans, to live in the city, to experience what it was like to be Flyers before making their decision. THAT was aggressive, and Timonen and Hartnell have become key cogs in that organization.

Like I said in my original post, if you are worried about him being injury-prone that's one thing. But if you think he's going to be healthy... With the 3rd overall we would be lucky to get what Staal already brings, and he's still getting better.
No, Staal is one of a couple of pieces we need.

The problem with trading for him is next year we won't be getting a decent draft pick. Then, in all likelihood we'll be trading away our 2nd round picks next year to get a little bit of help to put us over the top, to fill up holes on our team.

I call it treading water and no, I'm not part of the "everybody crowd" that wants our GM to be aggressive.

If we keep our 1st this year and add a couple more by trading Pleks and Markov then I'm okay with trading next years 1st for him.

Frozenice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:40 PM
  #145
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,137
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vokiel View Post
How about Kunitz + Staal for Nash + picks if needed?

Bad proposal?

Edit: well off-topic anyway, there's certainly more work to do than just straight up, you're right.
Staal is better and cheaper than Nash on his own.....

Nash is an overrated floater and Staal is an underrated workhorse.......I'll take the latter thank you.

Estimated_Prophet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:52 PM
  #146
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 28,938
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Why exactly would parise come here? "I can't wait to play for a bottom dweller that made no attempt to get better"

Even if parise comes, so what, you think it will help us be a contender?

Way I see it is, either this team retools, gets younger and stocks up at the draft and builds around the foundation of young talent or they make an attempt to improve now.

I prefer #1 but seems like #2 is the direction the team will go, or better yet, status quo. I seriously hope bergevin has a vision and isn't afraid to go a step back to go a step forward.



Nash for about 8 mil? I don't think they can afford it under the cap.
Parise would come here for a lot of the same reasons Cammalleri Gionta Gill Cole Moen Hamrlik Spacek etc did

I think trading the #3 pick for Staal could turn out just like the Gomez trade. Trade a huge asset for the guy then have to give him big money and expect him to be a star and when he tops out at 60 points and doesn't lead the team far in the playoffs they throw him under the bus and eventually his production drops under the weight of pressue and expectactions.

Monctonscout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 04:52 PM
  #147
FiveForDrawingBlood
Registered User
 
FiveForDrawingBlood's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,477
vCash: 500
This has been talked about a thousand times on here...Staal is set to test the open market Habs be nuts to give up the 3rd pick in draft for him. Houle no longer run the Habs! However, I suspect he is a member of this board.

FiveForDrawingBlood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 05:02 PM
  #148
GrangerX
Registered User
 
GrangerX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 70
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
If we are going to trade for Staal (which I fully endorse), then next years 1st would be where I would want to start.

It is rumoured that he is looking for 6 million per season and I think he is worth it. This is a guy who is only 23 and is nearly a poiny per game player while having to play behind Crosby and Malkin with very little power play time. He is a top penalty killer and is one of the top shutdown centers in the game. You go head to head with the oppositions top line all night/every night and come out on top on most nights.

With his great size he would be a perfect center for Gallagher in the coming years and Gionta would fit in their nicely next season.
add in he was a #2 overall pick, 6'3 220 lbs and a proven playoff performer to the above...and unlike Pleks, usually puts the puck in the net shorthanded when he gets the chance. This guy is exactly what we've been lackingat center for the past 20 years, and at 6ish mil a season is a manageable number for a top line center, which is what he would be with us. Staal/Pacioretty would be a monster duo.

If he could be signed (only way I'd make the deal), Staal straight up for anybody we'd pick at #3 for me is a no brainer. Having said that, it probably won't happen as I can't see the Pens giving him up when push comes to shove, so hopefully our scouting staff will give us the best chance to draft someone who is gonna help us. Forsberg, Murray or a healthy Galchenyuk I think are all good options.

GrangerX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 05:05 PM
  #149
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 28,938
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrangerX View Post
add in he was a #2 overall pick, 6'3 220 lbs and a proven playoff performer to the above...and unlike Pleks, usually puts the puck in the net shorthanded when he gets the chance. This guy is exactly what we've been lackingat center for the past 20 years, and at 6ish mil a season is a manageable number for a top line center, which is what he would be with us. Staal/Pacioretty would be a monster duo.

If he could be signed (only way I'd make the deal), Staal straight up for anybody we'd pick at #3 for me is a no brainer. Having said that, it probably won't happen as I can't see the Pens giving him up when push comes to shove, so hopefully our scouting staff will give us the best chance to draft someone who is gonna help us. Forsberg, Murray or a healthy Galchenyuk I think are all good options.
If the trade is made for need A-it's dumb and B-we have bigger needs than a #2 center.

Monctonscout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-03-2012, 05:10 PM
  #150
Bob Cole
Registered User
 
Bob Cole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,789
vCash: 500
Eric yes

But Jordan Is this a joke?

Bob Cole is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:45 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.