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Trade Pominville while his price is high?

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Old
05-03-2012, 12:08 PM
  #26
WhoIsJimBob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
it worked cap wise
Really?

Your roster is already over $50M against the cap before giving new deals to the FAs (Parise, Ennis, McClement, Kaleta, Suter, and Sulzer).

It would be hard to fit those guys under the cap and leave some space for injuries/trades.

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05-03-2012, 12:21 PM
  #27
Jame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
Really?

Your roster is already over $50M against the cap before giving new deals to the FAs (Parise, Ennis, McClement, Kaleta, Suter, and Sulzer).

It would be hard to fit those guys under the cap and leave some space for injuries/trades.
Parise(6.0)-Staal(4.0)-Ryan(5.1)
Leino(4.5)-CoHo(1.667)-Ruutu(4.75)
Foligno(.900)-Ennis(2.75)-Stafford(4.0)
Gerbe(1.433)-McClement(1.5)-Kaleta(1.2)
x McCormick(1.2), Ellis(.525)

Suter(6.0)-Myers(5.5)
Sulzer(1.0)-Ehrhoff(4.0)
Sekera(2.75)-Regehr(4.02)
x Weber(.950)

Hiller(4.5)
Enroth(.675)

=68.92

oops

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05-03-2012, 12:22 PM
  #28
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Just because a player is playing really well doesn't mean he should be traded. Sometimes, it means you build around that person.

Pommer is a keeper.

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05-03-2012, 12:24 PM
  #29
Rob Paxon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPurp26 View Post
Correction, Vanek is indeed soft
I stand corrected

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Old
05-03-2012, 12:28 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Parise(6.0)-Staal(4.0)-Ryan(5.1)
Leino(4.5)-CoHo(1.667)-Ruutu(4.75)
Foligno(.900)-Ennis(2.75)-Stafford(4.0)
Gerbe(1.433)-McClement(1.5)-Kaleta(1.2)
x McCormick(1.2), Ellis(.525)

Suter(6.0)-Myers(5.5)
Sulzer(1.0)-Ehrhoff(4.0)
Sekera(2.75)-Regehr(4.02)
x Weber(.950)

Hiller(4.5)
Enroth(.675)

=68.92

oops
I can't see Suter and Parise getting less than guys like Doughty and Richards.

I'm expecting them to get $6.5 to 7M per year against the cap.

I also expect McClement to get a bigger raise than that in UFA.

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05-03-2012, 12:42 PM
  #31
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I have a feeling Pominville will retire a sabre. I'd trade Vanek before id trade poms...same goes for stafford and the obvious choices of gerbe and leino kaleta etc. Aside from Foligno there isnt a winger on this team i wouldnt trade before Poms.

Likewise you have to figure goose is gone, hecht is done, kaleta is riding his way outta town sooner or later...Poms is the only reliable PK option we have game in and out. That alone increases his value to me

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05-03-2012, 12:53 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJN21 View Post
I have a feeling Pominville will retire a sabre. I'd trade Vanek before id trade poms...same goes for stafford and the obvious choices of gerbe and leino kaleta etc. Aside from Foligno there isnt a winger on this team i wouldnt trade before Poms.

Likewise you have to figure goose is gone, hecht is done, kaleta is riding his way outta town sooner or later...Poms is the only reliable PK option we have game in and out. That alone increases his value to me
This.

I only see 3 scenarios where we trade JPom:
1) We get a big, mean, 50+ point center in return.
2) We decide the playoffs are out of reach next year and trade him for a big picks/prospects package.
3) Some fool GM drastically overpays for him.

None of those are likely to happen, so I think he stays.

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Old
05-03-2012, 02:23 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
Personally I would take Mr. Datsyuk
Zetterberg might be more realistic.

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Old
05-03-2012, 02:43 PM
  #34
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Going off-topic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJN21 View Post

kaleta is riding his way outta town sooner or later...
Maybe I'm misinformed, but hasn't Regier all but verified that Kaleta will be brought back next season as he's viewed as an integral player on the team?

Knock on Kaleta for being a turtle all you want, but he's turned into a solid hockey player. The front office sees it, too.

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05-03-2012, 03:37 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
I can't see Suter and Parise getting less than guys like Doughty and Richards.

I'm expecting them to get $6.5 to 7M per year against the cap.

I also expect McClement to get a bigger raise than that in UFA.
If Suter/Parise is only looking for a 5-6 year deal... then I agree. But at 27, they are going to have the ability to get 10+ yr deal, and that will bring that cap hit down.


All you have to do is take Brad Richards deal (9 yr / 60 mil / 6.6 per), and tack on 3 years at 4 million a year and you get a 12 yr / 72 mil / 6.0 cap hit)

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05-03-2012, 03:46 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJN21 View Post
I have a feeling Pominville will retire a sabre. I'd trade Vanek before id trade poms...same goes for stafford and the obvious choices of gerbe and leino kaleta etc. Aside from Foligno there isnt a winger on this team i wouldnt trade before Poms.

Likewise you have to figure goose is gone, hecht is done, kaleta is riding his way outta town sooner or later...Poms is the only reliable PK option we have game in and out. That alone increases his value to me
Pomms will retire a Sabre....as I stated above, I wouldn't mind trading him this offseason because I'm with Jame on building a harder team to play against when it matters, the playoffs. We're too soft, we need to be a little more nasty. BUT, I do agree my gut says Pomms will always be a Sabre.

As for the reliable PK part, I'm kind of the mindset that we over rate PK'ing. Of course it's important but Roy has been doing a good job there, as well as Kaleta, and there always seems to be guys stepping up in that department. Shoot, a couple years ago Vanek looked very good on the PK. PK'ing seems to come down to me more on the defense and goaltending, something we are stronger at then the forwards. I do agree, Pomms is a strong PK'er, as well as a two-way forward but if the right deal comes along to upgrade the forward ranks IN THE LONG TERM (read younger) and NASTIER, then if it takes Pomms to get, I'm all for it. Also, upgrade at center.

Pomms impressed me this year but he's not untouchable on a non-playoff team.

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Old
05-03-2012, 04:02 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
I stand corrected


I agree. Vanek is not soft.

He may not throw checks and fight.

But the guy is willing and able to go to the front of the net and

take a beating for a goal.



Vanek isn't close to being soft.

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05-03-2012, 04:13 PM
  #38
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Makes sence from a business standpoint if we really could get a big return

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05-03-2012, 04:15 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
If Suter/Parise is only looking for a 5-6 year deal... then I agree. But at 27, they are going to have the ability to get 10+ yr deal, and that will bring that cap hit down.


All you have to do is take Brad Richards deal (9 yr / 60 mil / 6.6 per), and tack on 3 years at 4 million a year and you get a 12 yr / 72 mil / 6.0 cap hit)
Im all for a positive attitude but I dont think we have a shot at landing either of them

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05-03-2012, 04:16 PM
  #40
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He's certainly not untouchable but I would be shocked to see him get dealt this summer. He's coming off his first season as Captain where he was the only consistent player on the team. The return would have to be heavily in the Sabres favor for them to trade him.

You want people to come here? You don't trade your Captain after one season. Bad mojo.

Bias note: Pominville is my favorite player on the team and has been since his rookie year.

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05-03-2012, 04:39 PM
  #41
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To make an omelet you have to break eggs. The Sabres were stuck in first round purgatory for most of the 80's and early 90's when they traded their star player Turgeon, for another star player in LaFontaine. The trade worked out for both teams as the Isles went further then they went since their Cup days and the Sabres franchise was revitalized leading to a move to the 2nd round.

Pominville and Turgeon are very similar in style and I would not mind him being packaged if it leads to a player who can get this team over the hump.

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05-03-2012, 04:50 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
Im all for a positive attitude but I dont think we have a shot at landing either of them
Neither do i

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Old
05-03-2012, 04:53 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
No.

The objective is to keep your good players and get more of them. Not trade them.

The joke used to be that the Sabres were the development team for the rest of the NHL; make good players, then trade them away because they couldn't afford them. I'd rather not go that route.
This... X10.

Why trade a player just because he's had a career season? Pominville has been fairly consistent in his career and he makes the Sabres a better team. He's a solid point producing 2 way forward and he's only 29 going on 30. He is in about the middle of his prime and should be a very good player for at least a handful of years to come.

Unless we are making a trade that will clearly make this team better both in the short and long term, I'd be against the idea of trading while Pominville's value is high. We shouldn't be shopping our players just because they have a career season if they are a largely positive value to us. I would want to see a great return for Pominville if we entertained a trade proposal.

Cycling through players just because they may be at their peak is not something I am fond of and I don't think it would be looked up favorably by NHL players in general. One of the things players want is a certain amount of stability for themselves and their family. I think that is one of the top considerations when a player evaluates a contract, one of the things you always hear about with FA negotiations is term length. If we want Buffalo to continue along the idea of being Hockey Heaven and a destination for players then we need to consider how we do business with the players we have in our organization.


Last edited by Mellifleur: 05-03-2012 at 06:21 PM.
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05-03-2012, 05:20 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loods View Post
Going off-topic.



Maybe I'm misinformed, but hasn't Regier all but verified that Kaleta will be brought back next season as he's viewed as an integral player on the team?

Knock on Kaleta for being a turtle all you want, but he's turned into a solid hockey player. The front office sees it, too.
to be a solid player you need to be playing...

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05-03-2012, 05:21 PM
  #45
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not too mention if Tropp can up his intensity and hit alittle more i think he's potentially a younger, cheaper Kaleta...and I got nothing against Patty I love him

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05-03-2012, 05:31 PM
  #46
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I'm in favour of keeping Kaleta. We need Patty for some toughness and looks like he has Ruff's trust on the PK.


Last edited by Matty K: 05-03-2012 at 06:41 PM.
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05-03-2012, 05:51 PM
  #47
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What's taters precious whats taters!!!!


That's what I think of that, perposterous!!


Actually, for the right return value....

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05-03-2012, 06:09 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Matty K View Post
I'm in favour of keeping Kaleta. We need Patty for some toughness and looks like has Ruff's trust on the PK.
Meh, we need someone who can play more than 2/3 of the games in a season and can be effective in his role. Patty got burned quite a few times on what appeared to be reputation calls.

Oh, and keep Pominville.

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Old
05-03-2012, 06:26 PM
  #49
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nobody over 23 years old in the organization is untouchable
Nobody on any team is untouchable for the right deal, after all Gretzky got traded.

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05-03-2012, 06:49 PM
  #50
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Those two bolded trades make a lot of sense for both teams. I'm not sure Anaheim would bite on the deal they get offered though. Either way, getting Tuomo Ruttu would be a godsend. The man has talent and physicality and is everything Vanek is not in the effort department. Rutherford said he wanted to make a splash this off-season. Let him bring in Vanek and ride the draft class of 2003 to mediocrity!
You have got to be kidding me. Sure Ruutu is a very physical forward, but look at his career stats versus Vanek's. Nearly the same # of games played. 532 for Ruutu and 547 for Vanek. Ruutu averages about 20 goals per season and Vanek 34. Ruutu averages 46 points a season and Vanek 67 points a season. I get it that you're getting more than point production in the trade, but uhm... last I checked we weren't exactly swimming in goals this season.

I also don't get the idea of throwing Vanek under the bus when it comes to effort. The guy stands in front of the net taking a beating to screen goalies and tip in pucks or put in rebounds. He may not be the best defensively and he may not take the body hard but in my mind it takes courage and effort stand in front of the net like he does. If we're trading Vanek for Ruutu we'd better be getting something else coming our way and have a plan to get a guy who can duplicate what Vanek does for us.

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