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HF Team Board Mock Draft - 2nd Overall

View Poll Results: Who do you want Columbus to select 2nd overall?
Mikhail Grigorenko 4 4.40%
Ryan Murray 45 49.45%
Alex Galchenyuk 27 29.67%
Filip Forsberg 12 13.19%
Matt Dumba 3 3.30%
Voters: 91. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-05-2012, 07:16 AM
  #26
jacks johnson
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Originally Posted by gojackets1 View Post
Just because he might not be a 40 or 50 point defenseman doesnt bother me a bit. Who wouldnt like to have a Ryan Suter type player on their team?
At absolute best case scenario he may become a Ryan Suter type, problem being defenseman are hardest position to project. In my eyes he compares to John Moore , which I find interesting to go back and read his scouting profile ....

The CSB had him ranked #6 overall among North American skaters in their final pre-draft rankings before the June 26 draft. CSB scouting director Jack Barzee issued the following analysis before the draft:

“I watched John Moore as an underage player and I knew he was a must see player for this year; he hasn’t disappointed me one bit. His first two strides are like Paul Coffey and he has been labeled as a world-class skater. He is poised with the puck, he gets his shots through to the net and he has gotten a lot stronger this season. He resembles (Calgary Flames) defenseman Jordan Leopold and similar to Leopold at the same age he needs to get a little bit better at playing more aggressive and more physical, but John is going to be a one-two defenseman in the NHL.”

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05-05-2012, 10:05 AM
  #27
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Gilbert Brule is having a career saving playoff run for another team.
So does this pick matter THAT much?

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05-05-2012, 11:23 AM
  #28
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I went with Galchenyuk. He projects to be a top line Center. Has vision, skating, skill and work ethic. Many believe he could be the top player in this draft. I don't look at 2012/13 when thinking about drafting players because none will have an impact next year on this team. Who projects to be a better fit long term. For me it's Galchenyuk.

I also think guys like Bystrom, Lindholm, Severson, Matteson and a few others could be top 3 guys in the future and could be had late first, early/mid 2nd. We have those picks available and could get a guy like Dansk and Lindholm without using the LA Kings pick this year. Besides, I have Nash going to Ottawa in my dream which adds a mid round 1st.

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05-05-2012, 01:23 PM
  #29
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I went with Murray. The D would be set for the foreseeable future. Have wanted this guy since I started following this draft. The only other option for me is Galy. His ACL injury gives me pause. Grigs has motivation issues. Forsberg just gives me bad vibes. Don't really know if he will continue his development when he comes over.

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05-05-2012, 01:47 PM
  #30
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Yeah, I'm increasingly all about Galchenyuk too. I wouldn't freak out if Murray was picked, tho.

I'm more concerned about what may happen here if Murray isn't picked, since he's apparently now The One True Choice of the messianics around here.

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05-05-2012, 03:16 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I'm more concerned about what may happen here if Murray isn't picked, since he's apparently now The One True Choice of the messianics around here.
I'm mostly concerned with what will happen if/when Forsberg gets picked.

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05-05-2012, 04:37 PM
  #32
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Im starting to think that Forsberg wouldnt be such a bad option, but I think somehow, some way, we'll end up with Yakupov. *crosses fingers*

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05-05-2012, 06:52 PM
  #33
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The more I think about it, the more I'm for Galchenyuk. After watching some of the Sarnia highlights, it looks like he's defensively active and has an absolutely wicked wrist shot. It also seems that a lot of Yakupov's goals were cake goals handed to him by Galchenyuk.

He's also the biggest guy in the top ten. I think, had he been healthy, he probably would've given the number one spot more of a run.

Plus, it gives us some insurance for that franchise center in case Johanson doesn't turn out to be one or maxes out as a second line center. But even better it would be if we had two elite centers on our first two lines.

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05-05-2012, 08:57 PM
  #34
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The more I think about it, the more I'm for Galchenyuk. After watching some of the Sarnia highlights, it looks like he's defensively active and has an absolutely wicked wrist shot. It also seems that a lot of Yakupov's goals were cake goals handed to him by Galchenyuk.

He's also the biggest guy in the top ten. I think, had he been healthy, he probably would've given the number one spot more of a run.

Plus, it gives us some insurance for that franchise center in case Johanson doesn't turn out to be one or maxes out as a second line center. But even better it would be if we had two elite centers on our first two lines.
Galchenyuk is listed at 6'1", 185 ... Filip Forsberg and Mikhail Grigorenko are both taller, and project as larger players in the pros.

If we're taking a forward and with the assumption that Yakupov has gone first, Galchenyuk is my choice, with Forsberg a close second. But, I don't expect him to be a physically imposing player.

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05-05-2012, 10:17 PM
  #35
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Id be cool with Galchenyuk, but went with Murray.

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05-05-2012, 11:33 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Yeah, I'm increasingly all about Galchenyuk too. I wouldn't freak out if Murray was picked, tho.

I'm more concerned about what may happen here if Murray isn't picked, since he's apparently now The One True Choice of the messianics around here.
It's a poll. People are going to give opinions, right?

Most of what I've read here indicates it could go several ways. In other words, I think people do realize that there isn't one answer.

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05-06-2012, 01:15 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Galchenyuk is listed at 6'1", 185 ... Filip Forsberg and Mikhail Grigorenko are both taller, and project as larger players in the pros.

If we're taking a forward and with the assumption that Yakupov has gone first, Galchenyuk is my choice, with Forsberg a close second. But, I don't expect him to be a physically imposing player.
I've seen Galchenyuk listed anywhere from 185-205, Yakupov 165-195, Forsberg 165-180, etc etc. To be fair, I haven't much paid attention to Grigs, since I'm not interested in him at all, and I don't think the franchise is either. And I've also seen Galchenyuk listed at 6'2" as well, which would make him the same height as Forsberg, not that an inch makes that much of a difference anyway.

I don't see how you can take a few players of around the same height and age, and say one of the heaviest of them projects to be the smaller player. Even on the light end of 185, Galchenyuk is still heavier than some of the higher-reported weights of the other players.

Also, I never used the words "physically imposing player" or anything implying it. I only said what I did say, because they are concerns about Forsberg allegedly still has to build strength, and Yakupov is smallerish.

On Sarnia's website, for example, Galchenyuk is listed at 6.02 and 205lbs, Yakupov is listed at 5.11 and 190lbs.

Just shows that there are several numbers out there. Don't see how you can say someone like Forsberg is going to be bigger when he could be twenty-five pounds lighter.

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05-06-2012, 03:23 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Yeah, I'm increasingly all about Galchenyuk too. I wouldn't freak out if Murray was picked, tho.

I'm more concerned about what may happen here if Murray isn't picked, since he's apparently now The One True Choice of the messianics around here.
They'll probably all convert to dirty dirty Nashville fans.

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Old
05-06-2012, 07:37 AM
  #39
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At absolute best case scenario he may become a Ryan Suter type, problem being defenseman are hardest position to project. In my eyes he compares to John Moore , which I find interesting to go back and read his scouting profile ....

The CSB had him ranked #6 overall among North American skaters in their final pre-draft rankings before the June 26 draft. CSB scouting director Jack Barzee issued the following analysis before the draft:

“I watched John Moore as an underage player and I knew he was a must see player for this year; he hasn’t disappointed me one bit. His first two strides are like Paul Coffey and he has been labeled as a world-class skater. He is poised with the puck, he gets his shots through to the net and he has gotten a lot stronger this season. He resembles (Calgary Flames) defenseman Jordan Leopold and similar to Leopold at the same age he needs to get a little bit better at playing more aggressive and more physical, but John is going to be a one-two defenseman in the NHL.”
How can you say that when Murray right now is a better defender than Moore? And he's just as good of a skater, if not better. Moore was never supposed to be a top-10 pick, let alone top-2, he was always ranked in the teens as far as the mocks went. Not to mention everyone knew Moore would need to develop whereas Murray is touted as NHL ready, moreso than a lot of guys in previous years.

Who on our team plays defense well? Sure, Johnson leaves it all on the ice every shift and is a physical presence, but he has about average defending skills. Nikitin I suppose defends fine, but Wiz is a pylon, Tyutin seems to lose his coverage more often than you would like, Methot is average at everything, and Moore and Savard are still learning the ropes. Why do we need him to be scoring 65+ points or whatever it would take for the pundits to lay off his so-called offensive "deficiencies"? You guys realize we've had 1 guy score more than 40 from the backend, right? Murray's potential is in that 40 point range, and we've got Wiz and Johnson at a minimum to produce.

That's not to say Murray would come in and play savior, but he's labeled as that Lidstrom or Suter type defending – outsmarting forwards, great positioning and stickwork; he's the guy you know you can trust to have on the ice.

I really am not opposed to Galchenyuk or Forsberg, in fact I haven't voted yet because I'm still torn between Murray and Galch. I would be happy with either Galch or Forsberg because our forward prospects are crap for the most part. What I am opposed to is ignorance.

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05-06-2012, 08:11 AM
  #40
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Hah, and whats happen if Edmonton wont trade their pick but get Murray as the number 1?

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05-06-2012, 12:01 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperGenius View Post
It's a poll. People are going to give opinions, right?

Most of what I've read here indicates it could go several ways. In other words, I think people do realize that there isn't one answer.
You have far, far more faith in the sanity of this fanbase than I have remaining.

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05-06-2012, 01:09 PM
  #42
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How can you say that when Murray right now is a better defender than Moore? And he's just as good of a skater, if not better. Moore was never supposed to be a top-10 pick, let alone top-2, he was always ranked in the teens as far as the mocks went. Not to mention everyone knew Moore would need to develop whereas Murray is touted as NHL ready, moreso than a lot of guys in previous years.

Who on our team plays defense well? Sure, Johnson leaves it all on the ice every shift and is a physical presence, but he has about average defending skills. Nikitin I suppose defends fine, but Wiz is a pylon, Tyutin seems to lose his coverage more often than you would like, Methot is average at everything, and Moore and Savard are still learning the ropes. Why do we need him to be scoring 65+ points or whatever it would take for the pundits to lay off his so-called offensive "deficiencies"? You guys realize we've had 1 guy score more than 40 from the backend, right? Murray's potential is in that 40 point range, and we've got Wiz and Johnson at a minimum to produce.

That's not to say Murray would come in and play savior, but he's labeled as that Lidstrom or Suter type defending – outsmarting forwards, great positioning and stickwork; he's the guy you know you can trust to have on the ice.

I really am not opposed to Galchenyuk or Forsberg, in fact I haven't voted yet because I'm still torn between Murray and Galch. I would be happy with either Galch or Forsberg because our forward prospects are crap for the most part. What I am opposed to is ignorance.
No ignorance , people are still allowed to have opinions, to say Murray is already better defensively than John Moore is a reach. Defenseman take the longest to develop, when you analyze our defensive core, seems like your making the assumption that jack Johnson, John Moore and nikitin , have all reached their potential , as well as methot. They are all still really young defenseman , and most likely still could get alot better. The reason scouts are concerned with Murray, and rating others like riley, and troumba even, or ahead, is Murray is not a shut down defenseman, so when the others have a better offensive game, this is causing him to fall in the eyes of some scouts . He is a rounded defenseman, but as I noted above, both jack Johnson and John Moore where projected by scouts to be a #1 defenseman. When you look at our forwards and centers, what depth do we have ? Boone Jenner looks to be a nice player, maybe Calvert , or kubilak ? Seems we have much greater need at forward position to me .

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05-06-2012, 02:42 PM
  #43
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No ignorance , people are still allowed to have opinions, to say Murray is already better defensively than John Moore is a reach. Defenseman take the longest to develop, when you analyze our defensive core, seems like your making the assumption that jack Johnson, John Moore and nikitin , have all reached their potential , as well as methot. They are all still really young defenseman , and most likely still could get alot better. The reason scouts are concerned with Murray, and rating others like riley, and troumba even, or ahead, is Murray is not a shut down defenseman, so when the others have a better offensive game, this is causing him to fall in the eyes of some scouts . He is a rounded defenseman, but as I noted above, both jack Johnson and John Moore where projected by scouts to be a #1 defenseman. When you look at our forwards and centers, what depth do we have ? Boone Jenner looks to be a nice player, maybe Calvert , or kubilak ? Seems we have much greater need at forward position to me .
I simply believe that a player of Murray's ilk is the type of defenseman we need on our back end. Suter, OEL, McDonagh, Hamhuis... they're all comparable to Murray, and that's the kind of guy I want. That smart defender who eats minutes. I do believe Johnson, Nikitin, Moore, and Savard have more potential, absolutely. To think otherwise would be moronic. But Tyutin is what he is, so is Wiz, and as well Methot. But none of these players have that same skillset that Murray has. None could be compared to Suter or OEL IMO.

With that said, I stress again that I share your sentiment in that our forward core looks bleak, and would be all over a selection of Galchenyuk.

One more thing, Trouba is the other guy I would be after if I'm looking at defensemen. Project pick without question, but he plays a lot like Braydon Coburn, who has been a mancrush of mine for a while. Big, great skater, and physicality. Rielly would be my pick before him, as he is so smooth and has incredible hockey IQ, but we need at least one guy who can be an elite defender.

A guy who can be paired next to JJ so that we can say that we have a balanced and potent (not to mention legitimate) top pairing.

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05-06-2012, 06:31 PM
  #44
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One more thing, Trouba is the other guy I would be after if I'm looking at defensemen. Project pick without question, but he plays a lot like Braydon Coburn, who has been a mancrush of mine for a while. Big, great skater, and physicality.
Trouba's going to be a monster IMHO. Highest ceiling and if he develops his offensive game could be the next Shea Weber (without the 100+mph shot)

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05-06-2012, 11:24 PM
  #45
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No ignorance , people are still allowed to have opinions, to say Murray is already better defensively than John Moore is a reach.
I don't see John Moore at the WHCs ... not even for team USA. Ryan Murray's defensive prowess already has him suiting up for team Canada ... not to mention what he did with Everett this year. I know for a fact that he was ranging from 25-31 minutes per game towards the end of the season, and regularly dominating games with his presence alone.

No offense, but you're way off base with this remark. Ryan Murray is one of the top defense prospects - as far as playing DEFENSE goes - to come along in a long time. John Moore is, and always was, an offensive minded defenseman whose defensive instincts are shaky at best. He's a high risk player - Murray is as safe and steady as they come. And yes, he is as good (or better) a skater as John Moore.

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05-07-2012, 07:21 AM
  #46
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I don't see John Moore at the WHCs ... not even for team USA. Ryan Murray's defensive prowess already has him suiting up for team Canada ... not to mention what he did with Everett this year. I know for a fact that he was ranging from 25-31 minutes per game towards the end of the season, and regularly dominating games with his presence alone.

No offense, but you're way off base with this remark. Ryan Murray is one of the top defense prospects - as far as playing DEFENSE goes - to come along in a long time. John Moore is, and always was, an offensive minded defenseman whose defensive instincts are shaky at best. He's a high risk player - Murray is as safe and steady as they come. And yes, he is as good (or better) a skater as John Moore.
Murray is part of team canada so Lowe can get a good look at him (in my opinion). Do you honestly think that Methot, Schenn, and murray are 3 of Canada's best defenseman they have to offer, of all the players out there. Also, I read that Murray is in the lineup because of an injury, as it initially he was supposed to be an extra defenseman. By that logic, should I assume that Schenn, and Methot are better defenseman than Murray at this time. Dont get me wrong, he looks to be a great young talent, he just hasnt separated himself enough from the other defenseman to be drafted in the #2 spot, if we go D, we could easily trade down and pick up another asset, and maybe still grab him, or a riley, troumba. I still think if you were to look at the needs of out team, we need a forward much more than a defenseman. Its not like we could go out in the free agent market, and pick up an elite forward, and convince them to sign here. Unfortunately with our losing history, we need to draft our way out of this mess. A great defensive core could honestly win us alot more games in the short term, due to the nature of the nhl, and low scoring games, but where does that put us next year ? So many times in the past we drafted, 6,7,8 and missed out on elite players. Most likely still out of the playoffs, but drafting out of the top 10. Keep in mind next year, there is supposed to be alot of elite talent, Seth Jones, Mckinnon, etc . Next year is the year we want a #1 or #2 pick. I guess what i'm saying is that Murray may make us better next year, but its almost like a band-aid keeping your wound from fully healing. If that makes sense.


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Old
05-07-2012, 09:04 AM
  #47
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Murray is part of team canada so Lowe can get a good look at him (in my opinion). Do you honestly think that Methot, Schenn, and murray are 3 of Canada's best defenseman they have to offer, of all the players out there. Also, I read that Murray is in the lineup because of an injury, as it initially he was supposed to be an extra defenseman. By that logic, should I assume that Schenn, and Methot are better defenseman than Murray at this time.
That's not how the WC's usually work, bub.

Go do some research on how many 18-year-olds are even invited to their respective camps for a tournament filled with NHLers and vets of up to 20 years. This really has nothing to do with the discussion, I just find it kind of crazy that you're playing Devil's advocate on this specific topic regarding the WC's.

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05-07-2012, 09:19 AM
  #48
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That's not how the WC's usually work, bub.

Go do some research on how many 18-year-olds are even invited to their respective camps for a tournament filled with NHLers and vets of up to 20 years. This really has nothing to do with the discussion, I just find it kind of crazy that you're playing Devil's advocate on this specific topic regarding the WC's.
I think Jonathan Toews was an invite a few years back, but he was 19 at the time and had a full year at UND under his belt.

The last 18-year-old I can think of who was seriously considered to be on any type of international team (from a major hockey nation) was Eric Lindros with the 1991 Canada Cup. I don't know with 100% certainty that he was the last one, but he's the last I can remember off the top of my head.

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05-07-2012, 09:54 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Yeah, I'm increasingly all about Galchenyuk too. I wouldn't freak out if Murray was picked, tho.

I'm more concerned about what may happen here if Murray isn't picked, since he's apparently now The One True Choice of the messianics around here.

Viqsi you don't know NUTHIN about hockey and prospects.

Murray wins the swimsuit competition hands-down.

Galchenyuk:


Murray:


Every year we hold this beauty contest.
And every year I say the same thing.

btw...anybody considering the possibility that Howson trades the pick for a veteran point scorer to replace NASH and save his job?

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05-07-2012, 10:06 AM
  #50
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I think Jonathan Toews was an invite a few years back, but he was 19 at the time and had a full year at UND under his belt.

The last 18-year-old I can think of who was seriously considered to be on any type of international team (from a major hockey nation) was Eric Lindros with the 1991 Canada Cup. I don't know with 100% certainty that he was the last one, but he's the last I can remember off the top of my head.
Think they said during Us - Canada game, Paul Kariya. I'm not discounting accomplishment, but also think that Edmonton used this as opportunity to get a hands on with Murray. @ ludicrous speed- Did you read the story above, mentioning actual Nhl team scouts saying that Murray's stock was falling in some of the scouts eyes ?

I'm not bashing Murray, just trying to understand the logic of us drafting a defenseman, with our anemic depth at forward. Yeah we can shore up our defensive core, get a good goalie this offseason, then find ourselves drafting out of the top 10, next season, trying to find elite forwards to score some goals. Maybe some when considering this draft pick, are still thinking with the mindset we have Rick Nash ?


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