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Isles trying to get 1st Overall from Edmonton?

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Old
05-06-2012, 06:29 PM
  #76
Seachd
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Originally Posted by Kevin27NYI View Post
If you don't understand the difference between Tavares and Yakupov then there is a problem.
The difference between Tavares and Yakupov isn't really relevant to his post though. The difference between the 1st and 4th picks this year is.

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05-06-2012, 06:30 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
From what you've read? And 'dreaming' wasn't quite the word I was using. My point is more that Murray has Hamonic-upside. A good top-2 two-way defenseman that is calm and steady in the d-zone and capable of 30-35 points offensively. Ryan Suter-lite.
Hammer is more Weber and Murray more Suter imo....

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05-06-2012, 06:31 PM
  #78
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Edmonton is majorly gambling if they trade down past #2, unless something is going to Columbus to entice them not to pick Edmonton's guy. Montreal is pretty much a lock to take one of the centers, but Columbus can go either Murray or center, so without involving Columbus, Edmonton would be gambling big time by trading to fourth if it is Murray or Gal(something) that they want.

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05-06-2012, 06:33 PM
  #79
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This starts and ends with DiPietro

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05-06-2012, 06:36 PM
  #80
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Knowing the Isles they will Trade for the 1st overall and Draft Murray....Its what we do, we cant get anything rite.

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05-06-2012, 06:38 PM
  #81
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I would think that if edmonton offered some NHL ready dmen and isles offered up a replacement talented winger a deal could be figured out.

1st+Teubert+nhl ready dman for 1st+Nino/Okposo

Edmonton gets a top dman prospected with the pick, and more of an nhl ready player with size. Isles get 2 nhl ready dmen and the more elite winger.

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05-06-2012, 06:40 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin27NYI View Post
No way in hell does EDM take that.


If you don't understand the difference between Tavares and Yakupov then there is a problem.
That's not even the point. You don't know that Yakupov can't become as good as Tavares. Obviously, you're going to have some bias now that Tavares is already in the NHL and you can gauge his potential more accurately but the question still remains: Would you or would you not do Tavares for the 4th pick (Kane) + average D prospect.

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05-06-2012, 06:43 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd View Post
The difference between Tavares and Yakupov isn't really relevant to his post though. The difference between the 1st and 4th picks this year is.
How is that not relevant? Also, the franchise positions of the Isles in 2009 and the Oilers now are completely different. The Isles had nothing, NOTHING before Tavares. The Oilers already have Hall, RNH, Eberle. They don't "need" Yakupov, and that's why they can trade the pick for help elsewhere. The Islanders absolutely needed Tavares and that's why they would never have traded down.

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Old
05-06-2012, 06:45 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
Snow's not doing his job, if he's not talking to every team in the top 10.

According to different media sources,he's kicked the tires on moving his lottery pick in the past 3 drafts.

About a week ago,I read a Tambellini interview,where he talked about getting a good (established ) player + good pick for his first overall.I posted the trades scenerios I thought realistic ,involving the Oilers and the teams drafting 2nd-5th overall:

Oilers ask for Johanson+ 2nd overall.
Oilers ask for Subban + 3rd overall.Habs pass,offer Gorges + 3rd overall.
Oilers ask for Harmonic + 4th over.NYI pass,offer De Haan + 4th overall.
Oilers ask for Gardiner +5th overall.Burkes pushes Schenn + 5th overal.
Apologies to Edmonton fans, but I don't see Nail Yakupov being that stellar of a first overall that it would cost these teams that much to move up to get him at number one.

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05-06-2012, 06:47 PM
  #85
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The Oilers aren't trading Yakupov unless a team steps up and offers a crazy deal, trading top picks will always come back to haunt you, you just don't do it, that simple, look at the Kessel deal now.

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05-06-2012, 06:48 PM
  #86
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It's Hamonic + 4th or bust IMO (That's the type of deal that the Oilers would do) and since the Isles would never do that, there's nothing more to see here.
There is a reason that 1st overalls are hardly ever traded, the team holding the pick sets the price too high and the team looking to get the pick doesn't want to give up enough so lets say in this situation that Hamonic + 4th is too rich for Snow to give up and DeHaan + 4th is not enough to get Tambellini to bite.

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05-06-2012, 06:50 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin2799 View Post
I would think that if edmonton offered some NHL ready dmen and isles offered up a replacement talented winger a deal could be figured out.

1st+Teubert+nhl ready dman for 1st+Nino/Okposo

Edmonton gets a top dman prospected with the pick, and more of an nhl ready player with size. Isles get 2 nhl ready dmen and the more elite winger.
There's no dman going to Edmonton in that deal.

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05-06-2012, 06:52 PM
  #88
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Strome + Murray (no.4)
Yakupov + Gagner

I think the Islanders would bite. They need an electric superstar to play with Tavares and sell more tickets, and Gagner is also best friends with Tavares.

Oilers fill needs.

However, as an Oiler fan, I would feel uneasy with this trade simply because I think Yakupov is going to be the best player in the trade, and when you trade away the best player ... I dunno. I think you are asking for trouble.

Two d-men is overkill for the Oilers. They have Marincin, Gernat (who had better numbers in junior this year than Murray did), Klefbom still coming and Petry + Smid already graduated up. People who say the Oilers having nothing coming on the blue line don't know what they're talking about.

If I'm the Oilers I don't trade the pick.

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Old
05-06-2012, 06:56 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Strome + Murray (no.4)
Yakupov + Gagner

I think the Islanders would bite. They need an electric superstar to play with Tavares and sell more tickets, and Gagner is also best friends with Tavares.

Oilers fill needs.

However, as an Oiler fan, I would feel uneasy with this trade simply because I think Yakupov is going to be the best player in the trade, and when you trade away the best player ... I dunno. I think you are asking for trouble.

Two d-men is overkill for the Oilers. They have Marincin, Gernat (who had better numbers in junior this year than Murray did), Klefbom still coming and Petry + Smid already graduated up. People who say the Oilers having nothing coming on the blue line don't know what they're talking about.

If I'm the Oilers I don't trade the pick.
How many of those are going to be legit top pairing defensemen? One, maybe. You can pile up on second or third pairing defensmen but you will always need a top defenseman.

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05-06-2012, 06:56 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslesRock4 View Post
How is that not relevant?
How is it relevant? If the Oilers do trade the pick, are they going to base the value of it on the difference between Tavares and Kane? It's the same idea.

He wasn't saying Yakupov will be as good as Tavares or had the same kind of value. But what his value was before the 2009 draft has no bearing on this situation today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IslesRock4 View Post
How is that not relevant?
Also, the franchise positions of the Isles in 2009 and the Oilers now are completely different. The Isles had nothing, NOTHING before Tavares. The Oilers already have Hall, RNH, Eberle. They don't "need" Yakupov, and that's why they can trade the pick for help elsewhere. The Islanders absolutely needed Tavares and that's why they would never have traded down.[/QUOTE]

I guess, although I don't think anyone has really argued against this. What the vast majority of Oiler fans believe, with good reason, is that trading the pick for "help elsewhere" could be monumentally stupid.

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05-06-2012, 06:57 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Strome + Murray (no.4)
Yakupov + Gagner

I think the Islanders would bite. They need an electric superstar to play with Tavares and sell more tickets, and Gagner is also best friends with Tavares.

Oilers fill needs.

However, as an Oiler fan, I would feel uneasy with this trade simply because I think Yakupov is going to be the best player in the trade, and when you trade away the best player ... I dunno. I think you are asking for trouble.

Two d-men is overkill for the Oilers. They have Marincin, Gernat (who had better numbers in junior this year than Murray did), Klefbom still coming and Petry + Smid already graduated up. People who say the Oilers having nothing coming on the blue line don't know what they're talking about.

If I'm the Oilers I don't trade the pick.
What needs does that fill for the Oilers? The Oilers replace Gagner with Strome, is Strome even an upgrade on Gagner and even with that being said, Strome is not the big 2 way center that the Oilers need to complement RNH and does he even play center in junior?
So essentially it's Yakupov for Murray (who likely won't even be there at 4) and Gagner for Strome. Color me unimpressed, Step up your game Soundwave, i expect better from you.

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05-06-2012, 06:58 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd View Post
There's no dman going to Edmonton in that deal.
they would draft a dman with the #4 overall, and get a nhl ready top6 winger in either nino or okposo. They get the better nhl upside dman and add to their forward corp. Both those forwards have size and grit and provide a different element then hall/eberle/rnh.

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05-06-2012, 06:58 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
What needs does that fill for the Oilers? The Oilers replace Gagner with Strome, is Strome even an upgrade on Gagner and even with that being said, Strome is not the big 2 way center that the Oilers need to complement RNH and does he even play center in junior?
So essentially it's Yakupov for Murray (who likely won't even be there at 4) and Gagner for Strome. Color me unimpressed, Step up your game Soundwave, i expect better from you.
I'm not saying that I would do that deal, in fact I said I wouldn't.

I'm just saying I could see that being proposed.

de Haan + 4th is a complete non-starter.

Honestly I hope Tambellini simply does nothing. Just take freaking Yakupov. Let him play with our kids for a year and see what happens. It's not like his value still won't be sky high next summer.

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05-06-2012, 07:01 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd View Post
The difference between Tavares and Yakupov isn't really relevant to his post though. The difference between the 1st and 4th picks this year is.
How isn't it relevant? The factors are very different in the trade he proposes.

He is saying would you have done the 1st for the 4th and a D prospect in 09. The first in 09 was Tavares and this year it's very likely Yakupov. Tavares had a lot of value and hype going into the draft in 09 that Yakupov isn't/can't match so in 09 that trade obviously wouldn't have cut it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boco View Post
That's not even the point. You don't know that Yakupov can't become as good as Tavares. Obviously, you're going to have some bias now that Tavares is already in the NHL and you can gauge his potential more accurately but the question still remains: Would you or would you not do Tavares for the 4th pick (Kane) + average D prospect.
Read what said in response to Seachd's post and IslesRock's post as well which also helps show how different the two trade proposals are.

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05-06-2012, 07:01 PM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
I'm not saying that I would do that deal, in fact I said I wouldn't.

I'm just saying I could see that being proposed.

de Haan + 4th is a complete non-starter.
That would get proposed and Tambellini would shoot it down.
I agree that De Haan + 4th is a non-starter.

As i said above, Hamonic + 4th should be the only deal that Tambellini would consider from the Islanders and since Snow won't do that, it'll be on to the next team.
The only way that i see a trade down is to Columbus at 2 because it's pretty clear that Murray is their guy if it's not Yakupov and it's too risky to trade down lower than 2 since Murray will likely go top 2.

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05-06-2012, 07:02 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Strome + Murray (no.4)
Yakupov + Gagner

I think the Islanders would bite. They need an electric superstar to play with Tavares and sell more tickets, and Gagner is also best friends with Tavares.

Oilers fill needs.

However, as an Oiler fan, I would feel uneasy with this trade simply because I think Yakupov is going to be the best player in the trade, and when you trade away the best player ... I dunno. I think you are asking for trouble.

Two d-men is overkill for the Oilers. They have Marincin, Gernat (who had better numbers in junior this year than Murray did), Klefbom still coming and Petry + Smid already graduated up. People who say the Oilers having nothing coming on the blue line don't know what they're talking about.

If I'm the Oilers I don't trade the pick.
The only thing the Islanders NEED is to start winning games. That's the only way to reclaim what's left of a beaten down, disgruntled and disillusioned fanbase. And trading Strome and Murray for a winger doesn't help them at all.

The Isles have 3 defensemen under contract for next year (Streit, MacDonald and Hamonic). If Murrya falls to them, I'd hope they'd do a jig and run up and take him.

And Strome can be the dynamic winger that JT needs. Because looks what's he's done for PAP and Moulson.

So as an Islander fan, I say, "No," and let the Oilers stay and take Yakupov. Good luck.

EDIT: And if the Isles really want Murray, I'd suspect that Columbus would make a better partner than the Oilers.

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Old
05-06-2012, 07:04 PM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
It's Hamonic + 4th or bust IMO (That's the type of deal that the Oilers would do) and since the Isles would never do that, there's nothing more to see here.
.
It's bust imo because that's what I expect the Oilers to demand and for Snow to pass on.

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Old
05-06-2012, 07:08 PM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strickland View Post
The only thing the Islanders NEED is to start winning games. That's the only way to reclaim what's left of a beaten down, disgruntled and disillusioned fanbase. And trading Strome and Murray for a winger doesn't help them at all.

The Isles have 3 defensemen under contract for next year (Streit, MacDonald and Hamonic). If Murrya falls to them, I'd hope they'd do a jig and run up and take him.

And Strome can be the dynamic winger that JT needs. Because looks what's he's done for PAP and Moulson.

So as an Islander fan, I say, "No," and let the Oilers stay and take Yakupov. Good luck.

EDIT: And if the Isles really want Murray, I'd suspect that Columbus would make a better partner than the Oilers.
Believe me, that's fine by me too.

Honestly I have major, major misgivings about just gifting the Islanders what could potentially be the most dangerous 1-2 in the NHL in a year or two with Tavares and Yakupov.

I think the Oilers would never live that down if they did it. I hope our management just plays it safe and takes the obvious player at no.1.

Making these types of trades always feels like trying to get overly fancy on a 3-on-1 and ending up blowing it.

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Old
05-06-2012, 07:09 PM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Strome + Murray (no.4)
Yakupov + Gagner

I think the Islanders would bite. They need an electric superstar to play with Tavares and sell more tickets, and Gagner is also best friends with Tavares.

Oilers fill needs.

However, as an Oiler fan, I would feel uneasy with this trade simply because I think Yakupov is going to be the best player in the trade, and when you trade away the best player ... I dunno. I think you are asking for trouble.

Two d-men is overkill for the Oilers. They have Marincin, Gernat (who had better numbers in junior this year than Murray did), Klefbom still coming and Petry + Smid already graduated up. People who say the Oilers having nothing coming on the blue line don't know what they're talking about.

If I'm the Oilers I don't trade the pick.
No the Isles would not bite.Oiler fans are happy with Gagner's development and that's great.

Isles,however,have no interest in making Gagner our 2nd line center(or Tavares linemate).Tavares said yesterday in a short interview,that Strome's gonna be his exclusive offseason workout partner.

Tavares most productive month was Jan,when KO was his winger.I'd like to see that Moulson-Tavares-KO line reunited.

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05-06-2012, 07:09 PM
  #100
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The OP said something about a 3rd team, maybe the deal is something like

To Oil: 4th OV, Gormley

To NYI: 1st OV

To Phx: Nino

????? - No idea, but the point is maybe the 3rd team provides the Dman in exchange for Nino. Would Islander fans be willing to do 4th OV + Nino for Yakupov?

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