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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Where does Swiss rank in international tournaments?

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Old
05-08-2012, 11:37 PM
  #1
MB94
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Where does Swiss rank in international tournaments?

Me and a friend are having a argument on where Swiss ranks in international tournaments out of the teams that participate, where would you rank them and would you say they are starting to become a dangerous opponent?

Is it fair to say they are ranked 6th underneath Canada, USA, Russia, Finland, Sweden?

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05-08-2012, 11:42 PM
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Anomander Rake
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The Czechs and Slovaks are still ahead of them imo.

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05-08-2012, 11:56 PM
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Mr Kanadensisk
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it seems like hockey in Slovakia is slipping and they are moving down into the Swiss territory, but still slightly ahead of them in my opinion. There is still a considerable gap between the top 6 (CAN, USA, SWE, CZE, FIN, RUS) and the Swiss.

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05-09-2012, 12:08 AM
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Prairie Habs
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Canada
Sweden/Russia/USA
Finland/Czech Republic
Slovakia/Switzerland

This is how I usually think of it.

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05-09-2012, 12:13 AM
  #5
v-man
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I'd say a firm eight, although with Slovakia faltering the last little while at all levels, the argument could be made that they're seventh. Perhaps they need to make a medal round to cement that though.

And since everyone's making lists

Canada/Russia
Sweden
Finland/USA
Czech
Slovakia/Swiss
Latvia...........Norway/Germany
Belarus
the rest


Last edited by v-man: 05-09-2012 at 12:22 AM.
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05-09-2012, 12:18 AM
  #6
jesui
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Its like this:

canada/russia
sweden/usa/finland/cze
slovak/swiss
the rest

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05-09-2012, 01:35 AM
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edd1e
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Swiss remind me of team Finland in the late 80's. They are narrowing the gap and closing fast on Slovakia. At this tourny Swiss was tougher opponent to Finland.

I am looking forward for the Swiss Slovakia game.

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05-09-2012, 01:45 AM
  #8
roto
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Canada/Russia/Sweden
USA
Finland/Czech rep
Slovakia/Switzerland

I look forward to CAN-SUI game today. Hopefully Swiss are able to load their batteries for todays game. If they can skate/play like yesterday, I think Canada will have problems today.

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05-09-2012, 02:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v-man View Post
I'd say a firm eight, although with Slovakia faltering the last little while at all levels, the argument could be made that they're seventh. Perhaps they need to make a medal round to cement that though.

And since everyone's making lists

Canada/Russia
Sweden
Finland/USA
Czech
Slovakia/Swiss
Latvia...........Norway/Germany
Belarus
the rest
I approve this list, Sweden is kind of a half-step (1b) below Canada and Russia, but a full step above FIN/US

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05-09-2012, 02:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LiveeviL View Post
I approve this list, Sweden is kind of a half-step (1b) below Canada and Russia, but a full step above FIN/US
Sure. You swedes are not a half step behind anyone.
Rather like 10 steps ahead any other team.
Your NHL players join your team, whenever the championships are held in your home country. Call it commitment.

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05-09-2012, 02:51 AM
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zorz
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Any ideas why did the number of drafted players from Switzerland go down over the past 10 years if they are improving and "closing the gap"?

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05-09-2012, 02:52 AM
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begbeee
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While I agree the gap between Slovakia and Swiss is smaller than would think, I disagree with statement we are in the same group. We are still slightly ahead. While results seems they are outplaying us time to time, the high-end results tell otherwise.
We are still capable the deep playoff run. Can you imagine Swiss make it to the 4th place in OG? Can you imagine them win the WC? Yes, you can, but they didnt do it, we did.
TOP 6 - Slovakia is a group on its own - Swiss group on its own - ...

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05-09-2012, 03:03 AM
  #13
Garl
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Quote:
I approve this list, Sweden is kind of a half-step (1b) below Canada and Russia, but a full step above FIN/US
Sweden isn't below Russia. The only advantage Russia has on WC is the fact that russian players are more willing to come to WC.

At WC 2012 I would rank:

1.Sweden
2.Canada
3.Finland/Russia/USA/Czech.Rep
7.Slovakia/Switzerland

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05-09-2012, 03:04 AM
  #14
goodoldhockeygame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by begbeee View Post
While I agree the gap between Slovakia and Swiss is smaller than would think, I disagree with statement we are in the same group. We are still slightly ahead. While results seems they are outplaying us time to time, the high-end results tell otherwise.
We are still capable the deep playoff run. Can you imagine Swiss make it to the 4th place in OG? Can you imagine them win the WC? Yes, you can, but they didnt do it, we did.
TOP 6 - Slovakia is a group on its own - Swiss group on its own - ...
Good Statement!

My List:

Canada/Sweden/Russia

USA/Finland
Czech
Slovakia
Switzerland
Germany, latvia.......

anyway i think all the teams from can to czech are legit contender for big international tournaments. Slovaks too , even though it would be a lil surprise, but they still have some top talent (what lacks a lil bit in switzerland). Switzerland is a good hardworking team, they play physicle and have some talent and they are able to get some good results but they arent yet that ready to win it all......

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05-09-2012, 03:05 AM
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slovakiasnextone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorz View Post
Any ideas why did the number of drafted players from Switzerland go down over the past 10 years if they are improving and "closing the gap"?
I guess the numbers going down have to do with two things: a, the low succes rate of the Swiss prospects actually turning into NHLers, maybe also because of it was good enough for them to play in the NLA and b, a system of player development that is not aimed at developing top end talent...

However when it comes to international stage and especially the WC, it might actually favor them. They don´t have to rely on the NHLers coming or not, they have had a strong European based team for a few years now and have managed their succes through team efforts. Although under Simpson they have been playing more of an individual skill based hockey.

Still I agree with the notion that people often overrate the Swiss internationally (even though you don´t mention it explicitally).

I don´t know whether anyone has noticed, but this Swiss team is actually not very young age wise, they´re actually one of the older teams in the tourney. And while there are some young players on the team, the best of them like Nino, Sbisa or Josi probably won´t be available every year. The European leaders of this team are not all that young and neither is Streit for example.

They of course might have enough young players in Europe who could eventually replace them, but these players won´t have all the experience from WC, Olympics and other tournaments. I think this Swiss team has currently reached its peak and eventually they will have to face the necessity of rebuilding and it might influence their results, especially with new challengers for QF spots emerging.

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05-09-2012, 03:22 AM
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I think Switzerland is still way way way behind Canada, Sweden, Russia, Finland and the Czech Republic, and a fair distance behind the US, but ahead of Slovakia who hasn't done anything lately apart from upsetting Sweden in Vancouver.

However, I could change my mind against Slovakia after this tournament. I really like what I've seen from them so far and wouldn't be surprised if they reached the top 8. And their fans deserve it after the great tournament they host last year.

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05-09-2012, 03:27 AM
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QnebO
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This year swiss has a great team, but we must not forget so does slovakia. And its new young team mainly, so Slovakia "still has it" too. They are both teams that can beat any team in hockey, thats what makes it "top 8". Its harder for 7-8 to medal but they could.


I put slovakia still ahead of Swizerland, when you look at their results earlier you just cant too lgihtly put swiss ahead of them. They have good perform in last olympics and also they have won world championship, so....


TOP6
7. Slovakia
8. Swiss

TOP 6 can win any tournament every time, it wont matter is it wc or olympics, they play for the gold and they reach the finals pretty commonly. I let others list it. Top 8 can beat any team and could medal. I have some guestion mark still on Swiss being that good in the olympics, but now very big thought.

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05-09-2012, 03:38 AM
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zorz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QnebO View Post
This year swiss has a great team, but we must not forget so does slovakia. And its new young team mainly, so Slovakia "still has it" too. They are both teams that can beat any team in hockey, thats what makes it "top 8". Its harder for 7-8 to medal but they could.


I put slovakia still ahead of Swizerland, when you look at their results earlier you just cant too lgihtly put swiss ahead of them. They have good perform in last olympics and also they have won world championship, so....


TOP6
7. Slovakia
8. Swiss

TOP 6 can win any tournament every time, it wont matter is it wc or olympics, they play for the gold and they reach the finals pretty commonly. I let others list it. Top 8 can beat any team and could medal. I have some guestion mark still on Swiss being that good in the olympics, but now very big thought.
I see a big rant from slovakiasnextone coming to prove you that their team is not young

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05-09-2012, 03:46 AM
  #19
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For me its
1 can
2 swe
3 rus
4 Cze and fin
6 USA
7 slovakia
8 switzerland
9 germany
10 denmark

Next teams to have à chance to advance are switzerland and denmark. In à near future i put them beside USA and slovakia. I think swizz and denmark gets stronger by each year. Team that Will fall out are germany which gets weaker each year if you compare to the top 6

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05-09-2012, 03:47 AM
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There is BIG SIX : Canada, Sweden, Russia, USA, Czech and Finland.

Then there is slovakia, which can be considered as "BIG" when they have their best roster, like in Vancouver.

Then there is Switzerland and Germany.

While teams like Norway, Latvia, Denmark and Belarus are very dangeours challenger teams. Norway two times in 1/4 in last four years, Latvia once, Denmark once, Belarus once. All those results came within upset or two.


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05-09-2012, 03:48 AM
  #21
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The top 6 is still unreachable for Switzerland for sure, but IMO they are already ahead of the Slovaks. They already have better young players, the only difference is that Slovakia still has few of those older stars in the NHL.

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05-09-2012, 03:51 AM
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If you look at the junior tournaments I'd put Switzerland and Svk in the near future on an equal level. The golden generation of Svk will soon be gone and after that they cannot be ranked much above Switzerland.

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05-09-2012, 03:54 AM
  #23
WayneBruce
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Top six
Slovakia
Switzerland

This is when all countries have their best team. I would put Switzerland ahead of Slovakia when none of them have their NHL-players.

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Old
05-09-2012, 03:57 AM
  #24
slovakiasnextone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorz View Post
I see a big rant from slovakiasnextone coming to prove you that their team is not young
Haha. Not a big rant. But it is true that neither the Slovak nor the Swiss team in the tournament is young. However there are some young players on both.

The major difference is that for years Slovakia has relied on NHLers coming while the Swiss have slowly built their European team. Well, Slovakia only has young forwards here, but then again that is what needs rebuilding the most. I believe that Hudáček can eventually become our Euro starter once he plays in a top league next season. Now it seems that we finally have decided to take this route too (even though we are pretty much forced to do so). And we have finally grasped that even Slovak league players can do well at the WC.

Also, while this team here might not be young I also believe that we have the potential to build a young team from our European players that could compete at least as much as Switzerland has in the past few years. And if our top prospects in NA and the younger kids who look good now develop well, we could even have some better years when we´re gonna challenge for more than just the top 8. I mean people always talk about how bad we finish in WJC and U18 WC, but the fact is that in recent years we have rarely finished worse than the 7th/8th spot at this tourneys, so I see no reason why the very same players could not be at least as good or better in the men´s level as their counterparts who have finished even worse in the U18Wc/WJC.

Also, so far it seems that Slovan Bratislava´s entrance into the KHL could help the NT as well as they already have or have recently signed some of the NTs young and middle aged players.

But the main difference between Slovakia this year and recent years is however coaching. While I have criticised Vujtek for some decisions (though the building of the team that´s not just him that´s Sýkora too, and they have in the end made some good decisions even if it seemed like they won´t), he has managed to force Slovak players to play according to a system, which is something that no coach has managed at the WC with Slovak players in recent years.

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05-09-2012, 04:01 AM
  #25
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Finnish players were saying that Swiss was lot more better than Slovaks and first team that tried to play against them. Also CANAL+ experts were saying before the game that Swiss-game is first "big game" in tournament and it truly looked like it.

I'm ready to rank Switzerland ahead of Slovakia.

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