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Dougie Hamilton - OHL Defenseman of the Year

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Old
05-08-2012, 02:42 PM
  #101
bigbadbruins7
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Originally Posted by lordhenrikthegr819 View Post
Yeah he deserves that title. He'll be like Karlsson one day. Sucks he's going to Boston. Seems like Boston is always getting better and better. Like, is there a point of being a Bruins fan? Like your team will never stop dominating the league with their roster. It's like being a Yankee fan.
26th in league in 2006. 23 in 2007. the bruins just started being good in the past 5 years. why dont you say that about dettroit or pittsburgh.

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05-10-2012, 01:34 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by NathanHortonFan View Post
Carrick has nothing on Knight. Knight is wayyyy ahead of him in talent. But yes, most other teams have a prospect like Knight.


Hamilton is a beast, if he gets a nasty physical game going I'd dream of him turning into a Progner type player!
Hopefully Hamilton can learn to be more physical and use his size more but I don't ever see him having that Pronger nasty edge.

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05-10-2012, 07:26 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Tyler Sanguine View Post
It's not about being rushed, but more about what is best for his development. What benefit does it serve a 6'4" defenseman to return to junior for another year to battle against 17 and 18 year old kids, when he could spend every day learning from guys like Zdeno Chara and Dennis Seidenberg how to play defense in the NHL. I'd rather see Hamilton play 12-15 minutes/night on the bottom pairing, sit next to Chara in the locker room every day, and learn what it takes to be successful in the NHL for the next 15 years...rather than return to his billets care, play against teenagers, and try to top a season that already named him the best defenseman in the OHL.

It's nonsensical. No one inferring that Hamilton should be prepared to come in and play top pairing minutes right away, but he's got nothing to prove in the OHL. He's grown as much as he can grow there.
I agree with most of what you're saying here, except for the bolded. Offensively, he has nothing to prove, no doubt, he's been incredible. But when it comes to defensive play, aggression, physicality - that you'd like to see from someone his size - he has room for improvement, IMO. The NHL isn't going anywhere. I just feel if he'll be a lot more likely to refine the skills I mentioned, and be a better player in the future, if he's in the OHL rather than the NHL next year.

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05-10-2012, 11:36 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Pick Six View Post
I agree with most of what you're saying here, except for the bolded. Offensively, he has nothing to prove, no doubt, he's been incredible. But when it comes to defensive play, aggression, physicality - that you'd like to see from someone his size - he has room for improvement, IMO. The NHL isn't going anywhere. I just feel if he'll be a lot more likely to refine the skills I mentioned, and be a better player in the future, if he's in the OHL rather than the NHL next year.
But why would he improve those things playing in the OHL versus the NHL? I don't disagree that those are the things that he needs to work on, but I still fail to see why playing in the OHL for another year against far inferior talent both in his locker room and on opposing teams is a positive step for his development. I'm serious...make the case for me that another year in the OHL is better for his development than a year with guys like Seidenberg, Chara, etc every day in practice. Because I don't see it. I don't see how learning how to exert your physical will on 17 years olds half your size is going to somehow translate to a more aggressive and well rounded player in 12 months.

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05-11-2012, 12:18 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Tyler Sanguine View Post
But why would he improve those things playing in the OHL versus the NHL? I don't disagree that those are the things that he needs to work on, but I still fail to see why playing in the OHL for another year against far inferior talent both in his locker room and on opposing teams is a positive step for his development. I'm serious...make the case for me that another year in the OHL is better for his development than a year with guys like Seidenberg, Chara, etc every day in practice. Because I don't see it. I don't see how learning how to exert your physical will on 17 years olds half your size is going to somehow translate to a more aggressive and well rounded player in 12 months.
Well it kind of work for Pietrangelo, I think it's easier to work on your defense in junior, NHL coaches seems to bench defensman who make lots of errors.

If he's playing he could learn in the NHL too, I'm just not buying the "he has nothing more to learn in junior" thing.

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05-11-2012, 12:31 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by reffree View Post
Well it kind of work for Pietrangelo, I think it's easier to work on your defense in junior, NHL coaches seems to bench defensman who make lots of errors.

If he's playing he could learn in the NHL too, I'm just not buying the "he has nothing more to learn in junior" thing.
I never said he has nothing left to "learn" in junior, I stated that he has nothing left to "prove" in junior. Huge difference, and not just semantics. I have no doubt that he could learn plenty by returning to Niagara for another year, but is it best for his development? He was already the best defenseman in the league this season, so what's left to prove?

It's nonsensical to make the argument that players need to stay in junior/NCAA/Europe until they've ironed out every aspect of their game. If the goal is to become a productive NHL player for the long haul, then wouldn't playing in and learning from NHL players make more sense than dominating teenagers for another season? He's going to learn more in the first 3 months in Boston about what it takes to thrive in the NHL than he would over the entire next season in the OHL.

Dougie Hamilton has proven enough in this past season in Niagara to make a reasonable argument that it's time to move on and become an NHL player.

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05-11-2012, 12:32 AM
  #107
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I disagree that another year of Juniors universally helps any player all the time. When you're the best Defenseman in the OHL another year of playing at that level is a good way to get lazy and start to learn bad habits because you can get away with it against inferior competition. He should be a 6/7 Defenseman on the Bruins next year and play 60 games with protected minutes if he's going to really develop (that's assuming he can't play his way into a bigger role as the season goes on, which is very much a possibility).

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05-11-2012, 09:39 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by reffree View Post
Well it kind of work for Pietrangelo, I think it's easier to work on your defense in junior, NHL coaches seems to bench defensman who make lots of errors.

If he's playing he could learn in the NHL too, I'm just not buying the "he has nothing more to learn in junior" thing.
In some cases I'd agree with you but I think you're wrong here.

He dominated the league and was near the top for almost all defensive categories. He received the "OHL Defenseman of the Month" 4 out of the 6 times it was awarded. He was voted by the coaches as being the best defenseman in terms of offense in the league and came in 2nd for best defenseman in terms of defense in the league. He dominated voting for OHL Defenseman of the Year:

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Hamilton received an impressive 80 of a maximum 95 points in the voting process ahead of Scott Harrington of the London Knights who finished in second place with 36 voting points, and Cody Ceci of the Ottawa 67’s who finished in third place with 28 voting points. ~ ontariohockeyleague.com
Just goes to show how far and away ahead he is than his peers in the league and that's including missing 10 games due to a suspension mid-season. I agree he has some defensive lapses but he also just transitioned to defense a couple years ago. He has little left to prove as he's won nearly every individual award a defenseman can win in the OHL.

I'd rather him get sheltered minutes learning with and against men in the NHL than to watch him dominate another season in the OHL against kids who have no idea what to do when they see a 6'6 200+ lbs defensemen coming at them. He has the offensive ability, he has enough defensive ability (not to mention Boston is on of the best at team defense which will bail the kid out enough if he stumbles) and if he trains well this summer he should be real close to being physically ready to play in the NHL.

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05-11-2012, 11:49 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by IrishPaulie View Post
In some cases I'd agree with you but I think you're wrong here.

He dominated the league and was near the top for almost all defensive categories. He received the "OHL Defenseman of the Month" 4 out of the 6 times it was awarded. He was voted by the coaches as being the best defenseman in terms of offense in the league and came in 2nd for best defenseman in terms of defense in the league. He dominated voting for OHL Defenseman of the Year:



Just goes to show how far and away ahead he is than his peers in the league and that's including missing 10 games due to a suspension mid-season. I agree he has some defensive lapses but he also just transitioned to defense a couple years ago. He has little left to prove as he's won nearly every individual award a defenseman can win in the OHL.

I'd rather him get sheltered minutes learning with and against men in the NHL than to watch him dominate another season in the OHL against kids who have no idea what to do when they see a 6'6 200+ lbs defensemen coming at them. He has the offensive ability, he has enough defensive ability (not to mention Boston is on of the best at team defense which will bail the kid out enough if he stumbles) and if he trains well this summer he should be real close to being physically ready to play in the NHL.
I don't disagree with you and you have a good point about the Bruins system. It may be enough for him. I just have some fear seeing how he played in the WJC (best level he played to date). The WJC show how great he could be (3rd period against Russia) and how soso to bad he could be (rest of the tournament). He was running arround in his zone and beaten one on one too often for my liking. But again it was at the WJC and he may be way more dominant ine the OHL.

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05-11-2012, 01:13 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by reffree View Post
I don't disagree with you and you have a good point about the Bruins system. It may be enough for him. I just have some fear seeing how he played in the WJC (best level he played to date). The WJC show how great he could be (3rd period against Russia) and how soso to bad he could be (rest of the tournament). He was running arround in his zone and beaten one on one too often for my liking. But again it was at the WJC and he may be way more dominant ine the OHL.
I think that actually reinforces that he should move up. He did not have that issue in the OHL, but did when faced with stiffer competition. Thus I'd argue that he has to face that tougher competition on a more consistent basis if he wants to learn how to defend against it.

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05-11-2012, 02:55 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by ottawah View Post
I think that actually reinforces that he should move up. He did not have that issue in the OHL, but did when faced with stiffer competition. Thus I'd argue that he has to face that tougher competition on a more consistent basis if he wants to learn how to defend against it.
Ding Ding! We have a winner. In order to make the leap defensively, he has to be challenged on a more consistent basis, and he has to be exposed to the best hockey available. He'll get all of that every day playing in Boston.

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05-11-2012, 03:47 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Tyler Sanguine View Post
Ding Ding! We have a winner. In order to make the leap defensively, he has to be challenged on a more consistent basis, and he has to be exposed to the best hockey available. He'll get all of that every day playing in Boston.
Actually, I'd argue he does not have to be exposed to the best hockey available, only hockey that is a step above where he is playing. You can learn against your peers, and one step up. Any step down, or too far up and you may very well learn nothing. And it was obvious seeing him several times this year that the OHL is no longer his peers.

Really starting in the AHL next year is the best place for him to be from a learning perspective, but that is not possible. As such, he will be slightly rushed into the NHL, one step above where he should be, certainly not out of place.

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05-11-2012, 07:19 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Tyler Sanguine View Post
But why would he improve those things playing in the OHL versus the NHL? I don't disagree that those are the things that he needs to work on, but I still fail to see why playing in the OHL for another year against far inferior talent both in his locker room and on opposing teams is a positive step for his development. I'm serious...make the case for me that another year in the OHL is better for his development than a year with guys like Seidenberg, Chara, etc every day in practice. Because I don't see it. I don't see how learning how to exert your physical will on 17 years olds half your size is going to somehow translate to a more aggressive and well rounded player in 12 months.
Because trying to improve things like aggression, physicality, defensive instincts etc. will be a lot easier at the OHL level than NHL. If he's not an aggressive/physical player at this level what are the chances he becomes one at the next level? I can see him having difficulties even with smaller forwards when then they're not only skilled, but very strong on the puck. Too often he'll stick check opposing forwards, instead of using his size.

Chara, Seidenberg etc. will all be there the following year, the opportunity to refine his game thoroughly in the OHL will not. People forget, this is a player that just transitioned from forward to defence during the '08-'09 season. He's still very raw in many defensive aspects, IMO.

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05-11-2012, 09:49 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Pick Six View Post
Because trying to improve things like aggression, physicality, defensive instincts etc. will be a lot easier at the OHL level than NHL. If he's not an aggressive/physical player at this level what are the chances he becomes one at the next level? I can see him having difficulties even with smaller forwards when then they're not only skilled, but very strong on the puck. Too often he'll stick check opposing forwards, instead of using his size.

Chara, Seidenberg etc. will all be there the following year, the opportunity to refine his game thoroughly in the OHL will not. People forget, this is a player that just transitioned from forward to defence during the '08-'09 season. He's still very raw in many defensive aspects, IMO.
I'm not sure if you played hockey competitively or not, but if so, have you ever played with/against a guy growing up that just clearly the best player on the ice? More often than not, his skill alone allowed him to control the puck consistently, in Hamilton's case his size alone allows him to not have to physically exhort his will. Another year playing against players that he can easily contain is going to do absolutely nothing to bring out the physical parts of his defensive game. He doesn't need them at that level...he can get the puck without it.

He's not going to learn how to defend at a high level until he is forced to do it on a consistent level...and that's not going to happen with another year in the OHL.

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05-11-2012, 11:44 PM
  #115
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To me, hes' best off in the AHL which cannot happen. 2nd best would be to go to the NHL imo.

Looks very, very similar to Pietrangelo.

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05-12-2012, 11:22 PM
  #116
Kelly23
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It would be nice if you had a chance to call up from the CHL in say a 3 day window around the al-star week if they are 19 then the CHL would only be giving up another half year it would give the team a chance to see if there player is too good, also another roster spot may open by then

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