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Derek Roy-5 reasons to keep him

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05-17-2012, 03:45 PM
  #1
McTankel
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Derek Roy-5 reasons to keep him

http://www.trendingbuffalo.com/5-rea...eep-derek-roy/

Trade or Keep?

Interesting article but I would have to say we should trade him before his value plummets any further. If we could package him in a deal for Staal or Parise or even a 1st+Prospect I would be all for it. We need size up the middle. Ennis, Hodgson, ?????. We have a void and would love to see it filled with a large 2 way center.

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05-17-2012, 03:52 PM
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haseoke39
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I'll be pleasantly surprised if Roy is moved. I don't think Darcy will get offers that are close enough to how highly he's going to value Derek. That and I think (well, I hope) that Darcy will need to see where his top 2 replacement center is going to come from, and I'm not so sure he's available myself.

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05-17-2012, 04:10 PM
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McTankel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
I'll be pleasantly surprised if Roy is moved. I don't think Darcy will get offers that are close enough to how highly he's going to value Derek. That and I think (well, I hope) that Darcy will need to see where his top 2 replacement center is going to come from, and I'm not so sure he's available myself.
I agree. The main reason I would even think of keeping him would be to see how he plays during a contract year. If he does amazing and puts up huge numbers we should sell him at peak value at the trade deadline. But then again if he is doing that well, we would most likely be in the playoff picture and not be in a position to trade him. So its tough either way.

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05-17-2012, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Awwufelloff View Post
I agree. The main reason I would even think of keeping him would be to see how he plays during a contract year. If he does amazing and puts up huge numbers we should sell him at peak value at the trade deadline. But then again if he is doing that well, we would most likely be in the playoff picture and not be in a position to trade him. So its tough either way.
Roy has barely produced in the playoffs anyway.

Move him at the draft or anytime after that. Don't keep him through the end of his deal, regardless of what happens with the Sabres season.

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05-17-2012, 04:23 PM
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I want to punch babies every time I read Staal or Parise now. Thanks All. :joshjull:

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05-17-2012, 04:38 PM
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I read article.
Is this Samuel Johnson guy (see last paragraph) available to Coach the Sabres???
I like his style.

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05-17-2012, 04:59 PM
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1. Why does his point production from many years ago matter? He clearly was not fully recovered, and may not be for another full year. With 1 year left, banking on a return to form is a "fingers crossed" approach at best

2. I'd rather actually get BANG for our buck. Soft and small is no way to success.

3. The stock comparison isnt very well thought out... since the stock has almost zero value on 6/1/2013. Not to mention, selling at a loss is beneficial, if it is done before the asset does even further damage to your portfolio

4. This guy loses all credibility when he suggests that it's possible that Lindy Ruff will use Roy in a limited role behind Ennis and Hodgson. That's just comical.

5. Brad Boyes, Dustin Penner, Jarret Stoll, Andrei Kostitsyn.... the contract year thing is a myth.

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05-17-2012, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
1. Why does his point production from many years ago matter? He clearly was not fully recovered, and may not be for another full year. With 1 year left, banking on a return to form is a "fingers crossed" approach at best

2. I'd rather actually get BANG for our buck. Soft and small is no way to success.

3. The stock comparison isnt very well thought out... since the stock has almost zero value on 6/1/2013. Not to mention, selling at a loss is beneficial, if it is done before the asset does even further damage to your portfolio

4. This guy loses all credibility when he suggests that it's possible that Lindy Ruff will use Roy in a limited role behind Ennis and Hodgson. That's just comical.

5. Brad Boyes, Dustin Penner, Jarret Stoll, Andrei Kostitsyn.... the contract year thing is a myth.
Game/Set/Match

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05-17-2012, 06:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
5. Brad Boyes, Dustin Penner, Jarret Stoll, Andrei Kostitsyn.... the contract year thing is a myth.
No it's not. Needn't look further than in-house. Briere? Drury? Stafford?

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05-17-2012, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
No it's not. Needn't look further than in-house. Briere? Drury? Stafford?
The point is there no sure fire thing that players ate better in contrct years, some guys are, a lot of guys arent

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05-17-2012, 06:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
1. Why does his point production from many years ago matter? He clearly was not fully recovered, and may not be for another full year. With 1 year left, banking on a return to form is a "fingers crossed" approach at best

Because his entire career was the Roy we knew before. Last year was the abberation, not the norm. If he doesn't recover by next year, then his career is all but over, but if he does you have a very good player on your hands.

2. I'd rather actually get BANG for our buck. Soft and small is no way to success.

You are also on record of favoring Gerbe over Ennis because of his style. We get it, you don't like skilled players. Problem is, who can you possibly get at that price tag that can produce and have size? There aren't that many out there. Before his injury, Roy's contract was widely considered one of the best the the NHL.

3. The stock comparison isnt very well thought out... since the stock has almost zero value on 6/1/2013. Not to mention, selling at a loss is beneficial, if it is done before the asset does even further damage to your portfolio

Except, prior to the trade deadline, that stock can soar. If Gaustad can get a 1st at the deadline, Roy can get the same at least.

4. This guy loses all credibility when he suggests that it's possible that Lindy Ruff will use Roy in a limited role behind Ennis and Hodgson. That's just comical.

They were lines 1a, b, and c at the end of the season. Roy had been demoted to the second PP unit. While he leaned on him a lot still on the PK, he wasn't relied on to be the scorer he had been. Not to mention, they were winning this way.

5. Brad Boyes, Dustin Penner, Jarret Stoll, Andrei Kostitsyn.... the contract year thing is a myth.

You can point out guys who didn't get it done, but you can't deny that it is at the very least, a motivating factor for all of them.
Reply in bold.

Edit: To be clear, I don't mind moving Roy as long as he's replaced adequately. I don't think getting rid of him for the sake of getting rid of him is a good idea.


Last edited by stokes84: 05-17-2012 at 06:55 PM.
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05-17-2012, 06:51 PM
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The only reason to keep Roy would be if Darcy fails to add a center of similar capabilities this offseason.

I fully expect Darcy to land a new center, so there's no reason for Roy.

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05-17-2012, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Reply in bold.

Edit: To be clear, I don't mind moving Roy as long as he's replaced adequately. I don't think getting rid of him for the sake of getting rid of him is a good idea.
Roy got boatloads of icetime down the stretch and saw first unit power play time often.

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05-17-2012, 07:31 PM
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What if he gets hurt? What do we get for him then?

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05-17-2012, 07:41 PM
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To me, the case to keep Roy boils down to one word.

Depth.

Ever since the co-caps, we have been searching for center depth. We finally now have 3 guys who can play a top-6 center role. This really cannot be understated.

We're finally at a point where we don't need to shoehorn in a wing like Hecht, Leino, or Adam into a top 6 center role except in case of multiple injuries.

If Roy is moved out, he needs to be replaced by a center who can play in the top 6 to maintain this depth. Could be the return in the trade, signed in FA (although let's be clear, FA market is no slam dunk either...there are 29 other teams who may be interested in Stoll and his ilk), or could come in a parallel trade.

But I'd rather make the other move BEFORE moving Roy so that worst case scenario we still are 3-deep at center.

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05-17-2012, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveDaSwords View Post
To me, the case to keep Roy boils down to one word.

Depth.

Ever since the co-caps, we have been searching for center depth. We finally now have 3 guys who can play a top-6 center role. This really cannot be understated.

We're finally at a point where we don't need to shoehorn in a wing like Hecht, Leino, or Adam into a top 6 center role except in case of multiple injuries.

If Roy is moved out, he needs to be replaced by a center who can play in the top 6 to maintain this depth. Could be the return in the trade, signed in FA (although let's be clear, FA market is no slam dunk either...there are 29 other teams who may be interested in Stoll and his ilk), or could come in a parallel trade.

But I'd rather make the other move BEFORE moving Roy so that worst case scenario we still are 3-deep at center.
Pretty much where I am at, unless we can get another top ten pick for him at the draft because if thats an option ill take my chances with free agency

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05-17-2012, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveDaSwords View Post
To me, the case to keep Roy boils down to one word.

Depth.

Ever since the co-caps, we have been searching for center depth. We finally now have 3 guys who can play a top-6 center role. This really cannot be understated.

We're finally at a point where we don't need to shoehorn in a wing like Hecht, Leino, or Adam into a top 6 center role except in case of multiple injuries.

If Roy is moved out, he needs to be replaced by a center who can play in the top 6 to maintain this depth. Could be the return in the trade, signed in FA (although let's be clear, FA market is no slam dunk either...there are 29 other teams who may be interested in Stoll and his ilk), or could come in a parallel trade.

But I'd rather make the other move BEFORE moving Roy so that worst case scenario we still are 3-deep at center.
Ruff thinks Leino is a great 3rd line center, or at least better at that role than as a scoring line winger. So, to them it's perfectly "natural".

Also, the younger players need room for their egos to grow in that locker room, and the veteran core is hogging all the light.


Last edited by Play4Miracles*: 05-17-2012 at 08:37 PM.
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05-17-2012, 08:52 PM
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I love points 4 and 5. Those are the only reasons we should consider keeping him, honestly. If his value is low around the league, then we should just keep him.... Having him play as our 3rd line center could work out great, and the fact that he's playing for a fat contract will light a fire under his ass....

I want him gone, but I wouldn't hate keeping him.

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05-18-2012, 08:40 AM
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God rthe roy hate around here is bad.....I'm just going to say that I wouldn't mind keeping or trading him, but if we trade him it better include another top six center coming back, or we had better have already aquired one...otherwise it just hurts the team.

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05-18-2012, 09:20 AM
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Another center that played through injuries and had a down season with only 49 points was Ryan Kesler. I don't know why the Canucks haven't traded his sorry butt yet. I mean really, he was a no-show in the Cup finals against Boston. His shoulder and hip injuries are no excuse. I'm sure there was something Mr. Miyagi or the scientists that built the Six Million Dollar Man could have done if Kesler wanted to win that badly. Then he has the audacity to play ASAP after surgery and stink it up all season. His career is done and Vancouver should trade him TODAY, not tomorrow, not at the draft, not at the deadline.

This is all undeniable fact which cannot be refuted by any means of stat analysis or rational thought.

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05-18-2012, 09:23 AM
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Jame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Reply in bold.

Edit: To be clear, I don't mind moving Roy as long as he's replaced adequately. I don't think getting rid of him for the sake of getting rid of him is a good idea.
- His entire career BEFORE a game changing injury is irrelevant. Regardless, your point seems to be that Roy's production is going to be a coin flip (recovered/return to form... or not).

- The "best contract in the NHL" is a Sabre Fan created myth.

- sounds like another coin flip scenario

- Roy was the 1a line

- so...you are banking on another coin flip scenario here too

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05-18-2012, 10:31 AM
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You should know better then to argue about Roy with Jame....he is impervious to logic or facts on the subject.

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05-18-2012, 11:26 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabresfansince1980 View Post
Another center that played through injuries and had a down season with only 49 points was Ryan Kesler. I don't know why the Canucks haven't traded his sorry butt yet. I mean really, he was a no-show in the Cup finals against Boston. His shoulder and hip injuries are no excuse. I'm sure there was something Mr. Miyagi or the scientists that built the Six Million Dollar Man could have done if Kesler wanted to win that badly. Then he has the audacity to play ASAP after surgery and stink it up all season. His career is done and Vancouver should trade him TODAY, not tomorrow, not at the draft, not at the deadline.

This is all undeniable fact which cannot be refuted by any means of stat analysis or rational thought.
I know you're tongue in cheek, but I'd throw in sweetner with Roy to get Kesler...

If Derek loves the night life in BUF, he'll go ape in VAN.

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05-18-2012, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by brian_griffin View Post
I know you're tongue in cheek, but I'd throw in sweetner with Roy to get Kesler...

If Derek loves the night life in BUF, he'll go ape in VAN.
Vancouver isn't giving up Kesler, and if they are its Myers coming back, not Roy+

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05-18-2012, 11:41 AM
  #25
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Vancouver isn't giving up Kesler, and if they are its Myers coming back, not Roy+
Given his shoulder surgery, Kesler isn't getting moved this off season because teams won't give up a ton to get him right now.

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