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*OFFICIAL* Windsor Spitfires 2012-13 Season Thread (Part 2)

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05-11-2012, 07:59 PM
  #126
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The first thing I thought of...assuming we get the Cup, Rychel and Boughner move on to the NHL in some capacity while Doran takes over as GM. I hope this isn't the case, but I have a feeling.

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05-11-2012, 08:07 PM
  #127
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I'd be lying if I pretended to know how influential Doran has been during our success, but it's probably safe to assume he played a pretty big role as our head scout. I'd rather keep the guys who make us successful happy than lose them to the competition, so it sounds like a good move regardless of Rychel's future plans. Maybe this will free him up a bit to put the full court press on some of these question marks who haven't signed yet. It seems like the NHL draft is supposed to be the first domino to help set things in motion, but the wait for that is killing me.

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05-11-2012, 08:32 PM
  #128
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I think the reason`s why Doran was promoted was 1) he can take over and sign some free agents and work on small trades that WR would know about while he is off trying to get the USA kids to come over there is a guy he trusts to get the deal done much like NHL clubs do when the main guy goes over seas or when they go get a big fish free agent 2) when either the NHL or AHL call for him to be a GM or even an Assistant GM he knows the position is taken care of so they dont need to look for a new GM

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05-14-2012, 08:38 AM
  #129
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FYI - Ugene Melnyk Announces Sale of OHL's Mississauga St. Michael's Majors

http://www.oursportscentral.com/serv...es/?id=4400448

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05-14-2012, 09:10 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by mstrninja View Post
FYI - Ugene Melnyk Announces Sale of OHL's Mississauga St. Michael's Majors

http://www.oursportscentral.com/serv...es/?id=4400448
Of course he does. He got his payoff from Branch in the hosting gig and then gets out. It stinks even more...

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05-14-2012, 10:17 AM
  #131
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Of course he does. He got his payoff from Branch in the hosting gig and then gets out. It stinks even more...
Given the losses he has no doubt incurred in his tenure as owner of this franchise, re-couping some of it at last year's Mem Cup is the least that could be realized.....don't understand, he maintained this franchise for much longer than most people would have despite the poor attendance.

Why the hate on?

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05-14-2012, 10:21 AM
  #132
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Given the losses he has no doubt incurred in his tenure as owner of this franchise, re-couping some of it at last year's Mem Cup is the least that could be realized.....don't understand, he maintained this franchise for much longer than most people would have despite the poor attendance.

Why the hate on?
The Spitfires where up for the Memorail Cup in 2010. They lost out to the Majors. Thats probably where the resentment comes from. Truthfully, I dont really care who the owner of any team is, as long as its stable and they take care of their players. I think thats what matters.

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05-14-2012, 10:57 AM
  #133
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The Spitfires where up for the Memorail Cup in 2010. They lost out to the Majors. Thats probably where the resentment comes from. Truthfully, I dont really care who the owner of any team is, as long as its stable and they take care of their players. I think thats what matters.
By all accounts, Melnyk ran a good organization in spite of the fiscal challenges. In my opinion, as Mr. Kerr suggested the people of Mississauga should be thanking him for his support through these years.

At some point, we will see if the new regime is correct that support can be had. We will see.

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05-14-2012, 11:18 AM
  #134
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Dale Hunter steps down as Caps coach. Says it's time to go back to his family and family business. Hope Boughner looks at this closely and realizes NHL coaching isn't all that it's cracked up to be.

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05-14-2012, 12:31 PM
  #135
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By all accounts, Melnyk ran a good organization in spite of the fiscal challenges. In my opinion, as Mr. Kerr suggested the people of Mississauga should be thanking him for his support through these years.

At some point, we will see if the new regime is correct that support can be had. We will see.
OHL Jr A hockey in metro Toronto is a no win proposition and has been for some time. Provincial Jr A is difficult at best. Jr B can attract fans in certain parts of metro. Because tickets are reasonable and operating costs on the lower end of the scale it is viable.

As for Melnyk, he hung on to a losing proposition longer than I expected him to.
He probably has been trying to dump the team for some time.

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05-14-2012, 12:46 PM
  #136
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Dale Hunter steps down as Caps coach. Says it's time to go back to his family and family business. Hope Boughner looks at this closely and realizes NHL coaching isn't all that it's cracked up to be.
In my humble opinion Boughner will be here until this ownership group wins another Memorial Cup ( or sells the Spits) or he gets another NHL Asst Coaching OP that he likes.

Hunter, on the other hand, has positioned himself for an NHL head coaching job that pays big $$$ down the line. He bent the Caps style drastically and did much more than expected with a group of me me players. The Capitals are a team in decline and Hunter got out while the getting was good.

He will be in on every head coaching opportunity that comes along and you can bet when he does take one, and eventually he will, it will be with a great team.

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05-14-2012, 12:59 PM
  #137
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Don't understand, he maintained this franchise for much longer than most people would have despite the poor attendance.

Why the hate on?
Aside from the irritation regarding the 2011 tournament host gig, I'm not sure how Melnyk can't be villified by OHL fans. To me, his attendance issues were self-inflicted. I don't recall ever seeing much advertising or attempt to generate attention.

As well, owning the Senators and trying to sell something in zombie nation was certainly a poor proposition.

But most of all, he moved the city's actual team and took the history of St. Mike's and bastardized it by moving it to the burbs. How can you not hate on a guy that took away a fan base's team and then gives them another one and assumes that it should be all good? I'm assuming the Majors name will go dormant again.

So in the end, despite all the spin doctoring about how the 2011 Cup was an important step to gain a foothold for the CHL in the GTA and how great of a team the Majors were going into that year, Mississauga won nothing, Majors attendance is as poor as ever and an supposedly deep pocketed CHL owner bails. Nice work.

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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Dale Hunter steps down as Caps coach. Says it's time to go back to his family and family business. Hope Boughner looks at this closely and realizes NHL coaching isn't all that it's cracked up to be.
Personally it looks to me that McPhee was going to go in a different direction after the outcome of the Rangers series. It looks like he gave Hunter the option of quitting to allow for the appearance that all was well. The Saturday CBC broadcast certainly made it sound like he was not going to be back by choice.

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05-14-2012, 01:17 PM
  #138
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Aside from the irritation regarding the 2011 tournament host gig, I'm not sure how Melnyk can't be villified by OHL fans. To me, his attendance issues were self-inflicted. I don't recall ever seeing much advertising or attempt to generate attention.

As well, owning the Senators and trying to sell something in zombie nation was certainly a poor proposition.

But most of all, he moved the city's actual team and took the history of St. Mike's and bastardized it by moving it to the burbs. How can you not hate on a guy that took away a fan base's team and then gives them another one and assumes that it should be all good? I'm assuming the Majors name will go dormant again.

So in the end, despite all the spin doctoring about how the 2011 Cup was an important step to gain a foothold for the CHL in the GTA and how great of a team the Majors were going into that year, Mississauga won nothing, Majors attendance is as poor as ever and an supposedly deep pocketed CHL owner bails. Nice work.



Personally it looks to me that McPhee was going to go in a different direction after the outcome of the Rangers series. It looks like he gave Hunter the option of quitting to allow for the appearance that all was well. The Saturday CBC broadcast certainly made it sound like he was not going to be back by choice.
He tried hard to build a new rink within Toronto suitable for junior hockey, but could not get it done for a myriad of reasons.

I live in Oakville now but the better part of my life I have lived in Mississauga. Between promotions aimed at all the local minor hockey organizations, to school day game excursions, to outfitting city buses with Majors colours to advertising in the local newspapers and on billboards Melnyk did a decent job getting the message out there. We will see in the next few years if there in fact does exist a junior hockey market suitable to sustain a franchise in the city through Mr. Kerr's efforts.

Given all the choices with which to spend your entertainment dollar in the GTA and with the proximity of a second junior team not far away (Brampton) my personal opinion is that there is not an appetitie for the Majors or whatever they will be called in the future. I hope I'm wrong.

Having said that, I maintain Mr. Melnyk did everything he could to sell it.

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05-15-2012, 10:20 AM
  #139
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Originally Posted by dereksutton9 View Post
Aside from the irritation regarding the 2011 tournament host gig, I'm not sure how Melnyk can't be villified by OHL fans. To me, his attendance issues were self-inflicted. I don't recall ever seeing much advertising or attempt to generate attention.

As well, owning the Senators and trying to sell something in zombie nation was certainly a poor proposition.

But most of all, he moved the city's actual team and took the history of St. Mike's and bastardized it by moving it to the burbs. How can you not hate on a guy that took away a fan base's team and then gives them another one and assumes that it should be all good? I'm assuming the Majors name will go dormant again.

So in the end, despite all the spin doctoring about how the 2011 Cup was an important step to gain a foothold for the CHL in the GTA and how great of a team the Majors were going into that year, Mississauga won nothing, Majors attendance is as poor as ever and an supposedly deep pocketed CHL owner bails. Nice work.



Personally it looks to me that McPhee was going to go in a different direction after the outcome of the Rangers series. It looks like he gave Hunter the option of quitting to allow for the appearance that all was well. The Saturday CBC broadcast certainly made it sound like he was not going to be back by choice.
Melnyk being owner was doomed to fail regardless. Not being able to draw fans isn't his fault look no further than attendance in Brampton. Too many options for people in the GTA. I don't think it's a big deal Mississauga hosted a Memorial Cup and won nothing they aren't the first team to host a Memorial Cup and win nothing and won't be the last eg. Brandon, Rimouski, Guelph, quite possibly Shawinigan this year. Windsor fans will be bitter over not getting it last year but the biggest reason I saw for Windsor to get it was 2 Memorial Cups in a row and it was pure selfishness just to try and get that 3rd straight. It wasn't based on anything else other than that and honestly having one winner for 3 straight years doesn't help a sport. Look no further than professional sports where it's all based on competitive balance and parity with the exception of basketball but that's going to change.

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Old
05-17-2012, 09:07 AM
  #140
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Windsor fans will be bitter over not getting it last year but the biggest reason I saw for Windsor to get it was 2 Memorial Cups in a row and it was pure selfishness just to try and get that 3rd straight. It wasn't based on anything else other than that and honestly having one winner for 3 straight years doesn't help a sport. Look no further than professional sports where it's all based on competitive balance and parity with the exception of basketball but that's going to change.
Of course the threepeat would be the main reason for winning the 2011 bid and how easy would that have been to market for the CHL? The Ellis factor would have been huge and a very easy angle for the media to run with. Plus the CHL could have avoided the embarassment of dealing with the lack of crowds question.

If you have a system that gives the opportunity to a team prior to any games being played and only based on expectations, the idea of competitive balance goes out the window (See NCAA football/BCS system). In fact, I would think a sport is hurt more by a team not worthy of winning a championship doing so solely based on a lucky week of play and preseason judging than a team capable of a threepeat.

Parity is alive and well in the NHL but the Kings and Devils are earning it as opposed to having some committee concoct reasons to have the Cup Finals in LA because they want to drum up interest on the Left Coast. I remember when society celebrated winners instead of worrying about how everyone needs a medal and a chance to win. Parity is about giving teams the opportunity to build a winner and earn championships not passing out the trophy to people who haven't had it yet.

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05-17-2012, 11:31 AM
  #141
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Of course the threepeat would be the main reason for winning the 2011 bid and how easy would that have been to market for the CHL? The Ellis factor would have been huge and a very easy angle for the media to run with. Plus the CHL could have avoided the embarassment of dealing with the lack of crowds question.

If you have a system that gives the opportunity to a team prior to any games being played and only based on expectations, the idea of competitive balance goes out the window (See NCAA football/BCS system). In fact, I would think a sport is hurt more by a team not worthy of winning a championship doing so solely based on a lucky week of play and preseason judging than a team capable of a threepeat.

Parity is alive and well in the NHL but the Kings and Devils are earning it as opposed to having some committee concoct reasons to have the Cup Finals in LA because they want to drum up interest on the Left Coast. I remember when society celebrated winners instead of worrying about how everyone needs a medal and a chance to win. Parity is about giving teams the opportunity to build a winner and earn championships not passing out the trophy to people who haven't had it yet.
Every game was sold out for the tourney in Mississauga the empty seats were ones that couldn't be sold on the secondary market so you may view it was embarrasment but fact is those tickets were sold.

The media angle you portray is lame in my opinion. The media hardly gives the CHL much publicity as it is. Sportsnet is trying to do a better job but right now it's all about London and the capital of hockey. Tell me how many games London gets on Sportsnet every year. If you want to talk about selling the sport just don't show London 60% of the time for OHL games on sportsnet.

I agree that the bidding process is ridiculous but nobody has come up with a better system. You can't wait until the end to decide on a host because these facilities want to maximize their own revenue and get people in the seats so they're busting their rear ends to get acts and get $$$. In the WHL you will never see Edmonton, Calgary or Portland (getting new facility) so they can now but they share facilities with a professional sports team so it's not feasible for those franchises to host memorial cups. So you're left with some small market teams having to bid for it.

Spits lost Timmins, Mitchell, Young, Hall, Fowler, Nemisz, Henrique, Grubauer, Cundari, Wellwood. Hard to spin in my mind why Windsor had the team to win an OHL championship and Memorial Cup for a 3rd straight year. They might have been better with Shugg and Cantin but still not deserving of a Memorial Cup in my mind.

Furthermore when you say parity is all about giving teams the opportunity to build a winner and not pass out a championship. Well until the drafting process in the CHL changes and the bad teams are rewarded by getting the best players in a draft without any draft games being played then we can complain. I find it funny people are upset about the 11 Memorial Cup still but don't have any issues with the Spitfires being the recipients of draft games and getting the best players. One thing that hasn't changed among Windsor fans are the complaints about the league and one Dave Branch. The case for Windsor getting the Memorial Cup was nothing more than getting a hand out from Branch which is the equivalent of a lifetime achievement award for the prior 2 years, there were no meat and potatoes to getting the 11 Memorial Cup. Having Kenny Ryan, Stephen Johnston and Zack Kassian as your top 3 returning forwards is worthy of getting a bid? Derek you're a smart guy you're not buying that are you?

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05-17-2012, 12:50 PM
  #142
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Just because a ticket broker or scalper buys tickets, doesn't mean they're necessarily "sold." By definition, yes, they are, but if "Joey" (Rayzor better get that reference) buys up 200 tickets and doesn't sell one, those are unsold to me.

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05-17-2012, 01:16 PM
  #143
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I bought a tickets on-line for a game on the Tuesday on that day, the games were not all sold out. I'd agree the semi-final and final were.

The Majors were awarded the Memorial Cup before Cantin, Shugg were traded and it was known Folwer was staying with Anaheim. Spits could have won the OHL title with those players.

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05-17-2012, 01:24 PM
  #144
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Just because a ticket broker or scalper buys tickets, doesn't mean they're necessarily "sold." By definition, yes, they are, but if "Joey" (Rayzor better get that reference) buys up 200 tickets and doesn't sell one, those are unsold to me.
Joey represents the secondary ticket market. How did he get those tickets in the first place? A broker probably bought them all hence those tickets are sold. Stubhub=secondary ticket market, _____marketplace for tickets=secondary ticket market. By definition is all that matters because those tickets were sold.

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05-17-2012, 01:28 PM
  #145
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Spits lost Timmins, Mitchell, Young, Hall, Fowler, Nemisz, Henrique, Grubauer, Cundari, Wellwood. Hard to spin in my mind why Windsor had the team to win an OHL championship and Memorial Cup for a 3rd straight year. They might have been better with Shugg and Cantin but still not deserving of a Memorial Cup in my mind.

Furthermore when you say parity is all about giving teams the opportunity to build a winner and not pass out a championship. Well until the drafting process in the CHL changes and the bad teams are rewarded by getting the best players in a draft without any draft games being played then we can complain. I find it funny people are upset about the 11 Memorial Cup still but don't have any issues with the Spitfires being the recipients of draft games and getting the best players. One thing that hasn't changed among Windsor fans are the complaints about the league and one Dave Branch. The case for Windsor getting the Memorial Cup was nothing more than getting a hand out from Branch which is the equivalent of a lifetime achievement award for the prior 2 years, there were no meat and potatoes to getting the 11 Memorial Cup. Having Kenny Ryan, Stephen Johnston and Zack Kassian as your top 3 returning forwards is worthy of getting a bid? Derek you're a smart guy you're not buying that are you?
It's easy to talk about who they lost now, hindsight is 20/20, but I believe at the time the cup was announced we still had Cantin and Shugg, Fowler was expected back and if we had been awarded the cup Wellwood may have been returned. Also, by that time I thought it was known that Campbell was coming as was Kuhnkackel. I believe Windsor still had the pieces in place to deserve the cup.

As to the draft comment, when the so called "bad teams" and their heads out of their .... then they can talk about players not reporting. It doesn't take years to turn it around, Windsor did with new ownership, Kingston appears to be on the right track with a solid coach and GM.

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05-17-2012, 01:55 PM
  #146
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Every game was sold out for the tourney in Mississauga the empty seats were ones that couldn't be sold on the secondary market so you may view it was embarrasment but fact is those tickets were sold.

I think tickets that are paid for and not used to be even more embarrassing then tickets not sold at all. Someone paid not to go, what does that say about the product. Nothing good.

To rewrite history does Boughner stay if Windsor hosts? None of this matters now but if the team they fielded made it to the Conference final they where not far off and with a full out go for it mind set they would have been even stronger. Many a hosts are bounced in the second round, much like Shawinigan this year. They had a good enough base to host.

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05-17-2012, 01:59 PM
  #147
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Did some research there were only 2 games that did not sellout the tiebreaker game 4900+ of 5429 capacity. That's to be expected though because based on ticket packages not all 5429 are packages those were seperate tickets just like 09 the tiebreaker didn't sell out either. The semi drew 5329 as well 100 short of a sellout. So only 600 total tickets for the event were not sold I would say they did a good job of supporting it.

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05-17-2012, 02:05 PM
  #148
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I think tickets that are paid for and not used to be even more embarrassing then tickets not sold at all. Someone paid not to go, what does that say about the product. Nothing good.

To rewrite history does Boughner stay if Windsor hosts? None of this matters now but if the team they fielded made it to the Conference final they where not far off and with a full out go for it mind set they would have been even stronger. Many a hosts are bounced in the second round, much like Shawinigan this year. They had a good enough base to host.
That happens in every city for every sport though it's not something that just happens in the CHL. People are busy now, prior commitments etc.. Every franchise in sports goes by tickets sold.

The Boughner thing is interesting because they knew before the Memorial Cup if they were going to get it again but Boughner didn't leave until late July or early August. Did Boughner have one foot out the door after the Memorial Cup and just waiting for the right opportunity?

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05-17-2012, 03:06 PM
  #149
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Joey represents the secondary ticket market. How did he get those tickets in the first place? A broker probably bought them all hence those tickets are sold. Stubhub=secondary ticket market, _____marketplace for tickets=secondary ticket market. By definition is all that matters because those tickets were sold.
Definition and actual "sold" tickets, though, I think should be two different situations. If I buy 100 tickets, but throw them in my car and let them rot away, I don't believe they're "sold." They're empty seats. If a guy buys any more than 10 tickets, usually it's for a broker situation and I don't believe it's "sold" at that point.

While the final game in Mississauga sold out, a lot of people were buying in the final hour from people outside. It didn't strike me as an interest thing as much as it was a "let's see how cheap we can get tickets for."

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05-17-2012, 03:17 PM
  #150
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The memorial cup is more than just the games, its a festival of junior hockey which got a collective yawn from the Mississauga community. Selling out and having a half empty building is hardly anything to be proud of. Mississauga's host team wasn't even all that good when the dust settled, I'm pretty sure Windsor could have put a comparable team on the ice had it been awarded.

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