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2012 NHL Entry Draft Talk 13.0

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Old
05-18-2012, 11:50 AM
  #951
Monctonscout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
We don't need him to lead us into battle against the English, we need an influx of talent. Grigs has the best chance of anyone in this class of turning into a 100p player IMO. The guy has unreal talent.
There are other guys with his skill level and 3x more grit and character. I have no problem comparing the careers of Galcheyuk Dumba Murray and Forsberg to Grigorenko in 10 years.

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05-18-2012, 11:51 AM
  #952
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halifaxhab View Post
Irigorenko has done very well in the Q, so, like most other top Q league players, was invited to the Habs combine, but it wasn't a special invitation just for him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vokiel View Post
There would more ruckus if the habs hadn't invited Grigo to their combine. The invite was almost automatic regardless of injury status.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveForDrawingBlood View Post
I definitely would be inviting Grig to our combine. He has the high end skill. Never know he may slide, we may be able to trade down and get extra first next year or trade up from 32th and grab him later than we think.
No doubt, so you'd think the agent would think that way too. The combine invite was normal. Which is why the quote is interesting and was worth posting, it suggests they have gone even further into the process than merely sending a Habs combine invitation.

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05-18-2012, 11:52 AM
  #953
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
What does being 17 have to do with anything?

He won't outwork or overpower guys from his own age group and you think he'll suddenly start battling like crazy and going into traffic against bigger, stronger and older players?

If he had a weak wrist shot or was too skinny then yeah, that's something age and maturity will fix, but guys that are scared and lack drive in junior don't usually turn into brave and gritty players in the pros.
Well maybe you haven't matured or changed at all since you were 17 but most everyone else has.

Your questioning of his heart and work ethic is easily corrected in the right environment. Many prospects have quaetioms about them because they are so young and haven't developed fully yet. Don't know why you're do fixated with this one player when just about EVER prospect has some issue or concern.

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Old
05-18-2012, 11:58 AM
  #954
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
Well maybe you haven't matured or changed at all since you were 17 but most everyone else has.

Your questioning of his heart and work ethic is easily corrected in the right environment. Many prospects have quaetioms about them because they are so young and haven't developed fully yet. Don't know why you're do fixated with this one player when just about EVER prospect has some issue or concern.
That's a ridiculous statement, guys with no heart not willing to pay the price usually pass 5-6 teams in their careers and things don't change. It's not the environment it's what the player has in his chest or belly that dertermine if he makes it and how good he gets.

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05-18-2012, 12:02 PM
  #955
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
No doubt, so you'd think the agent would think that way too. The combine invite was normal. Which is why the quote is interesting and was worth posting, it suggests they have gone even further into the process than merely sending a Habs combine invitation.
Either that or the agent is pimping his player which is his job...

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05-18-2012, 12:06 PM
  #956
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
That's a ridiculous statement, guys with no heart not willing to pay the price usually pass 5-6 teams in their careers and things don't change. It's not the environment it's what the player has in his chest or belly that dertermine if he makes it and how good he gets.
You live in a world of black or white with no grey. Everything is absolute and static for you. He's the best, he's the worst etc.

The fact is that noone in this draft is probably going to be as good or bad as you think. Grigs can go on to have a great NHL career and a guy like Galy can bust and you'd still want Galy because he has more heart. May not have a knee but that's okay.

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05-18-2012, 12:23 PM
  #957
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Im a little excited for our early second round pick with the way timmins has a knack for getting gems in the second. Hoping for another player capable of a PK/Patches impact.

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05-18-2012, 01:08 PM
  #958
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Originally Posted by Plante View Post
Im a little excited for our early second round pick with the way timmins has a knack for getting gems in the second. Hoping for another player capable of a PK/Patches impact.
Yeah me too, been since 2008 we haven't drafted in the 2nd round, and now Timmins have 2 picks in that round (to begin with, who knows what might happen). That draft is too far, damn !

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05-18-2012, 01:26 PM
  #959
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I am following the habs on facebook and the only player they have talked about in the draft is Galchenyuk....

Is that a sign we are going with him? It's between him and Forsberg except if Roy is coming we might go with Grigoenko instead.

If we could get Martin Frk in the second round i would be very happy he is a very capable goal scorer.

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Old
05-18-2012, 01:41 PM
  #960
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Galchenyuk
Thrower (2nd rounder)
Sutter (Nashville 2nd)
Bussieres (3rd Rounder)

Wishful thinking, guessing, hoping. Really like this Thrower.

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05-18-2012, 01:45 PM
  #961
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beendair Donedat View Post
Galchenyuk
Thrower (2nd rounder)
Sutter (Nashville 2nd)
Bussieres (3rd Rounder)

Wishful thinking, guessing, hoping. Really like this Thrower.
Yep, love thrower.

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Old
05-18-2012, 01:49 PM
  #962
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
You do realize he's SEVENTEEN.
I don't. He might be 17 but then again...

There's a lot more questions about this guy then there should be if he's going to be in consideration for a #3 overall pick.

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05-18-2012, 02:50 PM
  #963
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
I don't. He might be 17 but then again...

There's a lot more questions about this guy then there should be if he's going to be in consideration for a #3 overall pick.
I agree with that. Same can be said about Galys knee, TTs drive, Forsbergs ceiling etc etc etc. picking on 1 player for a perceived fault is ridiculous. I case can be made for all the prospects having perceived issues. Fact is Grigs IS arguably the most talented player in the draft and should be considered a top 3 pick along with the others.

I'm happy and confident we have w team of experts in this area and it's not posters who decide the pick or we're be screwed!

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Old
05-18-2012, 03:31 PM
  #964
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
Club feet? Don't they fix that at birth now? How does he put on skates?
Sorry to divert back to this for a second, but I asked London fans on the OHL forum and they did indeed verify that Houser does in fact have club feet.

So the NHL scout I spoke with was being quite serious. He feels it's an ankle stability issue long term. Still, I'd offer the kid an invite or minor pro contract given his pedigree and our organizational depth.


Last edited by Tim Wallach: 05-18-2012 at 03:31 PM. Reason: typo
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Old
05-18-2012, 03:44 PM
  #965
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I'm wondering if anyone feels like humouring me through the following scenario I've been conjuring up:

I wonder what kind of premium there would be on trading down from #3 to the #6 range? I ask because I'm sort of seeing teams preferences as follows:

Oilers - Defenceman
Jackets - Forward
Habs - Forward
Islanders - Defenceman
Leafs - Forward
Ducks - Defenceman

One scenario I could see playing out is that the Oilers take Yakupov (even though they'd prefer a d-man) and then the Blue Jackets take the next best forward (probably one of Forsberg or Galchenyuk). That leaves us with the next pick with everyone's favourite d-man still on the board (be it Murray, Dumba, Reilly, whoever).

The Habs could realistically be considering a d-man right now (BPA), and the Ducks would see that if that happens, they're likely getting stuck with the 3rd d-man selected (because the Islanders will draft one as well). The Habs, meanwhile, figure the Isles are taking a d-man, know the Ducks would take one if they traded up to #3, and so the only forward likely to go between pick 3 and 5 is to the Leafs and #5.

It could very realistically go something like this:

Oilers - Yakupov
Jackets - Forsberg
Ducks - Murray / Dumba / Reilly / Trouba
Islanders - Murray / Dumba / Reilly / Trouba
Leafs - Grigorenko / Galchenyuk / Teravainen

And that would leave the Habs with 5 out of the following 7 players to choose from:

Murray
Dumba
Reilly
Trouba
Grigorenko
Galchenyuk
Teravainen

If you remove any two of those players, there is still a lot of talent there to choose from.

Thoughts?

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Old
05-18-2012, 04:07 PM
  #966
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaskRinkRat View Post
I'm wondering if anyone feels like humouring me through the following scenario I've been conjuring up:

I wonder what kind of premium there would be on trading down from #3 to the #6 range? I ask because I'm sort of seeing teams preferences as follows:


It could very realistically go something like this:

Oilers - Yakupov
Jackets - Forsberg
Ducks - Murray / Dumba / Reilly / Trouba
Islanders - Murray / Dumba / Reilly / Trouba
Leafs - Grigorenko / Galchenyuk / Teravainen


If you remove any two of those players, there is still a lot of talent there to choose from.

Thoughts?
I don't like it or think it's probable. I see Burke as being the guy willing to offer the most to trade down to get the guy he wants, so even if we were going to be trading down it would be much more likely with TO. Plus, we would be taking a forward that Burke doesn't want so if we traded with him we have a better idea of who we're getting.

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Old
05-18-2012, 04:11 PM
  #967
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
I don't like it or think it's probable. I see Burke as being the guy willing to offer the most to trade down to get the guy he wants, so even if we were going to be trading down it would be much more likely with TO. Plus, we would be taking a forward that Burke doesn't want so if we traded with him we have a better idea of who we're getting.
This is possible, but I don't see Burke being in too much of a hurry to trade up if the first two players taken are forwards. He'll know that the Islanders will be taking a d-man, and knows there's a good possibility the Habs do as well, so he'll probably be left with the forward he wants anyway.

This is basically the opposite reasoning with the Ducks. They will be wanting a d-man, and they'll see the chance to get the one they think is the best in the draft.

But I could be wrong. Also, I don't think it's a guarantee the Jackets take a forward with #2, which throws all of this for a loop anyway.


Last edited by SaskRinkRat: 05-18-2012 at 04:16 PM.
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Old
05-18-2012, 04:21 PM
  #968
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaskRinkRat View Post
This is possible, but I don't see Burke being in too much of a hurry to trade up if the first two players taken are forwards. He'll know that the Islanders will be taking a d-man, and knows there's a good possibility the Habs do as well, so he'll probably be left with the forward he wants anyway.

This is basically the opposite reasoning with the Ducks. They will be wanting a d-man, and they'll see the chance to get the one they think is the best in the draft.

But I could be wrong. Also, I don't think it's a guarantee the Jackets take a forward with #2, which throws all of this for a loop anyway.
The Habs prospect pool is filled with D. They have no goalie prospects, only two high profile winger prospects and 0 center prospects of note.

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05-18-2012, 04:25 PM
  #969
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
The Habs prospect pool is filled with D. They have no goalie prospects, only two high profile winger prospects and 0 center prospects of note.
I'm not denying this, but I guarantee the Habs would consider taking a d-man at #3 if the first two players picked are forwards. After a while it just makes sense to take the best player available.

Also, your argument is also pretty good reasoning IN FAVOUR of trading down (assuming forwards go 1 and 2). Since there is likely to only be one forward selected between 3 and 5 in my scenario, the Habs could get the 4th best forward with the 6th pick (instead of the 3rd best with the 3rd pick) and pick up a premium from Anaheim in the deal.


Last edited by SaskRinkRat: 05-18-2012 at 04:33 PM.
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05-18-2012, 04:36 PM
  #970
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BPA

Yakupov
Forsberg
Galchenyuk/Dumba/Murray

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Old
05-18-2012, 04:40 PM
  #971
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monaco88 View Post
BPA

Yakupov
Forsberg
Galchenyuk/Dumba/Murray
Of those three, who is the BPA?

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Old
05-18-2012, 04:43 PM
  #972
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
You live in a world of black or white with no grey. Everything is absolute and static for you. He's the best, he's the worst etc.

The fact is that noone in this draft is probably going to be as good or bad as you think. Grigs can go on to have a great NHL career and a guy like Galy can bust and you'd still want Galy because he has more heart. May not have a knee but that's okay.
Why would he not have a knee?

He had the same operation as Malkin, would you trade the #3 pick for Malkin?

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05-18-2012, 04:46 PM
  #973
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Originally Posted by SaskRinkRat View Post
I'm not denying this, but I guarantee the Habs would consider taking a d-man at #3 if the first two players picked are forwards. After a while it just makes sense to take the best player available.

Also, your argument is also pretty good reasoning IN FAVOUR of trading down (assuming forwards go 1 and 2). Since there is likely to only be one forward selected between 3 and 5 in my scenario, the Habs could get the 4th best forward with the 6th pick (instead of the 3rd best with the 3rd pick) and pick up a premium from Anaheim in the deal.
I won't guarantee it but even if the first two picks are forwards, say Yakupov and Galchenyuk or Yakupov and Forsberg, I don't see why we wouldn't still be picking a forward. One of Galchenyuk and Forsberg and also TT would be still on the board and I don't see any reason we wouldn't be picking one of them.

We may very well take a d-man but it won't be because they won't be a decent forward to take at the #3 spot.

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05-18-2012, 04:52 PM
  #974
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
I won't guarantee it but even if the first two picks are forwards, say Yakupov and Galchenyuk or Yakupov and Forsberg, I don't see why we wouldn't still be picking a forward. One of Galchenyuk and Forsberg and also TT would be still on the board and I don't see any reason we wouldn't be picking one of them.

We may very well take a d-man but it won't be because they won't be a decent forward to take at the #3 spot.
Fair enough.

I think I'd have a hard time leaving the best d-man on the board if, say, the top 2 forward on the Habs list were taken in the first two picks.

Say our lists look something like:

Forwards: 1) Yakupov, 2) Forsberg, 3) Galchenyuk
Defence: 1) Murray, 2) Dumba

And then Yak and Forsberg go 1-2, it might be hard not to take Murray, unless they see Galchenyuk as the BPA.

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05-18-2012, 04:54 PM
  #975
shutehinside
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Why would he not have a knee?

He had the same operation as Malkin, would you trade the #3 pick for Malkin?
Different players, different knees, different recoveries. No one knee operation is the same and neither is the recovery. To make a blanket statement like that is irresponsible. Same thing was said about Markovs knee and now it's a huge debate as to whether he'll ever recover.

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