HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Columbus Blue Jackets
Notices

The Nash Thread (all things Nash here)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-19-2012, 10:27 PM
  #976
Cash for Nash
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,568
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Frankly, if we add another significant defenseman, I'd still only trade Methot - if we trade anyone at all. We had a painful lesson on what happens when you don't have sufficient defensive depth last year, and while the number and insane timing of injuries is unlikely to repeat itself, we're still inevitably going to need SOME depth.

Also, I think Tyutin for JvR is a ripoff in Philly's favor. I think JvR actually is what everyone seems to assume Nash is (i.e. grossly overrated due to easily visible talents that ought to be awesome but haven't been for him), and I want no part of that. Add that to his recent injury history and I wanna stay far far away. Tyutin's no epic badass, but he can carry the second pairing as ably as anyone in the league - that and I think he's become the heir to Klesla's whipping-boy legacy, and we all know what they think of Klesla now in Phoenix.
This entire post is right on the money....Frankly I'd rather stockpile or at least hang on to all the Dman we have currently. Why not make a position a strength...something we have never had in this franchises history at any position. And if Murray is the best player at 2, then draft him as well (still think Edmonton takes him). We can trade assets later when other teams start scrambling to shore up their blue line.
As for JVR: yeah he sucks and is exactly the type of player we don't need: injury prone, finesse, all style no substance. Not the type of guy for a rebuilding franchise at all.

Cash for Nash is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 12:02 AM
  #977
thrillermiller89
Registered User
 
thrillermiller89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: San Jose
Country: United States
Posts: 1,381
vCash: 500
what about nash for bobby ryan??

thrillermiller89 is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 12:11 AM
  #978
Robert
BOB
 
Robert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: KY & Lime Lake NY
Country: United States
Posts: 30,044
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Robert
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillermiller89 View Post
what about nash for bobby ryan??
I’m the only one on line tonight so you are stuck with me…

Great player no doubt but here’s the deal, when the names Rick Nash and Bobby Ryan come to mind which will the CASUAL NHL hockey fan know of? It’s Rick Nash….and names sell tickets.

I want him and more….Toss in an unproven Fowler and I'd consider it.


Last edited by Robert: 05-20-2012 at 12:19 AM.
Robert is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:07 AM
  #979
punk_o_holic
 
punk_o_holic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: N. Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Japan
Posts: 6,640
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillermiller89 View Post
what about nash for bobby ryan??
Don't think Ducks fans would like it. I think the Ducks GM would consider it as Nash did play with Getzlaf for Canada in the past. They also did have chemistry so it might be worth the gamble to try to get Getzlaf back on track(although it could potentially be for 1 season only).

Ryan has 3 more years left on his contract before becoming a UFA. I wonder if Howson is looking for player that is signed to a longer contract or a player that hits RFA and not UFA. Now, I say every year, Columbus will bounce back and make the playoffs but realistically, whats the time frame for Columbus? Two years, three years? Lets say we finish near the bottom again next season. Year after we climb up and finish around 10th. Year after that we make the playoffs. Then Ryan can potentially leave so we basically had him for 1 playoff season. The player we get in return for Nash, I would like him to be part of the team once we turned the corner. Not just for one playoff run and on the verge of turning the corner.

Won't happen, but I would push for Sbisa to be added in the deal although the Ducks might want something else as well from us.

punk_o_holic is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 07:44 AM
  #980
Cash for Nash
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,568
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
I’m the only one on line tonight so you are stuck with me…

Great player no doubt but here’s the deal, when the names Rick Nash and Bobby Ryan come to mind which will the CASUAL NHL hockey fan know of? It’s Rick Nash….and names sell tickets.

I want him and more….Toss in an unproven Fowler and I'd consider it.
Well...Fowler is a great young player/prospect so along with Ryan by the trades scenario's outlined earlier (which was a really good summary btw) that would be gross overpayment by the Ducks imo. But I agree with you, we should only be accepting overpayment for our franchise cornerstone.

I brought this up earlier: If we got Jack Johnson + LA first round pick for Knucklehead Carter, then is Nash worth basically the same (ex Toronto first + Luke schenn and another "mediocre forward" as well.) And would Nash accept playing in Anaheim for a lousy team. In response to another thread, we can't be worried about losing Ryan after 3 years because if we are a playoff team in his last year, and have the money to spend (which we will) there is no excuse why we shouldn't be able to re sign him anyway.


I think Nash will have to expand his list of teams in the next month. Question is: Would Anaheim even be on his list?

Certainly a dream scenario for Nash for Ryan/Fowler. Sign the papers as fast as you can....

Cash for Nash is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 08:40 AM
  #981
EspenK
Registered User
 
EspenK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,041
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
Agree, Methot is the odd man out, and, no Stanley Cup contender can enough solid defenseman.. none.
So are you saying Methot is highly desirable to the likes of teams on Nash's list or that the Jackets keep him healthy and active until he breaks Chelios age record?

EspenK is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 11:18 AM
  #982
CapnCornelius
Registered User
 
CapnCornelius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 10,923
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash for Nash View Post
This entire post is right on the money....Frankly I'd rather stockpile or at least hang on to all the Dman we have currently. Why not make a position a strength...something we have never had in this franchises history at any position. And if Murray is the best player at 2, then draft him as well (still think Edmonton takes him). We can trade assets later when other teams start scrambling to shore up their blue line.
As for JVR: yeah he sucks and is exactly the type of player we don't need: injury prone, finesse, all style no substance. Not the type of guy for a rebuilding franchise at all.
Additionally, I don't think there is that great of a market for Fedor Tyutin. And he's the only one we'd plausibly move (remember, Nikitin is a free agent at present).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash for Nash View Post
Well...Fowler is a great young player/prospect so along with Ryan by the trades scenario's outlined earlier (which was a really good summary btw) that would be gross overpayment by the Ducks imo. But I agree with you, we should only be accepting overpayment for our franchise cornerstone.

I brought this up earlier: If we got Jack Johnson + LA first round pick for Knucklehead Carter, then is Nash worth basically the same (ex Toronto first + Luke schenn and another "mediocre forward" as well.) And would Nash accept playing in Anaheim for a lousy team. In response to another thread, we can't be worried about losing Ryan after 3 years because if we are a playoff team in his last year, and have the money to spend (which we will) there is no excuse why we shouldn't be able to re sign him anyway.


I think Nash will have to expand his list of teams in the next month. Question is: Would Anaheim even be on his list?

Certainly a dream scenario for Nash for Ryan/Fowler. Sign the papers as fast as you can....
Howson best not worry too much about 3 years from now. Because, if he hasn't turned it around by then, he will most definitely be gone. Besides that, I'd be concerned about him trading for contracts longer than that because it ties up too many things and could result in many untradeable contracts.

Nash isn't going to have to expand anything. There are reasonable offers to be had. There was at least one made at the deadline. Howson needs to work with what he has and if I was Nash's agent, I'd start leaking some of the offers to put the pressure on him to move forward instead of needlessly expanding his trade list which may not yield any better offers and will drag this on for no good reason.

CapnCornelius is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 11:28 AM
  #983
EspenK
Registered User
 
EspenK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,041
vCash: 500
If Nash ok'd Anaheim I'd trade him for Bobby Ryan. If Anaheim threw in something else great, but a proven scorer like Ryan works for me.

And I agree that if Carter brought JMFJ and a #1 to expect too much more than that for Nash is along the lines of no mother ever had an ugly daughter.

EspenK is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 12:22 PM
  #984
thrillermiller89
Registered User
 
thrillermiller89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: San Jose
Country: United States
Posts: 1,381
vCash: 500
awesome feedback on my "nash for ryan" post

thanks everybody

thrillermiller89 is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 12:35 PM
  #985
Roadman
Moving On
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: London OH
Country: United States
Posts: 2,591
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
If Nash ok'd Anaheim I'd trade him for Bobby Ryan. If Anaheim threw in something else great, but a proven scorer like Ryan works for me. r.
Then why make the trade? The idea of trading Nash was to gain multiple pieces that would, in time, improve the team. Nash 1 for 1 sounds like making a trade for the sake of making a trade.

Not sure what motivation there is for either side.

__________________
__________________

I post, therefore I am.
Roadman is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 12:58 PM
  #986
EspenK
Registered User
 
EspenK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,041
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadman View Post
Then why make the trade? The idea of trading Nash was to gain multiple pieces that would, in time, improve the team. Nash 1 for 1 sounds like making a trade for the sake of making a trade.

Not sure what motivation there is for either side.
um, er, Nash requested a trade. Its been said a lot that in a Nash trade the other team gets the best player. In a Nash for Ryan deal I think the players are pretty close in value. In fact if you look at just the numbers Ryan has a slight edge over the last three years. Add in he is younger and less expensive. Why not make the trade?

Not saying its the only deal to do - just one that I'd definitely make if it was on the table. If there were others it would depend on what else was offered.

And from Anaheim's perspective it gives them an equal player who is locked into a long term contract and who might help re-ignite the Getzlaff-Perry combo. And if it doesn't and if Getzlaff and/or Perry walk via free agency next year they still have a bona fide starfor another 5 years.

Also from what I have read, Ryan was somewhat of a whipping boy for the Duck fans and perhaps the management.

EspenK is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 12:59 PM
  #987
thrillermiller89
Registered User
 
thrillermiller89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: San Jose
Country: United States
Posts: 1,381
vCash: 500
i think the biggest problem facing the blue jackets, other than acquiring a starting-caliber goalie, is the fact that they do not have a bonafide top line.

And if they trade nash, depending on the return (which is likely to consist of prospects/picks), then they won't even have a top line player on their roster.

Columbus has very difficult decisions ahead. I hope they rebuild this thing the right way.

thrillermiller89 is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:27 PM
  #988
Cash for Nash
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,568
vCash: 500
For what its worth (re: Nash) Rimmer reported on the CBJ morning show that WOTS is the Boston Bruins are really making a push to land Nash in a month. I'd assume this deal would not include Rask or Thomas so one can speculate.

Again its "Rimmer" so take it with a grain of salt but they were the only team he mentioned.

Cash for Nash is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:33 PM
  #989
Shaun
Registered User
 
Shaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Country: Italy
Posts: 20,636
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash for Nash View Post
For what its worth (re: Nash) Rimmer reported on the CBJ morning show that WOTS is the Boston Bruins are really making a push to land Nash in a month. I'd assume this deal would not include Rask or Thomas so one can speculate.

Again its "Rimmer" so take it with a grain of salt but they were the only team he mentioned.
Do you have a link? I wouldn't be surprised if Nash ended up in Boston even though I think hes overpaid.

Shaun is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:39 PM
  #990
Viqsi
"They're back."
 
Viqsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The Scary Internet
Country: United States
Posts: 20,095
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Viqsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnCornelius View Post
Nash isn't going to have to expand anything. There are reasonable offers to be had. There was at least one made at the deadline.
I hope to G-d Almighty that this isn't a reference to the rumored NYR offer. Yeah, the Rangers were giving up more assets than they should... but how many of those assets were useful to the Jackets, particularly in light of giving up a major scorer like Nash?

__________________
Remember - when you're a hockey fan, it's not "reckless driving", it's "good forechecking".
"Viqsi, you are our sweet humanist..." --mt-svk on the CBJ boards

Thanks, Howson, for cleaning up MacLean's toxic waste. Welcome, Kekalainen; let's get good things built!
Viqsi is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:48 PM
  #991
CBJBrassard16
Sergei BobTrollsky
 
CBJBrassard16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 11,791
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash for Nash View Post
For what its worth (re: Nash) Rimmer reported on the CBJ morning show that WOTS is the Boston Bruins are really making a push to land Nash in a month. I'd assume this deal would not include Rask or Thomas so one can speculate.

Again its "Rimmer" so take it with a grain of salt but they were the only team he mentioned.
I remember Rimmer saying he didn't believe the CBJ were shopping Nash at all around the trade deadline. His word means crock.

CBJBrassard16 is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:50 PM
  #992
Mayor Bee
\/me_____you\/
 
Mayor Bee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 13,583
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash for Nash View Post
For what its worth (re: Nash) Rimmer reported on the CBJ morning show that WOTS is the Boston Bruins are really making a push to land Nash in a month. I'd assume this deal would not include Rask or Thomas so one can speculate.

Again its "Rimmer" so take it with a grain of salt but they were the only team he mentioned.
Looking at Boston, I have no idea how they could possibly frame this into a deal that makes sense for both sides. I maintain that their prospect pool is too weak to work with; they have Hamilton....they have Hamilton. It depends on how you feel about Spooner, Knight, and Khokhlachev. So basically, there would have to be actual roster players coming back.

Their pending free agent are Brian Rolston, Chris Kelly, Gregory Campbell, Daniel Paille, Joe Corvo, Greg Zanon, Marty Turco, and Mike Mottau (all UFA) and Benoit Pouliot (RFA). But with the contract extensions that are starting next year, they're looking at $5 million for 5 roster players, and that doesn't take injury callups into account.

Assume that Turco and Rolston are either retiring or not coming back. Mottau is a spare part. That leaves Corvo, Zanon, Kelly, Campbell, and Paille. I'd imagine that they'll try to re-sign Kelly and Paille, with the others all up in the air. If Marc Savard retires, that would clear another $4 million in cap space, which may be put toward re-signing those two (although Kelly himself may get that much in the open market).

Basically, there's a very small number of players who Boston could move that would have value. They'd be looking at gutting their forward corps, with Bergeron and Horton having NTCs. Which leaves....Lucic? Krejci? Seguin? Peverley? Shawn Thornton? Draft picks...Boston picks 24th in the first round.

Basically, the only pieces I can see in play are Lucic, Krejci, Seguin, Peverley, the first-rounder (24th), and Tim Thomas (whose NTC expires July 1). Is it possible for a deal to be reached in principle, that involves Boston's first-rounder being taken and then traded after July 1 as part of this deal? It's possible, but that's getting into the territory of seriously reaching.

Mayor Bee is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 01:53 PM
  #993
Viqsi
"They're back."
 
Viqsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The Scary Internet
Country: United States
Posts: 20,095
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Viqsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
Looking at Boston, I have no idea how they could possibly frame this into a deal that makes sense for both sides. I maintain that their prospect pool is too weak to work with; they have Hamilton....they have Hamilton. It depends on how you feel about Spooner, Knight, and Khokhlachev. So basically, there would have to be actual roster players coming back.

Their pending free agent are Brian Rolston, Chris Kelly, Gregory Campbell, Daniel Paille, Joe Corvo, Greg Zanon, Marty Turco, and Mike Mottau (all UFA) and Benoit Pouliot (RFA). But with the contract extensions that are starting next year, they're looking at $5 million for 5 roster players, and that doesn't take injury callups into account.

Assume that Turco and Rolston are either retiring or not coming back. Mottau is a spare part. That leaves Corvo, Zanon, Kelly, Campbell, and Paille. I'd imagine that they'll try to re-sign Kelly and Paille, with the others all up in the air. If Marc Savard retires, that would clear another $4 million in cap space, which may be put toward re-signing those two (although Kelly himself may get that much in the open market).

Basically, there's a very small number of players who Boston could move that would have value. They'd be looking at gutting their forward corps, with Bergeron and Horton having NTCs. Which leaves....Lucic? Krejci? Seguin? Peverley? Shawn Thornton? Draft picks...Boston picks 24th in the first round.

Basically, the only pieces I can see in play are Lucic, Krejci, Seguin, Peverley, the first-rounder (24th), and Tim Thomas (whose NTC expires July 1). Is it possible for a deal to be reached in principle, that involves Boston's first-rounder being taken and then traded after July 1 as part of this deal? It's possible, but that's getting into the territory of seriously reaching.
Frankly, I wouldn't see Seguin in play. That said, there's three assets in there that are expendable that I like (Krejci, Peverley, and the 1st). Dunno if those alone are enough, tho.

Viqsi is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 02:03 PM
  #994
Mayor Bee
\/me_____you\/
 
Mayor Bee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 13,583
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Frankly, I wouldn't see Seguin in play. That said, there's three assets in there that are expendable that I like (Krejci, Peverley, and the 1st). Dunno if those alone are enough, tho.
I'd throw Thomas in there too, if a deal is to be made with Boston. But I don't think his value is too terribly high, to be honest. Moving him would clear a huge amount of cap space, and the question of whether or not he's actually declining or simply had an off year is something that would have to be determined.

The other variable is that he has a $5 million cap hit, but only $3 million due in salary. Would he choose to simply retire rather than be traded? If so, what would the recourse be?

Let's say this....Nash to Boston for Krejci, Peverley, Thomas, and the 2012 1st-rounder (24th overall). If Thomas does not play a certain number of games in the 2012-13 season (which would cover retirement or injury, which is obviously a concern with a 38-year-old goalie), Boston adds their 2013 first-rounder in.

Boston adds Nash's $7.8 million cap hit. They shed Krejci's $5.25 million (his three-year extension begins July 1), Peverley's $3.25 million hit (same), Thomas' $5 million hit (one year remaining). Net savings to Boston: $5.7 million. Net addition for Columbus: $5.7 million (Thomas has a 35+ contract, so his hit counts even if he retires). Boston gets an additional $4 million savings with Savard's retirement, giving them nearly $10 million to play with without even considering the possibility of a cap increase. That gives them a legitimate chance to take a run at Parise. They'd upgrade Peverley with Nash, and need to replace Krejci and Savard up the middle.


Last edited by Mayor Bee: 05-20-2012 at 02:11 PM.
Mayor Bee is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 03:05 PM
  #995
Cash for Nash
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,568
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I hope to G-d Almighty that this isn't a reference to the rumored NYR offer. Yeah, the Rangers were giving up more assets than they should... but how many of those assets were useful to the Jackets, particularly in light of giving up a major scorer like Nash?
None....that was a poop offer. The Rangers have done a superb job of building their prospect pool with great drafting and sheer luck such as fleecing the Habs GM in trading McDonaugh for Scott "freaking" Gomez.

A trade can be had if the Rangers offer a couple top prospects such as Kreider and Erixson along with Dublinsky; however the timing has sucked with Kreider looking like a young Nash over the last two weeks. I still can't believe the Sens and Capitals didn't beat them. A phenominal goalie does wonders for a team (Henrik).

We should never consider 2nd tier prospects for a player of Nash's caliber. Ever....

Cash for Nash is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 03:13 PM
  #996
Xoggz22
Registered User
 
Xoggz22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Country: United States
Posts: 3,903
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillermiller89 View Post
what about nash for bobby ryan??
Pass. And not because of value but because this doesn't change the team. One for one makes no sense to move Nash. Ryan isn't scoring 30+ for the CBJ with the expected CBJ lineup, no connection to the community and I don't see him making the team better by his mere presence.

Xoggz22 is offline  
Old
05-20-2012, 08:18 PM
  #997
Double-Shift Lassé
Moderator
Just post better
 
Double-Shift Lassé's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Superurban Cbus
Country: United States
Posts: 17,003
vCash: 500
Maxxed. New thread open.

__________________
"Every game, every point is a necessity." -- Ty Conklin, January 2007
"I'll have a chance to compete for the post of first issue. This is the most important thing." -- Sergei Bobrovsky, June 2012
Double-Shift Lassé is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:30 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.