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Justin Schultz de-registers from Winsconsin

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Old
05-26-2012, 06:49 PM
  #76
Dado
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So, realistically, what are we looking at? Upside of Bieksa, downside of Brunnstrom?

Is that about right?

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"They have all sorts of e-mails from him basically saying, ‘I'm coming there, I'm coming there,' and suddenly, for some reason, he's not coming there."
Sounds like it might have coincided with Anaheim not making the playoffs.

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05-26-2012, 06:51 PM
  #77
John Bender
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What would lead you to believe that?

Micheal Russo is a moron. I'm pretty sure Schultz knows the score...if his agent is worth a squirt of piss he'll let Schultz know that he'll be a widely attractive commodity to numerous teams if he allows himself to become a UFA. And unless Anaheim has any actual evidence of tampering, which will be tough to obtain if there is any at all, they have no basis for the charge.
Exactly. I mean, there's no rule that he can say he's coming to the Ducks and change his mind. Unless there is compelling evidence that the Oilers spoke to him or communicated to him in some fashion, it's a dead issue.

I wish Bettman was more like Goodell sometimes though - seems there is not much to deter tampering.

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05-26-2012, 06:53 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
So, realistically, what are we looking at? Upside of Bieksa, downside of Brunnstrom?

Is that about right?
I read on TSN (after educating myself) that the upside is more like a Suter - a guy that can control a game.

Thank god we did not get Brunnstrom. Remember all the excitement about him coming to Vancouver?

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05-26-2012, 06:54 PM
  #79
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I read on TSN (after educating myself) that the upside is more like a Suter - a guy that can control a game.
I suspect that says more about TSN than it does about Schulz.


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05-26-2012, 06:55 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by EricTheGiant View Post
I read on TSN (after educating myself) that the upside is more like a Suter - a guy that can control a game.

Thank god we did not get Brunnstrom. Remember all the excitement about him coming to Vancouver?


At the time he would still have been a top 9 player on our roster...basically for free

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05-26-2012, 06:59 PM
  #81
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Shultz-gate.
If that really is all the evidence they have (I doubt it is, but still) then they have no real case at all. All Schultz would have to say is that he had a change of mind regarding wanting to play in Anaheim and that would be the end of it. Unless the Ducks can come up with some concrete evidence showing WHICH team was tampering, they won't be able to win the case. Proving that he was tampered with is one thing, but proving that the team that signed him is 100% the team that tampered with him is another thing all together.

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05-26-2012, 07:18 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by thecupismine View Post
If that really is all the evidence they have (I doubt it is, but still) then they have no real case at all. All Schultz would have to say is that he had a change of mind regarding wanting to play in Anaheim and that would be the end of it. Unless the Ducks can come up with some concrete evidence showing WHICH team was tampering, they won't be able to win the case. Proving that he was tampered with is one thing, but proving that the team that signed him is 100% the team that tampered with him is another thing all together.
Unless the parties involves were really stupid - difficult to prove tampering.

Just look at all those UFA signings involving complicated contracts signed mere seconds (or seemingly seconds) after the start of free agency. Anybody *really* think those type of deals were not only negotiated but signed in just a matter of moments?

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05-26-2012, 07:28 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Socratic Method Man View Post
On the main boards there was an article posted that cited a hockey writer (I believe for Minnesota) who believes Toronto will sign him. He sounds like he knows some details about the situation. He also believes the Ducks are preparing to file for tampering charges, as he believes a team has been tampering with the situation. (Toronto). But he says he is only guessing, so it might not be the Leafs.
Doubt it would be Toronto involved with tampering in this case - Burke and Bob Murray are very good friends and have made a ton of deals together. As much as I can't stand Burke, hard to imagine he'd pull that on Murray.

As for a tampering case, who knows. A guy changing his mind isn't evidence. If they have emails and hard evidence he was in contact with another team, that's a different ballgame.

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05-26-2012, 07:58 PM
  #84
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I can just see Gillis making this happen seemingly by the book only to have a series of "I like u, do u like me?" emails between AV and Schultz revealed during a tampering investigation.


Last edited by PRNuck: 05-27-2012 at 12:05 AM.
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Old
05-26-2012, 09:54 PM
  #85
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Doubt it would be Toronto involved with tampering in this case - Burke and Bob Murray are very good friends and have made a ton of deals together. As much as I can't stand Burke, hard to imagine he'd pull that on Murray.

As for a tampering case, who knows. A guy changing his mind isn't evidence. If they have emails and hard evidence he was in contact with another team, that's a different ballgame.
If all they have is the e-mails of him saying he's coming to Anaheim and then suddenly changing his mind, they wouldn't have much to stand on.

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05-26-2012, 10:29 PM
  #86
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Russo is only good for Wild info, everything else his guess is as good as ours.

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05-27-2012, 12:13 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
I suspect that says more about TSN than it does about Schulz.

Don't be mistaken: Schultz is widely considered to be the best defenseman to play college hockey this past season, and was very close the year before. He was always better than Jake Gardiner. And some analysts have said he is the best defensman not yet in the NHL. Now, that might be difficult, with Dougie Hamilton and maybe one or two other guys at that level who are not yet in the NHL. But Schultz is right up there. His skill level is very high.

As for his upside; it is higher than Bieksa. Although, I am not sure I would compare him to Suter - based on his style, to me he seems more in the mold of Lidstrom. But as for level of talent, his highest upside may be around either of these guys.

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05-27-2012, 01:17 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Socratic Method Man View Post
And some analysts have said he is the best defensman not yet in the NHL.
Fabian Brunnstrom was hyped us as the best player not in the NHL.

The Monster was hyped up as the best goalie not in the NHL.

Maybe Schulz makes it, maybe he doesn't - it's a crapshoot, no matter what a TSN analyst says (or doesn't say).

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05-27-2012, 01:20 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
Fabian Brunnstrom was hyped us as the best player not in the NHL.

The Monster was hyped up as the best goalie not in the NHL.

Maybe Schulz makes it, maybe he doesn't - it's a crapshoot, no matter what a TSN analyst says (or doesn't say).
That never happened.

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05-27-2012, 02:04 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
Fabian Brunnstrom was hyped us as the best player not in the NHL.

The Monster was hyped up as the best goalie not in the NHL.

Maybe Schulz makes it, maybe he doesn't - it's a crapshoot, no matter what a TSN analyst says (or doesn't say).
You realize he was the highest scoring defenseman in college hockey the past 2 seasons? I'm not saying he's any gaurantee to be a star... I suppose it's hypothetically possible he doesn't even make the NHL. But there is also the chance Jonathan Huberdeau doesn't become a star, or Dougie Hamilton. The point is, Schultz has the credentials. He is at the level of Dougie Hamilton.

Several scouting sites post prospect rankings. I believe HF does one once a year, and I believe Schultz was rated as the 25th best prospect in hockey. Consider all the players in all the leagues Schultz is up against; Charlie Coyle in the Q, Yevgeni Kuznetsof in the KHL, Mikael Granlund in Finland etc. Schultz is up against a wide range of talent. People who professionally scout hockey believe he is a fairly rare talent.

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05-27-2012, 02:27 AM
  #91
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Apparently the Leafs had tried to acquire Schultz from Anaheim when they traded Beauchemin but instead settled on his college teammate Gardiner as Anaheim thought Schultz was a more valuable asset. Some food for thought:

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1153129

Could those emails be between ex-teammates Gardiner and Schultz? Who knows, but I highly doubt that Anaheim will allow the Leafs to get both players so cheaply. I sure hope we (Vancouver) are able to acquire this player although I won't be expecting it.

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05-27-2012, 11:32 AM
  #92
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The point is, Schultz has the credentials. He is at the level of Dougie Hamilton.
No, he's not, as (at a minimum) Hamilton has gotten to that point 3 years sooner.

Or put another way, Schultz is already 3 years behind Hamilton.

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05-27-2012, 11:34 AM
  #93
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That never happened.
Sure it did.

"Turns out, he was. In the same way that Fabian Brunnstrom was "the best player outside the NHL" when Toronto was courting him."

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2012/...adline_brophy/

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05-27-2012, 11:36 AM
  #94
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Could those emails be between ex-teammates Gardiner and Schultz?
Gardiner and Schultz can say whatever they want to one another.

With regards to email between Schultz and a third party, how on earth would the Ducks get access to those (in a way that they can use them without looking even worse than Gardiner's camp in this hypothetical scenario)?

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05-27-2012, 12:34 PM
  #95
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Sure it did.

"Turns out, he was. In the same way that Fabian Brunnstrom was "the best player outside the NHL" when Toronto was courting him."

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2012/...adline_brophy/
Just because Mark Spector says it, doesn't make it so. I'd be inclined to believe the opposite of anything he says.

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05-27-2012, 12:38 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
Fabian Brunnstrom was hyped us as the best player not in the NHL.

The Monster was hyped up as the best goalie not in the NHL.

Maybe Schulz makes it, maybe he doesn't - it's a crapshoot, no matter what a TSN analyst says (or doesn't say).
Brunnstrom had nothing in his resume that would make any knowledgeable person think he was the best player not in the NHL. He wasn't even a Top 30 player (hell, not even a 1st liner) in the SEL when he was signed.

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05-27-2012, 12:46 PM
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Brunnstrom had nothing in his resume that would make any knowledgeable person think he was the best player not in the NHL. He wasn't even a Top 30 player (hell, not even a 1st liner) in the SEL when he was signed.
I'm not arguing that he was.

Nor am I arguing that Schultz isn't.

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05-27-2012, 01:11 PM
  #98
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The only thing I remember hearing hyped up about Brunnstrom was that he could be the next Alfredsson.

They were probably hyped up as being the "best undrafted player not in the NHL" but that's completely different from the "best player not in the NHL". Spector's just retrospectively tagging those terms on to increase the gap between the hype and where they are now.


Schultz, on the other hand, is a drafted player who has shown that he's the best defenseman in the NCAA, which is no small feat. Best defenseman outside the NHL? Probably not, but at least with Schultz there's a reasonable comparison in his former teammate Jake Gardiner, who quickly rose to be one of the Leafs best D-men.

It's not out of the realm of possibility that he comes in and makes an impact right away. We shouldn't hype him to be the solution to all of our D woes, but at a max ELC, it would be foolish to not pursue him. There's absolutely no risk.

Now if the Canucks don't sign him, then that's the way it goes, so long as Gillis does everything in his power (save for tampering) to get Schultz to sign here, then that's all that we ask.

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05-27-2012, 01:12 PM
  #99
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Whether Schultz pans out or not you take a chance on him. If he was draft eligible I'm assuming he'd be picked in the top 10 if not 5. Not all high picks or prospects pan out doesn't mean you don't take them. It's a crapshoot with all players picked look at Pavel Brendl what did he ever do and I'm sure theres plenty more. Whether or not he turns into a star or even makes team you sign him if you can and get a chance at a high ceiling player.

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05-27-2012, 01:25 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by armchairgmvancouver View Post
Whether Schultz pans out or not you take a chance on him.
Considering the amount of prospects we currently have in the organization that are right side offensive D - it only adds to the reason to go after him.

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