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Ryan Kesler Unhappy?

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Old
05-28-2012, 08:23 PM
  #326
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
I was thinking the other day, Eller would be a perfect fit for the 3rd line center spot in Vancouver.

What is he worth on his own MTL fans? Not getting Kesler or Edler without adding something significant ie. Subban or Paciocretty.
Habs wouldn't even think about it.
Rather have P.K. and Patches over Kesler and edler.

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05-28-2012, 08:35 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Habs don't have the depth to manage this. Kesler is indeed an upgrade over Plekanec alone, but he's also going to miss some time, and while the Canucks maybe can afford that, the Habs can't afford to start the season with the void it would leave at center. As one factor. But even beyond that, the Habs are too thin, and need to keep Plekanec and also hope for continued emergence from Eller.
This answer makes the most sense. Canucks wouldn't do it either because it doesn't make them a stronger team for the playoffs.

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Old
05-28-2012, 08:40 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by Mahleezer View Post
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Nice Job Madhabber!!


I can agree that Kesler is a bit better offensively then Plecky however Plecky is much better defensively than Kessler.

I always thought both Kessler and Plecky were very comparable players. The diffrences being minor in each and the impact to their team of identical importance.

Would I trade Plecky for Kessler 1 for 1... yeah I would but for Plecky and Eller, not gonna happen.

As Madhabber has stated, the stats are not that far off between the 2 players... Kessler is simply riding on his 41 goal season of 2010-11 to make him look more sexy as a player.

Give Plecky two regular linemates instead of playing musical chairs and his numbers should improve.
Since when?

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Old
05-28-2012, 08:53 PM
  #329
Socratic Method Man
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What do you think of my trade proposal?

Your star
for
My good players


Nah


Well your star sucks anyways, I wouldn't trade anyone on my team for him

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Old
05-28-2012, 09:09 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post
Kesler has been a constant contender the last few years for the selke and has won it.

Plekanec is a good defender himself but no where near as good as Kesler.

They are also not comparable offensively. Obviously career wise they will be because Kesler was stuck on the 3rd line for half his career because He was not going to displace Henrik Sedin or Brendan Morrison. Back then the Canucks had arguably the best 1st line in the league so he wasn't getting playing time either.

It wasn't until the 08/09 season he became our 2nd line center without having to fill in for an injury. What do u know, thats the same season his offensive game took off.

Comparing them from 08/09 til now, its quite clear Kesler is the better offensive player. Please don't use the top defenders argument because Kesler was facing them just as much as the Sedins were. Not to mention Kesler was on the ice mostly when the other teams top line was on the ice. I don't know if its the same for Pleks where he played againstthe top players of other team but if he didn't that more than enough makes up for and exceeds not playing against the top defenders all the time
Yes, Kesler won a selke with a pretty terrific team. Pleks plays PK situations and is typically on against the oppositions best line. He's played the last few years with a revolving bunch of line mates and his offensive output has suffered as a result. Kesler v Pleks yes Kesler is a marginally better player but the divide is not as wide as you imply.

Personally I don't do this trade from a Habs POV.

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Old
05-28-2012, 09:28 PM
  #331
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Am I the only one who thinks this entire topic is ludicrous?

AV said something Kesler probably didn't like. So? How on Earth does that mean he's looking for a trade, or that the Canucks are looking to trade him? And for what? Plekanic? How does that fill any of their needs?

The Canucks need 1 or 2 top-4 D-men (depending if Salo stays or goes), and ideally a playmaking RW. They have no desire to trade Kesler, and *absolutely* no desire to downgrade on offense.

This entire thread makes no sense.

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Old
05-28-2012, 09:44 PM
  #332
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Originally Posted by LiquidSnake View Post
OWNED. well done.
That's probably your reply when Naslund was in decline too. Too bad that the truth hurts eh?

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Old
05-28-2012, 09:49 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by xlnc66 View Post
That's probably your reply when Naslund was in decline too. Too bad that the truth hurts eh?
The decline started with Steve Moore's elbow, got 1000x worse losing Bertuzzi and his style of play after he went crazy, and ended, in Vancouver, playing with guys that would need injuries to crack the top six of a lottery team.

Until Henrik cracks Keith open like a ripe melon, and his subsequent banishment from the league, and Daniel playing with the likes of Dale Weise and Aaron Volpatti for 2/3rds of a season, we only have 1 out of three factors that might come up.

Thanks for coming out though.

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Old
05-28-2012, 10:04 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by Boondock View Post
It's obvious that you dislike the Canucks, but you are letting your hatred cloud your reason. No Canuck fan has said if they stand pat they will win a cup, but a few tweaks will help a lot more then moving big pieces of their core. Luo isn't the worst contract in hockey, so that's just a flat out un-truth. With the potential to trade Luo (5.3), Ballard (4.2), and a good possibility that Raymond isn't going to be qualified (2.55) there is cap relief. So with Lack replacing Schneider, and Schneider replacing Luongo the Canucks would have roughly 16.5 million to fill 5 roster spots - so cap isn't a huge issue. Canucks are an elite team even with the 1st round knock out and will push for the top of the league again next year.
Schneider is due for a big raise. he'll get at least 4 million total salary. Whoever plays backup will get at least what Schneider makes now. So if Luongo is moved you're looking at one million max in cap savings there.

Raymond won't be qualified, but you still need to find a replacement. Forty plus point wingers do not come cheap on the free agent market.

Moving Ballard is easier said than done. Plus you then need to find a replacement for Salo.

basically what I'm saying is getting rid of Luongo won't create that much space.

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Old
05-28-2012, 10:16 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by redthrowaway View Post
Am I the only one who thinks this entire topic is ludicrous?

AV said something Kesler probably didn't like. So? How on Earth does that mean he's looking for a trade, or that the Canucks are looking to trade him? And for what? Plekanic? How does that fill any of their needs?

The Canucks need 1 or 2 top-4 D-men (depending if Salo stays or goes), and ideally a playmaking RW. They have no desire to trade Kesler, and *absolutely* no desire to downgrade on offense.

This entire thread makes no sense.
Downgrade on offense.Kesler is a .60 ppg career player while Pleks is a .65 ppg career player and Pleks out pointed him on a much weaker team.

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Old
05-28-2012, 10:19 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
There is no way in this universe that it would cost Patches AND Pleks to get Kesler. No real self respecting Hab fan with half a brain would offer that. Heck I would not do Patches straight up for Kesler.
Then you wouldn't get Kesler. I am a fan of both teams and Kesler is simply a better player than Pacioretty. Could that change in the long haul, certainly, but until such an occurrence it is Montreal who adds to Pacioretty if they want Kesler. That said, it would be a foolish trade for the Habs. Kesler needs scorers and moving Pacioretty would leave Montreal incredibly thin in that aspect.

Wish Cole was available though. He would be fantastic with Kesler.

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Old
05-28-2012, 10:35 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
The decline started with Steve Moore's elbow, got 1000x worse losing Bertuzzi and his style of play after he went crazy, and ended, in Vancouver, playing with guys that would need injuries to crack the top six of a lottery team.

Until Henrik cracks Keith open like a ripe melon, and his subsequent banishment from the league, and Daniel playing with the likes of Dale Weise and Aaron Volpatti for 2/3rds of a season, we only have 1 out of three factors that might come up.

Thanks for coming out though.
What i see is Henrik dropping off in 2 consecutive years by a total of 31 points. Oh wait, cue the, oh the scoring is down in the league excuses. It's kinda funny how the 8 guys who had the same amount of points or more as Henrik, all had their production increase from the season before. Not to mention that the Canucks finished 5th in league in GF while the lowely Islanders finished 28th in goals, yet John Tavares was still able to score the same amount of points as Hank with weaker linemates. Oh but he did finish 1st in the west though

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05-28-2012, 10:43 PM
  #338
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Kesler vs the Preds last year was something special. That was the last time he was fully healthy - before the nagging hip injury slowed him down, and his shoulder injury nulified his physical game. He also bagged 40 goals in his last healthy season. No way we do this deal, or deal him in general - without being offered something outrageous....

Gillis wants size, and Kesler is bigger than either of the 2 offered. Don't see that happening.

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Old
05-28-2012, 10:44 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Drive425 View Post
Yes, Kesler won a selke with a pretty terrific team. Pleks plays PK situations and is typically on against the oppositions best line. He's played the last few years with a revolving bunch of line mates and his offensive output has suffered as a result. Kesler v Pleks yes Kesler is a marginally better player but the divide is not as wide as you imply.

Personally I don't do this trade from a Habs POV.
Kesler is in the same boat plays against top lines with a revolving door of wingers except Kesler's offense didnt suffer and his wingers were worse than Plek's

Pleks has Patches, Gionta, Bourque, Cole, Desharnis
Kesler has Booth, Higgins, Raymond, Hansen, Lapierre

So Kesler has the worse revolving door of line mates and does more with them

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Old
05-28-2012, 11:33 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post
Kesler is in the same boat plays against top lines with a revolving door of wingers except Kesler's offense didnt suffer and his wingers were worse than Plek's

Pleks has Patches, Gionta, Bourque, Cole, Desharnis
Kesler has Booth, Higgins, Raymond, Hansen, Lapierre

So Kesler has the worse revolving door of line mates and does more with them
lol, kind of difficult for Plekanec to play with Desharnais, Pacioretty and Cole, when those three are on the same line. And Gionta was hurt most of the season. Try Bourque, White, Moen, Darche, Blunden.

Plekanec also doesn't have the Sedins to feed him easy points on the PP.

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Old
05-28-2012, 11:46 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
Not downplaying Kesler, or Plekanec, or anyone who's considered a 2 way player, but if Malkin back checked more consistently you'd see him winning Selkes
Uh... yeah, but, he doesn't. So he wins no Selkes. He wins Art Ross's.

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05-29-2012, 12:50 AM
  #342
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Not even if your pluses were the 2 sisters. Tavares has way more value than Kesler, especially with his injury.

There is zero chance that Tavares is moving for anything short of Crosby/Malkin and you don't have either of them.
I'm VERY far from a Canuck fan but this post is simply ludicrous. Kesler and the Twins would win the division and likely make you contenders....Tavares alone has you in the lottery....AGAIN.

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05-29-2012, 12:51 AM
  #343
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Habs wouldn't even think about it.
Rather have P.K. and Patches over Kesler and edler.
That's exactly why you aren't a GM in the league. Edler was top 5 in defense scoring this year, while Kesler is a year removed from winning the Selke and having a 40 goal year, lets not forget the fact he was one Vancouver win away from likely winning the Conn Smythe. Pacioretty and Subban have nothing on the Vancouver duo.

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05-29-2012, 01:22 AM
  #344
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Yeah, what?

Edler has been rock solid for a few years, produces, and Kesler is easily worth Pacioretty even if both were centers. I like what Subban can bring, but Edler and Kesler combined do more for the Canadiens than Pacioretty and Subban, in a vacuum.

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05-29-2012, 01:26 AM
  #345
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You never trade a center like Kesler for a winger unless he's a top 5 in the league. It's such a valuable position and with a guy as good defensively as Kesler it would make no sense. Subban and Edler are close, Edler has proven more but Subban can be just as good if not better in time.

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Old
05-29-2012, 01:44 AM
  #346
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Originally Posted by NugentHopkinsfan View Post
You never trade a center like Kesler for a winger unless he's a top 5 in the league. It's such a valuable position and with a guy as good defensively as Kesler it would make no sense. Subban and Edler are close, Edler has proven more but Subban can be just as good if not better in time.
Subban is better than Edler

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Old
05-29-2012, 01:53 AM
  #347
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I should hope that Kesler is unhappy, along with all the other Canucks, with that first round exit.

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Old
05-29-2012, 01:53 AM
  #348
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Subban is better than Edler
Yeah.. Scoring less points , having a worse plus minus and being a liability by taking idiotic penalties totally make him better than Edler.

Pk subban is a good and has the Potential to be better than Edler, but as of right now he is not.

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05-29-2012, 02:14 AM
  #349
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lol, kind of difficult for Plekanec to play with Desharnais, Pacioretty and Cole, when those three are on the same line. And Gionta was hurt most of the season. Try Bourque, White, Moen, Darche, Blunden.

Plekanec also doesn't have the Sedins to feed him easy points on the PP.
Which one is it? top line or bad wingers?

Guess I can't trust Habs fans so using behind the net i figured it out.

this season Plekanic's top 5 vs 5 line mates were:
1. Rene Bourque
2. Brian Gionta
3. Mike Cammalleri
4. Travis Moen
5. Erik Cole

Kesler's were:
1. David Booth
2. Chris Higgins
3. Mason Raymond
4. Jannik Hansen
5. Alex Burrows

Offensively speaking:
Bourque << Booth
Gionta > Higgins
Cammalleri >>>> Raymond
Moen = Hansen
Cole > Burrows

So Pleks did have the better line mates and he was 2nd in ice time for centers meaning he did play on the 2nd line

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Old
05-29-2012, 02:52 AM
  #350
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Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post

Offensively speaking:
Bourque << Booth
Gionta > Higgins
Cammalleri >>>> Raymond
Moen = Hansen
Cole > Burrows

So Pleks did have the better line mates and he was 2nd in ice time for centers meaning he did play on the 2nd line
This is the most incoherent and surprisingly common line of reasoning I've seen on this site.

Camm > Booth
Bork > Higgins
Gionta > Raymond
Cole > Burrows
Moen = Hansen.

Ergo Plekanec had the better linemates by a country mile.

This sort of silly means of comparison and evaluation needs to stop. It doesn't prove anything and is completely useless in determining anything. It's downright bad. Just stop.

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