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The Illusion of Depth

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Old
05-29-2012, 03:21 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Barely. To be honest, I think comparing him to Mitchell was over-stating his physicality. He's not afraid of contact, but to me, being "physical" means initiating contact and doing it often.

Jones doesn't create offense. Which is what we need.
Creativity is a word I find myself repeating over and over when watching the Rangers - usually while bashing my head against the wall because they possess so little of it.

Richards and Stepan are the only guys that are the least bit creative with the puck. Gaborik is the least creative 40 goal scorer I've ever seen in my life.

Its a real problem. And probably the biggest factor as to why the powerplay sucks and this team cant collectively put the puck in the net.

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05-29-2012, 03:45 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Creativity is a word I find myself repeating over and over when watching the Rangers - usually while bashing my head against the wall because they possess so little of it.

Richards and Stepan are the only guys that are the least bit creative with the puck. Gaborik is the least creative 40 goal scorer I've ever seen in my life.

Its a real problem. And probably the biggest factor as to why the powerplay sucks and this team cant collectively put the puck in the net.
I love the guys on this team -- most of them at least -- but there is very little ability to do anything other than go straight up the ice, dump the puck, and then go get it. Board work is fantastic, and necessary, but you're not going to find yourself scoring from the boards very often. If guys can't find seams and create shooting lanes, you're going to spend a lot of time chasing the puck when it ends up in your own end. Worse, if you run into a goalie who can handle the puck like Brodeur, it almost entirely nullifies your dump and chase strategy. Ya can't pin the goalie to the boards behind the net.

This team needs some people who can do something other than work the boards and crash the net. Having a system is great, and getting people to buy into that system is wonderful, but having an entire roster of players who play the same way? That's not only entirely unrealistic, but foolish as well. Look at the teams in the SCF. They both have a balanced mix of skill and grit. Elias and Kovalchuk sure as hell aren't defensive stalwarts, or masters at working the boards, but that's fine because they have guys that can compliment them by doing those things.

Find someone who can do something other than flip the puck into the corner. That's a good start.

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05-29-2012, 09:05 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
At various points this season, especially on this board, I've seen the Rangers depth be commended time and time again. Personally, I had a problem with it then and I still have a problem with it, considering lack of depth is what eventually ended this team's run.

The defense, while the least of this team's problems, still lacks considerable depth. McDonagh, Staal, and Girardi are as solid as they come. Del Zotto is a wildcard as Im not completely sold on his mental toughness. The third pairing was rescued by Anton Stralman, but still needed to choose between Bickel and Eminger. Thats not depth - its top heavy, and the opposite of depth.

On offense, its far, far worse. This is a team that went 19 straight playoff games without scoring more than 3 goals. It was only a matter of time before their offensive shortcomings (and lack of depth) became exposed. Its almost poetic justice that it came at the hands of a team that rolled 4 lines, and possessed a 4th line capable of scoring big and timely goals. Could anyone imagine the Prust - Mitchell - Rupp combo contributing in such a manner? Or even the 3rd line? Or even the second line at times?

The first step is admitting this team has a depth problem, which may be difficult for several people. The second step is figuring out what can be done about it.
Good Thread. I would like to hear what Gorton thinks about this>

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05-29-2012, 09:10 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Drewbackatu View Post
Wow, the truth shall set us realistic Ranger's fans free! Well done pal.
There is a propensity on this forum to
1) Overrate our prospects
2) Overrate the players we have on
our present roster.

If it wasn't obvious before or during the season(and it wasn't as I had countless battles with many fans who post here about Maryanne Gaborik, Michael Del Zaster, Brad Dubinsky and others), it should be crystal clear now after about as weak, lackluster and lackadaisical performance by a team in going 10-10 in their trip to the ECF.

That being said, what the hell do we do about it. Our crackerjack general manager will be entering his 12th year at the helm(mind boggling as it may seem) and we have developed "One Lousy Superstar" (Hank) under his reign and one possible superstar to be(McDonagh) in a good trade that he made. Have we drafted better the past 5+ years? Yes.
Are we doing better developing young talent? Yes.

However, we still have many holes to fill up front in order to make this team bigger, tougher, grittier with more offensive skill and much tougher to play against in the playoffs.

Now it's up to the senile old man Savior to get off his ass and figure it all out while the Devils(our main rival who didn't make the playoffs last year) go for their 4th Stanley Cup in 17 years while we wallow in failure.

Kind of brings out the hostilities in you, don't it??
Really felt like Washingtons skill, size, and speed especially from the forwards was embarrasing. There was a dump them or keep them article in the post I believe and I felt like I wanted to dump more than I should have

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05-29-2012, 09:16 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
David Jones would not be more of the same.

Where on the roster is the 6-3, 220 physical power forward that can score 20+ goals per season? I don't see him.

He had two independent fluke injuries. I wouldn't be too concerned about them now. He could provide this team a lot of good.
If he can be a 3rd line rightwing, then that is exactly what we need. Keep prust on the 4th line.

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05-29-2012, 09:19 PM
  #81
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Sarich and Wideman are the two UFAs that stand out to me... both being righty D-men.
Also Bryan Allen if the price is right?

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05-29-2012, 09:21 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by wafflepadsave View Post
Also Bryan Allen if the price is right?
He's a lefty, but I believe he plays a fair bit on the right.

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05-29-2012, 09:34 PM
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He's a lefty, but I believe he plays a fair bit on the right.
Could certainly cover up for DelZotto

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05-30-2012, 09:26 AM
  #84
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If the Rangers are unwilling to make a long-term commitment at this juncture and/or simply dont like the trade/free agency landscape, I'd be very intrigued with making a 1-year offer to Ray Whitney as a stopgag depth move.

Sure, hes old, but hes damn creative and had a great season with Phoenix. Hes just what the Rangers would need considering they are young and gritty enough.

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05-30-2012, 09:50 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
If the Rangers are unwilling to make a long-term commitment at this juncture and/or simply dont like the trade/free agency landscape, I'd be very intrigued with making a 1-year offer to Ray Whitney as a stopgag depth move.

Sure, hes old, but hes damn creative and had a great season with Phoenix. Hes just what the Rangers would need considering they are young and gritty enough.
I worry about his age. He looked every bit of 40 in the playoffs.

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05-30-2012, 12:38 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
If the Rangers are unwilling to make a long-term commitment at this juncture and/or simply dont like the trade/free agency landscape, I'd be very intrigued with making a 1-year offer to Ray Whitney as a stopgag depth move.

Sure, hes old, but hes damn creative and had a great season with Phoenix. Hes just what the Rangers would need considering they are young and gritty enough.
Not a Torts guy. We should have kept Drury for this. Younger too.

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05-30-2012, 12:52 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
At various points this season, especially on this board, I've seen the Rangers depth be commended time and time again. Personally, I had a problem with it then and I still have a problem with it, considering lack of depth is what eventually ended this team's run.

The defense, while the least of this team's problems, still lacks considerable depth. McDonagh, Staal, and Girardi are as solid as they come. Del Zotto is a wildcard as Im not completely sold on his mental toughness. The third pairing was rescued by Anton Stralman, but still needed to choose between Bickel and Eminger. Thats not depth - its top heavy, and the opposite of depth.

On offense, its far, far worse. This is a team that went 19 straight playoff games without scoring more than 3 goals. It was only a matter of time before their offensive shortcomings (and lack of depth) became exposed. Its almost poetic justice that it came at the hands of a team that rolled 4 lines, and possessed a 4th line capable of scoring big and timely goals. Could anyone imagine the Prust - Mitchell - Rupp combo contributing in such a manner? Or even the 3rd line? Or even the second line at times?

The first step is admitting this team has a depth problem, which may be difficult for several people. The second step is figuring out what can be done about it.
I agree but you have to give the current group of young forwards at least another year to see that next jump.

No point in going out and acquiring high-end talent when we might have our own developing.

Kelly Miller and Mike Ridley for Carpenter, Weight, Amonte, Zamuner, Marchant, Middleton for Hodge, Lisin for Korpikoski.

I say wait. No reason to rush.

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05-30-2012, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
I agree but you have to give the current group of young forwards at least another year to see that next jump.

No point in going out and acquiring high-end talent when we might have our own developing.

Kelly Miller and Mike Ridley for Carpenter, Weight, Amonte, Zamuner, Marchant, Middleton for Hodge, Lisin for Korpikoski.

I say wait. No reason to rush.
Your best players (Lundqvist, Richards, Gaborik) are all on the wrong side of 30.

So, there is a bit of a reason to rush.

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05-30-2012, 01:10 PM
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Not a Torts guy. We should have kept Drury for this. Younger too.
Whens the last time Drury had a 77 point NHL season? (Ill save you the trouble - never). Drury was also never the creative type, so Im not sure where that comparison is coming from.

I worry about Whitney's age, but I wouldnt mind him as a 1 year flier if the trade and free agency landscape dont pan out.

I'll be very disappointed if this team doesnt upgrade its offensive skill in some way. Kicking back and hoping the young players improve to be consistent point producers is not going to get this team any further.

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05-30-2012, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I'll be very disappointed if this team doesnt upgrade its offensive skill in some way. Kicking back and hoping the young players improve to be consistent point producers is not going to get this team any further.
After shipping Wolski to FLA (one single shot team depth reduction) Sather has cap money to burn. I want Semin, if not Nash.

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05-30-2012, 01:41 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Your best players (Lundqvist, Richards, Gaborik) are all on the wrong side of 30.

So, there is a bit of a reason to rush.
They just hit 30.

They dont play the kind of game where their skills were erode lightning quick. It will be gradual.

Heck, Messier's best season as a Ranger was arguably 1996 -- his fifth season with the team and at 35 years old.

They can go one more year with this group.

2013 is a great UFA crop. If they bottom out in 2013, nobody really develops and Henrik is standing on his head again, then I will be all for a 1993/1994-style revamp.

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05-30-2012, 04:43 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Your best players (Lundqvist, Richards, Gaborik) are all on the wrong side of 30.

So, there is a bit of a reason to rush.
And that is why you do not trade your youth.

This way when Richards Gaborik, and Lundqvist, are declining from their peak.....


Stepan, Kreider, Delzotto, Anisimov, Mc Donagh, will just about be reaching their peak, and be our best players

Callahan, Dubinsky, Staal, Girardi, will be in the middle of there prime

lastly players like, JT Miller, Christian Thomas, Dylan Mcilrath, Michael St Croix, Jesper Fasth, will all be gaining experience in order to replace Dubi, Girardi, Staal, Callahan.

At this point everyone one on this board will be demanding that the young players mentioned, be traded because of the mental errors they make.

Ladies and Gentleman you have just learned how player development works. Rather then putting all your eggs in one basket hoping for just one single title!!!!!!!!!

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05-30-2012, 06:05 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by jskramer83 View Post
And that is why you do not trade your youth.

This way when Richards Gaborik, and Lundqvist, are declining from their peak.....


Stepan, Kreider, Delzotto, Anisimov, Mc Donagh, will just about be reaching their peak, and be our best players

Callahan, Dubinsky, Staal, Girardi, will be in the middle of there prime

lastly players like, JT Miller, Christian Thomas, Dylan Mcilrath, Michael St Croix, Jesper Fasth, will all be gaining experience in order to replace Dubi, Girardi, Staal, Callahan.

At this point everyone one on this board will be demanding that the young players mentioned, be traded because of the mental errors they make.

Ladies and Gentleman you have just learned how player development works. Rather then putting all your eggs in one basket hoping for just one single title!!!!!!!!!
Thats a ton of good players.

Unfortunately, you need some great ones to win a cup.

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05-31-2012, 12:05 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Thats a ton of good players.

Unfortunately, you need some great ones to win a cup.

Which is also known as being a deep team, which was the original point of this thread.

As far needing great ones to win the cup, I am not so sold on that now with a salary cap. Boston was a bunch of good players who were playing great for 16 games, same with Carolina, or how about the Devils when they won there 3 cups? They were a team filled with good players, no superstars.

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