HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Schultz talk pt. 2

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-30-2012, 04:19 PM
  #301
Selanne138
Registered User
 
Selanne138's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,479
vCash: 500
People bashing Ducks fans for judging Schultz need to look at it from our perspective.

If a prospect told you he wanted to play for your team for three year, in the media and then spurned you for no apparent reason, it would bother you too and you would question his character. Especially when he goes mum on the situation entirely.

Leading a team on like you will sign with them and then jumping ship last minute is, on the surface a dick move. Fans of other teams sit in here on their high horse, but everyone knows you would do the same thing if a prospect did that to one of your teams.

Of course no one would ever do that to the Canucks or Leafs though because they are the bestest places ever to play hockey and no one would ever not want to play there.

Selanne138 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:21 PM
  #302
vanwest
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
I think you have too many feelings invested in this to see the logic in what Schultz has done.
I can see why the fanbase would be upset. Imagine that a top prospect of any team decides to leave and sign elsewhere and you get no compensation. Fans who follow prospects become excited to see them play and make the jump to the big team. They become emotionally invested in the prospect. Having said that, the players for the first few years of their careers have very few rights and the CBA tends to favour the club until the player reaches UFA status. I have no idea what made Schultz decide not to sign with the Ducks but I don't really see there being any character issue. He's free to decide to play wherever he wants under the rules. You can argue that the rules are infair and that the next CBA should address this but I don't see how anyone can paint this as a character issue. These guys have a few years on average to make money in their careers. They need to do what they feel is best for them.

vanwest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:27 PM
  #303
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
NFITO,

Are you trying to be dense? Seriously are you? Why do you keep mentioning the CBA? Not one duck fan thinks he's not within his rights, so your long ass posts about the CBA are pointless.

You think its ok to lie, fine. I'd bet about 99% of posters here would disagree but that's irrelevant. You're spouting off the same information over and over.

Yes I believe you owe the team that drafted you at least your honesty. I think it's wrong to mislead them, which is exactly what he did. Maybe he did change his mind, but he needs to be upfront with it to the ducks. He owes them that at least for telling them that he planned to play for them. It'd be different if he never would have told them that but he did. I realize he has his choices but yes it's low of him to make a promise and not even tell them he changed his mind. Yes that is low character.

Duck Off is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:29 PM
  #304
NuxFan09
Registered User
 
NuxFan09's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selanne138 View Post
People bashing Ducks fans for judging Schultz need to look at it from our perspective.

If a prospect told you he wanted to play for your team for three year, in the media and then spurned you for no apparent reason, it would bother you too and you would question his character. Especially when he goes mum on the situation entirely.

Leading a team on like you will sign with them and then jumping ship last minute is, on the surface a dick move. Fans of other teams sit in here on their high horse, but everyone knows you would do the same thing if a prospect did that to one of your teams.

Of course no one would ever do that to the Canucks or Leafs though because they are the bestest places ever to play hockey and no one would ever not want to play there.
Absolutely. I don't know why anyone wouldn't be expecting Ducks fans to be pissed off. I think some people just enjoy conflict.

NuxFan09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:31 PM
  #305
jax00
DangleSnipe&Celly
 
jax00's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Anaslime
Country: United States
Posts: 8,560
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
he doesn't owe them a damn thing, regardless of what he said before.
I happen to believe people should back up their words...but we're never going to agree on this point, so I'll just end it here.

jax00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:36 PM
  #306
7even
Moderator
Deus Ex Machina
 
7even's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Georgia
Country: United States
Posts: 7,834
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by gliff View Post
Not bitter. I just hate Leafs fans who think the world revolves around their basement dweller team.
Oh I know. You've made it painfully clear over and over.

7even is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:47 PM
  #307
NFITO
hockeyinsanity*****
 
NFITO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,857
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckstudd269 View Post
NFITO,

Are you trying to be dense? Seriously are you? Why do you keep mentioning the CBA? Not one duck fan thinks he's not within his rights, so your long ass posts about the CBA are pointless.

You think its ok to lie, fine. I'd bet about 99% of posters here would disagree but that's irrelevant. You're spouting off the same information over and over.

Yes I believe you owe the team that drafted you at least your honesty. I think it's wrong to mislead them, which is exactly what he did. Maybe he did change his mind, but he needs to be upfront with it to the ducks. He owes them that at least for telling them that he planned to play for them. It'd be different if he never would have told them that but he did. I realize he has his choices but yes it's low of him to make a promise and not even tell them he changed his mind. Yes that is low character.
Really, so you know for a fact that he was lying and didn't just change his mind? I would love to see some support for this - that Schultz intentionally lied or misled the Ducks and didn't actually change his mind.

Or do you think that it's "low character" for a 21 year old to change their mind?

Since you seem to know for sure that he was actually lying, I'd love to see some proof for this.

If he was in fact straight out lying, and never had any intention to sign with the Ducks, then yes, I'd agree with you. But given how common it is for kids that age to change their mind, I tend to give him the benefit of the doubt... But again if you can provide proof to the contrary, I'll change my stance on this... Until then I see a bunch of pissed off fans accusing him of lying without knowing for sure - guilty until proven otherwise basically.

It seems you are all convinced he is lying and didn't just change his mind, so I'm assuming you must have some inside info to back that up, and aren't just ripping on him for what you believe he is actually doing?

NFITO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:47 PM
  #308
Homesick
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Homesick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,465
vCash: 50
Does anyone have a link quoting Schultz saying that he was going to sign with Anaheim? I just have yet to see one

Homesick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 04:51 PM
  #309
BeersHockey
Registered User
 
BeersHockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Chicago, IL
Country: United States
Posts: 930
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
You aren't really in any position to judge his character, just like anyone else on this board, as we have no idea what he's thinking or what his priorities are or why. What if he signs with Vancouver, does that automatically mean he lacks character?

What if he comes out and says that his decision was based on family reasons? His parents supported his career choice and helped get him where he is by financially and emotionally supporting his development from waking up early to take him to practice, to paying the huge amounts it takes to support a kid in what is a very expensive sport. And now that he has the option to play anywhere, he chose to do it close to home, with the team that his family have listed as their favorite, so they can come and watch their son play often as part of their favorite team. Not to mention the easier access his friends and community - which he's always spoken highly of - would have to watch him live as well.

Would that still make him someone who lacks character? Someone who left money on the table now, and an opportunity to get to RFA status sooner to get his next contract (and make more money) for other things that he placed greater importance to. What would that say about his character?

We don't know what his reasons or priorities are, and we may never know, as it's not his responsibility to let the world know why he made the decisions he did. But the limited info we have puts us in no position to understand what his character really is like. There are plenty of reasons he could have for not signing with the Ducks and/or signing with any other given team. And there are plenty of reasons which wouldn't mean he lacks character because he does sign elsewhere. You're basing your assumptions on very little info all from second hand sources without knowing anything from the kid himself. How is someone who doesn't even know the person or heard any reasons from the person himself, in any position to judge his character?
Sunshine and lollipops, bro. Have respect for the system, you are drafted, so go home with the girl that brought you. Basically, what you highlight is his selfishness. To wit, if it is not about the $$, which you posit above, then why isn't he finishing the commitment he made to the Badgers? Why isn't he finishing school, like he claimed was important? He is taking advantage of a loophole in the CBA, plain and simple.

BeersHockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 05:22 PM
  #310
vanwest
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeersHockey View Post
Sunshine and lollipops, bro. Have respect for the system, you are drafted, so go home with the girl that brought you. Basically, what you highlight is his selfishness. To wit, if it is not about the $$, which you posit above, then why isn't he finishing the commitment he made to the Badgers? Why isn't he finishing school, like he claimed was important? He is taking advantage of a loophole in the CBA, plain and simple.
Players decide to leave school all of the time in every sport. I certainly would not hold that against Schultz. Do you know how short the average pro's career is?

vanwest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 05:48 PM
  #311
BeersHockey
Registered User
 
BeersHockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Chicago, IL
Country: United States
Posts: 930
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
Players decide to leave school all of the time in every sport. I certainly would not hold that against Schultz. Do you know how short the average pro's career is?
Right, so let's all stop pretending that he is making anything but a selfish decision. Ducks fans have every right to be pissed at him, it's a dick move.

BeersHockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 05:57 PM
  #312
Crazy8oooo
k ؃
 
Crazy8oooo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Orange County
Country: United States
Posts: 967
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
Does anyone have a link quoting Schultz saying that he was going to sign with Anaheim? I just have yet to see one
Here ya go...That quote was from last season, when he chose to stay for another year in NCAA hockey.

Quote:
"Right when the season was over, Anaheim gave me a couple weeks to think things over, but I had already made up my mind around Christmas time that I was coming back," Schultz said. "They hounded me a little bit, but I made it pretty clear to them. They know that I want to play for them in the next couple years, and they trust me."

Crazy8oooo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 05:57 PM
  #313
vanwest
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeersHockey View Post
Right, so let's all stop pretending that he is making anything but a selfish decision. Ducks fans have every right to be pissed at him, it's a dick move.
The decision to leave school isn't a dick move. It's one that many players choose. And if I had 6 or 7 years on avearage as a pro player's career to make money I'd be selfish too. Sorry but I don't see how you can criticize Schultz for deciding to leave school and start his pro career.

vanwest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 05:58 PM
  #314
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
NFITO,

I never said I think he's lying. I get the impression that you think it's ok for him to not inform the ducks if he's changed his mind, which IMO is wrong, and if he told them he plans to play for them and never tells them otherwise, then I believe that is a lie.

I'd like your opinion on something because I believe this comparison is a good one:

A senior is interning at a business. He's been there for the past 2 years. 7 months before classes end, he is offered a salary position with the company when he finishes school. The student tells the company he will accept the offer and start right away. About two months before graduation the student receives an offer that has better pay, better hours, and is closer to home. He knows he's given his word to his current company but he knows that this is just a much better situation and he needs to take it so he accepts that offer and will start when school finishes. The student knows that his current company has already started planning for his upcoming position and has even made personell moves that are reactionary to his new employment.

My question to you is: does he owe the company the responsibility of at least telling his current internship that he changed his mind about his upcoming position with them to pursue a better job? Or is it fair to just not show up when his new job starts?

I for one believe the student (Schultz) owes the company at least his honesty, and IMO the right thing to do is tell them immediately because they are going to have to make adjustments for his "change of heart". Yes, they are probably going to be upset about him changing his mind, and it's not a conversation someone wants to have, but can you honestly say that it's ok to just not show up one day? Isn't changing your mind bad enough? It may not be for the student personally, but wouldn't it be the right thing to do in at least giving them warning?

I dont know. If you think it's ok that's your opinion, but I am perplexed on how someone could think like that. I believe that Schultz should do what he wants because his first contract will affect him personally in a large way, however I don't think your employer, or in this case, drafting team, should be completely ignored or disrespected. I believe he needs to be upfront with the team at least. Ignoring the situation is like spitting in their face IMO.

Duck Off is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:01 PM
  #315
Gliff
Nick Bonino
 
Gliff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: California
Country: United States
Posts: 8,835
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7even View Post
Oh I know. You've made it painfully clear over and over.
Then stop crying about how much I hate Burke and the Leafs (not directed at you, everyone who does say that).

Gliff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:02 PM
  #316
arsmaster
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 16,545
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selanne138 View Post
People bashing Ducks fans for judging Schultz need to look at it from our perspective.

If a prospect told you he wanted to play for your team for three year, in the media and then spurned you for no apparent reason, it would bother you too and you would question his character. Especially when he goes mum on the situation entirely.

Leading a team on like you will sign with them and then jumping ship last minute is, on the surface a dick move. Fans of other teams sit in here on their high horse, but everyone knows you would do the same thing if a prospect did that to one of your teams.

Of course no one would ever do that to the Canucks or Leafs though because they are the bestest places ever to play hockey and no one would ever not want to play there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckstudd269 View Post
NFITO,

Are you trying to be dense? Seriously are you? Why do you keep mentioning the CBA? Not one duck fan thinks he's not within his rights, so your long ass posts about the CBA are pointless.

You think its ok to lie, fine. I'd bet about 99% of posters here would disagree but that's irrelevant. You're spouting off the same information over and over.

Yes I believe you owe the team that drafted you at least your honesty. I think it's wrong to mislead them, which is exactly what he did. Maybe he did change his mind, but he needs to be upfront with it to the ducks. He owes them that at least for telling them that he planned to play for them. It'd be different if he never would have told them that but he did. I realize he has his choices but yes it's low of him to make a promise and not even tell them he changed his mind. Yes that is low character.
I think I can speak for every hockey fan - NOBODY likes this loophole.

What I take question with is calling Schultz a LIAR. Nobody knows or has heard from Schultz on what's been said over the last 3 years.

I've seen the link with some interview saying 'they know i want to play there'...

We dont how often Murray bombarded the 21 year old KID with 'leave school now, sign with us now" type statements.

It sucks for Anaheim, but doesn't mean he is any less of a person or any different than Billy Sweatt of Blake Wheeler.

NObody takes into account that Anaheim has probably been pressuring the stuffing out of him to sign, probably weekly, for the last 3 years.


Edit* added the bold to counteract a later post where you said you weren't suggesting he lied.....

arsmaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:27 PM
  #317
Kaoz
Ima Krejciist.
 
Kaoz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Nova Scotia
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,590
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy8oooo View Post
Quote:
"They know that I want to play for them in the next couple years, and they trust me."
Damn, that's rough.

Kaoz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:34 PM
  #318
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
What is your opinion of that example? Again, the issue isn't really whether he lied or not (just clearing this up) and I could care less what people think about wheeler or anyone else. I'm just baffled on how someone can not think this is wrong on his part.

Duck Off is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:34 PM
  #319
NuxFan09
Registered User
 
NuxFan09's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Damn, that's rough.
Wow. Talk about lying through your teeth. Well, maybe he was telling the truth at the time but still, you have to stick by your word.

NuxFan09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:34 PM
  #320
vanwest
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy8oooo View Post
Here ya go...That quote was from last season, when he chose to stay for another year in NCAA hockey.
I don't see that quote as being that bad. He's saying that he wants to play for the Ducks a year ago. He's changed his mind. That doesn't show he was lying when he said he wanted to play for the Ducks.

vanwest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:36 PM
  #321
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Damn, that's rough.
****ed up isn't it?

Yet apparently it's not wrong to say that and then not just not play for the Ducks, but not even say anything.

Duck Off is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:42 PM
  #322
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
I don't see that quote as being that bad. He's saying that he wants to play for the Ducks a year ago. He's changed his mind. That doesn't show he was lying when he said he wanted to play for the Ducks.
Have you not read anything duck fans have said? We are pissed that he doesn't have the decency to be honest with the team. Even mckenzie is saying Schultz is just staying silent and it's irritating Murray because how can you deal with someone that won't tell you how they are feeling?

A kid has every right to change his mind, but if he's going to do it, he needs to be at least upfront with them immediately. This whole silent treatment shows extreme immaturity and yes a lack of character. He may be a great guy for all I know, but he's dealing with this whole thing terribly.

Duck Off is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:44 PM
  #323
jax00
DangleSnipe&Celly
 
jax00's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Anaslime
Country: United States
Posts: 8,560
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckstudd269 View Post
NFITO,

I never said I think he's lying. I get the impression that you think it's ok for him to not inform the ducks if he's changed his mind, which IMO is wrong, and if he told them he plans to play for them and never tells them otherwise, then I believe that is a lie.

I'd like your opinion on something because I believe this comparison is a good one:

A senior is interning at a business. He's been there for the past 2 years. 7 months before classes end, he is offered a salary position with the company when he finishes school. The student tells the company he will accept the offer and start right away. About two months before graduation the student receives an offer that has better pay, better hours, and is closer to home. He knows he's given his word to his current company but he knows that this is just a much better situation and he needs to take it so he accepts that offer and will start when school finishes. The student knows that his current company has already started planning for his upcoming position and has even made personell moves that are reactionary to his new employment.

My question to you is: does he owe the company the responsibility of at least telling his current internship that he changed his mind about his upcoming position with them to pursue a better job? Or is it fair to just not show up when his new job starts?

I for one believe the student (Schultz) owes the company at least his honesty, and IMO the right thing to do is tell them immediately because they are going to have to make adjustments for his "change of heart". Yes, they are probably going to be upset about him changing his mind, and it's not a conversation someone wants to have, but can you honestly say that it's ok to just not show up one day? Isn't changing your mind bad enough? It may not be for the student personally, but wouldn't it be the right thing to do in at least giving them warning?

I dont know. If you think it's ok that's your opinion, but I am perplexed on how someone could think like that. I believe that Schultz should do what he wants because his first contract will affect him personally in a large way, however I don't think your employer, or in this case, drafting team, should be completely ignored or disrespected. I believe he needs to be upfront with the team at least. Ignoring the situation is like spitting in their face IMO.
Thank you. Everyone who thinks Duck fans are being pissy should read this.


Last edited by jax00: 06-10-2012 at 10:34 PM.
jax00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:46 PM
  #324
vanwest
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckstudd269 View Post
Have you not read anything duck fans have said? We are pissed that he doesn't have the decency to be honest with the team. Even mckenzie is saying Schultz is just staying silent and it's irritating Murray because how can you deal with someone that won't tell you how they are feeling?

A kid has every right to change his mind, but if he's going to do it, he needs to be at least upfront with them immediately. This whole silent treatment shows extreme immaturity and yes a lack of character. He may be a great guy for all I know, but he's dealing with this whole thing terribly.
I'd be surprised if he hasn't said anything to Murray. Maybe he hasn't let him know his reasons but at least his agent would have probably told Murray that he wants to test free agency. I'm no sure he owes any more explanation than that.

Edit: I just searched Bob McKenzie's tweets and saw that he said that neither the Ducks nor Schultz are responding to requests from the media for comment. That doesn't mean that Schultz hasn't talked to Murray.


Last edited by vanwest: 05-30-2012 at 06:52 PM.
vanwest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-30-2012, 06:56 PM
  #325
Crazy8oooo
k ؃
 
Crazy8oooo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Orange County
Country: United States
Posts: 967
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
I don't see that quote as being that bad. He's saying that he wants to play for the Ducks a year ago. He's changed his mind. That doesn't show he was lying when he said he wanted to play for the Ducks.
I never once said he lied...I simply posted a link that someone inquired about.

As for changing his mind, it is bad in the sense that he knew the Ducks put their trust in him, as indicated by his own statement and if the speculation is correct, has not gone back to Anaheim to tell them he's changed his mind. That's the part where Duck fans are questioning his character...If you don't think he owes them the decency to tell them he's changed his mind then we just don't agree and that's fine because we're all entitled to our opinions. But my opinion stands...I think it shows a huge lack of integrity on his part if this all shapes up as the media is painting it out to be.

Crazy8oooo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:10 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.