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Who wants to buy some Handguns? (Off-Season Speculation Part III)

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Old
06-03-2012, 10:43 AM
  #926
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Whats taking DW so long to 1) announce coaching staff for net season, and 2) provide the results of the player/coaching meetings as a "what went wrong last season and we we can do about it" analysis to the media and us speculators. Anyone recall when he had this completed last season??
I believe he is at the GM meetings right now. He probably does not want to tip his hand too much on which players he wants to move, versus which players he might be willing to move for the right price.

But honestly, I don't expect much from him this year. He'll put out his usual BS when he makes a move like trading Couture for Nash, or something similar. If he made an honest assessment of what went wrong, he would have to fire himself since pretty much everything wrong with the team is his responsibility (coaching issues, development issues, drafting issues, roster issues).

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06-03-2012, 11:28 AM
  #927
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I don't think I've agreed with Vaasa this much in an offseason since I joined HF ...

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06-03-2012, 11:48 AM
  #928
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I don't think I've agreed with Vaasa this much in an offseason since I joined HF ...
It's just because I'm posting less now. I'm actually hoping to be travelling for work when the draft comes up so I can just ignore it and then break a few things when I get home. Then, after I have calmed down, maybe I'll see how HFB melted down.

Or who knows, maybe people are actually coming around to my long-time contention that the real problem is DW.

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06-03-2012, 11:54 AM
  #929
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Or who knows, maybe people are actually coming around to my long-time contention that the real problem is DW.
I agree AGAIN! Mind boggling ...

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06-03-2012, 12:38 PM
  #930
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I believe he is at the GM meetings right now. He probably does not want to tip his hand too much on which players he wants to move, versus which players he might be willing to move for the right price.

But honestly, I don't expect much from him this year. He'll put out his usual BS when he makes a move like trading Couture for Nash, or something similar. If he made an honest assessment of what went wrong, he would have to fire himself since pretty much everything wrong with the team is his responsibility (coaching issues, development issues, drafting issues, roster issues).
Yep, i can see why he'd not publicly say much even about the teams wants and needs as other GMs will know why he's calling.

I expect no more than last summer also, a UFA or two, probably a trade or two. We have a year or two before the team starts to look pretty long in the tooth and needs a major re-tooling to the core - this will not be fun as sharks fans.

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06-03-2012, 12:55 PM
  #931
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Whats taking DW so long to 1) announce coaching staff for net season, and 2) provide the results of the player/coaching meetings as a "what went wrong last season and we we can do about it" analysis to the media and us speculators. Anyone recall when he had this completed last season??
He has been known to tell players that they will no longer be with the team at the exit interviews. I could imagine something might have been said to White. Mainly for players where it is a slamdunk that they won't be with the Sharks in the future. IIRC, Nichol and Mayers got the word early last year. If he is on the fence, he doesn't tip his hand because that could backfire if he can't move the player.

I do think he was somewhat candid this year as it was very clear that he himself failed on many fronts. I do think that he is rethinking his approach after this year's massive failure (not talking about first round exit, but am talking about failed PK and lack of scoring).

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06-03-2012, 01:28 PM
  #932
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I have come to the conclusion that if TMAC was coming back, it would have been announced by now. I was a long time season ticket holder and I have decided not to renew this year. I will not pay more based on the results last year. The team lost revenue by being knocked out after 2 home playoff games and that is being passed along to STHs- I won’t pay the shortfall for the team’s lack of success in last year’s playoffs.

An email to my ticket rep was forwarded to DW, who is in Toronto at the scouting combine interviewing players eligible for this year’s draft. I am impressed that he took the time to contact me- he didn’t have to.

In an email to me, he mentioned looking at potential candidates to add to the coaching staff that are still under contract until July 1 with their existing teams. It makes no sense for assistant coaches elsewhere to make a lateral move to come here as an assistant coach. He has to be looking at them as head coaching candidates. He also mentioned that the PK was “awful” and will be fixed. Not a surprise-when you are 29th in the league, it is hard to fall off of the floor.

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06-03-2012, 01:33 PM
  #933
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So after thinking about this, the silence from the Sharks makes sense. Until a coach is hired, nothing else will happen. The order will probably go something like this:

1) Hire a coach and in turn, have him name assistants- ideally immediately after the Stanley Cup Finals. This needs to be done prior to the July 1 Free agent signing date. If a potential coach is under contract with another team until July 1, DW will need to get the team’s permission to talk to him. My guess is he is targeting someone whose team is still playing.

2) Once a coach is named, quickly determine the team’s style of play based on any rule changes determined at the GM Meetings. There are a lot of teams that will need to adjust- Detroit, Chicago, Boston, Vancouver, San Jose- All of them were knocked out in the first round by teams you could argue were inferior on paper and had higher salary levels. Pittsburgh was also knocked out in the first round by Philly- they need to make some tweaks too.

3) Based on the style of play, determine the makeup of the roster. Who fits and who doesn’t? I’m sure they already did a detailed analysis of each player’s strength and weaknesses after the exit interviews. Can they get out of no movement or no trade clauses? Will guys waive the clause? What kind of players do we need to fit the system? Target free agent and trade prospects prior to the draft. Target players in the entry draft that fit the system or can step in immediately to help.

4) Go to the draft ready to make deals.

It all makes sense now. Changes are a comin’ but not until a coach is named. I see adjustment and chemistry issues ahead. We will be introducing an entirely new system. The Detroit system we copied is dead as validated by their own early exit. It doesn’t work anymore. League rules and the way games are played and called now have killed it.

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06-03-2012, 01:40 PM
  #934
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Point 2 in previous post.....*Lower Salary levels*

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06-03-2012, 01:45 PM
  #935
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The problem with that assumption, bproeder, is that they don't necessarily need to wait to fire McLellan if their intentions were to hire a new coach. In fact, McLellan was hired about a full month after Ron Wilson was fired. He was hired a week after the Wings had won their Cup in 2008. If they were going to can McLellan, they would have done it by now.

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06-03-2012, 01:53 PM
  #936
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So on the flip side, why doesn't DW just confirm that TMac is the coach based on the LeBrun report?

Maybe he is still being considered as a candidate pending other interviews? Maybe they have another role for him in the organization?

I have idea why DW would mention interviewing other coaches in other organizations if TMac was still the guy. It makes no sense that he is looking to interview for assistant coaches and that those assistant coaches would make a lateral change to join the Sharks. Maybe kicking tires? I don't know.

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06-03-2012, 01:58 PM
  #937
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So on the flip side, why doesn't DW just confirm that TMac is the coach based on the LeBrun report?

Maybe he is still being considered as a candidate pending other interviews? Maybe they have another role for him in the organization?

I have idea why DW would mention interviewing other coaches in other organizations if TMac was still the guy. It makes no sense that he is looking to interview for assistant coaches and that those assistant coaches would make a lateral change to join the Sharks. Maybe kicking tires? I don't know.
Because it is conceivable for him to be looking at other assistants to come here to be an assistant. Some assistants will jump to another position of the same title because it has a better prospect of turning into a head coaching position.

One example is Dave Barr of the Devils. He started as an assistant with the Avs, went to Minnesota for two seasons, and was the Devils assistant this year.

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06-03-2012, 02:00 PM
  #938
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So back to the first question....why doesn't he just say that Tmac is the coach? Why delay?

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06-03-2012, 02:05 PM
  #939
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So back to the first question....why doesn't he just say that Tmac is the coach? Why delay?
He probably doesn't feel the need to do so until he's figured out what he wants to do with the assistants.

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06-03-2012, 02:11 PM
  #940
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I have come to the conclusion that if TMAC was coming back, it would have been announced by now. I was a long time season ticket holder and I have decided not to renew this year. I will not pay more based on the results last year. The team lost revenue by being knocked out after 2 home playoff games and that is being passed along to STHs- I won’t pay the shortfall for the team’s lack of success in last year’s playoffs.

An email to my ticket rep was forwarded to DW, who is in Toronto at the scouting combine interviewing players eligible for this year’s draft. I am impressed that he took the time to contact me- he didn’t have to.

In an email to me, he mentioned looking at potential candidates to add to the coaching staff that are still under contract until July 1 with their existing teams. It makes no sense for assistant coaches elsewhere to make a lateral move to come here as an assistant coach. He has to be looking at them as head coaching candidates. He also mentioned that the PK was “awful” and will be fixed. Not a surprise-when you are 29th in the league, it is hard to fall off of the floor.
He promised that the PK would be fixed last year. Yawney got the ax and it wasn't fixed. Failure in analysis.

There are lots of coaching candidates. He could go the retread route with B. Sutter, MacT, Renney, etc. That would be a mistake. The reason they are on the sidelines is because they haven't kept up with the game. There are golden AC's out there that have no business being HC's like Ramsay. Ramsay wears out his welcome quickly but is an excellent offensive AC. There is much higher turnover with ACs as opposed to HCs. And, ACs can make a big difference (I won't go into the evidence here).

A new system usually takes a year to take hold before launching a team to the promised land. Sutter tweaked but did not overturn LA's system. DeBoer is close but failing so far with NJ's new system. The window is almost shut on the Sharks, taking a year out is not the right way to go.

My take is that the Detroit system (possession) may still work. Many coaches have sided with the statistical cognoscenti as to the merits of the possession system. They left behind the parts that made the system successful. To an extent they need to emphasize a non-north/south game to make it work. And they have to emphasize quickness. And they need to not quite go all out on possession to do so. Get conservative about possession (no mistakes) and die. Slow the play and die because there are a bunch of teams out there who have worked on high pressure defensive systems. The worm turned towards those teams in this year's playoffs.

The key issue that the Sharks have missed is speed, both skating and speed of play. They have been repeatedly defeated in the playoffs when they have been taken to task for that. It appears in DW's moves that he has discounted that issue for years in one way or another. High turnover negates speed of play. Systems can negate speed of play. And player abilities/deficits can negate speed of play. They went farthest in the playoffs with what amounted to their fastest team.

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06-03-2012, 02:13 PM
  #941
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http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklun...-close/1/44751

Hmm...Niemi to Tampa? I wonder what the Sharks would get (or want) in return? I would hope it would include one of their two first rounders.

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06-03-2012, 02:24 PM
  #942
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I believe he is at the GM meetings right now. He probably does not want to tip his hand too much on which players he wants to move, versus which players he might be willing to move for the right price.

But honestly, I don't expect much from him this year. He'll put out his usual BS when he makes a move like trading Couture for Nash, or something similar. If he made an honest assessment of what went wrong, he would have to fire himself since pretty much everything wrong with the team is his responsibility (coaching issues, development issues, drafting issues, roster issues).
Great post. I totally agree.

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06-03-2012, 02:24 PM
  #943
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Part of my reason for not renewing my tickets had to do with the team's effort- they took way too many games off and took a huge step back last year. Why should I pay more money? Give me the reasons.

To me, this is all about coaching and some serious flaws I believe exist within our so called "core group of players". It bothered me to be asked to make a season ticket payment now- a higher payment than last year- when I didn't know what would change. I specifically said that I don't even know who the head coach is, what philosophies will change, how about the PK? etc.

DW shared a lot of information that he didn't have to. He could have easily said we are looking to add new assistants to address the PK, but he worded it very carefully...."The potential candidates that we are looking to add to our coaching staff are in many cases still under contract with their existing teams and can't be talked about until July 1st". If TMAC is the guy, why not say that? I wasn't asking about assistants, I was asking about the head coach and his philosophy.

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06-03-2012, 02:31 PM
  #944
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http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklun...-close/1/44751

Hmm...Niemi to Tampa? I wonder what the Sharks would get (or want) in return? I would hope it would include one of their two first rounders.
Honestly, I'd be happy with getting any one of the three 2nd rounders that they have.

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06-03-2012, 02:41 PM
  #945
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Part of my reason for not renewing my tickets had to do with the team's effort- they took way too many games off and took a huge step back last year. Why should I pay more money? Give me the reasons.

To me, this is all about coaching and some serious flaws I believe exist within our so called "core group of players". It bothered me to be asked to make a season ticket payment now- a higher payment than last year- when I didn't know what would change. I specifically said that I don't even know who the head coach is, what philosophies will change, how about the PK? etc.

DW shared a lot of information that he didn't have to. He could have easily said we are looking to add new assistants to address the PK, but he worded it very carefully...."The potential candidates that we are looking to add to our coaching staff are in many cases still under contract with their existing teams and can't be talked about until July 1st". If TMAC is the guy, why not say that? I wasn't asking about assistants, I was asking about the head coach and his philosophy.
When a guy like DW references adding to the coaching staff, he is speaking in terms of assistants. If he wanted to make changes to the head coach position, he would've let McLellan go already. He has no reason to hang on to him up until now if he was planning on replacing him. The likelihood is that they want to add a real assistant to the staff and push Woodcroft back to the video room.

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06-03-2012, 02:56 PM
  #946
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He promised that the PK would be fixed last year. Yawney got the ax and it wasn't fixed. Failure in analysis.

There are lots of coaching candidates. He could go the retread route with B. Sutter, MacT, Renney, etc. That would be a mistake. The reason they are on the sidelines is because they haven't kept up with the game. There are golden AC's out there that have no business being HC's like Ramsay. Ramsay wears out his welcome quickly but is an excellent offensive AC. There is much higher turnover with ACs as opposed to HCs. And, ACs can make a big difference (I won't go into the evidence here).

A new system usually takes a year to take hold before launching a team to the promised land. Sutter tweaked but did not overturn LA's system. DeBoer is close but failing so far with NJ's new system. The window is almost shut on the Sharks, taking a year out is not the right way to go.

My take is that the Detroit system (possession) may still work. Many coaches have sided with the statistical cognoscenti as to the merits of the possession system. They left behind the parts that made the system successful. To an extent they need to emphasize a non-north/south game to make it work. And they have to emphasize quickness. And they need to not quite go all out on possession to do so. Get conservative about possession (no mistakes) and die. Slow the play and die because there are a bunch of teams out there who have worked on high pressure defensive systems. The worm turned towards those teams in this year's playoffs.

The key issue that the Sharks have missed is speed, both skating and speed of play. They have been repeatedly defeated in the playoffs when they have been taken to task for that. It appears in DW's moves that he has discounted that issue for years in one way or another. High turnover negates speed of play. Systems can negate speed of play. And player abilities/deficits can negate speed of play. They went farthest in the playoffs with what amounted to their fastest team.
Can I get some clarification?

We've always been told the Sharks play a style similar to Detroit's (since TMac arrived). But watching both teams play, the styles don't seem similar to me at all. Detroit plays a possession style no doubt ... they hold onto the puck and maintain possession as much as possible. The Sharks on the other hand, seem to play a dump-and-chase. Often when we have the puck, we'll skate it to center ice and dump it in. Detroit seems to skate the puck in far more than we do.

Also, Detroit seems to hold onto the puck mostly when making line changes (maintaining possession), while the Sharks skate it to center and dump it in, allowing the other team to gain possession (giving up possession).

Is this not right?

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06-03-2012, 03:02 PM
  #947
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When a guy like DW references adding to the coaching staff, he is speaking in terms of assistants. If he wanted to make changes to the head coach position, he would've let McLellan go already. He has no reason to hang on to him up until now if he was planning on replacing him. The likelihood is that they want to add a real assistant to the staff and push Woodcroft back to the video room.
Adding to the coaching staff could mean anything....there is no announcement as of yet as to what the coaching staff- including head coach- is.

I agree with you on one thing, if he is out, he should have been fired already. On the other hand if he was in, that should have been declared also.

Again I go back to the thought that maybe he is staying in the organization in a different capacity?

If DW was trying to keep me as a STH and the head coach and the philosophy was my issue, he could have said he and Todd have talked, they have a plan and they are working on assistant coaches to fix things. Why bother responding to me at all if you aren't trying to keep me as a STH and address my concerns?

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06-03-2012, 03:11 PM
  #948
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
When a guy like DW references adding to the coaching staff, he is speaking in terms of assistants. If he wanted to make changes to the head coach position, he would've let McLellan go already. He has no reason to hang on to him up until now if he was planning on replacing him. The likelihood is that they want to add a real assistant to the staff and push Woodcroft back to the video room.
They may also be looking to add an assistant who is a good candidate to be a HC if McLellan does not get the team off to a good start next year. Getting someone to come under those conditions may be hard, especially if TMac does manage to have the team playing well next season and the new AC does not see a good chance to move up.

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06-03-2012, 03:12 PM
  #949
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Adding to the coaching staff could mean anything....there is no announcement as of yet as to what the coaching staff- including head coach- is.

I agree with you on one thing, if he is out, he should have been fired already. On the other hand if he was in, that should have been declared also.

Again I go back to the thought that maybe he is staying in the organization in a different capacity?

If DW was trying to keep me as a STH and the head coach and the philosophy was my issue, he could have said he and Todd have talked, they have a plan and they are working on assistant coaches to fix things. Why bother responding to me at all if you aren't trying to keep me as a STH and address my concerns?
They won't do that to McLellan because the chances are that he would want to pursue another head coach position when many teams would be interested. The reason why there would be no announcement yet is that they would treat the entire coaching staff as one when it comes to announcing changes. When they get the assistant that they want, they will announce that this is the coaching staff they're going with.

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06-03-2012, 03:17 PM
  #950
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Honestly, I'd be happy with getting any one of the three 2nd rounders that they have.
I won't be happy with that. Niemi should be worth more than Domonic Moore.

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