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Old
06-05-2012, 08:30 PM
  #651
deandebean
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Those guys have experience, but you also have to remember that as a group they tend to be extremely conservative, set in their ways, and tend to prefer to always go back to the same network.




No, but it would have been better if Therrien hadn't brought up "work ethic and intensity" in a way that made it appear it was the thing the team needed to fix the most when if anything it was the only thing about it that never faltered.

I'm not asking for details, but something like "I felt the team's structure broke down and we need to recommit to a puck possession game with quick transition" would have been far better in my opinion. And this ought to be a goal regardless of your roster composition. A better identification of the problem that also hints that he considers it important. It doesn't help that I've seen too many coaches whose only solution to any problem was "work harder".



I'm not sure why you're bringing this up with me. I don't think language is the issue here by any means. I would probably have gone with Groulx or a francophone rookie coach.

Actually, Montreal lacked intensity from March until the end of the season. It wasn't pretty.

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06-05-2012, 08:31 PM
  #652
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In a few months these clowns will be bashing you Michel!!!

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06-05-2012, 08:32 PM
  #653
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I'm saying that amongst the great coaches in the league that we should have taken EVEN THOUGH they don't speak french, we have Trotz, Babcock, Ruff and Bylsma. So we can say that those guys represent the "exceptionnals". Well amongst those guys, you have one in Trotz, who wasn't too good in the outshot column for at least 2 years in a row now and I didn't chech the other years.
Trotz is all right. I don't think he's awesome. He has to deal with an undertalented though, which stands to reason given their limited budget.

For my money the league's truly exceptional coaches are Babcock, Bylsma, and Vigneault. Coaches are like goalies: really elite ones are very rare but can really help your team. Then you have a mass that goes from above-average to slightly below-average, it can be hard to tell within that lot. Then you have the really bad ones that can really mess up a team, but usually don't last long as a result -- but like bad goalies, even a bad coach can come up with a good record on a short stretch. I think Therrien fits in the latter category.

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06-05-2012, 08:32 PM
  #654
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Highly correlated to shot attempts.



Conklin goaled .923. Fleury .921. Was it a fluke? Absolutely, but sometimes goalies get hot for a year like that. It's not the result of good coaching.
It is pretty strange that during his 2 most successful seasons as a coach, goalies played out of their minds? Coincidence?

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06-05-2012, 08:33 PM
  #655
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Actually, Montreal lacked intensity from March until the end of the season. It wasn't pretty.
I don't agree. They were working hard, they were just doing it terribly ineffectively. They ended up being trapped in their zone a lot and that's never good for looking lively.

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06-05-2012, 08:34 PM
  #656
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Trotz is all right. I don't think he's awesome. He has to deal with an undertalented though, which stands to reason given their limited budget.

For my money the league's truly exceptional coaches are Babcock, Bylsma, and Vigneault. Coaches are like goalies: really elite ones are very rare but can really help your team. Then you have a mass that goes from above-average to slightly below-average, it can be hard to tell within that lot. Then you have the really bad ones that can really mess up a team, but usually don't last long as a result -- but like bad goalies, even a bad coach can come up with a good record on a short stretch. I think Therrien fits in the latter category.
Bylsma hasn't been impressive the last 2 seasons. I see him in danger after next season if Pittsburgh fails miserably like it did this season. I found his team lacked defensive prowess in the playoffs.

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06-05-2012, 08:35 PM
  #657
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I don't agree. They were working hard, they were just doing it terribly ineffectively. They ended up being trapped in their zone a lot and that's never good for looking lively.
We can disagree. I found the kids played with intensity, but the some of the vets lacked commitment.

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06-05-2012, 08:36 PM
  #658
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It is pretty strange that during his 2 most successful seasons as a coach, goalies played out of their minds? Coincidence?
Not at all. Hot goalies are the leading cause of making coaches look better than they are.

If he could consistently make good save percentages happen, you might have had something. But Theo went from .909 to 931 to .908, Fleury .906 to .921 to .912.

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06-05-2012, 08:38 PM
  #659
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Jacques cracking jokes

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06-05-2012, 08:38 PM
  #660
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We can disagree. I found the kids played with intensity, but the some of the vets lacked commitment.
Like who? By that point the vets of any significance were Pleks, Gorges, Gomez, Cole, and a bunch of grinders. Pleks, Gorges and Cole never stopped. Gomez was held together with duct tape. And the grinders are grinders.

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06-05-2012, 08:38 PM
  #661
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Not at all. Hot goalies are the leading cause of making coaches look better than they are.

If he could consistently make good save percentages happen, you might have had something. But Theo went from .909 to 931 to .908, Fleury .906 to .921 to .912.
I'm not asking WHAT are the numbers, but WHY? Stats don't tell the real story. They are a photo of a situation, but don't tell the real story. What CAUSED the goalies to show the numbers they had?

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06-05-2012, 08:39 PM
  #662
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Bylsma hasn't been impressive the last 2 seasons.
What are you talking about? His teams are juggernauts even when they have injury situations to rival the Habs.

Yeah, his goalie melted down in the playoffs. Fleury wasn't all that good to begin with, and things happen in small samples. That's why we really need to stop acting like the playoffs have more meaning than the handful of games they typically represent.

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06-05-2012, 08:40 PM
  #663
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I'm not asking WHAT are the numbers, but WHY? Stats don't tell the real story. They are a photo of a situation, but don't tell the real story. What CAUSED the goalies to show the numbers they had?
Standard goaltending volatility. They fluctuate all the time like that. I don't think there's a deeper meaning.

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06-05-2012, 08:44 PM
  #664
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Standard goaltending volatility. They fluctuate all the time like that. I don't think there's a deeper meaning.
That's too easy. There is a deeper meaning. Having coached a many levels, I can assure you that a coach can make or break a goalie. Maybe Therrien can make them?

Listen, I'm not a fan of the guy. I'm floored that he's back, to be honest. And I'm afraid his hiring has just sent a negative buzz throughout the UFAs and his own players. If I'm to judge Gill's tweet.

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06-05-2012, 08:45 PM
  #665
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I hope JM will work for l'antichambre next year . He's way better and funnier when he's aloud to talk

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06-05-2012, 08:47 PM
  #666
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I hope JM will work for l'antichambre next year . He's way better and funnier when he's aloud to talk
Yep.. Would of have liked him more if he had done his press conferences the way hes @ L'antichambre now

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06-05-2012, 08:49 PM
  #667
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That's too easy. There is a deeper meaning. Having coached a many levels, I can assure you that a coach can make or break a goalie. Maybe Therrien can make them?
But only one out of three years and they're mediocre-to-sucky otherwise?

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And I'm afraid his hiring has just sent a negative buzz throughout the UFAs and his own players. If I'm to judge Gill's tweet.
This here already gives us an inkling on the buzz that went through UFAs: http://www.canada.com/hockey/columni...511/story.html

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Originally Posted by Dave Stubbs
One prominent unrestricted free agent I’ve spoken with since regular-season’s end could be a nice fit in Montreal at a decent price and would fill a Habs need.

But then I floated the name of Therrien among potential Canadiens coaches, a suggestion that drew 30 seconds of stone-cold silence. Finally: “If that happens,” he said, “I’ve got 29 teams I can play for.”

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06-05-2012, 08:52 PM
  #668
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AC got their guy...all is well in Habs world.

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06-05-2012, 08:53 PM
  #669
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If he gets us Crosby in 2 years, who cares about other free agents?


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06-05-2012, 08:59 PM
  #670
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What are you talking about? His teams are juggernauts even when they have injury situations to rival the Habs.

Yeah, his goalie melted down in the playoffs. Fleury wasn't all that good to begin with, and things happen in small samples. That's why we really need to stop acting like the playoffs have more meaning than the handful of games they typically represent.
His teams have lacked defensive awareness in the playoffs.

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06-05-2012, 09:01 PM
  #671
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But only one out of three years and they're mediocre-to-sucky otherwise?



This here already gives us an inkling on the buzz that went through UFAs: http://www.canada.com/hockey/columni...511/story.html
I don't know. I'm just asking.

As for the UFAs, I had suspected it.

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06-05-2012, 09:02 PM
  #672
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But only one out of three years and they're mediocre-to-sucky otherwise?



This here already gives us an inkling on the buzz that went through UFAs: http://www.canada.com/hockey/columni...511/story.html
The UFA sounds like a guy looking to cash in and float awhile. Now that he heard MT might force players to work for their paychecks he says he has 29 other teams to choose from. Well good luck to him as I don't want free floating FA to show thinking they can ride into retirement on the Habs payroll. We've had too many of these primadonnas.

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06-05-2012, 09:04 PM
  #673
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JM so right about depth last year. Everytime he open his mouth it's a jab to Gauthier

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06-05-2012, 09:06 PM
  #674
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What are you talking about? His teams are juggernauts even when they have injury situations to rival the Habs.

Yeah, his goalie melted down in the playoffs. Fleury wasn't all that good to begin with, and things happen in small samples. That's why we really need to stop acting like the playoffs have more meaning than the handful of games they typically represent.
Hope you didn't mean it the way I read it. Playoffs are EVERYTHING.

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06-05-2012, 09:06 PM
  #675
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The UFA sounds like a guy looking to cash in and float awhile. Now that he heard MT might force players to work for their paychecks he says he has 29 other teams to choose from. Well good luck to him as I don't want free floating FA to show thinking they can ride into retirement on the Habs payroll. We've had too many of these primadonnas.
I don't see what is the big deal what one UFA thinks ..

No matter who they would have named as Head Coach, I bet a journalist could have easily found a handful of UFAs who didn't want to play for that coach. You guys think this wasn't the case when Martin was here? Every UFA loved him? lol yeah right.

I am much more interested in what guys like Crosby and Malkin think of Therrien, both star players who apparently have a very high opinion of him and even went out of their way to call him today to congratulate him.

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