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Jagr for MVP

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Old
04-01-2006, 05:06 AM
  #1
Cristobal Huet
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Jagr for MVP

LINK Hey Rangers Fans read this article (link right here) about Jagr and tell me what you think about it .

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04-01-2006, 05:10 AM
  #2
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It sure would be a crime.

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04-01-2006, 09:21 AM
  #3
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How does he not get the MVP?

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Old
04-01-2006, 10:47 AM
  #4
broadwayblue
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on EPSN.com i read an article by George Johnson who thinks the MVP should go to Kiprusoff.

He finishes with:

"Kiprusoff should be a lock for the Vezina. But he deserves more. Remember, by the definition of the award: " to the player adjudged to be the most valuable to his team.''

Yes, it is difficult to imagine the Rangers without Jagr.

It's impossible to imagine the Flames without Kiprusoff."

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/column...rge&id=2391550

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Old
04-01-2006, 11:08 AM
  #5
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Let's attempt to put this in a better perspective

Could Calgary find a goalie who could taken up some of the slack? In today's NHL I think that is a possibility. I'm not saying replace, I'm saying fill the viod to a lesser degree.

Jagr. He has willed games, dominated many. He has been a leader in every sense, the same way Messier has been credited as being a leader. He is emotinal and a fierce competitor. Is he tempermental? Yes! So to was Messier, or does everyone forget the Roger Nielson affair. All great players are. It is their need to succeed that drives them.

The NYRs without Jagr would have been a continuation of the previous 7 years. That is not to say that people like Lundqvist, Prucha, Tyutin would not have made an impact, they would have, but I think to a lesser degree. Jagr sets the tone.

Lundqvist is the exception though. I think he is the real thing. He's a world class goalie that hates being scored on. He rarely gets beat on the 1st shot. Usually it is on the 3rd shot, or a deflection. He gives Kipper a run for his money for the Vezina. Without King Henke we are in trouble.

Therein lies the dilemma. Henke and Jagr could split the vote. Henke should be considered for the Hart, Vezina and Calder. Name a Rookie that has had the impact that Lundqvist has had on a team. Sure Ovechin (sp) has had a great numbers year and is a player of unparallel skill. Like Crosby though, subtract both form their teams and how much worst are they? Subtract Lundqvist and we are where washington and pittsburgh are with those two players!

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04-01-2006, 12:00 PM
  #6
Heat McManus
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If the award was actually handed to the "player most valuable to his team" then Bure should have won it when he was in Florida and Ovechkin should win it this year.

The award more or less seems to go to "the best player on a play-off bound team".

Jagr is the best player in the league this year, IMHO. He has carried the team on his back and has been dominant in doing so. The Rangers without Jagr would be clawing for the post-season right now. As a Devil's fan, I hate him. As a hockey fan, I love watching him play.


Kiprusoff does deserve a lot of credit as well. Look at his teams goal differential and it's plain to see that they have won a lot of games with their netminder.

If San Jose was in a better position, I believe Thornton would get a LOT of consideration. Same with Ovechkin. The first yr the Caps make the playoffs Alex O will get the Hart.

Alfredsson has too many other elite players on his team to win the Hart in my opinion. But like Kipper, he may get votes based on some writers favoring Canadian teams.

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04-01-2006, 12:21 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeffyuhTJRest
If the award was actually handed to the "player most valuable to his team" then Bure should have won it when he was in Florida and Ovechkin should win it this year.

The award more or less seems to go to "the best player on a play-off bound team".

Jagr is the best player in the league this year, IMHO. He has carried the team on his back and has been dominant in doing so. The Rangers without Jagr would be clawing for the post-season right now. As a Devil's fan, I hate him. As a hockey fan, I love watching him play.


Kiprusoff does deserve a lot of credit as well. Look at his teams goal differential and it's plain to see that they have won a lot of games with their netminder.

If San Jose was in a better position, I believe Thornton would get a LOT of consideration. Same with Ovechkin. The first yr the Caps make the playoffs Alex O will get the Hart.

Alfredsson has too many other elite players on his team to win the Hart in my opinion. But like Kipper, he may get votes based on some writers favoring Canadian teams.
I think you are confusing being the most valuable with being the best player on your team by a long shot.

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Old
04-01-2006, 12:26 PM
  #8
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Let me just put it this way. Put Iginla and Kiprusoff on the Rangers. And then put Jagr and Lundqvist in front and behind that Flame Defense and tell me who wins the stanley cup and tell me where the Rangers are at. Not to mention Mikka sat out the Olympics and both Jagr and Lundqvist went far into them, came back and are still tearing up the league.

This type of homerism is cynical, and I am a homer yes, but at least my homerism has facts to back it up.

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Old
04-01-2006, 12:32 PM
  #9
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God people who cares about who's the best on the team or who's really the most valuable..the bottom line is 95% of the time the award goes to the best player in the NHL for this season. That's why don't waste your time on the terminology of the award. Wayne Gretzky won 8 hart trophies in a row for god sakes and he wasn't even close to being the most valuable...Oilers even won the cup the year he left. If Jagr wins the scoring race he'll get the MVP hands down..it won't even be close!

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04-01-2006, 01:51 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broadwayblue
on EPSN.com i read an article by George Johnson who thinks the MVP should go to Kiprusoff.

He finishes with:

"Kiprusoff should be a lock for the Vezina. But he deserves more. Remember, by the definition of the award: " to the player adjudged to be the most valuable to his team.''

Yes, it is difficult to imagine the Rangers without Jagr.

It's impossible to imagine the Flames without Kiprusoff."

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/column...rge&id=2391550
Johnson writes for the Calgary Herald... could he possibly be biased?

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Old
04-01-2006, 07:57 PM
  #11
Czech Your Math
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Jagr is MVP

I don't think it's that close.

Where were the Rangers picked? Near last in league by most. They're contending for a division title.

First of all, almost no one's going to vote for a rookie, unless he's clearly had the best season, and it would be near impossible to make a case that Ovechkin or Lundqvist has had a clearly better season and more impact than Jagr. I don't think it's clear cut which goalie has had the best season, although Kiprusoff and Lundqvist have outstanding numbers.

OTOH, it's clear to me that Jagr has had by far the best season of any forward. Probably will lead NHL in goals, ~2nd-3rd in assists, likely first in points, and last I checked, among top 3 forwards in +/-, tied for most GW goals, and has helped elevate Nylander to a career-best season, Straka to his best season since he played with Jagr in Pittsburgh, and both to within a point of Forsberg.

Without Lundqvist, the Rangers would probably have average goaltending at best, with Weekes and Montoya. So they'd basically be a similar team to Jagr's last few years in Pittsburgh, with same or slightly weaker goaltending, better defensive depth, and without another forward near Jagr's level. At best, a 5 or 6 seed, at worst just missing the playoffs IMO.

Without Jagr, the Rangers would likely be struggling to score more than 2 goals in most games, and have to hope Lundqvist didn't give up more than a goal or two every time he played. Just look at the recent "slump" which has been fairly modest. No Jagr, and a lot of those wins and OT losses turn into 0 points, and they drop like a rock in the standings (probably out of playoff contention, considering how much lower they would already have been).

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Old
04-03-2006, 12:36 AM
  #12
Heat McManus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoochiNorris
I think you are confusing being the most valuable with being the best player on your team by a long shot.

no, I mean that the award isn't awarded as it officially designated.

either way, Jagr for Hart/MVP/Kid's Choice/Best Helmet

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Old
04-03-2006, 12:40 AM
  #13
Heat McManus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Czech Your Math
I don't think it's that close.

Where were the Rangers picked? Near last in league by most. They're contending for a division title.

First of all, almost no one's going to vote for a rookie, unless he's clearly had the best season, and it would be near impossible to make a case that Ovechkin or Lundqvist has had a clearly better season and more impact than Jagr. I don't think it's clear cut which goalie has had the best season, although Kiprusoff and Lundqvist have outstanding numbers.

OTOH, it's clear to me that Jagr has had by far the best season of any forward. Probably will lead NHL in goals, ~2nd-3rd in assists, likely first in points, and last I checked, among top 3 forwards in +/-, tied for most GW goals, and has helped elevate Nylander to a career-best season, Straka to his best season since he played with Jagr in Pittsburgh, and both to within a point of Forsberg.

Without Lundqvist, the Rangers would probably have average goaltending at best, with Weekes and Montoya. So they'd basically be a similar team to Jagr's last few years in Pittsburgh, with same or slightly weaker goaltending, better defensive depth, and without another forward near Jagr's level. At best, a 5 or 6 seed, at worst just missing the playoffs IMO.

Without Jagr, the Rangers would likely be struggling to score more than 2 goals in most games, and have to hope Lundqvist didn't give up more than a goal or two every time he played. Just look at the recent "slump" which has been fairly modest. No Jagr, and a lot of those wins and OT losses turn into 0 points, and they drop like a rock in the standings (probably out of playoff contention, considering how much lower they would already have been).

Very good point. Without Jagr's offensive production we may not be talking about Lundqvist half as much do to the fact that he wouldn't be winning as many games.

Great play means a lot, but c'mon: this is NY. Winning is everything. Lundqvist could have played great but without the W's he wouldn't be getting as much attention.

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Old
04-03-2006, 02:07 PM
  #14
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just like i didnt worry about it for arod, im not worrying about it for jagr. he is the MVP, and will win it.

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