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Canucks file for cut down arbitration with Raymond

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Old
06-13-2012, 04:33 PM
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Winroba
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Canucks file for cut down arbitration with Raymond

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Dreger: Canucks file "cutdown" arbitration on Mason Raymond. Q.O is $2.6 million. Salary can't drop more than to $2.21 million if Van wins arb case.
Very interesting

edit: Gotta give props to Gilman for knowing that this was a thing Canucks can save $400,000 against the cap and with Gilman at the helm, that's quite a bit of room

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06-13-2012, 04:35 PM
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CAPiTA
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Yeah well would you want to pay $2.6 mil for Raymond? I wouldn't even want him on his previous year's contract.

-Bell

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06-13-2012, 04:37 PM
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Taelin
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Can anyone explain what a "cut down" abitration is?

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06-13-2012, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by CAPiTA View Post
Yeah well would you want to pay $2.6 mil for Raymond? I wouldn't even want him on his previous year's contract.

-Bell
One word - bandwagon.

Raymond had a serious back injury and is still getting into form. Might not but it'll be interesting to see if he returns to form this year.

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06-13-2012, 04:38 PM
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also increases his trade value

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06-13-2012, 04:38 PM
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Winroba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taelin View Post
Can anyone explain what a "cut down" abitration is?
I'd assume it's to take him to arbitration to show that he isn't worth his QO and the arbitrator can rule for or against it.

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06-13-2012, 04:38 PM
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This would be great. Makes keeping Raymond on the team a possibility.

I am hoping Raymond is okay with going along with this to stay on a contender.

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06-13-2012, 04:41 PM
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Muffin
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MG really doesn't treat his players that well does he. The whole Hodgson thing first, then Kesler, now he's doing this just to save like 400k?

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06-13-2012, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Muffin View Post
MG really doesn't treat his players that well does he. The whole Hodgson thing first now he's doing to just to save like 400k?
For a cap team, $400k is a lot. I don't think this has anything to do with treating his players poorly. If Raymond wants to stay in Vancouver he will have to either start performing to his cap hit, or take less money so that more talent can be injected into the lineup.

Kesler, Sedins, Burrows, Bieksa, Hamhuis, Luongo, Hansen, Salo, Malhotra, Lapierre and Higgins all took lower amounts of money to stay with the team and I'd hope that Raymond is open to doing the same.

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06-13-2012, 04:45 PM
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Sorry rest of the league, no Raymond for you! Back to the drawing board!


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06-13-2012, 04:45 PM
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All those offer sheets cluttering up Raymond's desk will now need to be looked at. What a back-breaker. Cheers.


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06-13-2012, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muffin View Post
MG really doesn't treat his players that well does he. The whole Hodgson thing first, then Kesler, now he's doing this just to save like 400k?
Be honest, you're just trolling for gullible Canuck fans aren't you.

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06-13-2012, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by birddog View Post
One word - bandwagon.

Raymond had a serious back injury and is still getting into form. Might not but it'll be interesting to see if he returns to form this year.
Bandwagoner? I take offense to that. He's not going to be a 25 goal, 50 point player again. He wasnt in 10/11 either. Soft players like him who can't hit or forecheck on your 3rd line are not what we want for a cup run.

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06-13-2012, 04:50 PM
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I think the QO would be fair money for Raymond to be honest. Pro-rated he had a 30pt season, and he came off a significant injury. Previous two seasons suggests he is well worth it aswell, when we consider what the market is like right now. I have no idea how the arbitrary process works though, what they take consideration to. But I think a cap hit of $2.6M is fair for Raymond. If that is plausible for the Canucks is another matter.

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06-13-2012, 04:52 PM
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I believe this is just taking a player to arbitration.

But since Raymond had such a poor year, they can reduce it by what appears to be 15% for his next deal.

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06-13-2012, 04:54 PM
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I can't see the Canucks winning this case. Too much money getting thrown around at players who produce less, giving Raymond's agent the ability to provide a ton of comparables and despite the injury he has other productive seasons to back himself up with.

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06-13-2012, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CAPiTA View Post
Soft players like him who can't hit or forecheck on your 3rd line are not what we want for a cup run.
Yeah...I don't think we want Raymond hitting either. The one freaking time he tries to throw a hit the puck ends up in the back of our net.

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06-13-2012, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweech View Post
I can't see the Canucks winning this case. Too much money getting thrown around at players who produce less, giving Raymond's agent the ability to provide a ton of comparables and despite the injury he has other productive seasons to back himself up with.
Well, salary arbitration uses players in comparable situations (ie. restricted free agents) to benchmark what a player should earn so you won't see David Jones being used or anything like that.

Furthermore Raymond's injury is a major question mark, regardless of his past productivity.

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06-13-2012, 05:47 PM
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I didn't know you could file to cut down a players salary

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06-13-2012, 05:47 PM
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If Raymond wins his arbitration case I believe the Canucks walk away. We'll hear plenty of stupid comments on HF either way.

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06-13-2012, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
If Raymond wins his arbitration case I believe the Canucks walk away. We'll hear plenty of stupid comments on HF either way.
Except the Canucks can't walk away, because it's club elected. So he's either playing with the Canucks or traded sometime during the summer/season. Waiving isn't really an option unless he's significantly worse in training camp than previous years... which is not going to happen, he's going to be useful bottom 6 player in any case.

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06-13-2012, 06:29 PM
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wow i had no idea you could do this. i always thought the QO was supposed to set the min (offer QO or let player go UFA), didn't know teams could get under it by claiming said player sucked but shouldn't be UFA.

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06-13-2012, 06:30 PM
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It does appear that Gillis is hard nosed with his players. I have read in places that the Nucks are one of the most disliked teams in the NHL by players and fans, I get where the Fan hate comes from regarding their playoffs and antics but not sure why the players would have a dislike for the team. But how a GM treats his players goes a long way and if Gillis is hard as he looks attracting UFA's will be difficult. It looks like Gillis is kicking Raymond while he is down.

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06-13-2012, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by birddog View Post
One word - bandwagon.

Raymond had a serious back injury and is still getting into form. Might not but it'll be interesting to see if he returns to form this year.
Raymond was playing poorly before his back injury. If you weren't a Raymond "bandwagoner" you'd know this of course

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Old
06-13-2012, 06:36 PM
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Winroba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbyt911 View Post
It does appear that Gillis is hard nosed with his players. I have read in places that the Nucks are one of the most disliked teams in the NHL by players and fans, I get where the Fan hate comes from regarding their playoffs and antics but not sure why the players would have a dislike for the team. But how a GM treats his players goes a long way and if Gillis is hard as he looks attracting UFA's will be difficult. It looks like Gillis is kicking Raymond while he is down.
If the Canucks are hated by players how do they get top quality UFA's to sign there for under FMV?

The players may not be the most liked but there's no faults in the organization. Less cash in pocket but more than the money is made up in working conditions, private chefs who prepare healthy meals for players, anything you could ask for is attended to by the team and personal health issues are hugely important to the team. Just look at the way they dealt with Rypien (RIP) and the founding and support of MindCheck to help athletes with mental issues. The organization is far and away one of the classiest in the league.

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